ASCII display errors August 1, 2002 7:54 AM Subscribe
I'm seeing these ? everywhere. It's maddening for those who post them (when they go unseen in the preview), and makes reading difficult. Is there anything that can be done about this? I don't just mean a programming solution, but what is it, specifically, that the users are doing which causes this?
I don't think users are doing anything. If one checks old threads (like from six months or a year ago) they are now there where they once did not appear.
posted by ljromanoff at 7:56 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by ljromanoff at 7:56 AM on August 1, 2002
That is to say, they have appeared where single quotes once were.
posted by ljromanoff at 7:58 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by ljromanoff at 7:58 AM on August 1, 2002
Are you posting straight into the comment box, or are you composing your thoughts in Word or something similar first? If so, there are special characters you need to turn off ("smart quotes" in Word are one that I know of). Or you might switch to a simple text editor (Notepad, etc.) That's the "clueless luser" explanation. Someone more technically knowledgeable than I will have to tell you why it happens in the first place.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:00 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:00 AM on August 1, 2002
..."smart quotes" in Word are one that I know of...
Eek! How about
...the "smart quotes" feature in word causes some problems, for instance...
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:07 AM on August 1, 2002
Eek! How about
...the "smart quotes" feature in word causes some problems, for instance...
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:07 AM on August 1, 2002
I never compose my posts in Word, but I've used NotePad on occasion(I haven't had a problem like the one I brought up, though)
Which characters specifically are causing this problem?
posted by insomnyuk at 8:08 AM on August 1, 2002
Which characters specifically are causing this problem?
posted by insomnyuk at 8:08 AM on August 1, 2002
‘Single smart quotes’
“double smart quotes”
an apostrophe like the one in "don’t"
These were all done with smart quotes and look fine on Preview. Let's see how they post.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:14 AM on August 1, 2002
“double smart quotes”
an apostrophe like the one in "don’t"
These were all done with smart quotes and look fine on Preview. Let's see how they post.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:14 AM on August 1, 2002
So if one cuts and pastes from an article (like your example above), and the article was composed in Word (or something that uses similar characters), quotes and apostrophes will look fine on preview but post as boxes. I guess a user could do a find and replace on the copied text, replacing all "curly" quotes, with "straight" quotes.
I still have no idea why this happens, but isn't it fun to experiment?
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:21 AM on August 1, 2002
I still have no idea why this happens, but isn't it fun to experiment?
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:21 AM on August 1, 2002
“this is a quotation that’s got ‘smart quotes’ inserted by Wordperfect”
"this is the same quotation that's got 'smart quotes', after running it through Notepad"
They both looked fine in preview.
posted by yhbc at 8:26 AM on August 1, 2002
"this is the same quotation that's got 'smart quotes', after running it through Notepad"
They both looked fine in preview.
posted by yhbc at 8:26 AM on August 1, 2002
Mmmm... don’ts... Sorry, couldn't resist it. Thanks for the tips, PinkStainlessTail. I need to use Notepad more often.
posted by y2karl at 8:28 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by y2karl at 8:28 AM on August 1, 2002
This is maddening for me, too. It's making me feel like some sort of punctuationally-impaired version of thomcatspike.
I have to consciously delete the last period in everything I write, or something appears after it from out of nowhere. And even that doesn't work most of the time.
posted by interrobang at 8:31 AM on August 1, 2002
I have to consciously delete the last period in everything I write, or something appears after it from out of nowhere. And even that doesn't work most of the time.
posted by interrobang at 8:31 AM on August 1, 2002
karl, you give me an idea! This could be a great feature instead of a bug:
Kiss my ‘ss
F’ck me gently with a chainsaw
Don’t sh’t where you eat
Mmmmm, expurgation!
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:33 AM on August 1, 2002
Kiss my ‘ss
F’ck me gently with a chainsaw
Don’t sh’t where you eat
Mmmmm, expurgation!
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 8:33 AM on August 1, 2002
The best I can do is switch to UTF-8 encoding for data, but that still loses some high ascii characters. I'll see if I can do straight search-and-replaces for the current problem characters.
(you can also continue using word for posts, just turn off "smart quotes" in your Word preferences)
posted by mathowie (staff) at 8:42 AM on August 1, 2002
(you can also continue using word for posts, just turn off "smart quotes" in your Word preferences)
posted by mathowie (staff) at 8:42 AM on August 1, 2002
Can we quit labelling everything that does not seem to make sense "tomcatspikish?" Come on, if calling self-promotion a "BM" isn't flying here, I don't see why this is.
posted by adampsyche at 8:55 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by adampsyche at 8:55 AM on August 1, 2002
Hey Matt, I wrote for my own purposes a custom tag to replace curly quotes, emdashes, trademark characters, and single-character ellipses with their low-ASCII counterparts... it won't fix all the existent high-ASCII stuff in the database, of course, but if you'd like to have it to integrate with the post/comment boxes here, send me an email and it's yours.
posted by Sapphireblue at 9:01 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by Sapphireblue at 9:01 AM on August 1, 2002
adampsyche: "BM"?
