Newsfilter in the worst way January 6, 2003 12:20 PM Subscribe
This thread is a NewsFilter post in the worst way.
It is not new (Newsflash: Bush to Lower Taxes, Water Wet) or interesting. And it certainly doesn't lend itself to much discussion. I, for one, want to be subjected to Randian diatribes only slightly more than I want people posting their personal tax ephemera on metafilter. The fact that the article is from a mainstream news source only adds insult to injury.
It is not new (Newsflash: Bush to Lower Taxes, Water Wet) or interesting. And it certainly doesn't lend itself to much discussion. I, for one, want to be subjected to Randian diatribes only slightly more than I want people posting their personal tax ephemera on metafilter. The fact that the article is from a mainstream news source only adds insult to injury.
Still, it led to a reasoned, enlightening - and courteous - discussion...
posted by dash_slot- at 1:52 PM on January 6, 2003
posted by dash_slot- at 1:52 PM on January 6, 2003
Settle down there, zpousman. This is neither insult, nor injury, it's just a post about something someone thought others here would find interesting; clearly, given the level and depth of discussion, people did. No personal insult was intended to you, nor were your eyes meant to be scorched by the reading of the post.
posted by jonson at 1:58 PM on January 6, 2003
posted by jonson at 1:58 PM on January 6, 2003
"This post has no point!"
"Stop crying, just ignore the posts you don't like!"
Haven't we had this discussion (several times) before?
posted by yhbc at 2:01 PM on January 6, 2003
"Stop crying, just ignore the posts you don't like!"
Haven't we had this discussion (several times) before?
posted by yhbc at 2:01 PM on January 6, 2003
Yep, I tend to agree with Dash_slot. The initial link was fairly uninteresting, but the discussion that followed wasn't half bad.
Although, I have to say, these political debates are starting to go the way of I/P threads, with people firmly entrenched in their own little worldview that won't change no matter what is said. And, as a result, the resultant conversation just degenerates into name-calling and prejudicial language.
posted by bshort at 2:17 PM on January 6, 2003
Although, I have to say, these political debates are starting to go the way of I/P threads, with people firmly entrenched in their own little worldview that won't change no matter what is said. And, as a result, the resultant conversation just degenerates into name-calling and prejudicial language.
posted by bshort at 2:17 PM on January 6, 2003
The thread probably should have been euthanised while it was young, but it seems to have grown up well and can stand alone now. Always listen to your intuition, mathowie and if you are not sure, delete it anyway.
posted by dg at 2:57 PM on January 6, 2003
posted by dg at 2:57 PM on January 6, 2003
"Always listen to your intuition, mathowie and if you are not sure, delete it anyway."
Hear, hear. In fact, you should occasionally delete a "good" post, just for the feeling of power. Then you could put "Because it's my site, and I can" for the reason.
That would totally rock.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 3:11 PM on January 6, 2003
Hear, hear. In fact, you should occasionally delete a "good" post, just for the feeling of power. Then you could put "Because it's my site, and I can" for the reason.
That would totally rock.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 3:11 PM on January 6, 2003
These overtaxed pancakes - do they vibrate?
Reason enough to delete the whole thing.
posted by Mid at 3:27 PM on January 6, 2003
Reason enough to delete the whole thing.
posted by Mid at 3:27 PM on January 6, 2003
I, for one, want to be subjected to Randian diatribes only slightly more than I want people posting their personal tax ephemera on metafilter.
And yet, curiously, the only one "subjecting" you to it, is you....
posted by rushmc at 6:12 PM on January 6, 2003
And yet, curiously, the only one "subjecting" you to it, is you....
posted by rushmc at 6:12 PM on January 6, 2003
This thread was interesting, was related to something important regarding my life (my MONEY), and is an issue that everyone should be concerned about, in my opinion.
I liked hearing what MeFier's had to say about it. Actually, I wish there were more links about issues like these. I know I am in the minority, but it can be boring to me to just be reading about the latest internet chachka that's made its way online.
