December 27, 2005

3:51 PM

This—combined with this—makes me wonder if there needs to be a flagging option on MeFi Projects.
posted by interrobang to etiquette/policy at 3:51 PM (54 comments total)

I was thinking that too. It'll certainly be necessary once Matt enables comments over there, which I believe he has said is in the works.
posted by Gator at 3:57 PM on December 27, 2005

Aside from the guy acting like a huge asshole, not using punctuation, and using grody internet word-shortenings, it seems to me that the longer Projects is around, the more likely it's going to be that "ppl" will spam Projects.

Even if this site turns out not to be owned by this milos83 character, I don't think it's appropriate for "ppl" to post projects that are not theirs to the Projects page. There is too much room for abuse.

On the other hand, if he did have something to do with his linked site, the metafilter post on the front page is clearly a self-link. He can't have it both ways.
posted by interrobang at 4:04 PM on December 27, 2005

For my 2006 new year's resolution, I'm going to add metatalk.metafilter.com to my hosts file.
posted by crunchland at 4:11 PM on December 27, 2005

crunchland : "For my 2006 new year's resolution, I'm going to add metatalk.metafilter.com to my hosts file."

As the target, I hope? Like "Redirect all attempts to go to goatse.cx or google.com to metatalk.metafilter.com"?
posted by bugbread at 4:19 PM on December 27, 2005

Great last comment from stavros.

We're all stronger for this, right?



Right?
posted by interrobang at 4:19 PM on December 27, 2005

Interrobang: I thin the solution is simply to put more limitations on the newist users.

Perhaps posts by the newest 1% of posters could require a review of FPPs to avoid problems like this? Long time users would have the opportunity to view and comment on posts in a queue, and suss out self-links and other garbage before they get posted to the main page.

The vast majority of link posting sites require editorial review before links are posted. I think that could benefit metafilter.

Maybe, like, the first 3 FPPs require review?
posted by delmoi at 4:20 PM on December 27, 2005

For my 2006 new year's resolution, I'm going to add metatalk.metafilter.com to my hosts file.

Yeah, that way you'll still be able to resolve it if your DNS server dies. Good thinking.
posted by delmoi at 4:21 PM on December 27, 2005

Aw. Game over.
posted by apocalypse miaow at 4:22 PM on December 27, 2005

I wonder if someone will re-post the link on projects.
posted by delmoi at 4:23 PM on December 27, 2005

I'm presuming it's a self-link and so the MeFi post goes and the Projects post stays, yes? Otherwise, since Projects is pretty low traffic, folks can just alert us the old fashioned way about Projects abuse.
posted by jessamyn at 4:23 PM on December 27, 2005

It should be taken off of Projects. The guy self-linked on the front page, which (presumably) means he's been banned. Therefore, not a project by a metafilter user, right?
posted by interrobang at 4:25 PM on December 27, 2005

um. no.

127.0.0.1 metatalk.metafilter.com
posted by crunchland at 4:26 PM on December 27, 2005

Apparently, he works for the project and didn't create it. Wouldn't this be the equivalent of me posting a link to my employer's website on the Projects page?
posted by aburd at 4:27 PM on December 27, 2005

I don't understand your post, crunchland.
posted by interrobang at 4:28 PM on December 27, 2005

crunchland : "127.0.0.1 metatalk.metafilter.com"

What? You host a mirror of MetaTalk from your own loopback address? Crazy!
posted by bugbread at 4:28 PM on December 27, 2005

mihail is a saint by comparison
posted by mischief at 4:30 PM on December 27, 2005

It should be taken off of Projects. The guy self-linked on the front page, which (presumably) means he's been banned. Therefore, not a project by a metafilter user, right?

Seconded.

Seriously, I wonder whether it's gargantuan balls or just plain stupidity that leads these people to totally ignore the prominent warning on the Post A Link page :

Note: You read the guidelines, right? Because linking to your own site or a project you worked on in this space will result in a deletion and your account will be banned. Post it to MetaFilter Projects to announce your work instead, which was designed especially for this purpose.

posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:31 PM on December 27, 2005

As an aside, I once put some annoying advertising server in my hosts file, and AIM started hitting it over and over again, every second.

The problem was, I had a web server running, serving up my default homepage with a rather CPU intensive script. Aim ended up murdering my machine.

I think it was x10.com I had put in there.
posted by delmoi at 4:32 PM on December 27, 2005

ok sorry, just poked my head in here. I'll go make it right.
posted by jessamyn at 4:32 PM on December 27, 2005

fixed, banned, ok now?
posted by jessamyn at 4:34 PM on December 27, 2005

Thanks, jessamyn.
posted by interrobang at 4:36 PM on December 27, 2005

Maybe the warning needs to be more promonent. Like a giant white box with red text. Perhaps we should also add a warning to the new user signup page.
posted by delmoi at 4:37 PM on December 27, 2005

I would like to thank bugbread, delmoi, loquacious, and of course, Milos, for creating one of the most entertaining discussions I've seen on Metafilter. Seriously, it was downright hilarious to read. Only MeFi can create such greatness from such crap.