Do you mean Billy Maulana? Or rather, "pulling a Billy Maulana"?
(still the third link on Google.)
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 9:05 AM on August 1, 2002
Do you mean Billy Maulana? Or rather, "pulling a Billy Maulana"?
(still the third link on Google.)
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 9:05 AM on August 1, 2002
Can we quit labelling everything that does not seem to make sense "tomcatspikish?"
First, what's "everything"? I've only seen that term used once, and it's the one you've linked.
Second, and more importantly, clavdivs is rather difficult to understand. But he doesn't post 20 comments a day, 5 days a week. If thomcatspike would reduce his commenting, or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
posted by BlueTrain at 9:20 AM on August 1, 2002
First, what's "everything"? I've only seen that term used once, and it's the one you've linked.
Second, and more importantly, clavdivs is rather difficult to understand. But he doesn't post 20 comments a day, 5 days a week. If thomcatspike would reduce his commenting, or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
posted by BlueTrain at 9:20 AM on August 1, 2002
So as it's only been used twice, it's OK? How bluetrainish.
posted by MiguelCardoso at 9:25 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by MiguelCardoso at 9:25 AM on August 1, 2002
My trick is to paste the relevant text into Notepad and then cut it and then paste it into MeFi. That takes out any of those non-standard characters.
posted by gen at 9:38 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by gen at 9:38 AM on August 1, 2002
Aren’t “smart” quotes the ‘bee’s knees’?
Trying gen's trick. The above was written in Word and pasted to Notepad. It works in preview, with curly quotation marks. Let's see if it's still the same when posted.
posted by MiguelCardoso at 9:51 AM on August 1, 2002
Trying gen's trick. The above was written in Word and pasted to Notepad. It works in preview, with curly quotation marks. Let's see if it's still the same when posted.
posted by MiguelCardoso at 9:51 AM on August 1, 2002
If thomcatspike would reduce his commenting, or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
why can't you just ignore him now?
I for one enjoy his posts and hope he continues to post whenever he pleases...
posted by PugAchev at 10:00 AM on August 1, 2002
why can't you just ignore him now?
I for one enjoy his posts and hope he continues to post whenever he pleases...
posted by PugAchev at 10:00 AM on August 1, 2002
First, what's "everything"?
Uh, comments? Comments that don't make sense? Like, didn't you get that from my post? I'll be more specific next time.
I've only seen that term used once, and it's the one you've linked.
Well, it was used up here. Don't you read threads you comment in?
If thomcatspike would reduce his commenting, or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
Do you really think that he has a reason to reduce his commenting? Perhaps it just sticks out more? I don't see him commenting more than most others. Sure, he gets a little superfluous in a few threads, but who doesn't?
posted by adampsyche at 10:02 AM on August 1, 2002
Uh, comments? Comments that don't make sense? Like, didn't you get that from my post? I'll be more specific next time.
I've only seen that term used once, and it's the one you've linked.
Well, it was used up here. Don't you read threads you comment in?
If thomcatspike would reduce his commenting, or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
Do you really think that he has a reason to reduce his commenting? Perhaps it just sticks out more? I don't see him commenting more than most others. Sure, he gets a little superfluous in a few threads, but who doesn't?
posted by adampsyche at 10:02 AM on August 1, 2002
i have always thought that was a result of this, and have always wondered why mefi runs on that mickeysoft crap instead of apache/php anyway.
posted by quonsar at 10:04 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by quonsar at 10:04 AM on August 1, 2002
My trick is to paste the relevant text into Notepad and then cut it and then paste it into MeFi. That takes out any of those non-standard characters.
people actually do this? people actually load word, compose, copy/paste to notepad, then copy/paste to the page form? [shakes head in wonder] i remember how hard i laughed the first time outlook asked if i wanted to use word as my email editor! apparently there are those who actually took that suggestion seriously. [shakes head somemore]
oh, and thanks for pointing me to that explanation PinkStainlessTail!
posted by quonsar at 10:15 AM on August 1, 2002
people actually do this? people actually load word, compose, copy/paste to notepad, then copy/paste to the page form? [shakes head in wonder] i remember how hard i laughed the first time outlook asked if i wanted to use word as my email editor! apparently there are those who actually took that suggestion seriously. [shakes head somemore]
oh, and thanks for pointing me to that explanation PinkStainlessTail!
posted by quonsar at 10:15 AM on August 1, 2002
As the author of the linked post, adampsyche, I'll apologize, but only to TCS. We've exchanged a few e-mails, and i'll be meeting him at the meetup on tuesday, which will be cool. I really doubt it offended him, and he's the only one i'd be worried about offending. I certainly didn't mean to start a trend, and I hope it doesn't become one. It won't happen again.
posted by Ufez Jones at 11:05 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by Ufez Jones at 11:05 AM on August 1, 2002
As long as it's good natured. ;-) Sorry to you if I got a little testy.