For example, the links zpouseman has posted aren't interesting to me in the least. They are:
1. A link about the Turing test (*wow, fascinating, and talked about here every week)
2. Link about AI's difficulty understanding contextual aspects of language (*yawn)
3. Link about raising a cow [via NYTimes] (*nice link, but didn't you just write above that linking to a major news source was reason enough to delete the post in question?)
WTF? I don't whine to Metafilter everytime someone posts the umpteenth link about Linux servers. Can't some of us talk about what we feel is newsworthy?
posted by xammerboy at 6:24 PM on January 6, 2003
I liked hearing what MeFier's had to say about it. Actually, I wish there were more links about issues like these. I know I am in the minority, but it can be boring to me to just be reading about the latest internet chachka that's made its way online.
For example, the links zpouseman has posted aren't interesting to me in the least. They are:
1. A link about the Turing test (*wow, fascinating, and talked about here every week)
2. Link about AI's difficulty understanding contextual aspects of language (*yawn)
3. Link about raising a cow [via NYTimes] (*nice link, but didn't you just write above that linking to a major news source was reason enough to delete the post in question?)
WTF? I don't whine to Metafilter everytime someone posts the umpteenth link about Linux servers. Can't some of us talk about what we feel is newsworthy?
posted by xammerboy at 6:24 PM on January 6, 2003
Can't some of us talk about what we feel is newsworthy?
I don't think that is what the site is for.
posted by timeistight at 6:44 PM on January 6, 2003
I don't think that is what the site is for.
posted by timeistight at 6:44 PM on January 6, 2003
Allright, xammerboy, no need to make this personal, either. zpousman's response is over the top, but clearly based on Matt's comments, he felt a twinge of the same urge when he first read the link. That said, no need to dig up zpousman's old posts and disparage them; while timeistight brings up the question of what exactly the site IS for, I'm pretty sure it's not for pissing matches over post quality.
posted by jonson at 8:17 PM on January 6, 2003
posted by jonson at 8:17 PM on January 6, 2003
I don't whine to Metafilter everytime someone posts the umpteenth link about Linux servers.
This would be a valid complaint at slashdot.org. Where's the profusion of *nix posts at MeFi? I can't recall any in recent memory. And those zpouseman posts you point out don't really help your case. They all sound like the kind of material that works well on this site.
(*yawn)
To you, maybe. That link is a perfect fit for the criteria on this site. It is a link to something interesting on the web that most of us have never seen. The post that ignited this thread is the real yawner. Oh look, righties and lefties arguing over possible tax cuts by a conservative president. I wonder what that conversation is going to be like?
posted by eyeballkid at 8:49 PM on January 6, 2003
This would be a valid complaint at slashdot.org. Where's the profusion of *nix posts at MeFi? I can't recall any in recent memory. And those zpouseman posts you point out don't really help your case. They all sound like the kind of material that works well on this site.
(*yawn)
To you, maybe. That link is a perfect fit for the criteria on this site. It is a link to something interesting on the web that most of us have never seen. The post that ignited this thread is the real yawner. Oh look, righties and lefties arguing over possible tax cuts by a conservative president. I wonder what that conversation is going to be like?
posted by eyeballkid at 8:49 PM on January 6, 2003
I thought it was kinda interesting. but whatever, I guess.
posted by mcsweetie at 9:34 PM on January 6, 2003
posted by mcsweetie at 9:34 PM on January 6, 2003
It is not new (Newsflash: Bush to Lower Taxes ...
Perhaps the CNN Money link wasn't the best choice about the topic, but to claim that it's "not new" is ludicrous -- the new tax relief proposals to spur the economy are a big story.
posted by rcade at 10:27 PM on January 6, 2003
Perhaps the CNN Money link wasn't the best choice about the topic, but to claim that it's "not new" is ludicrous -- the new tax relief proposals to spur the economy are a big story.
posted by rcade at 10:27 PM on January 6, 2003
Where's the profusion of *nix posts at MeFi?
About one a month.
Is anyone else having strange problems with the comment box under Phoenix? I had to post this in IE.
posted by inpHilltr8r at 1:40 AM on January 7, 2003
About one a month.
