Why in hell was my comment deleted? February 3, 2012 9:55 AM Subscribe
Why in hell was my comment deleted?
In the I need something from the Department of Snappy Retorts thread my comment in its entirety was:
This is not the case-- very obviously not the case, quite frankly-- and I resent the implication.
I would like an explanation for the deletion and an apology for the damage to my reputation.
In the I need something from the Department of Snappy Retorts thread my comment in its entirety was:
But some people say, "Wow, he's really light-skinned," and follow it up with an enthused, "That's good!"The deletion of my comment implies I said something inappropriate and possibly racist.
'In case your daughter wants to marry him someday?'
This is not the case-- very obviously not the case, quite frankly-- and I resent the implication.
I would like an explanation for the deletion and an apology for the damage to my reputation.
Your reputation is secure.
Every comment I've had deleted was pretty much because I didn't flesh it out enough. This reads less like a snappy retort and more like a verbal slap, which is maybe not what the Asker wanted.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:00 AM on February 3, 2012
Every comment I've had deleted was pretty much because I didn't flesh it out enough. This reads less like a snappy retort and more like a verbal slap, which is maybe not what the Asker wanted.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:00 AM on February 3, 2012
Reputation? What reputation? Do you believe you are so closely followed that you have a reputation? Gotta say if you had just left this alone no one and I mean NO ONE would ever think about this again. As it is you have just opened up a forum for people to mock you. Whatever reputation you have is going to be so much more dinged by this MeTa then a silly deleted comment.
posted by edgeways at 10:01 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
posted by edgeways at 10:01 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
I can't help with the explanation as to why it was deleted, but if it isn't there any more then there is nothing there to damage your reputation (except this post). If it had remained as was getting flagged to death because people were misinterpreting that, that is their problem for misinterpreting but it is probably worse for your reputation as people can still see it and be mistaken.
posted by charred husk at 10:03 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by charred husk at 10:03 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
an apology for the damage to my reputation
Yes sir Mr. jam M. jam.
(BTW far fewer people would have known about this, and thus far less damage to your reputation, had you not said anything. The comment was gone, as though it had never been made, and we would all have been ignorant that it was deleted)
posted by Hoopo at 10:03 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
Yes sir Mr. jam M. jam.
(BTW far fewer people would have known about this, and thus far less damage to your reputation, had you not said anything. The comment was gone, as though it had never been made, and we would all have been ignorant that it was deleted)
posted by Hoopo at 10:03 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
I'm betting that your "reputation" is going to be more damaged by this metatalk thread than by deletion of your answer.
Whatever reputation you have is going to be so much more dinged by this MeTa then a silly deleted comment.
There's a kind of MetaTalk-as-Thunderdome groove that goes on here that I really dig sometimes.
posted by Shepherd at 10:05 AM on February 3, 2012 [7 favorites]
Whatever reputation you have is going to be so much more dinged by this MeTa then a silly deleted comment.
There's a kind of MetaTalk-as-Thunderdome groove that goes on here that I really dig sometimes.
posted by Shepherd at 10:05 AM on February 3, 2012 [7 favorites]
Oh yeah, jamjam. I know that guy (or gal, whatever). Very thin-skinned and hostile. Doesn't play well with others.
posted by Curious Artificer at 10:05 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by Curious Artificer at 10:05 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
I would like an explanation for the deletion and an apology for the damage to my reputation.
Been there, demanded that. I looked like a complete fool, which was fine because I was behaving like a complete fool. Learn from my mistakes and the mistakes of so many others and just ask "Hey, what's up with this" and quit worrying that other MeFites will think terrible of you, even if it's a goof on your part.
Get outta this thread, find a strip club, maybe do a little blow, you'll feel better. Just make sure it's not the good shit you're saving for when the East Coast kicks some West Coast ass this Super Bowl Sunday.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:06 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
Been there, demanded that. I looked like a complete fool, which was fine because I was behaving like a complete fool. Learn from my mistakes and the mistakes of so many others and just ask "Hey, what's up with this" and quit worrying that other MeFites will think terrible of you, even if it's a goof on your part.
Get outta this thread, find a strip club, maybe do a little blow, you'll feel better. Just make sure it's not the good shit you're saving for when the East Coast kicks some West Coast ass this Super Bowl Sunday.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:06 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
I am reminded of verb's request in the last MeTa:
Can I get this "someone follows me around and helpfully nukes comments that make me sound like an ass before anyone else notices them" service on other web sites?
posted by exogenous at 10:07 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
Can I get this "someone follows me around and helpfully nukes comments that make me sound like an ass before anyone else notices them" service on other web sites?
posted by exogenous at 10:07 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
wait, we have reputations here? i've been doing this all wrong.
posted by neuromodulator at 10:08 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by neuromodulator at 10:08 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
The fact that your comment was deleted is above my pay grade, but for what its worth I think it's a good retort for the original asker to use.
posted by TedW at 10:09 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by TedW at 10:09 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
Strippers and drugs not your thing? No problem, head down to the local spa, try an Organic Chocolate Body Wrap w/ a bit of Aromatherapy and a Vitamin C & Organic French Lavender Facial. That'll slurp the stress right out of you.
