I love sweet baby jesus (sexy teenage Jesus, not so much)
June 13, 2007 5:39 PM   Subscribe

Uh-oh (Jesus in the desert part deux)
posted by Joseph Gurl to Etiquette/Policy at 5:39 PM (327 comments total) 13 users marked this as a favorite

"What did you say that offended the Christian?"

Have you got a week or so?
posted by mr_crash_davis at 5:45 PM on June 13, 2007


my bad - deleted already.
posted by Joseph Gurl at 5:47 PM on June 13, 2007


Closed that. If Osmanthus or anybody else wants to discuss this, metatalk is the place for it.
posted by cortex (staff) at 5:47 PM on June 13, 2007


I take this censorship of legitimate ideas very seriously. The comments I have made are not inflammatory, spamming nor do I believe they violate any policy.

How is it that an atheist can ask a question, but an atheist cannot answer? Why are there religious censors on metafilter ?
posted by Osmanthus at 5:51 PM on June 13, 2007


Blame it on Petra
posted by mds35 at 5:55 PM on June 13, 2007


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another. This is not the forum I wished to canvas. Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two weeks because..what..I'm not christian?

Is metafilter proud of this behavior?
posted by Osmanthus at 5:56 PM on June 13, 2007


You have some brass balls, man.
posted by mds35 at 5:58 PM on June 13, 2007


wendell, banhammer, popcorn, pitchfork
posted by briank at 5:59 PM on June 13, 2007 [14 favorites]


I feel nothing but pride; that’s all I do feel. An empty pride, a hopeless vanity, a dreadful arrogance, a stupefyingly futile conceit... but at least it’s something to hang on to.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 6:01 PM on June 13, 2007 [3 favorites]


Jesus Henry Christ, Osmanthus. You're pretty quick to cry "religious persecution". Since none of us saw your comment, none of us can COMMENT on your comment, except the moderators. It would be better to ask jessamyn, mathowie, or cortex why it was deleted. AskMetafilter is NOT the place for such things. Metatalk is the closest, although see my first sentence.

Have you ever heard "Don't discuss religion or politics in polite society?" Well, Metafilter has a similar list of hot-button topics that never end well.

And you know, I'm getting sick of metafilterites complaining of over-moderation here. It's like complaining that the land of milk and honey is too freaking sweet.
posted by muddgirl at 6:01 PM on June 13, 2007 [9 favorites]


Jesus loves us all. He just wishes some of us were smarter.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:01 PM on June 13, 2007 [6 favorites]


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another. This is not the forum I wished to canvas. Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two weeks because..what..I'm not christian?

Osmanthus, at the top of the Ask Metafilter "post a new question" page, it says "If your question is about MetaFilter, MetaTalk, or Ask MetaFilter, please post it to MetaTalk, which is designed for questions about the site itself."

That's why your question was deleted, and why I said it should be here (in MetaTalk) in the first place. You not reading the instructions doesn't have anything to do with your religion. At least, I assume it doesn't.
posted by demiurge at 6:05 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus: "Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two weeks because..what..I'm not christian?"

You're to shut up for two weeks because AskMe is for questions. Not for rocking the boat.
posted by Plutor at 6:06 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another. This is not the forum I wished to canvas. Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two weeks because..what..I'm not christian?

Your question was deleted because it broke the site guidelines. AskMe isn't the place for discussion of site etiquette or policy, and that's a rule that applies to everyone of every religion i.e., atheists, Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Druids...

That kind of question goes in MeTa (which is the place you're in right now), supposing that after having read the existing MeTa thread about the Jesus in the desert AskMe you decided there was a need for yours.
posted by orange swan at 6:07 PM on June 13, 2007


Muddgirl: that is the crux of the matter isnt it? If people cannot speak freely, how can they speak about what can be spoken freely?

As far as 'ask jessmyn, mathaow, or cortex', Ive never seen those names before, thus, the question about redress.

I recieved an email from one of them stating that my original question was a 'non-sequitor', when emphatically it was not. The original question asked about other figures who had similar transformations to Jesus, and I mention Mithras. For this, I was censored.
posted by Osmanthus at 6:07 PM on June 13, 2007


You not reading the instructions doesn't have anything to do with your religion. At least, I assume it doesn't.

I can't speak for Osmanthus, but I myself am OII (Orthodox Intentional Illiterate). It's an article of faith with us that we must fail to read any instructions that prevent us from Doing the Right Thing.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 6:07 PM on June 13, 2007 [13 favorites]


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another. This is not the forum I wished to canvas. Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two weeks because..what..I'm not christian?