posted by adampsyche at 11:11 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by adampsyche at 11:11 AM on August 1, 2002
(I guess I got the feeling at times that it wasn't so good natured. Sorry if I misconstrued.)
posted by adampsyche at 11:13 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by adampsyche at 11:13 AM on August 1, 2002
it's cool, adam. like i said, if it became a trend, it would get really old really quick, so I won't do it again. Not a prob.
posted by Ufez Jones at 11:20 AM on August 1, 2002
posted by Ufez Jones at 11:20 AM on August 1, 2002
*looks for a hole to fall into as she tests the previously-offered custom CF tag for replacing high-ascii characters and finds that it no longer works in CFMX*
and I was so hoping to be able to help... there's no electronic karma here on MeFi but there's still the metaphysical kind and I fear I'm in the hole.
posted by Sapphireblue at 12:00 PM on August 1, 2002
and I was so hoping to be able to help... there's no electronic karma here on MeFi but there's still the metaphysical kind and I fear I'm in the hole.
posted by Sapphireblue at 12:00 PM on August 1, 2002
That's the "clueless luser" explanation.
PinkStainlessTail, I resent that.
posted by luser at 12:32 PM on August 1, 2002
PinkStainlessTail, I resent that.
posted by luser at 12:32 PM on August 1, 2002
Ah, but I think of you as the Clueful Luser. or indeed, Luser the Clueful!
(that oughta appease the little Sh’thead).
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 12:39 PM on August 1, 2002
(that oughta appease the little Sh’thead).
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 12:39 PM on August 1, 2002
or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
(please BT with LOL)
Please explain, a) I make sense so ignore me? b) I don't make sense so start ignoring me? c)you just pulled a thomcatspike, per above comments about me, and the trick is on me. d) per your calculations I've been here 2 and 1\2 weeks. e) It not my fault, the square. f) I just received again a Meta spin-off series on an unrelated thread g) sometimes I post as Matt asked me to follow up and not leave folks in the dark, yet I do have e-mail h) some of you open your own pandora's box i) because "I"( as in this comment letter) like pancakes....they make you feel dumb after digesting them as in all the sweet syrup goes right to your brain.
posted by thomcatspike at 5:07 PM on August 1, 2002
(please BT with LOL)
Please explain, a) I make sense so ignore me? b) I don't make sense so start ignoring me? c)you just pulled a thomcatspike, per above comments about me, and the trick is on me. d) per your calculations I've been here 2 and 1\2 weeks. e) It not my fault, the square. f) I just received again a Meta spin-off series on an unrelated thread g) sometimes I post as Matt asked me to follow up and not leave folks in the dark, yet I do have e-mail h) some of you open your own pandora's box i) because "I"( as in this comment letter) like pancakes....they make you feel dumb after digesting them as in all the sweet syrup goes right to your brain.
posted by thomcatspike at 5:07 PM on August 1, 2002
If thomcatspike would reduce his commenting, or better yet, make some damn sense every so often, he'd be ignored by those who don't understand him.
a,b,c) thomcatspike, this means that if you commented less, more people could easily ignore your comments because there would be less to bitch about. Instead, because you do comment quite often (and there's nothing wrong with that), there are many more comments that need to be ignored.
e) I am not blaming you for the square.
f) This is not a MeTa spinoff. Please don't make it seem like this is a big deal. It's not.
h) they make you feel dumb after digesting them as in all the sweet syrup goes right to your brain.
It certainly looks like the "syrup" went to someone's brain and I'm looking in your direction.
posted by BlueTrain at 6:11 PM on August 1, 2002
a,b,c) thomcatspike, this means that if you commented less, more people could easily ignore your comments because there would be less to bitch about. Instead, because you do comment quite often (and there's nothing wrong with that), there are many more comments that need to be ignored.
e) I am not blaming you for the square.
f) This is not a MeTa spinoff. Please don't make it seem like this is a big deal. It's not.
h) they make you feel dumb after digesting them as in all the sweet syrup goes right to your brain.
It certainly looks like the "syrup" went to someone's brain and I'm looking in your direction.
posted by BlueTrain at 6:11 PM on August 1, 2002
you guys with the squares are making me crack up. Hilarious. Especially the "b[][]bies" one.
*snicker*. :)
posted by beth at 9:29 PM on August 1, 2002
*snicker*. :)
posted by beth at 9:29 PM on August 1, 2002
Hey, so thomcatspike sent me an e-mail a couple days ago, but, surprise surprise, I have no idea what the heck it says. Can anyone help me translate it please?
thomcatspike, I will, of course, let you approve any translator.
posted by BlueTrain at 6:07 AM on August 3, 2002
thomcatspike, I will, of course, let you approve any translator.
posted by BlueTrain at 6:07 AM on August 3, 2002
Be happy to help, BlueTrain. I can usually understand what he is saying without too much trouble (I think)
posted by dg at 6:30 AM on August 3, 2002
posted by dg at 6:30 AM on August 3, 2002
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posted by insomnyuk at 7:56 AM on August 1, 2002