Then smoke a joint.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:10 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
Then smoke a joint.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:10 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
There's a kind of MetaTalk-as-Thunderdome groove that goes on here that I really dig sometimes
I'm still waiting on SOME PEOPLE to start the Diplomacy game that was organized, so I gotta get my licks in somehow.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:10 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm still waiting on SOME PEOPLE to start the Diplomacy game that was organized, so I gotta get my licks in somehow.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:10 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
wait, we have reputations here?
Yes and they're measured in numbers of favorites and user numbers.
posted by Hoopo at 10:10 AM on February 3, 2012
Yes and they're measured in numbers of favorites and user numbers.
posted by Hoopo at 10:10 AM on February 3, 2012
I'm guessing the mods interpreted the comment (wrongly) as a non-serious joke answer, when the question was actually asking for snarky replies. So I agree with you, I think the deletion was bad, but I don't think it means anyone thinks you're a racist.
posted by albrecht at 10:11 AM on February 3, 2012
posted by albrecht at 10:11 AM on February 3, 2012
Brandon Blatcher, you can't be referring to the teams that are playing... are you?
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:12 AM on February 3, 2012
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:12 AM on February 3, 2012
There's a kind of MetaTalk-as-Thunderdome groove that goes on here that I really dig sometimes.
Yeah, I actually agree with you on this, quite strongly. I imagine that it deters some people from making legitimate critical MeTa posts. And then there are the huffy posts that seem like they are written dripping with blood to purposefully engage the snark and mocking.
posted by edgeways at 10:12 AM on February 3, 2012
The deletion of my comment implies I said something inappropriate and possibly racist.
No it doesn't. The OP asked for something "relatively polite" and your answer was not that. That's all it meant. That's the explanation. I'm not sure how to apologize for damage to your reputation that I don't believe occurred.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:12 AM on February 3, 2012 [13 favorites]
No it doesn't. The OP asked for something "relatively polite" and your answer was not that. That's all it meant. That's the explanation. I'm not sure how to apologize for damage to your reputation that I don't believe occurred.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:12 AM on February 3, 2012 [13 favorites]
If she won't do it, I'm happy to swallow my pride and tell you I'm sorry for the damage to your reputation, jamjam.
posted by gman at 10:14 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by gman at 10:14 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
Brandon Blatcher: "Just make sure it's not the good shit you're saving for when the East Coast kicks some West Coast ass this Super Bowl Sunday."
Which one is Boston and which one is New York?
posted by zarq at 10:14 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
Which one is Boston and which one is New York?
posted by zarq at 10:14 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
See, this is why one should avoid strippers and drugs before lunch.
Let's go get a taco jamjam.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:15 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
Let's go get a taco jamjam.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:15 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
that goes on here that I really dig
you know I had read that as ."...I really don't dig"
going away now.
posted by edgeways at 10:16 AM on February 3, 2012
you know I had read that as ."...I really don't dig"
going away now.
posted by edgeways at 10:16 AM on February 3, 2012
Damage to your reputation? Really?
The number of people aware of your comments' deletion is vanishingly small compared to the number of people who will see this MeTa. I can't see how two lines of text are important enough for this much sturm und drang.
posted by EatTheWeek at 10:19 AM on February 3, 2012
The number of people aware of your comments' deletion is vanishingly small compared to the number of people who will see this MeTa. I can't see how two lines of text are important enough for this much sturm und drang.
posted by EatTheWeek at 10:19 AM on February 3, 2012
For the record, comment deletions almost always improve people's reputations, and often undeservedly so.
posted by alms at 10:20 AM on February 3, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by alms at 10:20 AM on February 3, 2012 [6 favorites]
Taking a page from the Komen PR playbook?
posted by dirtdirt at 10:22 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by dirtdirt at 10:22 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
The OP asked for something "relatively polite" and your answer was not that.
This makes it confusing to me that answers like this one and a few others weren't deleted.
If a question says "Please give me answers of type X," and I say "Well, personally I would got with (not X), but that's just me," how has that answered the question?
posted by albrecht at 10:24 AM on February 3, 2012
This makes it confusing to me that answers like this one and a few others weren't deleted.
If a question says "Please give me answers of type X," and I say "Well, personally I would got with (not X), but that's just me," how has that answered the question?
posted by albrecht at 10:24 AM on February 3, 2012
Wow. This is a bit like letting a tiny duck-puff slip at a crowded party, and then standing on a chair banging two pans together yelling, "YES I FARTED OK? DON'T JUDGE ME YOU'VE ALL FARTED BEFORE! HOW DARE YOU LOOK AT ME THAT WAY!"
