Why don't people add tags? May 2, 2006 10:36 AM Subscribe
Use of the Damned Tags Filter:
Why don't people tag their posts? A simple addition of Colbert to the previous thread would have made it insanely easy to find.
Why don't people tag their posts? A simple addition of Colbert to the previous thread would have made it insanely easy to find.
ONsite Google: "Steven Colbert"
Seventh down:
Seventh down:
Metafilter | Community WeblogSteven Colbert (TruthyMan!) headlines the White House Correspondents Dinner -- and Bush is not amused. Will there be fallout? ...posted by y2karl at 10:46 AM on May 2, 2006
www.metafilter.com/ - 65k - Apr 30, 2006 - Cached - Similar pages
I think some people just have an irrational dislike of tags. Like how senior citizens can be with computers.
posted by smackfu at 10:51 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by smackfu at 10:51 AM on May 2, 2006
If you figure this out, let me know how I can apply the knowledge to the people sending emails at my company. Trying to locate information about the new project when every single email in my inbox has the subject line of "Here you go" or "More info" has sapped my will to live.
posted by occhiblu at 10:54 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by occhiblu at 10:54 AM on May 2, 2006
I think some people just have an irrational dislike of tags.
Other people are too lazy to use the search function.
posted by y2karl at 11:00 AM on May 2, 2006
Other people are too lazy to use the search function.
posted by y2karl at 11:00 AM on May 2, 2006
heh- occhiblu- I am having the same problem. Worse, I delete them thinking they're spam. I haven't even managed to train my bosses.
posted by small_ruminant at 11:00 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by small_ruminant at 11:00 AM on May 2, 2006
they probably just forgot. but here's the real question: how can we force them to use the tags you'd like them to use? I mean, what if that guy had tagged his post "hijinks" but not "Colbert?" Can't we just force all users to use the tags for their posts that you approve of, and save all of us you all this trouble?
posted by shmegegge at 11:02 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by shmegegge at 11:02 AM on May 2, 2006
y2karl, yes, I can see how that would work. Ever notice how utterly devoid of any tips/hints/helpful suggestions the search page is?
Maybe some tips could be added? As in, hey search in quotes with multiple terms. But don't narrow it down too much or you'll get nothing at all back.
keswick, do you need a kick in the nuts? I'm giving away free ones right now.
On preview: Too lazy to use the search function? Go fuck yourself y2karl. I did use it, several times, just not the right way apparently. It blows, it has blown for a long, long time. The addition of tags was supposed to help alleviate the suckiness of the search. People don't use it and the search still sucks ass.
posted by fenriq at 11:02 AM on May 2, 2006
Maybe some tips could be added? As in, hey search in quotes with multiple terms. But don't narrow it down too much or you'll get nothing at all back.
keswick, do you need a kick in the nuts? I'm giving away free ones right now.
On preview: Too lazy to use the search function? Go fuck yourself y2karl. I did use it, several times, just not the right way apparently. It blows, it has blown for a long, long time. The addition of tags was supposed to help alleviate the suckiness of the search. People don't use it and the search still sucks ass.
posted by fenriq at 11:02 AM on May 2, 2006
schmeggee, whatever, you're missing the point intentionally to be a cute snark wanker.
posted by fenriq at 11:03 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by fenriq at 11:03 AM on May 2, 2006
I didn't notice this in the original thread, but it's Stephen Colbert, not Steven. That probably doesn't help searchers either.
posted by ludwig_van at 11:05 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by ludwig_van at 11:05 AM on May 2, 2006
no, I'm completely getting the point. it's not that deep. what I'm saying is that this is one of those "I'm personally frustrated at {x} behavior on the site, so I'm going to call for official sanction of my personal preferences" meta posts. it WOULD be nice if everyone tagged, I guess, but it's just some little bullshit that's annoying you and we shouldn't build site policy around personal preferences.
posted by shmegegge at 11:05 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by shmegegge at 11:05 AM on May 2, 2006
wait, let's see if i get this:
i, fenriq, am too inept to search properly, so i am going to rail on people who do not tag things and then possibly kick somebody in the nuts who does not realize the gravity of this situation.
is that about right?
posted by keswick at 11:08 AM on May 2, 2006
i, fenriq, am too inept to search properly, so i am going to rail on people who do not tag things and then possibly kick somebody in the nuts who does not realize the gravity of this situation.
is that about right?
posted by keswick at 11:08 AM on May 2, 2006
I think some people just have an irrational dislike of tags.
