Comments on: =Noise? Derail? Breaks the guidelines?

=Noise? Derail? Breaks the guidelines?

msalt — Thu, 22 May 2008 11:43:08 -0800

Can we add a flag for trolling? Or is this covered under one of the existing flags?

By: Brandon Blatcher

Brandon Blatcher — Thu, 22 May 2008 11:45:59 -0800

yeah, and how about the ability to search favorites by username?

By: cortex

cortex — Thu, 22 May 2008 11:52:12 -0800

The thing is, "troll" is a charged and overloaded term. If someone is being noisy, it's noise; if you think it's a derail, flag it as such. If they're breaking the guidelines, they're breaking the guidelines.

If a comment isn't doing any of those things—if you really don't think any apply—then we're basically talking about adding a new flag as an excuse to mark stuff you don't like. Send us a contact email, maybe, if you see a hard-to-quantify emergent issue with a specific user.

By: ND¢

ND¢ — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:06:01 -0800

Oh what you need a new flag just to protect your precious feelings from "trolls"? I guess that is fine if you are too sensitive to man up and have a conversation with the grown folks. Let me guess, you are a woman right?

Hold on. I've got to run. I am getting my baby circumcised and I have to drop the cat off for declawing on my way there.

Also fat people need to stop eating so much pie, Bush is great, accept Jesus or go to hell where the gays and those that believe in evolution live and something about black people.

By: cortex

cortex — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:08:27 -0800

As a point of example, it wouldn't be unreasonable to flag a non-ironic version of ND¢'s comment there as "offensive", either.

By: kbanas

kbanas — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:10:58 -0800

ND¢ - you're getting the little bugger vaccinated, aren't you?

By: Mister_A

Mister_A — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:12:30 -0800

Flagged as ND¢.

By: Mister_A

Mister_A — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:18:16 -0800

Oh, and another thing–we prefer to be called "Infrapontine Humanoid Caprivores," or even "Caprivore-Americans," as appropriate.

By: kbanas

kbanas — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:20:34 -0800

Say what you will about the tenants of National Socialism, dude, but at least it's an ethos.

By: middleclasstool

middleclasstool — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:22:48 -0800

ND¢ - you're getting the little bugger vaccinated, aren't you?

Be sure to use the stuff with the preservatives that they store in BPA plastic bottles.

By: Fuzzy Skinner

Fuzzy Skinner — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:24:31 -0800

But the billy goats gruff have a hard enough time selecting the right flag reason already with thier clumsy hooves. Adding another to the list will just add to the problem.

By: Dizzy

Dizzy — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:26:40 -0800

My great-grandma used to live in the National Socialsim building too, kbanas!
Always paid her rent on time; she was an excellent tenant.

By: Plutor

Plutor — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:33:37 -0800

And that's why I love MetaFilter.

By: bardic

bardic — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:40:38 -0800

tenets

By: Dizzy

Dizzy — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:49:05 -0800

george

By: Pastabagel

Pastabagel — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:49:36 -0800

As a point of example, it wouldn't be unreasonable to flag a non-ironic version of ND¢'s comment there as "offensive", either.
posted by cortex at 3:08 PM on May 22

Yeah, but what if we want to flag his ironic comment as 'ironic'? Or better yet, what if I want to flag it as 'sardonic'? Where the hell is our 'sardonic' flag?

The sardonic flag looks like the Jolly Roger, only with square-rimmed glasses and a wry smile.

By: brain_drain

brain_drain — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:49:38 -0800

we're basically talking about adding a new flag as an excuse to mark stuff you don't like

Yes, please!

By: kbanas

kbanas — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:49:50 -0800

Aw, now I get what Dizzy was getting at.

Stupid words. I hate them all.

By: brain_drain

brain_drain — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:50:56 -0800

Even kumquat?

By: ssg

ssg — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:55:12 -0800

When someone is obviously trolling, dropping a quick "Please don't feed the troll" can be pretty effective. Obviously, you want to make sure that you aren't calling comments that you just happen to disagree with trolling, but when it is clear that someone is trolling publicly ignoring them is probably going to have better long term effects than deletion.

By: kbanas

kbanas — Thu, 22 May 2008 12:57:36 -0800

Even kumquat?

Especially kumquat.

By: Shepherd

Shepherd — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:03:19 -0800

I paid $5 to join MetaFilter in part because I heard it was a well-moderated site, and I figure part of that service is having moderators that can look at a multi-flagged post or comment and discern what the problem is, even if the flags aren't precisely worded to pin that problem down.

If a mod can't figure out what's wrong with a post/comment without a specific flag, it's probably not that problematic.