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 10:24 AM on February 3, 2012 [50 favorites]
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 10:24 AM on February 3, 2012 [50 favorites]
As soon as I saw the above-the-fold question, my next action was to check the poster so I'd know to whom to attach this reputation.
posted by DU at 10:25 AM on February 3, 2012
posted by DU at 10:25 AM on February 3, 2012
Favorited for use of the phrase "duck-puff"!
posted by Grither at 10:26 AM on February 3, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by Grither at 10:26 AM on February 3, 2012 [6 favorites]
Supposedly, in the court of Queen Elizabeth I, there was a courtier who farted at some inopportune moment, and he was so mortified that he left the country and lived abroad for a number of years. Eventually, he had stuff to do back in England, and he figured that everyone had forgotten, so he returned to the Court. The Queen spotted him and came over and said "Why have you been so long from our company? We had long since forgiven you the fart."
After all, when you take umbrage, it's like you're saying "um" before you b in a rage, you know?
posted by GenjiandProust at 10:32 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
After all, when you take umbrage, it's like you're saying "um" before you b in a rage, you know?
posted by GenjiandProust at 10:32 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
This is a bit like letting a tiny duck-puff slip at a crowded party
I thought for a second this meant you where hiding ducklings in your bag at a party and one escaped.
posted by The Whelk at 10:33 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
I thought for a second this meant you where hiding ducklings in your bag at a party and one escaped.
posted by The Whelk at 10:33 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
This makes it confusing to me that answers like this one and a few others weren't deleted.
No one flagged it and I hadn't seen it. I axed it.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:33 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
No one flagged it and I hadn't seen it. I axed it.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:33 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
Shall we gather the dueling pistols and meet you on the field of honor before or after teatime?
posted by Elly Vortex at 10:37 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Elly Vortex at 10:37 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
You're only 16, you don't have a rep yet.
*Busts something resembling a move*
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 10:38 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
*Busts something resembling a move*
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 10:38 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
No one flagged it and I hadn't seen it. I axed it.
Ok thanks, now I get it. Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by mods having other shit to do.
posted by albrecht at 10:42 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
Ok thanks, now I get it. Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by mods having other shit to do.
posted by albrecht at 10:42 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
You comment was deleted in order to sucker you into posting it here. Not enough people would have seen it in the thread.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 10:42 AM on February 3, 2012
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 10:42 AM on February 3, 2012
Congratulations! Your MeTa provided others with an opportunity to have their comments deleted, too. WIN WIN!
posted by heyho at 10:43 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by heyho at 10:43 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
I've made a huge mistake.
posted by iamabot at 10:44 AM on February 3, 2012 [7 favorites]
posted by iamabot at 10:44 AM on February 3, 2012 [7 favorites]
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by mods having other shit to do.
To be fair, sometimes when a thread starts to go badly [as that one did, which had nothing at all to do with jamjam's comment] we sometimes don't go back and look at the entire thread when we're just thinking "Man, this is a mess" So, a comment out on its own that didn't get picked up on might be a non-problem until such time as the thread ends up in MeTa and then people do the "How come this is gone and THAT isn't?" thing.
Usually the reason we axe comments in a general sense is to keep threads going smoothly, so while we try to be consistent sometimes the bar of what a comment needs to not be to keep a thread going smoothly varies over time. Which is, I admit, somewhat weird. It doesn't come up very often, maybe a few times a week, but it's one of the reasons we stress our human moderators, and using the flagging tool, so that we can do a better job keeping on top of things that might be problematic.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:46 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
To be fair, sometimes when a thread starts to go badly [as that one did, which had nothing at all to do with jamjam's comment] we sometimes don't go back and look at the entire thread when we're just thinking "Man, this is a mess" So, a comment out on its own that didn't get picked up on might be a non-problem until such time as the thread ends up in MeTa and then people do the "How come this is gone and THAT isn't?" thing.
Usually the reason we axe comments in a general sense is to keep threads going smoothly, so while we try to be consistent sometimes the bar of what a comment needs to not be to keep a thread going smoothly varies over time. Which is, I admit, somewhat weird. It doesn't come up very often, maybe a few times a week, but it's one of the reasons we stress our human moderators, and using the flagging tool, so that we can do a better job keeping on top of things that might be problematic.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:46 AM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
when the East Coast kicks some West Coast ass this Super Bowl Sunday.
....It's Patriots V. Giants. You count New York City as "West Coast"?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:47 AM on February 3, 2012
....It's Patriots V. Giants. You count New York City as "West Coast"?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:47 AM on February 3, 2012
Well, they do play in Jersey.
posted by exogenous at 10:50 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by exogenous at 10:50 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
I thought for a second this meant you where hiding ducklings in your bag at a party and one escaped.
