Comments on 12539

Congratulations, AskMe. This was a fantastic response to someone who probably thought she was losing her mind, the only person who ever felt like this or just plain evil. I felt so very sad for her when I read her question, and I'm glad she knows she's not alone in feeling like this.
posted by essexjan to MetaFilter-related at 3:17 AM (47 comments total)

Seconded.
posted by Wolof at 4:58 AM on August 20, 2006

This was a thread for the ages. To quote languagehat:

This thread all by itself justifies the existence of AskMe. Congratulations to all the people who posted those wonderful answers. I hope the poster takes them to heart.
posted by maryh at 5:02 AM on August 20, 2006

well done, mefi.
posted by terrapin at 5:16 AM on August 20, 2006

Fifthed. Great responses, and I hope they helped the poster.
posted by scarylarry at 5:25 AM on August 20, 2006

Wow, thanks for highlighting it. I avoided that question like the plague when I saw it, fully expecting an 'omigod! you need help now!" judgmental torrent. What a surprise to find so much thoughtfulness, acceptance and information instead.
posted by mediareport at 7:20 AM on August 20, 2006

Agreed. I saw the question before anyone answered and thought, "Uh oh, this is about to become a train wreck." Glad I was wrong.
posted by amro at 7:23 AM on August 20, 2006

Yeah, it went surprisingly well, with one glaring, fucked-up exception.

Guess whose and win a prize!
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 8:16 AM on August 20, 2006

Hitler?
posted by cortex at 8:42 AM on August 20, 2006

I was just telling someone this the other day. You know who I can't stand? Hitler. God, was he a bastard.
posted by SeizeTheDay at 8:48 AM on August 20, 2006

matteo..
posted by empath at 9:14 AM on August 20, 2006

It seems that the comment about getting a lawyer and terminating parental rights was deleted, which is a Good Thing, IMHO.
posted by needs more cowbell at 9:53 AM on August 20, 2006

This thread all by itself justifies the existence of AskMe.

I couldn't agree more. I'd also like to point out that it is basically therapyfilter. Those get deleted sometimes for no other reason.
posted by scarabic at 9:57 AM on August 20, 2006

Navel gazing. Lets all kiss each others asses over some anon question where everyone says the same thing over and over again. Good work, guys.
posted by bob sarabia at 10:17 AM on August 20, 2006 [3 favorites]

i was going to answer "start scouting dumpsters" but i thought some might react poorly to it.
posted by quonsar at 10:44 AM on August 20, 2006

Of course if the baby actually doesn't love its mother you guys are all red in the face!
posted by geoff. at 10:48 AM on August 20, 2006

i was going to answer "start scouting dumpsters" but i thought some might react poorly to it.
posted by quonsar at 1:44 PM EST

Laughing at that comment was Reason #4721 I Am Going To Hell.
posted by marxchivist at 11:02 AM on August 20, 2006

bob sarabia writes "Navel gazing. Lets all kiss each others asses over some anon question where everyone says the same thing over and over again. Good work, guys."

It may not have been entertaining to you, but it probably helped her hearing it from so many people.
posted by brundlefly at 12:00 PM on August 20, 2006

Navel gazing. Lets all kiss each others asses over some anon question where everyone says the same thing over and over again. Good work, guys.

Seconded.
posted by the cuban at 12:11 PM on August 20, 2006

Man, tough crowd! Every question can't be "how do I fix this thingie that broke on my computer", bob&cuban.
posted by Justinian at 12:54 PM on August 20, 2006

perhaps bob's just mad 'cause his mom never did learn to love him?
posted by scody at 1:04 PM on August 20, 2006

Bob, in this case I think the huge number of people giving her positive reinforcement was exactly the point. She felt very alone, and now she must realize that quite a lot of people have had the same problem. That's gotta be a real relief to someone in her position.
I give her a lot of credit for asking this in the first place. Anonymous or not, it must have been difficult for her.
posted by maryh at 2:16 PM on August 20, 2006

Well, it had a lot going for it from the beginning. Not about politics or religion, not containing its own answer, not asking for permission to continue doing something obviously wrong like over-drinking or being the other women etc, and not asking something google might answer more quickly.

It is curious though, 'best' answer evar? Why again? Ah, it's not really the answser but the behavior, the hive got to show a little genuine humanity absent the usual snark. So best answer? Not so sure about that logically speaking. But best behavior? Sure, could be alrighty.

I'd still maintain parenthetically though, the snark is the essence, the precious bodily fluid.
posted by scheptech at 2:27 PM on August 20, 2006

Nah, the snark is a boojum.
posted by kindall at 2:40 PM on August 20, 2006

Let's make a descision here then- snark covers boojum, boojum sprays monkey, monkey eats snark. Okay, GO!,/i>
posted by maryh at 2:44 PM on August 20, 2006

snark is not what the money eats. Though the correct answer does start with s and end with k.
posted by nanojath at 2:57 PM on August 20, 2006

I'm with scheptech and/or bob. Congratulations, we're not jackasses.