Also, as a current Hawkeye I would like to echo Delmoi's affinity for the vile swill that is Hawkeye Vodka. It's so bad it's good. You're not a true fan of the Hawks until you've downed a fifth of that putrid solvent they call "vodka."
posted by anomie at 4:39 PM on December 27, 2005

wow, that was the most entertaining thread of the holidays. my popcorn machine blew a fuse. apparently uc berkeley is slipping up in the admissions department.

Long time users would have the opportunity to view and comment on posts in a queue, and suss out self-links and other garbage before they get posted to the main page.

metadigg!
posted by 3.2.3 at 4:41 PM on December 27, 2005

I think we've perhaps got to assume that some people don't care if they break the guidelines or not, no matter how big the font size of the warning is - they just want to see if they can slip one through the net. Fat chance.
posted by Jimbob at 4:42 PM on December 27, 2005

anomie: Ironically I live in Ames. but we know a good, cheap, ethanol blend when we see it. Go cyclones! :P
posted by delmoi at 4:46 PM on December 27, 2005

Jimbob, the people who get caught invariably 1) Post crap, and 2) have never posted an FPP before. If milos had posted a couple interesting FPPs and some good comments, no one would have noticed. A while ago someone posted a self-link and then later posted on MeTa about how much traffic he got, along with a 'thank you' to metafilter.

He obviously hadn't read the guidelines or seen the warning.

This is a real problem. Not the self-links, but the fact that people just don't pay attention to what they're doing. They don't read the warnings. They just do what they think is right, put info in the boxes they think it goes in and hit post.

I think a lot of the recent self linkers had no idea they were breaking the guidelines.
posted by delmoi at 4:52 PM on December 27, 2005

Then, and I say this with all appropriate love and fellowship in my heart, fuck 'em.

To paraphrase from the SA Forums (which I mentioned in this context yesterday), it's Metafilter Darwinism, and it's just fine.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:58 PM on December 27, 2005

I think a lot of the recent self linkers had no idea they were breaking the guidelines.

I disagree with this; most of the recent self-linkers have played the "I'm dumb, but cute" card. milo83 did it at first, and then started actively insulting people. The rest of the recent self-linkers have posted the link, and then clammed up.

If you're a spammer of some sort, and you know that it's "only five dollars LOL", and posting a link to metafilter is going to get you a couple of thousand hits, it's probably worth the five bucks to post, have the post up for a couple of hours, and get banned. You can always pay another five dollars.
posted by interrobang at 5:00 PM on December 27, 2005

I think that the traffic from Metafilter might be a little overestimated, tangentially. I've had my site linked in front page posts a couple of times over the years, and even though those links remained undeleted (they weren't self-links), the resulting visits were, if I remember correctly, only about 1-2000.

Something that's only up for a couple of hours might generate a couple of hundred hits, max, I'd think. Is that worth $5 to the marketron self-promotion scuzweasels? I dunno.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 5:05 PM on December 27, 2005

Plus, the site doesn't have ads, so the only way they'd gain from this is if people (sorry, 'ppl') signed up for their little scheme, which I don't see happening.
posted by signal at 5:10 PM on December 27, 2005

Great last comment from stavros.

Indeed, and I'll repost it here so it doesn't get missed:

What's that, falling from the sky?

My god, it's a hammer! A massive, flaming banhammer!
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 7:17 PM EST on December 27

And it was.
posted by languagehat at 5:16 PM on December 27, 2005

I've had my site linked in front page posts a couple of times over the years, and even though those links remained undeleted (they weren't self-links), the resulting visits were, if I remember correctly, only about 1-2000.

My site was posted here back in March, and in a couple of hours, I got a little under 3000 hits. There are a lot more members than there used to be, and—I'd guess—a lot more readers.

I don't know what this guy's objective was, but I don't know how many "vonity" members there are.
posted by interrobang at 5:21 PM on December 27, 2005

I think milos should have amnesty in that thread only, in perpetuity. The fun would never stop.

Have I commented enough to post, yet? Maybe 4,439 isn't sufficient—I'll keep trying.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 5:24 PM on December 27, 2005

My site was posted here back in March, and in a couple of hours, I got a little under 3000 hits. There are a lot more members than there used to be, and—I'd guess—a lot more readers.