Osmanthus:
- I'm an athiest.
- AskMe is back to one a week. I doubt Matt will want to jump through any unusual hoops to speed that up, but who knows.
- Your comments were totally not answering the question.
- Your askme question was not within the guidelines for that part of the site. Discussions about Metafilter go in Metatalk.

I take this censorship of legitimate ideas very seriously. The comments I have made are not inflammatory, spamming nor do I believe they violate any policy.

Read the guidelines.

If you want to discuss this stuff, Metatalk is the place for it. If you'll do the kindness of being more explain-y and less rant-y, it'll probably go pretty well.
posted by cortex (staff) at 6:07 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another. This is not the forum I wished to canvas. Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two weeks because..what..I'm not christian?

If your question had not been deleted, you still wouldn't have been able to ask another (aka "lost your Ask privileges") for a week - unless it's been changed back to two weeks. If you had emailed an admin or responded to cortex's email or asked the deletion question here instead, you wouldn't have 'wasted' your question privileges.
posted by CKmtl at 6:09 PM on June 13, 2007


See also this comment from half an hour ago, and the email referenced therein.
posted by cortex (staff) at 6:10 PM on June 13, 2007


Hey you threatened to leave last October!
posted by smackfu at 6:10 PM on June 13, 2007


An osmanthus is a delicate flower.

A delicate flower, indeed.
posted by brain_drain at 6:11 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Cortex, you are being insincere. A user complained about atheists commenting in that thread, the their comments were deleted. It was a campaign to shutup atheists, its obvious and clear. You being an atheist yourself changes nothing.

Also, just because you didnt understand my post doesnt mean it was offtopic, as I said before, it was perfectly on target as it made a reference to an archtype of jesus, which answers the last question in the post.
posted by Osmanthus at 6:13 PM on June 13, 2007


Aaaaand I see that in the meantime you've acknowledge the email, which was sent hours before your comment in the other thread and your askme, and which mentioned mathowie and jessamyn by name and suggested you follow up with us.
posted by cortex (staff) at 6:14 PM on June 13, 2007


I didnt get the email until a few minutes ago.
posted by Osmanthus at 6:16 PM on June 13, 2007


Logic H. Science!
posted by geoff. at 6:18 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


You guys can fight this out. I'll watch it when it comes out on DVD. For now, I have some aimless wandering to do. I think I;ll take the usual route.

I go now, but I shall return, and when I do, I'll be back.
posted by mds35 at 6:19 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another. This is not the forum I wished to canvas [sic]. Will I get my Ask privileges back, or am I shut up for two [sic] weeks because..what..I'm not christian?

Given that you've only asked one other question since you joined in 2004, Osmanthus, I'm pretty sure you can survive.
posted by scody at 6:20 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


These atheists sure are keen to get up on the cross. Christ, meanwhile, is on a bike.
posted by Abiezer at 6:21 PM on June 13, 2007 [21 favorites]


I think I remember osmanthus' comment now - it was something like 'jesus is really a myth based on mithras who was called zeus by the greeks.' That seriously violates the 'just answer the question' policy of askMe, because (according to everybody but you) it doesn't explain anything about how 40 days in the desert = motivational speaker. I know this makes you feel persecuted and misunderstood, but tough shit. Nobody cares that you're atheist, only that you didn't make sense. Also, if you have never heard of mathowie, jessamyn or cortex (and can't even spell their names right when you quote someone else?), I very much doubt that you have ever read/understood enough of the guidelines to be able to make any decision about whether or not you've broken them.
posted by jacalata at 6:22 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


“I take this censorship of legitimate ideas very seriously. The comments I have made are not inflammatory, spamming nor do I believe they violate any policy.”

I didn't see your comment, but I suspect that you did violate the policy by not answering the question that was asked and instead answering a different question that wasn't asked. And you certainly violated policy with your Ask MetaFilter post on this matter.

You aren't being persecuted for your views and this isn't a matter of censorship. It's a matter of whether you violated policy, which you did.

On Preview: “It was a campaign to shut up atheists, its obvious and clear.” No it wasn't. Why don't you take your "I can't be bothered to read the site policies" ethos and your persecution complex with related paranoia and go somewhere else?
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 6:22 PM on June 13, 2007


Scody: I really do want to know what comments by atheists were deleted. Its a dicey situation because some peoples comments are being deleted, so the situation looks bizarre to people who didnt see them.