By: Dizzy

Dizzy — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:03:22 -0800

The "q-u" thing always pissed me off too, kb.
Q is such a NEEDY letter.

By: mr_crash_davis

mr_crash_davis — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:24:06 -0800

"Say what you will about the tenants of National Socialism, dude, but at least it's an ethos."

I always figured landlords were Nazis.

By: shmegegge

shmegegge — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:26:37 -0800

for what it's worth, on those rare occasions when I flag a comment, I'm often hesitant to use the "Offensive" flag because, being concatenated as it is with the Racism and Sexism flags, I assume it's a catch-all for any sort of -ism (jingoism, ageism, etc...) that comes down to some form of prejudice or discrimination.

The end result is that, while I technically consider someone being an asshole to be offensive, I don't flag it as such because I'm worried that, if I did, then the mods would be less likely to pay attention to flags from me. Perhaps they'd consider such flags little more than boy-who-cried-wolf style attempts to paint someone as a racist when in fact I just feel offended by their general prickishness.

What I'm saying is I think the "offensive" flag seems more specific than perhaps it is, and that it might be nice to make it plainer that the offensive flag also applies to jerks.

By: shmegegge

shmegegge — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:27:55 -0800

if, in fact, it does. if it doesn't, then I suppose we don't have any flag for jerks at all, and maybe that's the way it's supposed to be.

By: stet

stet — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:31:25 -0800

*qoph qoph*

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:41:45 -0800

The end result is that, while I technically consider someone being an asshole to be offensive, I don't flag it as such because I'm worried that, if I did, then the mods would be less likely to pay attention to flags from me.

If that's true, if that result is true, that would be disappointing, but it would not reflect poorly on you.

In the end, if you think a comment or post is offensive, you should flag it, and not worry about whether someone else interprets it in good or bad faith.

If you (in general) hold back from flagging because how someone on the other end may or may not interpret that act of flagging, that breaks the entire purpose of flagging. If the person on the other end assumes bad faith, it wouldn't matter much what you flagged to begin with, right or wrong.

By: Burhanistan

Burhanistan — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:46:50 -0800

Isn't this begging the question or something?

By: shmegegge

shmegegge — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:50:02 -0800

If the person on the other end assumes bad faith, it wouldn't matter much what you flagged to begin with, right or wrong.

Well, I'm not avoiding flagging because I think bad faith will be assumed because I'm me. I'm avoiding it because I think bad faith could be interpreted if my understanding of the flag differs from that of the mods. So, generally, I try to address things that are important enough to me in the thread and take my lumps if they're coming. (otherwise I just ignore it) That way, there's no confusion as to what I'm trying to say.

this is also kind of why I don't like flags in the first place. I understand their utility, and that's more important, but on the whole I think they're kind of a bullshit tattle tale way of pointing at someone behind their back and saying "unclean!"

By: sveskemus

sveskemus — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:53:57 -0800

We should only have two flags, good and bad. The mods have brains.

By: Dave Faris

Dave Faris — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:55:57 -0800

When in doubt, flag as "other."

By: Artw

Artw — Thu, 22 May 2008 13:57:20 -0800

Trading out "obnoxious" for "offensive" in the text of the offensive/sexism/racism flag might meet shmegegges concerns.

By: SeizeTheDay

SeizeTheDay — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:01:58 -0800

Is it possible to have a page setup to show which posts and comments I flagged, and whether or not anything was eventually done about it? Because I'd like statistical proof that my flags are in fact more effective that your average poster at guiding moderation on this site. Quite frankly, I've always known that my opinion counted more than everyone elses; I would just like to see explicit proof of this.

I'd also like every thread to have a topless scene. Sometimes the comments here are a bit inane; some soft core porn would definitely liven things up.

By: dirtdirt

dirtdirt — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:05:48 -0800

A couple times a day I find myself trying to apply the asshole flag.

By: empath

empath — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:15:43 -0800

derail = troll.

By: blue_beetle

blue_beetle — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:17:55 -0800

At least there is one thing that we can all agree on: Iraq deserved to be invaded; it was the best thing America has ever done.

By: Krrrlson

Krrrlson — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:20:53 -0800

I believe I speak for all of us when I say homosexuality is a sin and must be prayed out HARD.

By: languagehat

languagehat — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:22:50 -0800

When someone is obviously trolling, dropping a quick "Please don't feed the troll" can be pretty effective.

Really? Because I'm not sure I've ever seen it work around here. People love feeding the troll. He does this cute little happy dance after you toss him the troll food.