True, I guess. Hadn't thought of that. Or it could just be that nobody was interested in my shit. Heh.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 5:25 PM on December 27, 2005

I'm ok with people "spamming" projects with their work. Better there than anywhere else on mefi, and sometimes, they might actually be cool services/sites/communities.
posted by mathowie at 5:35 PM on December 27, 2005

I'm ok with people "spamming" projects with their work.

"spamming" might be a poor choice of words, there, Matt. People love to quote you chapter and verse...

At what point, then, I think it's important to clarify, does something go from being 'their work' to 'someone's work that they have some connection with and want to promote'.

If someone's a marketer for a site, for example, does their employment by that business allow them to claim it's 'their work' in some way?

I know that sounds like a stupid question, and the answer is semi-obvious to me at least, but I guarandamntee someone's going to try sooner than later to justify themselves with a similar argument. If they haven't already.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 5:41 PM on December 27, 2005

I'm ok with people "spamming" projects with their work. Better there than anywhere else on mefi, and sometimes, they might actually be cool services/sites/communities.

Understood, but the issue here is that the guy made three comments today, then posted his site to the front page. There is a gray area here. And—yuk, yuk—we're in it.

Like aburd said, where's the line? Projects is supposed to be projects by metafilter users, right?

I realize that this guy's project got deleted, but perhaps it's necessary to add flagging to Projects for this sort of thing. "Not actually his project" or "not a real mefite" come to mind as possible flags.
posted by interrobang at 5:43 PM on December 27, 2005

Just make posting to Projects only possible 6 months after joining. Nobody's going to bother joining Metafilter just to wait six months to promote their stuff. And if they stick around anyway, perhaps they'd become a conributing member of the community first, in which case everyone wins.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 5:47 PM on December 27, 2005

I 3rd the YAY stavrosthewonderchicken's last comment.

and damn wish I was on during that thread. It was quite funny.
posted by edgeways at 5:49 PM on December 27, 2005

Good idea, stavros.
posted by interrobang at 5:49 PM on December 27, 2005

Ahhh... using Hawkeye vodka to drink away the pain of being a Cyclone. The ultimate irony.
posted by anomie at 6:12 PM on December 27, 2005

Another vote for Stavros's suggestion.
posted by bshort at 7:04 PM on December 27, 2005

I've considered a long waiting period, but there have been several cool projects posted by someone that recently joined, but they weren't exactly metafilter members when they did it.

Perhaps a one-month window there is in order, and a second over-the-top warning when someone previews their first post.
posted by mathowie at 7:19 PM on December 27, 2005

There should be an "I understand that posting a self-link to Metafilter violates the site guidelines and is the equivalent to shitting on the living room floor at a party" button you have to click before you become a user. Somewhere. Make them click it. Click. Clickety. Click.
posted by mediareport at 8:49 PM on December 27, 2005

Maybe a higher membership fee for the ability to FPP within X days? (30, 60, 90?) I applaud the inclusivity and community spirit that the $5 represents, but I paid more than $5 for my muffin and coffee this morning. That price is lost in the noise for most folks here, I'd wager. For the opportunity to be a jackass in front of 30K ppl, $5 is cheap.
posted by Triode at 9:06 PM on December 27, 2005

Gator, please to not be steals my posts on the thing.
posted by quonsar at 9:42 PM on December 27, 2005

I don't think its a good idea to raise the price for access for normal users just so we might prevent the occasional unscrupulous web marketers from spamming the site.

And since there seems to be a vigilant set of self-link-exposing vigilantes on the site, I think they go a long way to keeping the problem at bay, even if it means we have to endure a length of time where otherwise normal and intelligent users resort to throwing their own poop around before the admins can delete the offending thread.
posted by crunchland at 9:50 PM on December 27, 2005

Just once, I'd like to take part in one of these self-linker threads, and let the drama unfurl around me. It's always so goddamn funny when they realize they've been caught—immediately they start being complete assholes, like they're angry at us for not being stupid enough to fall for their poorly-conceived publicity scheme.

Also, Milos is a funny name. Milos Milos Milos.
posted by jenovus at 11:20 PM on December 27, 2005

Yeah, but Milos Bosanac is an even funnier name.
posted by bshort at 11:53 PM on December 27, 2005

hahahahaha
posted by Edible Energy at 12:29 AM on December 28, 2005

The Vonity post hasn't been deleted from the Projects RSS feed.
posted by cillit bang at 3:15 AM on December 28, 2005

Well, im really sorry about your monkey problem...

Come on, guys, that was brilliant. We couldn't have kept him around for entertainment?
posted by nebulawindphone at 6:22 AM on December 28, 2005

stavros is two for two:

Which is the problem? Is the problem that the site is mine?

It can't be much clearer, can it?

Note: You read the guidelines, right? Because linking to your own site or a project you worked on in this space will result in a deletion and your account will be banned.



Dumbass.

posted by OmieWise at 6:30 AM on December 28, 2005