This [more inside] thing could be useful October 21, 2002 3:24 PM Subscribe
I'm not getting at the actual poster's with this (I love both of the stories). But wouldn't a Wheadonesque 'more inside' style posting ability be really useful in cases like this and this?
See ... I knew that would happen. I'm not saying we shouldn't do that. I was just suggesting that a 'more' feature would be something else which could make Mefi even more user friendly, for people who prefer to put their thoughts in the thread itself. Since Buffyfilter is very similar I wondered how easy it would be to implement.
I wasn't for any minute trying to join the fpp police. Longer posts add variety to what we see there sometimes. Twenty two liners tend to blur into each other ...
posted by feelinglistless at 4:43 PM on October 21, 2002
I wasn't for any minute trying to join the fpp police. Longer posts add variety to what we see there sometimes. Twenty two liners tend to blur into each other ...
posted by feelinglistless at 4:43 PM on October 21, 2002
Some discussion on this point may be found here. I don't think there needs to be an "acceptable totalitarian form of front page posting," but there are some posters who could learn something from y2karl.
An automated "more inside" function might be a nice feature, but it's possible to get the job done without it.
posted by Galvatron at 4:45 PM on October 21, 2002
An automated "more inside" function might be a nice feature, but it's possible to get the job done without it.
posted by Galvatron at 4:45 PM on October 21, 2002
there are some posters who could learn something from y2karl.
I suggest that oissubke's and Morphic's posting style is just as acceptable as y2karl's style, and they don't need to learn a thing. I think it's the knee-jerks who need to learn something.
posted by crunchland at 4:50 PM on October 21, 2002
I suggest that oissubke's and Morphic's posting style is just as acceptable as y2karl's style, and they don't need to learn a thing. I think it's the knee-jerks who need to learn something.
posted by crunchland at 4:50 PM on October 21, 2002
For Pete's sake crunchland, you're the only one I see being knee-jerky 'round here. Screaming totalitarianism is soooo August.
posted by Catch at 5:01 PM on October 21, 2002
posted by Catch at 5:01 PM on October 21, 2002
learn something from y2karl.
like when not to use the small tag
well, for important stuff anyway
posted by inpHilltr8r at 5:27 PM on October 21, 2002
like when not to use the small tag
well, for important stuff anyway
posted by inpHilltr8r at 5:27 PM on October 21, 2002
It seems more like a usability issue than a feature request; insofar as good posters are attentive to, or at least aware of, screen real-estate and the number of clicks or scrolls the community is faced with, a more efficient use of space would be great, sure, yeah. (Like the Mongolian post just really didn't need to be a bullet list - it would've made a fine little paragraph post.) But not all people think like HCI nerds so just separate the content from the form in your mind, breathe deep, and enjoy it anyway.
posted by DenOfSizer at 6:31 PM on October 21, 2002
posted by DenOfSizer at 6:31 PM on October 21, 2002
I was just suggesting that a 'more' feature would be something else which could make Mefi even more user friendly, for people who prefer to put their thoughts in the thread itself.
I think it speaks to the laziness of our culture when people need a feature in order to tag a 'more inside' notation onto the end of their post. It's pretty easy to just write it out, isn't it?
I don't mean to be snarky™, but it just seems like so much overkill.
posted by The God Complex at 6:54 PM on October 21, 2002
I think it speaks to the laziness of our culture when people need a feature in order to tag a 'more inside' notation onto the end of their post. It's pretty easy to just write it out, isn't it?
I don't mean to be snarky™, but it just seems like so much overkill.
posted by The God Complex at 6:54 PM on October 21, 2002
You ever think that most people don't know that it's the preferred method to put "more inside" on a FPP?
How is anyone supposed to know these things unless you tell them?
And it's not like the front page can only be 11 inchs long or something like that. This isn't a newspaper. The front page can be 2 miles long and all you have to do is scroll down.
I think it says something about the laziness of our culture when people can't scroll.
posted by nyxxxx at 8:51 PM on October 21, 2002
How is anyone supposed to know these things unless you tell them?
And it's not like the front page can only be 11 inchs long or something like that. This isn't a newspaper. The front page can be 2 miles long and all you have to do is scroll down.
I think it says something about the laziness of our culture when people can't scroll.
posted by nyxxxx at 8:51 PM on October 21, 2002
nyxxxx - The desire of some users to keep the front page clear of large text passages has nothing to do with lazy and everything to do with design. Would you prefer that the front page of Metafilter was 2 miles long?
posted by PrinceValium at 9:00 PM on October 21, 2002
posted by PrinceValium at 9:00 PM on October 21, 2002
Ok, why do some users want to keep the front page clear of large text passages? Please explain, because I honestly don't see any problem with the front page of metafilter being 2 miles long. Why do you expect everyone to have the same design aesthetic as you? I like long pages and you'll notice that about my sites.
I had people jump on me about the same issue last week. I honestly didn't know that it was a problem when I did it.
It just seems to me that some people are being a little overly nit-picky. But, if they are going to have all these rules, then I think they should be written down.
posted by nyxxxx at 9:53 PM on October 21, 2002
I had people jump on me about the same issue last week. I honestly didn't know that it was a problem when I did it.