Is anyone else having strange problems with the comment box under Phoenix? I had to post this in IE.
posted by inpHilltr8r at 1:40 AM on January 7, 2003
ok, i could live with about one post a month mentioning bush.
posted by andrew cooke at 3:40 AM on January 7, 2003
posted by andrew cooke at 3:40 AM on January 7, 2003
I'm sorry that I jumped the gun on this post.
When I first read it, it had only four comments. And they seemed weak to me. I didn't know exactly what to do, but I didn't want to disparage the thread inside it -- and, in my view, it's exactly the kind of thread that MetaFilter needs less of. Many things are newsworthy to some of us -- some of them could make well-crafted, interesting, and downright cool posts to metafilter. But some don't.
But I'm glad that I was proven wrong--the thread is a good one, taken as a whole. So I'm sorry I started the whole thing.
I do like political discourse on MetaFilter. I just like it to have more meaty links.
Note: I can't really defend my posting record, other than to say that I've been a member here for a while, and a pretty active member at times, and I've posted the things that I found that rose above the noise and got at the memes that are shaping our day. Don't like 'em? Skip 'em. I'll do the same.
posted by zpousman at 5:52 AM on January 7, 2003
When I first read it, it had only four comments. And they seemed weak to me. I didn't know exactly what to do, but I didn't want to disparage the thread inside it -- and, in my view, it's exactly the kind of thread that MetaFilter needs less of. Many things are newsworthy to some of us -- some of them could make well-crafted, interesting, and downright cool posts to metafilter. But some don't.
But I'm glad that I was proven wrong--the thread is a good one, taken as a whole. So I'm sorry I started the whole thing.
I do like political discourse on MetaFilter. I just like it to have more meaty links.
Note: I can't really defend my posting record, other than to say that I've been a member here for a while, and a pretty active member at times, and I've posted the things that I found that rose above the noise and got at the memes that are shaping our day. Don't like 'em? Skip 'em. I'll do the same.
posted by zpousman at 5:52 AM on January 7, 2003
I didn't know exactly what to do
Ignoring its existence is always an option.
posted by mischief at 7:13 AM on January 7, 2003
Ignoring its existence is always an option.
posted by mischief at 7:13 AM on January 7, 2003
I shouldn't have brought up zpousman's posts. I just wanted to show that "interesting" can be in the eye of the beholder. I don't like the trend toward disparaging anything news related, because I think that it ends up making this place kind of Fark-like, in the sense that it somewhat skews posts in general toward the trivial. All the same, I admit that there are many politically-oriented posts here that result in generic "us" versus "them" flame wars. I don't know what to do about that.
posted by xammerboy at 7:47 AM on January 7, 2003
posted by xammerboy at 7:47 AM on January 7, 2003
If you don't like it, don't look at it?? I accuse people who make that point of not caring about Metafilter. Or logic.
posted by luser at 8:18 AM on January 7, 2003
posted by luser at 8:18 AM on January 7, 2003
the new tax relief proposals to spur the economy are a big story
But that's the point: MetaFilter isn't a discussion forum for the hot news of the day, whether it's snipers, tax cuts or J. Lo's wedding. If something is a "big story" it by definition is not something most people haven't seen.
posted by timeistight at 8:53 AM on January 7, 2003
But that's the point: MetaFilter isn't a discussion forum for the hot news of the day, whether it's snipers, tax cuts or J. Lo's wedding. If something is a "big story" it by definition is not something most people haven't seen.
posted by timeistight at 8:53 AM on January 7, 2003
If something is a "big story" it by definition is not something most people haven't seen.
True, but there have been many big news stories linked on Metafilter, so to claim that they don't belong here at all is a bit disingenuous. The key is finding elements of the story that have been missed (or intentionally omitted) by the mainstream media.
posted by rcade at 9:18 AM on January 7, 2003
True, but there have been many big news stories linked on Metafilter, so to claim that they don't belong here at all is a bit disingenuous. The key is finding elements of the story that have been missed (or intentionally omitted) by the mainstream media.
posted by rcade at 9:18 AM on January 7, 2003
J. Lo's getting married?!?
Yes. To Jason Kottke. Who just moved to NYC and started a new cool website!!!
posted by PrinceValium at 9:24 AM on January 7, 2003
Yes. To Jason Kottke. Who just moved to NYC and started a new cool website!!!
posted by PrinceValium at 9:24 AM on January 7, 2003
The key is finding elements of the story that have been missed (or intentionally omitted) by the mainstream media.