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:25:34 -0800

Don't feed the trolls.

By: acoutu

acoutu — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:28:17 -0800

If you flag it as a troll, 50% of users will eat their words and the other 50% will throw them out.

By: sfenders

sfenders — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:32:13 -0800

There's already a way to flag for trolling: You just click the little [+] symbol. Understandable that you missed it, maybe it should be merged in with the other flags.

By: puke & cry

puke & cry — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:32:24 -0800

Really? Because I'm not sure I've ever seen it work around here. People love feeding the troll. He does this cute little happy dance after you toss him the troll food.

Plus, the "don't feed the troll" thing is just another way of feeding the troll.

By: krautland

krautland — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:41:40 -0800

how about allowing users to selectively ignore other users?

By: shmegegge

shmegegge — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:43:57 -0800

also, "don't feed the troll" is a really great way to insult someone who isn't a troll that you simply disagree with.

By: scrump

scrump — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:44:19 -0800

I think we need a flag for "I don't like this".

By: self

self — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:46:41 -0800

Can we also have ~~pennants~~ flags for our favorite baseball teams?

By: Afroblanco

Afroblanco — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:54:25 -0800

How about a flag for "this mean-spirited, snarky comment doesn't deserve nearly this many favorites"

By: self

self — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:54:47 -0800

Also maybe give us an epony~~sterical~~ tag. Pleeease?

By: eyeballkid

eyeballkid — Thu, 22 May 2008 14:55:09 -0800

Some more flags we need:

* Too right-wing
* M$ lover
* Religious nutjob
* Likes rich people
* SUV driver
* Drinks Starbucks coffee
* quonsar

By: languagehat

languagehat — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:02:52 -0800

*flags eyeballkid's comment as "quonsar"*

By: shmegegge

shmegegge — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:03:16 -0800

* I hate you all.

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:05:46 -0800

* Spartacus

By: eyeballkid

eyeballkid — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:06:43 -0800

Damn shmegegge, how could I miss that one?

By: ottereroticist

ottereroticist — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:27:18 -0800

I don't understand why we have "derail," "noise," and "breaks the guidelines."

Don't derails and noise both break the guidelines? And aren't derails a form of noise?

I'd happily trade "derail" for "obnoxious."

By: Daddy-O

Daddy-O — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:32:26 -0800

I think this place could use a "Christ what an asshole" tag.

By: Daddy-O

Daddy-O — Thu, 22 May 2008 15:32:53 -0800

I think this place could use a "Christ what an asshole" tag.

Christ what an asshole!!!

By: seanyboy

seanyboy — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:06:26 -0800

This would be a better idea if the majority of people on metafilter actually understood what trolling was.

By: dersins

dersins — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:15:52 -0800

This would be a better idea if the majority of people on metafilter actually understood what trolling was.

You would make your point more effectively if you didn't mispell "trolling."

By: maxwelton

maxwelton — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:17:39 -0800

This would be a better idea if the majority of people on metafilter actually understood what trolling was.

Flagged.

By: Deep Dish

Deep Dish — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:19:02 -0800

I think this place could use a "Christ what an asshole" tag

I would like the "Christ what an asshole" tag data fed into a database which runs some calculations against your number of comments and provides an "asshole rating" which displays alongside ones' username whenever posting/commenting.

By: fixedgear

fixedgear — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:20:58 -0800

Isn't trolling a sort of fishing? I like fish.

By: Ufez Jones

Ufez Jones — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:21:04 -0800

I dunno. I'm thinking we should have a strictly MeTa-based "overly-masturbatory" flag.

I'd sure as hell use it right about now.

By: Dave Faris

Dave Faris — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:22:57 -0800

I think there are some of us whose number would completely throw off the formatting of the site. Well... I guess you could use scientific notation.

By: everichon

everichon — Thu, 22 May 2008 16:53:28 -0800

I just want to know if Jess, Cortex et al do some kind of formal taking-down of the flags at the end of each day. Do they go into a special chest? Are they folded a certain way?

*presses nose to glass*

By: Armitage Shanks

Armitage Shanks — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:05:40 -0800

A couple times a day I find myself trying to apply the asshole flag.

You need to grease it up first.

By: Afroblanco

Afroblanco — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:15:25 -0800

I just want to know if Jess, Cortex et al do some kind of formal taking-down of the flags at the end of each day. Do they go into a special chest? Are they folded a certain way?

Yes. Matt and Jess fold the flags while Cortex plays Taps on a noseflute.

By: netbros

netbros — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:22:22 -0800

That's Matt and Jessamyn on the sidewalk.