Now how can I find out what sort of atheists comments are not allowed when I cant even ask what they were?
posted by Osmanthus at 6:23 PM on June 13, 2007


My kingdom for an image tag.

Here. I got some help for you Osmanthus.
posted by chiababe at 6:24 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


If your mail interchange was that slow, call it a wash: I apologize for sassing you about not getting it. If you didn't check your mail until a half hour after a comment replying to your previous complaint telling you that you had mail, and then posted to AskMe, bad form.

But look, I honestly don't want to aggravate you here. There are guidelines available, and you've been sort of running rampant over them in the last half hour in a pretty aggressive if inadvertent manner, on what's been a long day on mefi (check out the rest of the front page of Metatalk).

I deleted your comment solely and specifically because it seemed a non-sequitur. We may have been more aggressive this morning than we sometimes are given the volume of mess going down on the site, but there is no anti-athiest campaign, and your suggestion that my deletion of the initial comment was motivated by anything but a desire to keep the thread on topic is way, way off base.
posted by cortex (staff) at 6:25 PM on June 13, 2007


Cortex, I really wish you would drop this "guidelines" farce. We all know you just made that like ten minutes ago to aid in the oppression of atheists.

It's obvious and clear.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:27 PM on June 13, 2007


Well, If no one else is going to mention it, I think I should: nasreddin's tribute to Meatbomb was carried out beautifully.
posted by micayetoca at 6:27 PM on June 13, 2007


Ethereal: please go read the metatalk topic where the commentors on that thread are labeled the 'atheist brigade' and the user asks to squelch them.

By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.

Again: while my Mithras comment did not address the first question in the post, it did address the last, the one about other figures who had achieved profound transformation.
posted by Osmanthus at 6:29 PM on June 13, 2007 [4 favorites]


MetaFilter: A dicey situation because some peoples comments are being deleted, so the situation looks bizarre to people who didnt see them.

Anyway.

Now how can I find out what sort of atheists comments are not allowed when I cant even ask what they were?

Fixed that for you. And cortex already answered your question when he said "read the guidelines."

On preview: By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.

LOL?
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:30 PM on June 13, 2007


Cortex, do you deny that your scouring of that thread was in direct response from a user asking you to delete comments from the 'atheist brigade'?

This is not regular execution of the 'guidelines', it is knuckling under to unreasonable people won't allow people they don't agree with to speak.
posted by Osmanthus at 6:32 PM on June 13, 2007


ex, do you deny that your scouring of that thread was in direct response from a user asking you to delete comments from the 'atheist brigade'?

This is not regular execution of the 'guidelines', it is knuckling under to unreasonable people won't allow people they don't agree with to speak.


Haven't we been through this already?

"there is no anti-athiest campaign, and your suggestion that my deletion of the initial comment was motivated by anything but a desire to keep the thread on topic is way, way off base."
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:36 PM on June 13, 2007


By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.

oh, wow. That's up there with SCIENCE.
posted by atrazine at 6:38 PM on June 13, 2007 [3 favorites]


Osmanthus writes 'By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.


And therefore the Mefites did persecute Osmanthus, and sought to slay him, because he had derailed and transgressed policy on Ask Metafilter.

But he answered them: My browser is working, and I will continue to crappeth on thy threads
posted by PeterMcDermott at 6:38 PM on June 13, 2007 [37 favorites]


“Ethereal: please go read the metatalk topic where the commentors on that thread are labeled the 'atheist brigade' and the user asks to squelch them.”

What that person meant was that atheists who couldn't answer a theological question were instead taking the opportunity to make some atheistic argument. Such arguments didn't belong in the thread, not because they were atheist, but because they weren't answering the question.

The poster's derogatory "atheist brigade" was probably because this sort of thing happens fairly often—that someone asks a religious question that has a religious answer (say, a question about the typical Christian interpretation of some even depicted in the Bible) and one or two atheists will come along and take the opportunity to tell the questioner that the event didn't happen or somesuch thing, which isn't answering the question.

The reverse happens from time to time, as well. An atheist will ask a question that takes atheism as an explicit assumption (say, a question about how to deal with the fear of death from an atheistic perspective) and one or two theists come along and recommend that the questioner take up religious belief, which isn't answering the question.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 6:39 PM on June 13, 2007


By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.
A voice crying in the wilderness.
posted by Abiezer at 6:39 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Crap, I forgot my program. Can anyone remind me who is part of the Atheist Brigade and do they have any overlap with Cabal?
posted by Razzle Bathbone at 6:39 PM on June 13, 2007


By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.