My dislike of them is entirely rational. It's too idiosyncratic to be as useful as keyword searching.
posted by Miko at 11:08 AM on May 2, 2006
My dislike of them is entirely rational. It's too idiosyncratic to be as useful as keyword searching.
posted by Miko at 11:08 AM on May 2, 2006
I for one, have only the vaguest familiarity with the notion of tags and wouldn’t know how to usefully assign them. The couple of times I’ve tried using them, they seemed fairly useless for finding something specific. When you can do a full-text search of the site, I don’t understand the value of tags.
I therefore, would probably not bother to assign tags. Perhaps I’m just old and irrational.
. . .or, what Miko just said.
posted by Zetetics at 11:10 AM on May 2, 2006
I therefore, would probably not bother to assign tags. Perhaps I’m just old and irrational.
. . .or, what Miko just said.
posted by Zetetics at 11:10 AM on May 2, 2006
Go fuck yourself y2karl.
You made a triple-post FPP, and then you came to MeTa to bitch about how your mistake was actually someone else's fault. Another poster points out a relatively simple way you could have prevented that mistake, and your reply is to tell him, "Go fuck yourself."
Time to step away from the keyboard, pal.
posted by cribcage at 11:10 AM on May 2, 2006
You made a triple-post FPP, and then you came to MeTa to bitch about how your mistake was actually someone else's fault. Another poster points out a relatively simple way you could have prevented that mistake, and your reply is to tell him, "Go fuck yourself."
Time to step away from the keyboard, pal.
posted by cribcage at 11:10 AM on May 2, 2006
Go fuck yourself y2karl.
The world is neither predictable or compliant, fenriq. Learn to cope, or don't. The choice is yours.
posted by crunchland at 11:12 AM on May 2, 2006
The world is neither predictable or compliant, fenriq. Learn to cope, or don't. The choice is yours.
posted by crunchland at 11:12 AM on May 2, 2006
Seriously, fenriq. Stop flipping out.
posted by boo_radley at 11:13 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by boo_radley at 11:13 AM on May 2, 2006
yes. I'm too inept to search properly. Thanks. And I'm not railing. I'm just irritated that the gleeful asshole crew loves to leap into a thread they know will be deleted and be complete pricks.
But whatever, my offer to you was a joke.
I tried to be constructive. The search page sucks, why not add some text on how to search effectively at MetaFilter instead of, well, nothing at all?
No, instead I get dumbass snark. Which is fine. I suppose I should expect it. But I'd also like some balancing decent responses too, which I also expect.
Yes, its my fault. Bad FPP (the triple means nothing since the double was already deleted), bad response, bad search, bad me, bad, bad, bad me. I'm going to go kick puppies now.
posted by fenriq at 11:14 AM on May 2, 2006
But whatever, my offer to you was a joke.
I tried to be constructive. The search page sucks, why not add some text on how to search effectively at MetaFilter instead of, well, nothing at all?
No, instead I get dumbass snark. Which is fine. I suppose I should expect it. But I'd also like some balancing decent responses too, which I also expect.
Yes, its my fault. Bad FPP (the triple means nothing since the double was already deleted), bad response, bad search, bad me, bad, bad, bad me. I'm going to go kick puppies now.
posted by fenriq at 11:14 AM on May 2, 2006
Maybe some tips could be added? As in, hey search in quotes with multiple terms.
Searching without quotes: Steven Colbert White House puts it third down.
You know, using quotes in Search seems so Internet 101 but then I can remember when the process of cutting and pasting text seemed like total voodoo to me. Still, you could have read closer--the first double post was yesterday. It's 8th from the top.
posted by y2karl at 11:15 AM on May 2, 2006
Searching without quotes: Steven Colbert White House puts it third down.