It just seems to me that some people are being a little overly nit-picky. But, if they are going to have all these rules, then I think they should be written down.
posted by nyxxxx at 9:53 PM on October 21, 2002
Ok, why do some users want to keep the front page clear of large text passages? Please explain, because I honestly don't see any problem with the front page of metafilter being 2 miles long.
I'm no Jakob Nielsen (in fact at times I hate the bloody bastard), but the reasoning is that people are very, very lazy, and it's a lot of work to scroll down a page.
No, I'm not kidding.
MeFi, I'm betting, was designed to optimize scannability. Its incredibly difficult to scan for links when the page is longer. Well, not incredibly difficult, but fucking annoying.
Why do you expect everyone to have the same design aesthetic as you?
We expect everyone to adhere to established design principles of what a "good aesthetic" is until someone like David Carson comes in and fucks it all up and gets really famous.
if they are going to have all these rules, then I think they should be written down.
Very good point. A well-written guide/FAQ to good posting for newbies by some old MeFi fogey is long overdue. (No, I'm not talking about the guidelines.)
posted by Stan Chin at 10:33 PM on October 21, 2002
I'm no Jakob Nielsen (in fact at times I hate the bloody bastard), but the reasoning is that people are very, very lazy, and it's a lot of work to scroll down a page.
No, I'm not kidding.
MeFi, I'm betting, was designed to optimize scannability. Its incredibly difficult to scan for links when the page is longer. Well, not incredibly difficult, but fucking annoying.
Why do you expect everyone to have the same design aesthetic as you?
We expect everyone to adhere to established design principles of what a "good aesthetic" is until someone like David Carson comes in and fucks it all up and gets really famous.
if they are going to have all these rules, then I think they should be written down.
Very good point. A well-written guide/FAQ to good posting for newbies by some old MeFi fogey is long overdue. (No, I'm not talking about the guidelines.)
posted by Stan Chin at 10:33 PM on October 21, 2002
If this entire thread isn't some kind of joke about how stupid MeTa has become (of which I'm not entirely convinced), then you all need a busier schedule.
Scroll buttons and human contact will end all of your problems. I promise.
In lieu of that , feelinglistless, you may actually convince some phone-sex operators to converse with you on a personal level. The rates are relatively cheap compared with turning into a nit-picky bore.
posted by ttrendel at 1:22 AM on October 22, 2002
Scroll buttons and human contact will end all of your problems. I promise.
In lieu of that , feelinglistless, you may actually convince some phone-sex operators to converse with you on a personal level. The rates are relatively cheap compared with turning into a nit-picky bore.
posted by ttrendel at 1:22 AM on October 22, 2002
ttrendel, why not just say you disagree with the idea? What is the point of such an unprovoked personal attack?
posted by taz at 1:31 AM on October 22, 2002
posted by taz at 1:31 AM on October 22, 2002
How it it unprovoked? Every week there are tons of MeTa posts about spelling, line breaks, repeat topics, , breaks from the original discussion, follow-up posts, perceived anti-P.C.- ness, potentially offensive posts, post forms, and so on.
And that is alright. That's what MeTa is meant for.
BUT, re-iterating these over and over is just stupid. They solve nothing. Picking out a particular post that is "too long" is idiocy. Scroll over it.
It just adds to the idiocy that has become MeTa. Bitching about every little thing for the sake of bitching.
The point of this thread was to establish that a single post, containing mostly links, was too long and that it made feelinglisteless sad.
Stupid. Posting complaints just to see your name on Meta.
Sure, I agree that the personal attacks may a have been a little much, but they are every bit as useful as the complete 'self-policing' idiocy that has shown up on MeTa in the last year.
At least personal attacks are more interseting to read than whining about line breaks.
posted by ttrendel at 1:53 AM on October 22, 2002
And that is alright. That's what MeTa is meant for.
BUT, re-iterating these over and over is just stupid. They solve nothing. Picking out a particular post that is "too long" is idiocy. Scroll over it.
It just adds to the idiocy that has become MeTa. Bitching about every little thing for the sake of bitching.
The point of this thread was to establish that a single post, containing mostly links, was too long and that it made feelinglisteless sad.
Stupid. Posting complaints just to see your name on Meta.
Sure, I agree that the personal attacks may a have been a little much, but they are every bit as useful as the complete 'self-policing' idiocy that has shown up on MeTa in the last year.
At least personal attacks are more interseting to read than whining about line breaks.
posted by ttrendel at 1:53 AM on October 22, 2002
A post that takes up no more front-page real estate than is absolutely necessary is simply considerate. MetaFilter as a whole benefits from having more posts fit on each screen, and each post benefits from better visibility.
From another perspective, we've already established that there can be too many posts (or too many substandard posts) per day, and that double posts often occur because the original post -- sometimes posted mere hours earlier -- is lost further down the page. This latter point also highlights the problem some of us have with using the Page Down key.