(sorry)
posted by cillit bang at 3:13 PM on August 20, 2006

Not all therapy posts are the same, some of them probably DO need to be deleted. This one was about a very serious problem that isn't talked about much, which leaves a person feeling isolated when it happens. The various respones let the original poster that they weren't alone in their feelings

Brandon Blatcher, you don't have to convince me it was a good thread. I already agree with that. When you say "not all therapy posts are the same," do you want to elaborate on the ins and outs of which deserve to be deleted and why? Here I am reaching for some guidelines again... or at least something more than "this seemed like a good one."

Venting a feeling and then having a bunch of people tell you you're not alone and you should see a shrink is characteristic of all therapyfilter/supportfilter questions. And "very serious serious problem that isn't talked about much" covers a wide range of stuff I doubt would be tolerated. So I'm still wondering as to the content of this approval decision.

My guess is that it was well written and about having babies.
posted by scarabic at 4:50 PM on August 20, 2006

Yes, it was therapy filter. But really, being assy about it is stupid. I was happy to see some men chiming in, personally, when this was another one of those topics that could have easily descended into "Ew! GIRL-FILTER!!" It is therefore somewhat rightfully that MeFi pat itself on the back for not resorting to assholetry, what with the "Guy Zone" issues that crop up from time to time.

And my guess, FWIW, is that it was about a facet of depression that is not very much talked about and that is viewed as unique in how it isolates the sufferer from her family and support system. This isn't your run-of-the-mill "I don't feel well and I think it's because I've gone off my Wellbutrin, what should I do?" post. Hell, I don't have or want children and I can see the post's and responses' merit.
posted by Medieval Maven at 4:56 PM on August 20, 2006

It may not have been entertaining to you, but it probably helped her hearing it from so many people.

I don't think he meant the AskMe thread. The askme thread was nice. This MeTa back-smacking congratulations is disguisting, however. I hate it when these "This is Why We are So Great" threads come up.

Much like the thread in question, I'm sure a lot of people feel this way but are afraid to bring it up. Thank you, brave Bob.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 5:40 PM on August 20, 2006 [1 favorite]

scarabic : "So I'm still wondering as to the content of this approval decision.

My guess is that it was well written and about having babies."

I'd say "yes, but it isn't that being about babies makes it good, it's that people avoided going apeshit about it despite it being about babies". That is, lots of posts get answered with "that's normal, maybe see a therapist", but those are posts without touchy issues. This is more along the lines of a good thread about obesity, circumcision, Israel/Palestine, or the like: people are happy that it avoided the usual shitmire despite the subject.
posted by bugbread at 6:07 PM on August 20, 2006

Civil_Disobedient : "This MeTa back-smacking congratulations is disguisting, however."

I dunno, positive reinforcement is nice occassionally. A constant stream of "go us!" is annoying, but every once in a while someone bringing up the community doing something well instead of doing something poorly is a nice change of pace.
posted by bugbread at 6:09 PM on August 20, 2006

What bugbread said.

Nice to see something besides sock puppet cpnventions, demands for people's heads, petty demands for Matt to come to people's houses and personally read FPPs to them 'cause they can't be arsed, Hoorah For Atheism seminars, this is not the best of my web whining, and gifs that everyone's seen already.

Don't like it?

Skip it.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 6:28 PM on August 20, 2006

Exactly what shitmire could have appeared? Who has "women who maybe don't love their babies" on their hitlist?

"I have established a zionist state but I'm not sure I love it like I should"
posted by cillit bang at 6:31 PM on August 20, 2006 [1 favorite]

Exactly what shitmire could have appeared?

*shudders to think*
posted by mediareport at 6:42 PM on August 20, 2006

True cillit bang, all MeFites are known throughout the land for their sensitivity, their nonjudgemental nature, and their enlightened attitude towards mental health and children.

After reading the AskMe, the first thing I thought after "That poor woman," was "I wonder how many 'Too late for the wire hanger/I hear Andrea Yates is adopting/Did you know 80% of all infant deaths occur in the tub? Just sayin', is all...' jokes there are so far?"

For me this MeTa isn't about how swell we are as it is a sigh of relief.

puke & cry said:

Navel gazing. Lets all kiss each others asses over some anon question where everyone says the same thing over and over again. Good work, guys.

Should be:

For once the assholes didn't shit all over something, and a member who needed to hear some kind words got them.
Good work, guys.

Don't worry, you guys can wow and amaze us with your Not Ready For SA antics tomorrow.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 6:57 PM on August 20, 2006

cillit bang : "Exactly what shitmire could have appeared? Who has 'women who maybe don't love their babies' on their hitlist?"

As far as "what kind of shitmire", well, when I saw the question I envisioned a lot of "you are a horrible and irresponsible person who shouldn't have had a baby in the first place" and the like.

As far as "who has 'women who maybe don't love their babies' on their hitlist", keep in mind that the way it was originally phrased, it would be "who has 'women who say they don't love their babies' on their hitlist", and I (and some others) assumed incorrectly that a good chunk of MeFi does. Perhaps a good chunk of MeFi has "people who really don't love their babies" on their hitlist, but I'm happy that MeFi had the maturity to understand that "people who say they don't love their babies" isn't necessarily identical to "people who don't and never will love their babies"
posted by bugbread at 7:00 PM on August 20, 2006

I envisioned a lot of "you are a horrible and irresponsible person who shouldn't have had a baby in the first place"

You expect people to millitantly argue for the loving of babies by their mothers?