You know, using quotes in Search seems so Internet 101 but then I can remember when the process of cutting and pasting text seemed like total voodoo to me. Still, you could have read closer--the first double post was yesterday. It's 8th from the top.
posted by y2karl at 11:15 AM on May 2, 2006
I tried to be constructive. The search page sucks, why not add some text on how to search effectively at MetaFilter instead of, well, nothing at all?
God, that would have been a great MeTa post! You should have made that post!
'cause, you know, you didn't.
posted by shmegegge at 11:16 AM on May 2, 2006
God, that would have been a great MeTa post! You should have made that post!
'cause, you know, you didn't.
posted by shmegegge at 11:16 AM on May 2, 2006
Jesus Christ. In Firefox, go to the fucking front page of Metafilter, hit Ctrl+F and type 'Colbert.' OMFG! You've just saved yourself a world of embarrassment!
Better yet, in Google: "site:metafilter.com Colbert Bush" or "site metafilter.com Colbert dinner"
THESE ARE THE FIRST THINGS YOU DO WHEN MAKING A CURRENT EVENTS POST. THIS SHOULD BE OBVIOUS. STOP WHINING BECAUSE YOU FUCKED UP KTHXBYE.
posted by Ryvar at 11:16 AM on May 2, 2006
Better yet, in Google: "site:metafilter.com Colbert Bush" or "site metafilter.com Colbert dinner"
THESE ARE THE FIRST THINGS YOU DO WHEN MAKING A CURRENT EVENTS POST. THIS SHOULD BE OBVIOUS. STOP WHINING BECAUSE YOU FUCKED UP KTHXBYE.
posted by Ryvar at 11:16 AM on May 2, 2006
Of course, I go first to mefi lofi. That's one you should add to your searches. Everything is up there.
posted by y2karl at 11:17 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by y2karl at 11:17 AM on May 2, 2006
And this is why I told y2karl to fuck himself
I think some people just have an irrational dislike of tags.
Other people are too lazy to use the search function.
posted by y2karl at 11:00 AM PST on May 2 [!]
Not for offering his help on the search.
On Preview: y2karl, again, that's useful. Thanks for the useful suggestion.
posted by fenriq at 11:18 AM on May 2, 2006
I think some people just have an irrational dislike of tags.
Other people are too lazy to use the search function.
posted by y2karl at 11:00 AM PST on May 2 [!]
Not for offering his help on the search.
On Preview: y2karl, again, that's useful. Thanks for the useful suggestion.
posted by fenriq at 11:18 AM on May 2, 2006
Mefi: I'm going to go kick puppies now.
posted by wheelieman at 11:23 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by wheelieman at 11:23 AM on May 2, 2006
The addition of tags was supposed to help alleviate the suckiness of the search. People don't use it and the search still sucks ass.
So, Steven Colbert White House worked without quotes even if I did misspell his first name. Now, with Colbert White, it's the first hit. How hard was that ?
posted by y2karl at 11:24 AM on May 2, 2006
So, Steven Colbert White House worked without quotes even if I did misspell his first name. Now, with Colbert White, it's the first hit. How hard was that ?
posted by y2karl at 11:24 AM on May 2, 2006
Tags wouldn't have helped more than a regular search because you can't search on them anyway, unless they are in the top 150, you manually manipulate the url, or you just search the site for that word (it usually finds the tags page). Tag browsing is dead and looks dead for good and there is no good way to limit your search to tags.
posted by caddis at 11:30 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by caddis at 11:30 AM on May 2, 2006
Wow, this went well. I'll consider forcing tags before submission. I do it on ask mefi and it works out ok, so I might just do it at mefi.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 11:33 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by mathowie (staff) at 11:33 AM on May 2, 2006
y2karl, that you can use the search effectively does not automatically mean everyone can use the search effectively. But good for you.