By: scrump

scrump — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:28:22 -0800

I just want to know if Jess, Cortex et al do some kind of formal taking-down of the flags at the end of each day. Do they go into a special chest? Are they folded a certain way?

Fold the flag in half "fantastic"-wise twice. If done by two, then the "noise" field should be facing the bottom on the first fold. Fold up a triangle, starting at the "derail" end, and repeat until only the end of "breaks the guidelines" is exposed. Then fold down the square into a triangle and tuck inside "other".

By: mimo

mimo — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:32:28 -0800

Mispell was a joke, right? The humor here is so suptle.

By: everichon

everichon — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:39:43 -0800

I think it was a clever use of missdirection.

By: mimo

mimo — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:41:53 -0800

Ah, my misstake.

By: phearlez

phearlez — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:49:15 -0800

Personally I'm holding out for the "buzzkill" flag.

By: Sys Rq

Sys Rq — Thu, 22 May 2008 17:56:13 -0800

* Meh.

By: msalt

msalt — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:08:26 -0800

This would be a better idea if the majority of people on metafilter actually understood what trolling was.

Well, I'm using it in the sense of "just trying to rile people up and piss them off by pushing hot buttons", and I have added "don't feed" comments where I would consider flagging. I guess I'm not clear if that constitutes Derail or Noise; or whether there's any need to flag because the comment makes the point sufficiently.

To be direct, it's just one new user (BrooklynCouch) who seems pretty consistently to be taking positions designed to piss off MeFites and provoke predictable arguments, rather than sincerely making a point. I'm think I'm pretty aware of the danger of mistaking something I disagree with for trolling; this is the first time I've felt this was going on clearly in the few months I've been here. Suggesting drilling for oil in ANWR, for example, or saying that "atheism reflects a poverty of thought, and a lack of appreciation of the universe, including of love and evil."

Not that these are inappropriate comments per se, but in the context of Metafilter in general and those posts in particular, I sense that they are designed to provoke a specific reaction.

By: msalt

msalt — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:10:55 -0800

By the way, what do the mods do with "Fantastic Comment" flags?

By: jonmc

jonmc — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:21:35 -0800

By the way, what do the mods do with "Fantastic Comment" flags?

sew them into bikinis which they wear while doing a jaunty dance.

By: Dillonlikescookies

Dillonlikescookies — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:28:50 -0800

rub them all over their oiled up bodies.

By: Artw

Artw — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:35:30 -0800

msalt - that worked pretty well as well - I removed it from activity, but as far as I know that arguments still going. Still, I guess there was a certain kind of inevitability to it given the subject of the FPP.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:55:59 -0800

I just though of something: when Madonna becomes menopausal, I predict she'll do an album called Hot Flash.

By: msalt

msalt — Thu, 22 May 2008 18:58:28 -0800

Yeah, maybe I'm still just an idealistic newbie, thinking we can do better and avoid these sandtraps. There are moments in discussions I love, where people chime in with comments like "Well, then." that mark obnoxious behavior and often squelch it with subtly and grace.

By: Lentrohamsanin

Lentrohamsanin — Thu, 22 May 2008 19:13:27 -0800

Not that these are inappropriate comments per se, but in the context of Metafilter in general and those posts in particular, I sense that they are designed to provoke a specific reaction.

It's really hard to take that as a good faith argument msalt, especial since it starts by assuming bad faith on brooklyncouch's part. That is, it's hard for me to believe that you're not conflating disliking his views with assuming he's trolling.

By: dirigibleman

dirigibleman — Thu, 22 May 2008 19:25:54 -0800

OH!

INDECENT!

This thread's been useful, after all!

By: jessamyn

jessamyn — Thu, 22 May 2008 19:35:27 -0800

There are basically three sorts of flags

- fantastic = mods please sidebar
- breaks the guidelines/display error/offensive = mods please look at quickly
- noise/derail/double = mods please look at with normal speed (unless there are a ton of doubles)

Really it should just be +/0/- but this evolved organically. All the rest is just details. We don't need a troll flag.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Thu, 22 May 2008 19:58:39 -0800

Well, then.

By: msalt

msalt — Thu, 22 May 2008 20:16:43 -0800

Thanks, jessamyn. V. helpful.

It's really hard to take that as a good faith argument msalt, especial since it starts by assuming bad faith on brooklyncouch's part. That is, it's hard for me to believe that you're not conflating disliking his views with assuming he's trolling.

I understand, totally, and wouldn't say anything of this out loud if I wasn't pretty sure. I don't know how to establish that I'm not doing that with certainty; obviously it's subjective. I'm a newbie here but I've been in online discussions since 1991 (on the WELL); I may be projecting unfairly from past experience but it's a gut feeling based on experience.