I've felt for some time that a maximum length for posts, exclusive of HTML tags, needs to be established.
posted by mcwetboy at 4:44 AM on October 22, 2002
From another perspective, we've already established that there can be too many posts (or too many substandard posts) per day, and that double posts often occur because the original post -- sometimes posted mere hours earlier -- is lost further down the page. This latter point also highlights the problem some of us have with using the Page Down key.
I've felt for some time that a maximum length for posts, exclusive of HTML tags, needs to be established.
posted by mcwetboy at 4:44 AM on October 22, 2002
MetaFilter: if they are going to have all these rules, then I think they should be written down.
posted by walrus at 8:41 AM on October 22, 2002
posted by walrus at 8:41 AM on October 22, 2002
I think they should be written down
ps It's called "Metatalk". They're written down, discussed endlessly, thrown away, and then written down again. Rinse, lather, repeat.
posted by walrus at 8:43 AM on October 22, 2002
ps It's called "Metatalk". They're written down, discussed endlessly, thrown away, and then written down again. Rinse, lather, repeat.
posted by walrus at 8:43 AM on October 22, 2002
By request, I posted the latest episode of my saga in the "More Inside" format, and to be frank, as a MeFi reader I think I liked the Mongolia one better (though it perhaps should have had fewer links).
I enjoy seeing a bit of creativity in the FPPs, even if they take up (*gasp*) two inches on screen instead of one.
(Jakob Nielsen can go jump in a lake -- the man needs to calm down and enjoy life.)
However, I'm but one man. I'll continue to try to feel out the consensus and to follow a "When in Rome..." approach....though I can't promise my rebelliousness might not come out again sometime in the future ;-)
posted by oissubke at 2:32 PM on October 22, 2002
I enjoy seeing a bit of creativity in the FPPs, even if they take up (*gasp*) two inches on screen instead of one.
(Jakob Nielsen can go jump in a lake -- the man needs to calm down and enjoy life.)
However, I'm but one man. I'll continue to try to feel out the consensus and to follow a "When in Rome..." approach....though I can't promise my rebelliousness might not come out again sometime in the future ;-)
posted by oissubke at 2:32 PM on October 22, 2002
In lieu of that , feelinglistless, you may actually convince some phone-sex operators to converse with you on a personal level.
?!?
(1) Notice a trend on front page
(2) Notice that a similar site 'Wheadonesque' has a posting facility which allows posters who want it to have a way of highlighting they have more to say on a subject but don't want to include them on the front page.
(3) Think it's a topic worth discussing on Metatalk, because as the 'net is slowly becoming a medium for everyone, not just those who happen to know some programming language, every bit of extra usability helps
(4) Follow Metatalk rule of including relevant example.
(5) Make clear in post that I'm just suggesting something and offer examples where it might have been used if it was available and if the posters wanted to.
(6) Hope for reasoned discussion
(6.1) Note that this place hasn't changed
(7) Realise it was a vain hope, but note some good points are made.
posted by feelinglistless at 2:35 PM on October 22, 2002
?!?
(1) Notice a trend on front page
(2) Notice that a similar site 'Wheadonesque' has a posting facility which allows posters who want it to have a way of highlighting they have more to say on a subject but don't want to include them on the front page.
(3) Think it's a topic worth discussing on Metatalk, because as the 'net is slowly becoming a medium for everyone, not just those who happen to know some programming language, every bit of extra usability helps
(4) Follow Metatalk rule of including relevant example.
(5) Make clear in post that I'm just suggesting something and offer examples where it might have been used if it was available and if the posters wanted to.
(6) Hope for reasoned discussion
(6.1) Note that this place hasn't changed
(7) Realise it was a vain hope, but note some good points are made.
posted by feelinglistless at 2:35 PM on October 22, 2002
(8) Cover your head in cape and sulk back to the cave.
Come on, this is MetaFilter. Take some criticism. Suck it up.
posted by oissubke at 3:20 PM on October 22, 2002
Come on, this is MetaFilter. Take some criticism. Suck it up.
posted by oissubke at 3:20 PM on October 22, 2002
[more inside] is not a rule its just courtesy it dominates the visual space it's like WRITING IN ALL CAPS. Common newbie mistake and we educate. I do have a problem with some posters attacking the poor fella in an aggresive manner. The idea is to encourage future posts not haze.
posted by stbalbach at 1:26 PM on October 23, 2002
posted by stbalbach at 1:26 PM on October 23, 2002
This is the most confusing thread I've ever posted. I wasn't attacking anyone with it. I get attacked for making a suggestion (which is what I thought Metatalk was about). Then some people either defend or attack me some more (I'm not sure). I post something trying to rationise things and everything starts again.
I'd stop visiting Metafilter altogether if it wasn't more addictive than crack or something.
posted by feelinglistless at 2:19 PM on October 23, 2002
I'd stop visiting Metafilter altogether if it wasn't more addictive than crack or something.
posted by feelinglistless at 2:19 PM on October 23, 2002
You are not logged in, either login or create an account to post comments
I believe there are some who ignore the content of the post, and instead have a knee-jerk reaction to say "Ooh. Your front page post is too long," or "Ooh. Don't put hard returns in your front page post."
For pete's sake, can't we allow for a little individualism and style around here?
posted by crunchland at 4:18 PM on October 21, 2002