That was an episode of Louis last season. Really good one too. Except the party was Afghanistan & it was his daughter who hid it.
posted by scalefree at 10:52 AM on February 3, 2012
That was an episode of Louis last season. Really good one too. Except the party was Afghanistan & it was his daughter who hid it.
posted by scalefree at 10:52 AM on February 3, 2012
jessamyn: "but it's one of the reasons we stress our human moderators"
Yeeeaaaah....suuuuure.
posted by Grither at 11:01 AM on February 3, 2012
Yeeeaaaah....suuuuure.
posted by Grither at 11:01 AM on February 3, 2012
Your reputation is secure.
posted by These Premises Are Alarmed at 11:01 AM on February 3, 2012
posted by These Premises Are Alarmed at 11:01 AM on February 3, 2012
HONK IF YOU DEMAND SATISFACTION
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 11:03 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 11:03 AM on February 3, 2012 [5 favorites]
I would like an explanation for the deletion and an apology for the damage to my reputation.
I've always thought you were a good person, and have said so to everyone I know. But now that your comment was deleted, I have very serious second thoughts, and would no longer be willing to serve as a job reference, or write you a letter of recommendation.
I honestly believe that you should sue for millions.
posted by coolguymichael at 11:06 AM on February 3, 2012 [4 favorites]
I've always thought you were a good person, and have said so to everyone I know. But now that your comment was deleted, I have very serious second thoughts, and would no longer be willing to serve as a job reference, or write you a letter of recommendation.
I honestly believe that you should sue for millions.
posted by coolguymichael at 11:06 AM on February 3, 2012 [4 favorites]
but it's one of the reasons we stress our human moderators
This is essentially an admission to the existence of androids.
posted by shakespeherian at 11:12 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
This is essentially an admission to the existence of androids.
posted by shakespeherian at 11:12 AM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
I'm thankful for all my comment deletions. Most were made when I was really tired or sick. My reputation can only be improved by the mods' work.
posted by TooFewShoes at 11:21 AM on February 3, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by TooFewShoes at 11:21 AM on February 3, 2012 [4 favorites]
I'm not saying the comment should necessarily stand, but if it goes and those other ones stay, I have no idea what standard you're applying.
"Relatively polite" is a pretty broad and definitely subjective standard. I flipped through the ones you linked and they're all on the snarky side, but none of them quite trigger my "yeah that'll get you punched in the face" reaction which jamjam's does. I can't really define why, though, and I'm not totally thrilled by the direction that question has taken in general, so it's harder to apply a general standard. Fortunately, the OP's best-answering seems to indicate that some of these are hitting the mark for her.
I spent the last 15 or so hours in bed with food poisoning or something, so I admit my judgement is more suspect than usual, but it really seems like in this particular thread the line isn't super-clear so it's all judgement calls one way or the other.
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 11:24 AM on February 3, 2012
"Relatively polite" is a pretty broad and definitely subjective standard. I flipped through the ones you linked and they're all on the snarky side, but none of them quite trigger my "yeah that'll get you punched in the face" reaction which jamjam's does. I can't really define why, though, and I'm not totally thrilled by the direction that question has taken in general, so it's harder to apply a general standard. Fortunately, the OP's best-answering seems to indicate that some of these are hitting the mark for her.
I spent the last 15 or so hours in bed with food poisoning or something, so I admit my judgement is more suspect than usual, but it really seems like in this particular thread the line isn't super-clear so it's all judgement calls one way or the other.
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 11:24 AM on February 3, 2012
I stand by my comment, and I continue to think it was appropriate for the thread.
Thank you very much, jessamyn, for stating here that it was not deleted because a moderator thought it was racist.
posted by jamjam at 11:27 AM on February 3, 2012
Thank you very much, jessamyn, for stating here that it was not deleted because a moderator thought it was racist.
posted by jamjam at 11:27 AM on February 3, 2012
I could've done without the comment(s) that seem to be more about proving that it's not racist than about helping the asker.
Reading through the thread just now, I was especially taken aback by: These people aren't racist, obviously.
Like, what? Maybe, hopefully, they meant "These people aren't obviously racist."
posted by kmz at 11:30 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
Reading through the thread just now, I was especially taken aback by: These people aren't racist, obviously.