If I were to analyze it, it would be the combination of saying the perfectly inflammatory thing, not really defending his points after throwing the bombs, and certain phrases like "poverty of thought" which seem calculated to irritate.

By: klangklangston

klangklangston — Thu, 22 May 2008 20:46:09 -0800

Can we have a flag that says "Please close this and get back to your Scrabulous, mods, because I have some killer letters and want to play?"

Also, can y'all just cause less trouble? Sheesh. You're distracting them from the very important Facebook games they're playing.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Thu, 22 May 2008 20:51:05 -0800

yes, distract the mods with Scrabulous, and we can get on with lynching brooklyncouch, now that msalt has stopped pussyfooting around.

By: jessamyn

jessamyn — Thu, 22 May 2008 20:51:10 -0800

All right all right, your turn.

By: flabdablet

flabdablet — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:15:02 -0800

I spy with my little eye something beginning.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:22:27 -0800

hm, let me see, let me see...

S-N-A-O-R-U-Q

nope, can't make anything useful out of that. i'll have to pass this turn.

By: dersins

dersins — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:28:16 -0800

Too bad you don't have a lowercase "q".

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:40:22 -0800

yeh, then i could flip it upside-down to make a "b".

still wouldn't help much...best i can come up with is "suborn" - only six letters, leaving me with an unused "a".

By: Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America

Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:40:31 -0800

Isn't this whole site a troll, when it comes down to it?

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:54:12 -0800

it's as if he was summoned!

By: It's Raining Florence Henderson

It's Raining Florence Henderson — Thu, 22 May 2008 21:56:43 -0800

"atheism reflects a poverty of thought, and a lack of appreciation of the universe, including of love and evil."

I don't see why anyone would consider that a troll against atheists. Let's break it down:
1) "atheism reflects" - Okay - What else reflects? A mirror. Atheism = a mirror. Seems about right. No argument here.
2) Who's observing the mirror and passing judgement? That would be BrooklynCouch.
3) What does one usually see in a mirror? That's right: One's own reflection.
4) What did BrooklynCouch see reflected in atheism? "a poverty of thought, and a lack of appreciation of the universe, including of love and evil"
5) Whose poverty of thought, and a lack of appreciation of the universe, including of love and evil was BrooklynCouch witnessing? Caution: Trolls in mirror may be closer than they appear.

By: Kwine

Kwine — Thu, 22 May 2008 22:28:57 -0800

I be a mirror.

By: GuyZero

GuyZero — Thu, 22 May 2008 22:36:04 -0800

how about allowing users to selectively ignore other users?

Oh! OOOHHHH!!!!

And how about we make a hierarchy of subjects into which we'd divide MetaFiler posts! And we could transmit them from server to server with NNTP!!! And instead of a browser we could read MetaFilter with 'rn'!!!!!!

And then September would come...The September That Never Ended.

By: jessamyn

jessamyn — Thu, 22 May 2008 22:42:54 -0800

snarquo?

By: nebulawindphone

nebulawindphone — Thu, 22 May 2008 22:49:35 -0800

Quorns. Still stuck with that A, though.

By: msalt

msalt — Thu, 22 May 2008 23:06:12 -0800

Quorans! Once again, the Islam-bashing rears its ugly head. I should have known.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Thu, 22 May 2008 23:32:14 -0800

On the bright side, you get 50 bonus points for using all your letters.

By: Dillonlikescookies

Dillonlikescookies — Fri, 23 May 2008 01:44:52 -0800

metatalk is the best fun i've had in ages

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 23 May 2008 01:56:26 -0800

that doesn't say much for friday nights in the land of the long white yawn.

By: Marie Mon Dieu

Marie Mon Dieu — Fri, 23 May 2008 02:28:35 -0800

Squaro, keeping the N so I can spell "ninja" next time.

By: Kirth Gerson

Kirth Gerson — Fri, 23 May 2008 02:59:48 -0800

I think we need a flag for "I don't like this".

This is a good idea, but only if no one but the flagger could see it, and if that fact was never revealed.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 23 May 2008 03:08:57 -0800

INVISIBLE FLAG!

By: fixedgear

fixedgear — Fri, 23 May 2008 04:14:54 -0800

Do ya think Emily Gould sits on a BrooklynCouch? Just askin'...

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 23 May 2008 04:41:56 -0800

Do ya think fixedgear sits on a BrooklynCouch? Just askin'...