You and Alvy have an incredibly dim view of assholes. On sites like MeFi they do it to be clever and impress each other, and outright cruel stuff like Alvy's sugggestions don't do that. There just isn't a good hook in that question.
posted by cillit bang at 7:20 PM on August 20, 2006

cillit bang : "You expect people to millitantly argue for the loving of babies by their mothers?"

Nope. I expect people to be angry and attack, to (as you say) impress others with how much more moral and loving and iconoclastic and individualistic and socially conscious and the like they are. And, as you say, to be clever and snarky and quick-with-the-snapbacks.

Basically, I like MeFi, but I've noticed a strong propensity for Outrage and Snark, about pretty much anything, so I expected Outrage and Snark in the thread, and got pretty much zero of the first and maybe one comment of the second. I was impressed.

Obviously, in a sense, I was wrong to be impressed. That is, since MeFi was non-Outraged and non-Snarky, my assessment of MeFi's Outrage and Snark propensities was obviously wrong in the first place. I'm just happy that I was wrong, that's all.
posted by bugbread at 7:27 PM on August 20, 2006

So I'm still wondering as to the content of this approval decision.

I can't rememebr ever deleting something as TherapyFilter. Very rarely someone will post something that seems to obviously point to the fact that they have a fairly serious mental problem and the thread turns into a trainwreck. I've seen that once, maybe twice. There isn't any rule or guideline about therapyfilter posts just that, like any posts, if they're too stupid they sometimes won't get approved.
posted by jessamyn at 7:35 PM on August 20, 2006

I agree that it's nice to see someone saying the community handled something nicely and helpfully. Had essexjan posted some sort of long comment in that thread and was here congratulating herself it might be odd, but I liked that several people who couldn't offer answers nevertheless supported everyone who could. That's how a community should work, and I think it's right to acknowledge when it does work that way.
posted by occhiblu at 7:44 PM on August 20, 2006

Nope. I expect people to be angry and attack, to (as you say) impress others with how much more moral and loving and iconoclastic and individualistic and socially conscious and the like they are. And, as you say, to be clever and snarky and quick-with-the-snapbacks.

"Well I loved my baby the day she was born, so you suck."

It just doesn't work. The question as asked was far too nuanced and reasonable to be worth fighting about.
posted by cillit bang at 7:48 PM on August 20, 2006

Are you implying I don't know anything about being an asshole?

And if so, can I get that in writing to show my mother?
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 7:59 PM on August 20, 2006

cillit bang : "The question as asked was far too nuanced and reasonable to be worth fighting about."

Apparently, you're right. I was under the assumption that, for a lot of folks here (but, obviously, not so many that I would go cancel my MeFi account or anything) there is nothing too nuanced or reasonable to prevent Righteous Indignation. I was wrong.

But I think we grok eachother now.
posted by bugbread at 9:16 PM on August 20, 2006

I thought matteo's answer, when it appeared in the thread, was a taste of more, and worse, to come. But it wasn't.

Although there's no way to know and it's all just supposition, I think the thread went well because it started well and, more importantly, in doing so it probably educated a number of the people who otherwise would have been inclined to react with judgment and hostility. When you see a significant number of women—non-anonymous women—answer the question with anecdotes about how they, too, didn't love their babies during the first few months (or longer), it tells you something. It tells you that it's normal and that this doesn't mean the questioner is destined to be a lousy parent. (And hurrah! for the women who had the courage to describe on the permanent web their similar experiences.)

After seeing so many of those answers, I suspect the only type of person who would likely still answer with hostility would be those who brought their own issues (inappropriately identifying with the child) to the discussion.

One lesson that could be learned from this—and has been learned from similar threads—is that a sufficient quantity of early and good answers can keep a potential trainwreck from happening. Like I said, though, we know that already in the context of the entire site, not just AskMe. (And the converse: a small number of bad early comments can ensure the trainwreck.)
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 11:41 PM on August 20, 2006

Can we have a life-affirming thread about the health of a pet cat now? Because I want a reversal of the "YOUR CAT IS GOING TO DIE BECAUSE IT SNEEZED!" trend. Seriously. Ask Metafilter Armchair Cat Vets, drink in this thread deeply.
posted by Mayor Curley at 7:21 PM on August 21, 2006

I don't think he meant the AskMe thread. The askme thread was nice. This MeTa back-smacking congratulations is disguisting, however. I hate it when these "This is Why We are So Great" threads come up.

Much like the thread in question, I'm sure a lot of people feel this way but are afraid to bring it up. Thank you, brave Bob.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 7:40 PM CST on August 20 [+ 1] [!]

Right, that is what I was talking about. I don't really care about the question, just the congratulatory-metatalk-ass-slapping.
posted by bob sarabia at 10:29 PM on August 21, 2006

August 20, 2006 3:17 AM Subscribe

August 20, 2006
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