Why Was I Deleted?

June 9, 2005 7:55 AM

I posted a question to Ask Metafilter this morning, and it just vanished. What went wrong?
posted by a thousand writers drunk at the keyboard to Uptime at 7:55 AM (45 comments total)

What was the questions?
posted by taz at 7:58 AM on June 9, 2005

Check the email of your other Mefi account. I'd also suggest adding email or IM info to your profile so that people can contact you. It was a flagged chatfilter post reading, in total "how did you first get published?" In the email I sent, I gave you some suggestions of how you could repost it to avoid the flagging and get some better responses.
posted by jessamyn at 7:58 AM on June 9, 2005

How was that chatfilter? I clicked through from my RSS reader because I was interested in following the responses. I'd like to know how people first got published. Getting published is chatfilter but "singers who can really sing" isn't? (Not that I disliked that thread; it's just the first chatty thing that popped to mind.)
posted by jdroth at 8:09 AM on June 9, 2005

Are you drunk?
posted by OmieWise at 8:26 AM on June 9, 2005

jessamyn writes "I'd also suggest adding email or IM info to your profile so that people can contact you."

Word.
posted by terrapin at 8:28 AM on June 9, 2005

I missed it, but this thread (as jdroth described it) would have been very useful and interesting to me.
posted by rafter at 8:35 AM on June 9, 2005

rafter writes "I missed it, but this thread (as jdroth described it) would have been very useful and interesting to me."

And may still be. As jessamyn said above she "gave ... some suggestions of how [it] could [be] repost[ed] ... to avoid the flagging and get some better responses."
posted by terrapin at 8:43 AM on June 9, 2005

It was a flagged chatfilter post reading, in total "how did you first get published?"

Excuse me but that is outrageously ridiculous. Those answers would be instructive, perhaps tangibly useful to a lot of people.

It was fine as-is. Bad call. If you're going to pull something because of the way it's phrased, I think it's only fair to reset the poster's one-week quota. Has that been done?
posted by scarabic at 8:49 AM on June 9, 2005

It was a flagged chatfilter post reading

I reckon that means that people flagged it. So maybe don't blame jessamyn. And check your email before posting here.
posted by anapestic at 8:51 AM on June 9, 2005

Also, I would point out that information about how to get published is not exactly scarce on the Internet.
posted by anapestic at 8:52 AM on June 9, 2005

It sounds like it was a fine question, but asked with very little detail. A more inside would have been nice. I probably wouldn't have deleted it over it, but hopefully it comes back.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:09 AM on June 9, 2005

I didn't flag it, but I think Jessamyn's right. I can see where the poster is going, but "I'm looking for some first-hand perspective on how to get something published" is more likely to receive practical, useful responses than "How did you first get published?", which is an invitation for wistful memories from writers.
posted by mkultra at 10:16 AM on June 9, 2005

i'm curious about the whole flagging thing. is there threshhold number of flags that results in deletion? is it an editorial decision to respond to a flag with a deletion? are posts with "offense" flags more often removed than those with "noise"?

i think flagging/deleting is in generally valuable to the site overall and ask.met in particular. i'm just curious how it works.
posted by crush-onastick at 10:22 AM on June 9, 2005

Regarding publishing, might this AskMe thread help you?
posted by AlexReynolds at 10:23 AM on June 9, 2005

I agree, ridiculous deletion. Unfortunately, the occasional ridiculous deletion is the price we pay for a human-moderated site. Mistakes happen. Please rephrase and repost.

And Matt/jessamyn, scarabic has a good point -- resetting the one-week post limit in cases like this would be nice.

Of course, uptime comes first.
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 10:43 AM on June 9, 2005

I'm not getting the part about "your other MeFi account." Does that mean the question was posted by sock? If so, why wouldn't you use the sock for the MeTa post also?
posted by Mid at 11:29 AM on June 9, 2005

The one-a-week limit is reset for ask mefi. On metafilter, you're still blocked, but not on ask mefi.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 12:04 PM on June 9, 2005

why wouldn't you use the sock for the MeTa post also?