Which this post did how?
posted by timeistight at 9:31 AM on January 7, 2003
Which this post did how?
posted by timeistight at 9:31 AM on January 7, 2003
Why deny the fact that big news stories are eventually going to show up here, like it or not. The events of 9/11 were nothing but news, but no one would argue that it couldn't be discussed here.
This is a community... but I picture it more of an eternal cocktail party, people coming and going. Sometimes there are all sorts of interesting web related topics to gab about. Sometimes there isn't. It's only a matter of time before someone walks in and says, "Hey, yea origami is cool, but I was just outside and I heard this thing on the news. What do you think?"
While I "depend" on MeFi for all kinds of entertainment throughout my day, I've also come to "depend" on some of the members here for their expertise in various subjects. I don't know jack about economics or taxation, etc. (for the most part). So I don't mind it so much when I get to read about these things once in a while by people who seem to know what they're talking about. I have more faith in our cocktail party than I do at say... Fark.
posted by Witty at 2:47 PM on January 7, 2003
This is a community... but I picture it more of an eternal cocktail party, people coming and going. Sometimes there are all sorts of interesting web related topics to gab about. Sometimes there isn't. It's only a matter of time before someone walks in and says, "Hey, yea origami is cool, but I was just outside and I heard this thing on the news. What do you think?"
While I "depend" on MeFi for all kinds of entertainment throughout my day, I've also come to "depend" on some of the members here for their expertise in various subjects. I don't know jack about economics or taxation, etc. (for the most part). So I don't mind it so much when I get to read about these things once in a while by people who seem to know what they're talking about. I have more faith in our cocktail party than I do at say... Fark.
posted by Witty at 2:47 PM on January 7, 2003
is american taxation a big news story? really? ok, anything that alters the american economy affects the whole world, but that would justify almost anything as "big news". it seems more like domestic politics than "big" (isn't "international" a good way of measuring big?) news to me.
also, 9/11 is referred to in the faq as "the exception that proves the rule", not "the exception that isn't an exception at all, but the normal state of affairs"...
posted by andrew cooke at 3:12 PM on January 7, 2003
also, 9/11 is referred to in the faq as "the exception that proves the rule", not "the exception that isn't an exception at all, but the normal state of affairs"...
posted by andrew cooke at 3:12 PM on January 7, 2003
anarchism?
posted by andrew cooke at 4:26 PM on January 7, 2003
posted by andrew cooke at 4:26 PM on January 7, 2003
I thought it was referred to like this:
"As for the newsfilter call-outs, something just came to mind: I'm objecting to people doing it because is smacks of so much zero-tolerance bullshit. Again, the reasons why there are no hard and fast rules and only vague guidelines is because nothing is absolute. I'm saying yeah, 30 posts a day is too much, especially if they're all news items, but you know what? half of that is just fine, it's tolerable. Some have taken it as a sign that too many news links means no news links ever, and it's their duty to point this out, and that's what I have a problem with."
--Mathowie
Actually, thanks for pointing this discussion towards the FAQ. The issue has already been intelligently dealt with there (not just this quote but both sides of the argument). Really, all hail the Faq.
posted by xammerboy at 7:24 PM on January 7, 2003
"As for the newsfilter call-outs, something just came to mind: I'm objecting to people doing it because is smacks of so much zero-tolerance bullshit. Again, the reasons why there are no hard and fast rules and only vague guidelines is because nothing is absolute. I'm saying yeah, 30 posts a day is too much, especially if they're all news items, but you know what? half of that is just fine, it's tolerable. Some have taken it as a sign that too many news links means no news links ever, and it's their duty to point this out, and that's what I have a problem with."
--Mathowie
Actually, thanks for pointing this discussion towards the FAQ. The issue has already been intelligently dealt with there (not just this quote but both sides of the argument). Really, all hail the Faq.
posted by xammerboy at 7:24 PM on January 7, 2003
You are not logged in, either login or create an account to post comments
posted by mathowie (staff) at 1:13 PM on January 6, 2003