Like, what? Maybe, hopefully, they meant "These people aren't obviously racist."
posted by kmz at 11:30 AM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
Man I wish we could get past the idea of 'racist' as being something that you are rather than a description of behavior. It's possible to acknowledge that something you've said was, actually, pretty shitty without you labeling yourself as an Eternal Villain.
posted by shakespeherian at 11:42 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
posted by shakespeherian at 11:42 AM on February 3, 2012 [12 favorites]
I dunno, Shakespherian, "racist" is perfectly suited to use as a noun describing someone who believes in racist (adjective) doctrine so I don't think it's something that needs to be "gotten past." The problem is in that the same word can be used to someone who is merely ignorant and well-meaning just as easily as it can be used to describe a lifelong KKK member.
posted by Hoopo at 12:21 PM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Hoopo at 12:21 PM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
shakespeherian: "Man I wish we could get past the idea of 'racist' as being something that you are rather than a description of behavior."
When the behavior in question marks someone as a racist, then the proverbial shoe... it fits, yes?
posted by zarq at 12:31 PM on February 3, 2012
When the behavior in question marks someone as a racist, then the proverbial shoe... it fits, yes?
posted by zarq at 12:31 PM on February 3, 2012
I know it's a useful word for certain things but its wide net, which you mention, makes people get crazy defensive about it and think of it as a definitional thing. It's the same thinking that gets us the 'some of my best friends are black' defense: If I can demonstrate that I behaved in one area in a non-racist way, that means that the essence of my person is not racist, and therefore your accusations about my current behavior are false.
Some people are so engaged in a particular mindset w/r/t race that it's probably legitimate to say that they are racists, full-stop. But such usage makes it easier, sometimes, for us to look at ourselves and say 'Well clearly I'm not a racist, so I'm not really part of the problem,' whereas the reality is that racism is a systemic problem that comes about to a significant degree from lots of tiny unconscious actions on the part of ignorant well-meaning people like me rather than just David Duke and assholes like him.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:32 PM on February 3, 2012 [4 favorites]
Some people are so engaged in a particular mindset w/r/t race that it's probably legitimate to say that they are racists, full-stop. But such usage makes it easier, sometimes, for us to look at ourselves and say 'Well clearly I'm not a racist, so I'm not really part of the problem,' whereas the reality is that racism is a systemic problem that comes about to a significant degree from lots of tiny unconscious actions on the part of ignorant well-meaning people like me rather than just David Duke and assholes like him.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:32 PM on February 3, 2012 [4 favorites]
In other words, yes, someone who exhibits racist behavior may be called a racist, but in that case I am a racist, because I have, at times, exhibited racist behavior. I'm ignorant and have a lot of knee-jerk ingrained reactions based on a false idea of what the world is shaped like that I am consciously working to mature out of. Not many people want to label themselves thusly.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:33 PM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by shakespeherian at 12:33 PM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
Oh, and thank everyone who took the time to make a comment.
I'm considering what you said, or will say.
posted by jamjam at 12:34 PM on February 3, 2012
I'm considering what you said, or will say.
posted by jamjam at 12:34 PM on February 3, 2012
Have you considered a new haircut?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:37 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:37 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
shakes, I know where you're coming from. I sort of try divide people's behavior into 'deliberate' and 'non-deliberate' when it comes to racism and act accordingly.
posted by zarq at 12:41 PM on February 3, 2012
posted by zarq at 12:41 PM on February 3, 2012
I'm ignorant and have a lot of knee-jerk ingrained reactions based on a false idea of what the world is shaped like
It's round. No, round-ish. You're welcome
posted by Hoopo at 12:41 PM on February 3, 2012
It's round. No, round-ish. You're welcome
posted by Hoopo at 12:41 PM on February 3, 2012
I'm afraid, jamjam, that you made the mistake of indulging in a form of humour that many of the smart people at Metafilter are notorious for not getting.
posted by Decani at 12:49 PM on February 3, 2012
posted by Decani at 12:49 PM on February 3, 2012
... thanks everyone, that is.
Have you considered a new haircut?
I thought this was my new haircut.
posted by jamjam at 12:50 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
Have you considered a new haircut?
I thought this was my new haircut.
posted by jamjam at 12:50 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
I flipped through the ones you linked and they're all on the snarky side,none of them quite trigger my "yeah that'll get you punched in the face" reaction which jamjam's does. I can't really define why, though
er...........because your buddy didn't delete them ?
posted by sgt.serenity at 12:53 PM on February 3, 2012
er...........because your buddy didn't delete them ?
posted by sgt.serenity at 12:53 PM on February 3, 2012
a form of humour that many of the smart people at Metafilter are notorious
This is a BIG problem.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:55 PM on February 3, 2012
This is a BIG problem.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:55 PM on February 3, 2012
MetaTalk: Because I don't know how to MeMail the mods
posted by rich at 1:09 PM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by rich at 1:09 PM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
So jamjam here has never heard of The Streisand Effect?
posted by COD at 1:20 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by COD at 1:20 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
I think "it's good that your child is light-skinned" is a pretty goddamned racist statement to make, so suggesting that the OP in that thread name and shame that action is hardly inappropriate.