By: BrooklynCouch

BrooklynCouch — Fri, 23 May 2008 06:19:22 -0800

Only for an hourly fee.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 23 May 2008 06:50:48 -0800

$20, same as in town?

By: klangklangston

klangklangston — Fri, 23 May 2008 08:45:00 -0800

"All right all right, your turn."

Thanks. I lied about the good letters. Your turn.

(Also, the best words I could come up with out of Ubu's jumbled mass were Sonar and Qua. No Quran—while Bible is an accepted word, none of the variations of Koran that I could think of were accepted by the scrabble dictionary).

By: BrooklynCouch

BrooklynCouch — Fri, 23 May 2008 09:51:27 -0800

$175/hour.

By: msalt

msalt — Fri, 23 May 2008 10:48:23 -0800

Really?! Do you handle divorces in Oregon?

By: Mister_A

Mister_A — Fri, 23 May 2008 11:49:21 -0800

No, but I handle devices in organs!

By: Your Time Machine Sucks

Your Time Machine Sucks — Fri, 23 May 2008 12:02:41 -0800

The Scrabble dictionary wouldn't let me play Voudun either. That trolling Scrabble dictionary hates religion, is what.

By: Sys Rq

Sys Rq — Fri, 23 May 2008 13:15:22 -0800

S-N-A-O-R-U-Q

QUOAN. To QUOAN something. You need a medical dictionary.

By: Sys Rq

Sys Rq — Fri, 23 May 2008 13:17:00 -0800

(It's not Bible that is an accepted Scrabble word, but bible.)

By: BrooklynCouch

BrooklynCouch — Fri, 23 May 2008 14:18:44 -0800

This is one funny place!

By: klangklangston

klangklangston — Fri, 23 May 2008 14:23:38 -0800

Actually, it's BIBLE.

By: Sys Rq

Sys Rq — Fri, 23 May 2008 14:59:34 -0800

B₃I₁B₃L₁E₁, actually.

By: never used baby shoes

never used baby shoes — Fri, 23 May 2008 15:11:51 -0800

This is why you shouldn't play games with holy books. I mean, the Bible is only worth nine points!

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Fri, 23 May 2008 17:28:19 -0800

BrooklynCouch has been reminding me a bit of ParisParamus. Not a dead ringer, but there's something familiar about his ways.

By: Dillonlikescookies

Dillonlikescookies — Fri, 23 May 2008 17:45:31 -0800

that doesn't say much for friday nights in the land of the long white yawn.
i was waiting for my date to arrive you dick :P typical aussie >:D

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 23 May 2008 17:59:42 -0800

just snarkin', hey, cuz.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 23 May 2008 18:01:39 -0800

(and apart from two beers after work, i spent the rest of friday night at home!)

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Fri, 23 May 2008 19:55:12 -0800

Assuming that the web is public, and thus this email link can be public: confirmation?

My guess is that the LGF link this week brought him back to us. Yet another reason LGF should never, ever be linked on MeFi.

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 23 May 2008 20:34:19 -0800

Lay off HRC please

That's a very odd posting history.

By: dersins

dersins — Fri, 23 May 2008 20:54:09 -0800

Whoa, FFF. Good catch.

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Fri, 23 May 2008 21:15:42 -0800

My gut instincts and someone else's web savvy (speak up if you want, [redacted]).

The admins told him he was welcome to rejoin under a new name; that offer has been there since the perma-banning, afaik.

Can't say as I'm all that impressed with his return. I don't know if he's got other aliases in use, but this BC alias is repugnant. I hope it's soon banned. What a useless shitstain.

By: Dillonlikescookies

Dillonlikescookies — Fri, 23 May 2008 21:26:41 -0800

(and apart from two beers after work, i spent the rest of friday night at home!)
Metatalk: Better than outside :)

By: timeistight

timeistight — Fri, 23 May 2008 21:42:33 -0800

BrooklynCouch has been reminding me a bit of ParisParamus. Not a dead ringer, but there's something familiar about his ways.

Either way, I think it's a little earlier to have a lynching. Can't the mob wait until he actually does something wrong?

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Fri, 23 May 2008 22:41:18 -0800

Most of BCs comments are pretty innocuous so far. It's was a little much for me to say anything about banning.

I suppose I should have done everyone a favour and kept my mouth shut. Identifying BC as PP is akin to character assassination, and that isn't fair to him this early in his new alias.

On the other hand, it was through his behaviour I ended up with juju feelings. I didn't even look at his profile and mass-read his couple dozen comments until after the email that confirmed my suspicions.