Caddis, if it had been tagged with "Colbert" it would have been painfully easy to find. And yes,I know the FPP is there now. I checked the Tags specifically because I couldn't imagine someone not adding Colbert to the post. But apparently I'm one of the few that does find tags useful. My bad. I'll be extra super duper careful and quintuple check my posts before even considering an FPP.
bardic, I had no idea his middle name was "Fucking", I wonder if his family is Austrian?
mathowie, then my irritation wasn't in vain! Thanks!
posted by fenriq at 11:34 AM on May 2, 2006
Caddis, if it had been tagged with "Colbert" it would have been painfully easy to find. And yes,I know the FPP is there now. I checked the Tags specifically because I couldn't imagine someone not adding Colbert to the post. But apparently I'm one of the few that does find tags useful. My bad. I'll be extra super duper careful and quintuple check my posts before even considering an FPP.
bardic, I had no idea his middle name was "Fucking", I wonder if his family is Austrian?
mathowie, then my irritation wasn't in vain! Thanks!
posted by fenriq at 11:34 AM on May 2, 2006
Wave dramaticaly
Tags cause strife for a user
Panties in bundle
posted by edgeways at 11:36 AM on May 2, 2006
Tags cause strife for a user
Panties in bundle
posted by edgeways at 11:36 AM on May 2, 2006
Search ineptitude
Causes Ryvar's blood to boil
Kill all the morons
posted by Ryvar at 11:42 AM on May 2, 2006
Causes Ryvar's blood to boil
Kill all the morons
posted by Ryvar at 11:42 AM on May 2, 2006
Tags are not used well
Sometimes people double post
Compliance forced. Good!
posted by fenriq at 11:44 AM on May 2, 2006
Sometimes people double post
Compliance forced. Good!
posted by fenriq at 11:44 AM on May 2, 2006
Well, I am confused. Does the search function suck, or does it blow? This ambiguity is intolerable.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 11:45 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by Kirth Gerson at 11:45 AM on May 2, 2006
jingle jingle bell
bell jingle bell bell jingle
bell jingle bell bell
posted by boo_radley at 11:45 AM on May 2, 2006
bell jingle bell bell jingle
bell jingle bell bell
posted by boo_radley at 11:45 AM on May 2, 2006
Tags are not used well
Sometimes people double post
Compliance forced. Good!
Haiku can't save you
You've been marked for recycling
Report to the vats
posted by Ryvar at 11:47 AM on May 2, 2006
Sometimes people double post
Compliance forced. Good!
Haiku can't save you
You've been marked for recycling
Report to the vats
posted by Ryvar at 11:47 AM on May 2, 2006
SEARCH TIP (for everyone): use a tilde ~ (synonym finder) when searching Google for MeFi threads, it overcomes most spelling mistakes and using the wrong word.
posted by blue_beetle at 11:49 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by blue_beetle at 11:49 AM on May 2, 2006
Dear Ryvar, if you get so upset about stuff like this then perhaps you're substantially less "fit" than you think you are.
kirth, first it sucks you in with its come hither text box and then blows you away with how badly it works.
blue_beetle, cool, thanks for the tip.
posted by fenriq at 11:56 AM on May 2, 2006
kirth, first it sucks you in with its come hither text box and then blows you away with how badly it works.
blue_beetle, cool, thanks for the tip.
posted by fenriq at 11:56 AM on May 2, 2006
This is such a beautiful thread with lovely people loving each other. MeTa at its very best.
posted by keijo at 11:58 AM on May 2, 2006
posted by keijo at 11:58 AM on May 2, 2006
Meta at its very ~best.
posted by TimeFactor at 12:03 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by TimeFactor at 12:03 PM on May 2, 2006
I believe you want logical and not bit-wise negation there.
Meta at its very !best.
posted by GuyZero at 12:09 PM on May 2, 2006
Meta at its very !best.
posted by GuyZero at 12:09 PM on May 2, 2006
The sad thing is, I'm sitting here thinking, "Geeze, fenriq, you don't even know how to use a search engine?", but I know that in 5 fears, kids are going to be saying to me "Geeze, bugbread, you don't even know how to use regexp?"
posted by Bugbread at 12:11 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by Bugbread at 12:11 PM on May 2, 2006
Dear Ryvar, if you get so upset about stuff like this then perhaps you're substantially less "fit" than you think you are.
Anger as artform
Can confuse some people when
There is no substance
posted by Ryvar at 12:15 PM on May 2, 2006
Anger as artform
Can confuse some people when
There is no substance
posted by Ryvar at 12:15 PM on May 2, 2006
...but I know that in 5 fears, kids are going to be saying to me "Geeze, bugbread, you don't even know how to use regexp?"