There's really no way in which "it's good that your child is light-skinned" is meaningful outside of a context in which lighter skin tones are assigned higher social value. "It's good that your child is dark-skinned" might conceivably be taken as congratulating your child on their lowered risk for melanoma, but I just can't think of any parallel biomedical benefit to light skin.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:28 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
There's really no way in which "it's good that your child is light-skinned" is meaningful outside of a context in which lighter skin tones are assigned higher social value. "It's good that your child is dark-skinned" might conceivably be taken as congratulating your child on their lowered risk for melanoma, but I just can't think of any parallel biomedical benefit to light skin.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:28 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm afraid, jamjam, that you made the mistake of indulging in a form of humour that many of the smart people at Metafilter are notorious for not getting.
The part where you offer a snarky answer to a question where the OP has specifically requested non-snarky answers? This is some kind of advanced level humo(u)r that I am happy to be notorious for not getting.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:29 PM on February 3, 2012
The part where you offer a snarky answer to a question where the OP has specifically requested non-snarky answers? This is some kind of advanced level humo(u)r that I am happy to be notorious for not getting.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:29 PM on February 3, 2012
> ....It's Patriots V. Giants. You count New York City as "West Coast"?
> posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:47 AM on February 3
Maybe not the coast, quite, but it's west of West Egg and that's all Kansas.
posted by jfuller at 2:09 PM on February 3, 2012
> posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:47 AM on February 3
Maybe not the coast, quite, but it's west of West Egg and that's all Kansas.
posted by jfuller at 2:09 PM on February 3, 2012
The part where you offer a snarky answer to a question where the OP has specifically requested non-snarky answers? This is some kind of advanced level humo(u)r that I am happy to be notorious for not getting.
But they didn't request non-snarky, in fact they asked for "snappy retorts" that were "relatively polite". To me, snark can be both those things.
posted by oneirodynia at 2:39 PM on February 3, 2012
But they didn't request non-snarky, in fact they asked for "snappy retorts" that were "relatively polite". To me, snark can be both those things.
posted by oneirodynia at 2:39 PM on February 3, 2012
I have to agree with dasein, that there's no principled way to distinguish the levels of impoliteness shown in jamjam's response and the responses dasein linked to.
It seems like the mods have been getting way more hot-fingered about deletions.
But I really fall in with the crowd that says "it's just a deletion, don't get wound up about it, having your previous comments deleted from time to time is a small price to pay for having a civil community."
posted by jayder at 3:21 PM on February 3, 2012
It seems like the mods have been getting way more hot-fingered about deletions.
But I really fall in with the crowd that says "it's just a deletion, don't get wound up about it, having your previous comments deleted from time to time is a small price to pay for having a civil community."
posted by jayder at 3:21 PM on February 3, 2012
but it really seems like in this particular thread the line isn't super-clear
When stuff isn't clear, why over-moderate rather than under-moderate?
posted by spaltavian at 3:46 PM on February 3, 2012
When stuff isn't clear, why over-moderate rather than under-moderate?
posted by spaltavian at 3:46 PM on February 3, 2012
When stuff isn't clear, why over-moderate rather than under-moderate?
We try to make our best guesses. Last week, after we'd specifically dialed things back a little, there were quite a few "Why didn't you delete this??" MeTa threads and a bunch of emails. As I said above, we try to keep the community and the threads within them, running smoothly. And sometimes it's a judgment call figuring out whether deleting or leaving a comment will be the thing that lets the thread go better. So in this particular case, the earlier "fuck you" comment sort of escaped everyone's notice because the thread was going fine. Later on, after the thread was going less fine with a bunch of people chiming in to just talk and argue about race, we were doing a bit more of a close read on the flags that were continuing to accumulate.
Again, I'm only explaining this because people asked, not trying to put this forth in a "This is why and everyone should be able to learn how to do things differently the next time!" sort of way. But once a thread has started going badly, generally speaking we're tighter with moderation.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 3:51 PM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
We try to make our best guesses. Last week, after we'd specifically dialed things back a little, there were quite a few "Why didn't you delete this??" MeTa threads and a bunch of emails. As I said above, we try to keep the community and the threads within them, running smoothly. And sometimes it's a judgment call figuring out whether deleting or leaving a comment will be the thing that lets the thread go better. So in this particular case, the earlier "fuck you" comment sort of escaped everyone's notice because the thread was going fine. Later on, after the thread was going less fine with a bunch of people chiming in to just talk and argue about race, we were doing a bit more of a close read on the flags that were continuing to accumulate.
Again, I'm only explaining this because people asked, not trying to put this forth in a "This is why and everyone should be able to learn how to do things differently the next time!" sort of way. But once a thread has started going badly, generally speaking we're tighter with moderation.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 3:51 PM on February 3, 2012 [2 favorites]
I've had crappy comments deleted and it only served to improve my reputation.