So, meh. In the end, I don't give a shit one way or the other, so long as he isn't stupidly disruptive to the community.

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 23 May 2008 22:57:29 -0800

Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, was a duck under a previous username, shows every intention of continuing duck like behavior...

By: homunculus

homunculus — Fri, 23 May 2008 23:31:14 -0800

I suppose I should have done everyone a favour and kept my mouth shut.

I think you were right to identify him, but that doesn't mean he doesn't deserve another chance. If he can be a reasonable, responsible MeFi member, then we should welcome him back. But if he can't resist trolling, then he should be banned again. Since you identified him, people will be paying attention. Now it's up to him.

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Sat, 24 May 2008 00:17:01 -0800

I oppose gay marriage as flying in the face of four or five thousand years of civilization and religion.

He's trolling.

By: LiveLurker

LiveLurker — Sat, 24 May 2008 01:03:24 -0800

But how do those active in this community define "stupidly destructive to the community", five fresh fish? Msalt, who is fairly new, yet here long enough to get the Metafilter Community Vibe, went so far as to suggest we need a new flag for basically calling out responding members who don't subscribe to the same Vibe as the majority here. Fortunately Cortex recognized that, and commented early on in this thread. That was some nice reffing there, Cortex.

I really like this community. The FPP's are diverse. Some are fresh and current. Some are arcane. They nearly ALL work to make MetaFilter the wonderful space that it is online. AskMe's are extraordinary in their ability to help people with issues that are wide ranging. This is my favorite, come-to spot for diversity of content. There are, however, some issues, that I for one think should be more closely examined. I know I am not the first person to suggest this, but as a community, there is extremely low tolerance for diverse opinions on political and religious issues. Yeah I know there are some additional hot potatoes here, but let's focus on the big ones. There are some extremely bright and well-informed people here who make best case arguments for their points of view on the two hottest potatoes. I don't personally share the same view as the majority of commenters here, but I surely appreciate the passion of the stated views. I like to listen and to learn how"best thinkers" think, even and most particularly when I don't agree with them. And YES, it is entirely possible to call someone a "best thinker" even though you don't agree....because it makes you think. THINK is the operative word.

I am no "best thinker" OR "best speaker" for my current political or religious thinking, no matter how passionate I feel on these subjects. I would venture to guess that most here would say the same. So why is it then, that we fall so easily, and even lock-step, behind those who care to speak for us?

By: davejay

davejay — Sat, 24 May 2008 01:24:51 -0800

How about a shitcock flag? Can we have that?

By: Pope Guilty

Pope Guilty — Sat, 24 May 2008 01:24:51 -0800

Identifying BC as PP is akin to character assassination, and that isn't fair to him this early in his new alias.

Given that PP has an almost uniquely long history on this site of threadshitting, trolling, and general disruption, I think it's unfair to the rest of us for him to be able to just get a clean slate and start over again. There are situations in which clean slates are plausible and even perhaps desirable. Dhoyt springs to mind. PP spent years trolling Metafilter, and has gone right back to it the instant he got the chance. There's a valid place for the Brand New Day. Giving trolls who contribute nothing and don't desire to contribute anything to the site a chance to start over at zero opprobrium seems to me to be a massively bad use of the Brand New Day.

By: LiveLurker

LiveLurker — Sat, 24 May 2008 02:26:01 -0800

OR, a bad use of the MetaFilter "brand", Pope Guilty?

Perfect nic, by the way!;)

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sat, 24 May 2008 03:12:40 -0800

MeatFlitter: bad use of the Brand

By: Your Time Machine Sucks

Your Time Machine Sucks — Sat, 24 May 2008 04:12:55 -0800

The very idea that BC could be PP is a crock. A crock, I tells ya!

By: Your Time Machine Sucks

Your Time Machine Sucks — Sat, 24 May 2008 05:00:55 -0800

And while we're discussing crocks, I don't know if MetaMan was PP but they certainly had a similar response to the accusation of trolling, down to the "juvenile/grow up" detail. Maybe just similar types, with different political viewpoints but united in their disdain for the MSM. And the crock thing.

By: fixedgear

fixedgear — Sat, 24 May 2008 08:01:21 -0800

Didn't ParisParamus become SecaucusSeattle or something later?

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sat, 24 May 2008 08:25:42 -0800

Didn't ParisParamus become SecaucusSeattle or something later?

nah, FreedomCouch.

mmm...couch...

By: klangklangston

klangklangston — Sat, 24 May 2008 10:29:06 -0800

I sent FFF that link, as it has been sent to me by some previous (dunno if he wants outed) member. I can take no credit for clever googling.