Fear of Spell check is the 6th fear.
posted by y2karl at 12:16 PM on May 2, 2006
Fear of Spell check is the 6th fear.
posted by y2karl at 12:16 PM on May 2, 2006
bugbread, you're so old I bet you don't even know how to fuse with the Core Mind.
posted by boo_radley at 1:11 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by boo_radley at 1:11 PM on May 2, 2006
"5 Fears" - that's a Bruce Willis movie, isn't it?
posted by Kirth Gerson at 1:14 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by Kirth Gerson at 1:14 PM on May 2, 2006
I think it would be nice if we could tag other people's posts. But then we'd get into the a whole mess with people maliciously tagging, etc.
posted by delmoi at 2:02 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by delmoi at 2:02 PM on May 2, 2006
Well, this bodes well for Matt's daughter. A little temper tantrum, and her dad just totally caves.
posted by crunchland at 2:31 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by crunchland at 2:31 PM on May 2, 2006
crunchland : "A little temper tantrum, and her dad just totally caves."
Caves? Was he all opposed to it at the start?
posted by Bugbread at 2:41 PM on May 2, 2006
Caves? Was he all opposed to it at the start?
posted by Bugbread at 2:41 PM on May 2, 2006
"Why don't people tag their posts?"
Why do people not bookmark the posts in which they have interest? Why do people use contractions and end clauses with prepositions?
posted by mischief at 2:42 PM on May 2, 2006
Why do people not bookmark the posts in which they have interest? Why do people use contractions and end clauses with prepositions?
posted by mischief at 2:42 PM on May 2, 2006
OK, after reconsideration, fenriq is correct.
If the original poster had tagged his post using StephenTColbert, all would have been hunky-dory.
posted by mischief at 2:52 PM on May 2, 2006
If the original poster had tagged his post using StephenTColbert, all would have been hunky-dory.
posted by mischief at 2:52 PM on May 2, 2006
Tags are nearly but not quite useless for direct searching. They are however great for subject trawling eg. books/illustration etc etc and come with rss ---- it's for this reason that tags are useful and should be encouraged.
And if people can rub 2 braincells together well enough to construct a post in the first place surely (?!) they can reduce it to a few choice descriptive words before hitting enter. Although the email subject lines mentioned above are evidence to the contrary I suppose.
posted by peacay at 2:55 PM on May 2, 2006
And if people can rub 2 braincells together well enough to construct a post in the first place surely (?!) they can reduce it to a few choice descriptive words before hitting enter. Although the email subject lines mentioned above are evidence to the contrary I suppose.
posted by peacay at 2:55 PM on May 2, 2006
Agreed with peacay. Tags are not for direct searching, but for trawling topics of interest.
posted by Bugbread at 2:57 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by Bugbread at 2:57 PM on May 2, 2006
bugbread and peacay, yes tags are useful for trawling but I will maintain that they can also be used as a good search system (when the tags are being used by other members of the communtiy, of course).
Would it be that hard to make a tag specific search engine? I don't see why. In fact, I bet y2karl could drop a string like that. Or Matt could code in a "related FPPs" list based on the tags, start to generate more of a web of interconnected FPPs which would also get some older but still awesome FPPs out of the dust in the back of the closet (yes, I know those FPPs from the long, long ago don't have tags, yet).
crunchland, you haven't even begun to see a real tantrum. Not even close. My keyboard would probably lock up from the drool.
posted by fenriq at 3:19 PM on May 2, 2006
Would it be that hard to make a tag specific search engine? I don't see why. In fact, I bet y2karl could drop a string like that. Or Matt could code in a "related FPPs" list based on the tags, start to generate more of a web of interconnected FPPs which would also get some older but still awesome FPPs out of the dust in the back of the closet (yes, I know those FPPs from the long, long ago don't have tags, yet).
crunchland, you haven't even begun to see a real tantrum. Not even close. My keyboard would probably lock up from the drool.
posted by fenriq at 3:19 PM on May 2, 2006
Tags (at least folksonomy tags) are bad for searching for the very reason you asploded opened this MeTa, fenriq. People ain't gotta satisfy nobody when they tag their articles. My [humor video flash Colbert] tagset may be your [swf political satire Colbear], you know? What makes sense to you angers me inexplicably sort of differences, yeah?