Well, then we'd all know who the sock-puppet belongs to....
posted by dash_slot- at 1:01 PM on June 9, 2005

"I'm looking for some first-hand perspective on how to get something published"

is more likely to receive practical, useful responses than

"How did you first get published?"

Split hairs much?

Just because something's flagged doesn't mean it automatically gets deleted, so yes, this protest belongs to Jessamyn. What, are we editing questions for style, here? This is silly. Not an end to my world, just lame. At least the counter gets reset so the poster can try again. But given the razor thin line drawn between the sentence construction of a "good" question and one that gets yanked, I wouldn't blame the questioner for not having a clue what he did wrong or how to right it. I also wouldn't blame him for being turned off by the whole deal.

Pony: Please insert the phrase "I'm looking for some practical advice and first-hand perspectives that would educate me and inform my actions in the area of..." into the question submission form field automatically. Save us all time.
posted by scarabic at 1:37 PM on June 9, 2005

I'm rarely in a position to directly oppose scarabic -- I think the beetle's a significantly sharper tack than I am and generally well informed -- but I call bullshit.

The way a question is phrased absolutely does color the responses, and style matters. "How were you published?" is a different question in both style and substance from "How do I become published?" One's an invitation for a bunch of people to sit around swapping anecdotes, and another is a request to be informed.

That's not to say the thread is guaranteed to turn into a bunch of yarn trading if somehow "improperly phrased," but it certainly doesn't seem productive to bait it.

Hell, I'd actually like to read stories about how people came to be published! I just don't think Ask is the place to put them.
posted by majick at 2:10 PM on June 9, 2005

I wouldn't blame the questioner for not having a clue what he did wrong or how to right it.

aTWDatK has another account which has contact information and I emailed that account explaining this. AskMe posts that say some version of "tell me your stories" tend to get flagged, sometimes a lot; after that it's up to a human to decide what to do about them. I made a judgment call to see if the poster could rephrase and repost before the thread had gotten comments in it, since I knew I had contact info for them. This thread in MeTa was up within about five minutes of the deletion, my response to it was three minutes later. Is an eight minute time lag an okay price to pay for creating a post that won't get the wistful-memories-type answers that at least some people can't stand? I thought it was.
posted by jessamyn at 2:35 PM on June 9, 2005

stupidsexyFlanders writes "resetting the one-week post limit in cases like this would be nice. "

Why? There should be some friction in the system otherwise matt/jessamyn become editors not moderators.
posted by Mitheral at 3:49 PM on June 9, 2005

It would be nice if sockpuppet accounts were clearly marked as such, showing the alter-ego in the profile. It would cut out a lot of buttheadedness.
posted by crunchland at 4:32 PM on June 9, 2005

'How did you first get published?' -- interesteting as it may have been -- is totally fucking chatfilter. Good call, jessamyn.

Where the hell were you guys when AskMe was starting up and we were hashing this stuff out freaking daily, scarabic and Flanders et al?
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:33 PM on June 9, 2005

'interesteting' is my special private word that means sexy and chocolate-flavoured. I keep forgetting not to use it in public. Damn!
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:35 PM on June 9, 2005

totally fucking chatfilter.

Unless, of course, it was phrased as advice on how to get published. Then it's like, totally, OK.

Never mind. Need coffee.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:39 PM on June 9, 2005

Where can I sign up for this fucking chatfilter? Because, um, I think I have lots of interesting perspectives to offer, or something.
posted by yhbc at 5:54 PM on June 9, 2005

I don't agree that it's chatfilter. Every path to publication is different. Hearing different anecdotes is the only way to learn the way it works. The relatively low number of people published is also a good check on rampant chatting. This isn't the case of "have any weird dreams lately?" I was right here when we hashed those out, stavros. I've always advocated for erring on the side of chat. Really, what's the difference between saying "My Windows box crashed - what should I do to fix it?" and saying "What have you done in the past when your Windows boxes crash?"