But I'd argue that he's been rather innocuous so far, at least what I've seen (though I could just be being smug), and I'd argue that though you disagree with him, Blazecock, you might want to give him the benefit of the doubt for a while. And frankly, Pope Guilty, you're not someone who deals with disagreement well either.

By: msalt

msalt — Sat, 24 May 2008 10:52:49 -0800

benefit of the doubt

Well, I have no idea who or what ParisParasmus is, other in the reflected horror of the comments here. I've been here 6 months or so, not shy to mix it up with folks, not rarely struck by idiocy, but BrooklynCouch immediately leapt out at me as a troll, and no one else has. FWIW.

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Sat, 24 May 2008 12:10:09 -0800

I oppose gay marriage as flying in the face of four or five thousand years of civilization and religion.
He's trolling.

That sentence is perfectly innocuous in and of itself. Any of our respected members could say that and it wouldn't result in accusations of trolling.

Mind, at the same time they wouldn't dump that in a thread and then run away from the response. That's where the "threadshitting" part of his behaviour comes in: he can't and doesn't present a reasoned explanation for his position.

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Sat, 24 May 2008 12:16:50 -0800

There are, however, some issues, that I for one think should be more closely examined. I know I am not the first person to suggest this, but as a community, there is extremely low tolerance for diverse opinions on political and religious issues.

There is extremely low tolerance for opinions that express a desire to prevent others from having equality and peronal freedom, and opinions that are contrary to established fact. Do not mistake it for something else.

By: languagehat

languagehat — Sat, 24 May 2008 13:33:11 -0800

There is extremely low tolerance for opinions that express a desire to prevent others from having equality and peronal freedom, and opinions that are contrary to established fact.

While this is true, it is also true that a number of people have difficulty distinguishing opinions that express a desire to prevent others from having equality and peronal freedom and opinions that are contrary to established fact from opinions they personally find distasteful, and therefore they sweep them all under the same carpet and jump up and down on it.

By: goodnewsfortheinsane

goodnewsfortheinsane — Sat, 24 May 2008 14:44:37 -0800

As a data point, I engaged MetaMan once and found him markedly less eloquent than PP. YMMV.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sat, 24 May 2008 17:06:35 -0800

I hope that doesn't mean you were engaged to MetaMan. Because I oppose gay marriage as flying in the face of four or five thousand years of civilization and religion.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Sat, 24 May 2008 23:29:00 -0800

Because I oppose gay marriage as flying in the face of four or five thousand years of civilization and religion.

And when I say 'flying in the face', I mean flying in the face like a money shot in a porn video. In which the protagonist is a Roman Catholic priest, and his object of desire is a hot, muscular young choirboy who was just caught beating off while reading Jack Chick tracts and therefore needs to be taught a strong lesson about theology.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sun, 25 May 2008 01:15:24 -0800

That young choirboy needs a nice set of pearl rosary beads.

By: Your Time Machine Sucks

Your Time Machine Sucks — Sun, 25 May 2008 06:20:37 -0800

As a data point, I engaged MetaMan once and found him markedly less eloquent than PP.

Yeah, it's most likely just a crock-totin' type.

By: Sailormom

Sailormom — Sun, 25 May 2008 08:05:12 -0800

We don't need a new flag. We need a new hammer. The Trollhammaren.

By: Artw

Artw — Sun, 25 May 2008 21:32:02 -0800

MetaMan is 100% not this guy, right?

By: cortex

cortex — Sun, 25 May 2008 21:46:53 -0800

Correct.

By: msalt

msalt — Mon, 26 May 2008 20:52:02 -0800

MetaMan is about 28% ParisParamus. I'm about 5%, but only when I don't get enough sleep.

By: Artw

Artw — Tue, 27 May 2008 22:49:47 -0800

Global warming fun.

By: homunculus

homunculus — Tue, 27 May 2008 23:24:58 -0800

Oh well, so much for giving him the benefit of the doubt.

By: Burhanistan

Burhanistan — Tue, 27 May 2008 23:29:13 -0800

Check this thread also. That instance seems really blatant: "Hey guys! I misread the title so why don't I take a wholly unrelated dump in here!"

By: Artw

Artw — Wed, 28 May 2008 09:49:35 -0800

Why give him the benefit of the doubt? you know he's going to do it. It's not like theres a recorded instance of people giving a known troll teh benefit of the doubt ANYWHERE and it working out well.

By: homunculus

homunculus — Wed, 28 May 2008 13:49:10 -0800

Because I believe in second chances. I'm not a hardened cynic like you!

Can't we all just get along?

*weeps*