Although, I suppose you could just go to http://www.metafilter.com/tags/ and tack on whatever you're searching for there. Hell, that'd be a stone simple firefox search. Or, now that I've taken five minutes, a search bookmarklet.
posted by boo_radley at 3:39 PM on May 2, 2006
Although, I suppose you could just go to http://www.metafilter.com/tags/ and tack on whatever you're searching for there. Hell, that'd be a stone simple firefox search. Or, now that I've taken five minutes, a search bookmarklet.
posted by boo_radley at 3:39 PM on May 2, 2006
I don't know fenriq. The search function as is might not be the best possible system and relies upon you creating decent search strings to get a result. But I'm not sure how one's searching ineptitude is enhanced or reduced or whatever at all by adding a 2nd layer of trawling function....unless actual trawling is the aim of the game.
If I want to find something on 'Bush'/'Iraq'/'puppy love' then plugging those 3 terms into the search box is going to be more productive than looking through 3 separate tag arrangements of possible posts. It's also quicker and extinguishes the need to put 'puppy_love', 'puppylove' or 'love_puppy' or 'puppy' etc etc into the tag search.
This itself reiterates the individual nature of tagging and why it isn't the beall and endall that has been mooted these last few years. But you can't really legislate either against inherent stupidity or individuality for that matter.
posted by peacay at 3:39 PM on May 2, 2006
If I want to find something on 'Bush'/'Iraq'/'puppy love' then plugging those 3 terms into the search box is going to be more productive than looking through 3 separate tag arrangements of possible posts. It's also quicker and extinguishes the need to put 'puppy_love', 'puppylove' or 'love_puppy' or 'puppy' etc etc into the tag search.
This itself reiterates the individual nature of tagging and why it isn't the beall and endall that has been mooted these last few years. But you can't really legislate either against inherent stupidity or individuality for that matter.
posted by peacay at 3:39 PM on May 2, 2006
damn you, filter!
posted by boo_radley at 3:40 PM on May 2, 2006
<a href="javascript:javascript:var p = prompt ('Search for tag'); if(p!='){window.top.location= 'http://www.metafilter.com/tags/'+p;} ">search bookmarklet</a>posted by boo_radley at 3:40 PM on May 2, 2006
and how'd that javascript get in there twice? I give up. :|
posted by boo_radley at 3:43 PM on May 2, 2006
posted by boo_radley at 3:43 PM on May 2, 2006
STEPHEN FUCKING COLBERT, PEOPLE.
Stephen "Balls" Colbert, actually.
posted by Gary at 4:02 PM on May 2, 2006
Stephen "Balls" Colbert, actually.
posted by Gary at 4:02 PM on May 2, 2006
Tags actually seem to help out the Google/Yahoo searches. You search for 'colbert', the 4th hit is Posts tagged with colbert. Which is useful.
A separate issue is why that page says there are 6 posts but only lists 4.
posted by smackfu at 5:40 PM on May 2, 2006
A separate issue is why that page says there are 6 posts but only lists 4.
posted by smackfu at 5:40 PM on May 2, 2006
occhiblu: "If you figure this out, let me know how I can apply the knowledge to the people sending emails at my company. Trying to locate information about the new project when every single email in my inbox has the subject line of "Here you go" or "More info" has sapped my will to live."
Send this article to your co-workers, and get them to forward it around. I've done it and have been following it somewhat religiously for the past six months, and it's done wonders for the amount of useful feedback I get in response to my emails, plus a few of my co-workers actually took the hint.
posted by Plutor at 4:01 AM on May 3, 2006
Send this article to your co-workers, and get them to forward it around. I've done it and have been following it somewhat religiously for the past six months, and it's done wonders for the amount of useful feedback I get in response to my emails, plus a few of my co-workers actually took the hint.
posted by Plutor at 4:01 AM on May 3, 2006
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WTF?
You can't post an FPP without a title, why not make it so you can't post one without some descriptive tags too?
posted by fenriq at 10:37 AM on May 2, 2006