Negligible. Not worth a delete.
posted by scarabic at 6:59 PM on June 9, 2005

Bad deletion! Evolution at work, I guess, but then, I like to color outside the lines, not inside. Anyone seen my socks?
posted by mischief at 7:14 PM on June 9, 2005

so how does jessamyn know a thousand writers drunk at the keyboard has another account?
posted by puke & cry at 7:42 PM on June 9, 2005

IP addresses must be logged.
posted by mlis at 7:47 PM on June 9, 2005

so how does jessamyn know a thousand writers drunk at the keyboard has another account?< ?i>

*kills puke & cry silently but deadlily*

Any other questions?

(But seriously, do sock puppeteers really think no one knows what they're doing?)
posted by mediareport at 7:51 PM on June 9, 2005

*raises hands to sky, screams "NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!"*
posted by mediareport at 7:52 PM on June 9, 2005

Yes, such general questions are chatfilter. (Though sometimes chatfilter is worthy enough to stand on its own.) It's been said before: AskMe works best with a specific problem that you're actually looking to solve. At the very least it'd be nice to know what field of literature he's looking to publish in and more about his own level of education and experience--then perhaps people can recommend courses or the such. The criteria is very simple: be specific. Asking overly broad questions helps nobody. In this case, I think the deletion was fine.
posted by nixerman at 7:55 PM on June 9, 2005

(But seriously, do sock puppeteers really think no one knows what they're doing?)

it sure seems like it, what with all the shenanigans and goes-on.
posted by puke & cry at 8:18 PM on June 9, 2005

good post > chatfilter > bad post
posted by Saucy Intruder at 9:10 PM on June 9, 2005

(But seriously, do sock puppeteers really think no one knows what they're doing?)

I don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about.
posted by Rothko at 9:15 PM on June 9, 2005

(But seriously, do sock puppeteers really think no one knows what they're doing?)

Nor I. This kind of talk is just inane paranoia.
posted by Poltroon at 9:17 PM on June 9, 2005

(But seriously, do sock puppeteers really think no one knows what they're doing?)

No one's ever caught me.

Oops.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 9:20 PM on June 9, 2005

Isn't it perfect really. He asked for advice on how to get published, and jessamyn sent him advice on how to get published on askme...
posted by Chuckles at 8:37 AM on June 10, 2005

So this one is nixed, but "have you lived in a haunted house?" type questions are fine?
posted by agregoli at 9:01 AM on June 10, 2005

Really, what's the difference between saying "My Windows box crashed - what should I do to fix it?" and saying "What have you done in the past when your Windows boxes crash?"

"I got up, fixed myself a microwave pizza, did my laundry, then watched a few episodes of The X-Files" could be an answer to the latter question, but not to the former. That's the difference.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 10:44 AM on June 10, 2005

So if anybody flags your post for deletion it's automatically deleted? I'm confused now.

And what of sockpuppeteers who use different IP addresses, such as from home, work and public library? And what could account for "quonsar" and "kwantsar"?

And DevilsAdvocate, your "answer" is just ludicrous snarkiness and you know it.
posted by davy at 8:33 AM on June 11, 2005

I feel that this debate is pretty much already over (and that my view has lost out), but I'll just weigh in again on the side against both "have you lived in a haunted house?" AND "how did you first get published?" The former is more egregious than the latter, since there is at least an implicit request for help behind the publishing question. But any question that is on the model of "Dear Fellow Mefites, tell me your story!" is, to my mind, contrary to the original spirit of Ask Me.
posted by redfoxtail at 7:53 AM on June 12, 2005

It could have been a system glitch.

One may wonder: Have I jumped my own shark? Since I recognize neither the humor of the phrase nor the validity of the concept, the only reasonable answer is no.
posted by gramschmidt at 12:42 PM on June 27, 2005