R_n, get well soon.
posted by arcticseal at 4:33 PM on February 3, 2012
R_n, get well soon.
posted by arcticseal at 4:33 PM on February 3, 2012
But they didn't request non-snarky, in fact they asked for "snappy retorts" that were "relatively polite". To me, snark can be both those things.
Fair enough. Though I disagree that jamjam's answer met that guideline, I can see where it's a matter of opinion.
posted by Sidhedevil at 4:34 PM on February 3, 2012
Fair enough. Though I disagree that jamjam's answer met that guideline, I can see where it's a matter of opinion.
posted by Sidhedevil at 4:34 PM on February 3, 2012
R_n, get well soon.
Thanks. I still feel kinda crappy but I think more than half of it was caffeine withdrawal. I keep forgetting that I am a hardcore addict and being all "Oh I can quit any time, I'll have a little headache and it'll be fine."
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 4:41 PM on February 3, 2012
Thanks. I still feel kinda crappy but I think more than half of it was caffeine withdrawal. I keep forgetting that I am a hardcore addict and being all "Oh I can quit any time, I'll have a little headache and it'll be fine."
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 4:41 PM on February 3, 2012
Man I wish we could get past the idea of 'racist' as being something that you are rather than a description of behavior. It's possible to acknowledge that something you've said was, actually, pretty shitty without you labeling yourself as an Eternal Villain.
The Jay Smooth TED talk linked in the thread was really, really good on precisely that point. I know that I'm far too prone to say "that person's racist" rather than "what that person said evokes racial stereotypes in a hurtful way..." or whatever. I think he's really on point that discussions about these kinds of matters would be hugely more productive if we were able to see racially insensitive speech as a behavior rather than, necessarily, as a marker of an eternally fixed existential condition.
posted by yoink at 4:44 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
The Jay Smooth TED talk linked in the thread was really, really good on precisely that point. I know that I'm far too prone to say "that person's racist" rather than "what that person said evokes racial stereotypes in a hurtful way..." or whatever. I think he's really on point that discussions about these kinds of matters would be hugely more productive if we were able to see racially insensitive speech as a behavior rather than, necessarily, as a marker of an eternally fixed existential condition.
posted by yoink at 4:44 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
Honey's all like,"jamjam? What the fuck is a jamjam?
It's kind of like an item, only not as vague, and it generally doesn't try so hard to be cute.
posted by jamjam at 5:28 PM on February 3, 2012
It's kind of like an item, only not as vague, and it generally doesn't try so hard to be cute.
posted by jamjam at 5:28 PM on February 3, 2012
After all, when you take umbrage, it's like you're saying "um" before you b in a rage, you know?
This is funny, but I read it wrong because I'm tired, and probably because I'm tired my mistaken reading left me laughing like an idiot for some time. (I read the second half of the sentence as an instruction to reposition the b in "umbrage". After all the talk of duck puffs, well...)
posted by dumbland at 6:27 PM on February 3, 2012
This is funny, but I read it wrong because I'm tired, and probably because I'm tired my mistaken reading left me laughing like an idiot for some time. (I read the second half of the sentence as an instruction to reposition the b in "umbrage". After all the talk of duck puffs, well...)
posted by dumbland at 6:27 PM on February 3, 2012
It doesn't matter why your comment was deleted! Maybe it would matter if you worked really hard on a comment, but you didn't work really hard on that comment. Just make another comment in another thread. It will all work out.
I have a lot of comments deleted. Maybe it's because the mods power tripping psychopaths. Maybe it's because I sometimes make shitty comments. Maybe there's no reason at all. What can you do but shrug and keep posting?
posted by planet at 6:49 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
I have a lot of comments deleted. Maybe it's because the mods power tripping psychopaths. Maybe it's because I sometimes make shitty comments. Maybe there's no reason at all. What can you do but shrug and keep posting?
posted by planet at 6:49 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
Better dig out that PCP after all; it might make your comments less tedious and cliche-ridden-- it could scarcely make them more.
posted by jamjam at 7:26 PM on February 3, 2012
posted by jamjam at 7:26 PM on February 3, 2012
Please stop.
posted by shakespeherian at 7:54 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by shakespeherian at 7:54 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
...and they all lived happily ever after. THE END.
posted by 1000monkeys at 8:40 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by 1000monkeys at 8:40 PM on February 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
Boston is further east, so clearly New York represents the West Side. Just ask Biggie.
posted by maryr at 8:41 PM on February 3, 2012
posted by maryr at 8:41 PM on February 3, 2012
More and more I find these kinds of threads incredibly depressing.
From the op that should have gone to mods via private mefi mail to the lulzy pile on from the community.... Especially the lulzy pile-ons.
Sigh.
posted by HMSSM at 8:57 PM on February 3, 2012
From the op that should have gone to mods via private mefi mail to the lulzy pile on from the community.... Especially the lulzy pile-ons.
Sigh.
posted by HMSSM at 8:57 PM on February 3, 2012
So, you know deletions are silent, right? I didn't get a notification that your comment was deleted. Until you posted here.
posted by J. Wilson at 9:44 PM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by J. Wilson at 9:44 PM on February 3, 2012 [3 favorites]
PCP would've been a lot more fun if I didn't have to buy it from bikers and rednecks who INSIST you smoke a burner with them, because that's just what I want - to get twisted with some bikers and then walk home to my stepmom's noodles in cheese sauce and listen to my dad talk about the news.
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 4:32 AM on February 4, 2012
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 4:32 AM on February 4, 2012
I misread PCP as TCP, and wondered what on earth you'd have to do to make that stuff get you high. Although, there is apparently an hallucinogen called TCP, too.
posted by Solomon at 11:46 AM on February 4, 2012
posted by Solomon at 11:46 AM on February 4, 2012
Over in the vaccine question, These Birds of a Feather made a comment about how his/her body chemistry is incompatible with certain vaccines, so he/she has not gotten those. A couple of us asked for clarification on determining body chemistry -- I didn't realize you could really determine that. My comment asking a follow-up on that was deleted, as was another.
That seems like heavy-handed moderation to me. I understand the sensitivity of the vaccine issue, but the deleted comments were completely civil and actually would have furthered the purpose of the thread, had they remained and been answered by These Birds of a Feather.
posted by jayder at 1:05 PM on February 4, 2012
That seems like heavy-handed moderation to me. I understand the sensitivity of the vaccine issue, but the deleted comments were completely civil and actually would have furthered the purpose of the thread, had they remained and been answered by These Birds of a Feather.
posted by jayder at 1:05 PM on February 4, 2012
After the third or fourth comment from These Birds of a Feather, it seemed pretty clear to me that evidence wasn't immediately forthcoming, and her comments were generally not really aimed at the "please tell me why vaccines aren't terrible" question. If she wants to add a further comment that has actual data or addresses the question beyond "go with your gut" or unsupported (negative) claims, then that's totally fine. It's a messy thread and I'm trying not to go overboard with deleting claims other than what the OP specifically asked for when they seem helpful, but I had to draw a line somewhere.
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 1:26 PM on February 4, 2012
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 1:26 PM on February 4, 2012
I could've done without the comment(s) that seem to be more about proving that it's not racist than about helping the asker.
Yeah, if I were going to delete unhelpful answers, I would start here.
It's the word "obviously" that really sets my teeth on edge.
I agree that with Jay Smooth that calling words and actions racist is more productive than calling people racist, but that we shouldn't shy away from telling people that saying these words and engaging in these actions make them seem like racists.
The strangers' comments about gentian's baby are obviously racist, so saying that these people are "obviously" not racist is about as wrong and unhelpful as an answer can be.
posted by marsha56 at 1:31 PM on February 4, 2012
Yeah, if I were going to delete unhelpful answers, I would start here.
It's the word "obviously" that really sets my teeth on edge.
I agree that with Jay Smooth that calling words and actions racist is more productive than calling people racist, but that we shouldn't shy away from telling people that saying these words and engaging in these actions make them seem like racists.
The strangers' comments about gentian's baby are obviously racist, so saying that these people are "obviously" not racist is about as wrong and unhelpful as an answer can be.
posted by marsha56 at 1:31 PM on February 4, 2012
And speaking of which, her latest comment is exactly what I was hoping for.
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 1:37 PM on February 4, 2012
posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 1:37 PM on February 4, 2012
FWIW, I chose to respond to those inquiries via MeMail because I didn't want to derail the thread. I ended up putting my 2 cents back in later because the OP asked for anecdata, so I gave anecdata. If it's easier, just delete all of my comments in that thread. I recognize that the vaccines topic is super sensitive, but I have very personal experience with it and thought it would be okay to state my thoughts on the issue as neutrally as I could. If I didn't achieve that, please by all means delete my input. I will not be offended.
posted by These Birds of a Feather at 1:50 PM on February 4, 2012
posted by These Birds of a Feather at 1:50 PM on February 4, 2012
One of the nice things about getting older is enjoying damage to one's reputation.
posted by thinkpiece at 8:03 AM on February 5, 2012
posted by thinkpiece at 8:03 AM on February 5, 2012
I thought the Superbowl was East versus West, too, until someone reminded me the San Francisco Giants play baseball.
posted by gingerest at 4:21 PM on February 5, 2012
posted by gingerest at 4:21 PM on February 5, 2012
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posted by Grither at 9:59 AM on February 3, 2012 [35 favorites]