At least Jesus's stream of unbelievable bullshit was manufactured by other folks about 100 years after he died. We're watching yours stream right from your Virtual Anus. Jesus has more plausible deniability than you, and he's fictional. How does that feel, loser?
posted by Mayor Curley at 6:39 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


Can anyone remind me who is part of the Atheist Brigade and do they have any overlap with Cabal?

There is no A.B.C.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:40 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Scody: I really do want to know what comments by atheists were deleted. Its a dicey situation because some peoples comments are being deleted, so the situation looks bizarre to people who didnt see them.

It's already been explained to you that off-topic answers were deleted. I'm sorry you can't examine them and debate each one of them. It's an imperfect, godless world, isn't it?

By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.

Get off the cross, kiddo. We need the wood.
posted by scody at 6:41 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


SPLITTER!
posted by Otis at 6:42 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Abiezer writes 'A voice crying in the wilderness.'

A ban would be too extreme in the circumstances -- I'd suggest a suspension.

Forty days and forty nights seems about right.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 6:42 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


Ethereal: did you read the thread? How do you know what the atheists said: those comments were deleted! I never even saw them, and I commented on the thread myself.

In fact, your comment shows it is you that is not paying attention: the original question asker was an atheist, so it is entirely appropriate that atheists answer the question.

What is not appropriate is for a a christian to ask to squelch all non-religious people's answers to a question.
posted by Osmanthus at 6:43 PM on June 13, 2007


Holy fucking shit.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:45 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Metafilter: By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.
posted by Krrrlson at 6:45 PM on June 13, 2007


my Mithras comment

Try a Minya comment ... please.
posted by phoque at 6:45 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


The original poster, atheist or not, was asking a specific question.

Certain people, atheist or not, replied with off-topic posts.

Those posts were deleted, atheist or not, because they were off-topic.

What is not appropriate is for a a christian to ask to squelch all non-religious people's answers to a question.

You're right. That is exactly what happened. You are not off the mark in the least. It is obvious and clear.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:47 PM on June 13, 2007


This is the best popcorn thread EVER, because Osmanthus is trolling everyone and getting away with it, by using pumped-up rhetoric that (I assume) s/he believes echoes the types of arguments that religious folks use in similar circumstances.

On the flip side, WHAT A MAROON.
posted by davejay at 6:48 PM on June 13, 2007


a user asking you to delete comments from the 'atheist brigade'?

Not having seen your, or other, deleted comments... The user who posted the initial MetaTalk thread stated the problem as "being hijacked by...". As it's a thread about Jesus, the problematic comments were probably of the "Jesus doesn't/didn't exist" "The Bible is a fairytale" type. Which is thread-hijacking or thread-shitting, since it has nothing to do with the question and is only contributed in the spirit of stirring up shit.

Saying something along the lines of "Jesus is a myth based on the preexisting Mithras mythos" doesn't answer the question, and smells a lot like "roflcopter, Jesus is fake!"
posted by CKmtl at 6:49 PM on June 13, 2007


Where do I sign up to be oppressed?
posted by Krrrlson at 6:49 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


meanwhile: osmanthus, do you want to come over for dinner one night? i was just going to invite christians, but you seem so lonely...
posted by davejay at 6:49 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


How do you know what the atheists said: those comments were deleted! I never even saw them...
Just take it on faith, my son. Bless you.
And I was there when the Atheist Brigade stormed the Vatican, and have a nasty pike wound from a feisty Swiss Guard to prove it.
posted by Abiezer at 6:49 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Never mind the off-topic atheism, that thread should have had a [SPOILER ALERT] for anyone who hadn't gotten to the desert part yet.
posted by Salmonberry at 6:50 PM on June 13, 2007 [11 favorites]



Criminy, Osmanthus, the thread in question is still open; if you actually phrased your response in such a way that it clearly answered the question all you would have to do is post it and it would stay.
posted by oneirodynia at 6:51 PM on June 13, 2007


And by the way: anyone who can compare having a comment deleted with being gassed in a concentration camp is either unhinged or a troll of the highest order.

Whichever one it is, has someone paged languagehat?
posted by scody at 6:51 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Y'ALL ARE BRUTALIZING ME!!!!
posted by Mayor Curley at 6:52 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


Comments in AskMe that do not answer the question posed violate the guidelines and are subject to deletion. There are limited exceptions to this rule, none of which applied to your comment in the "motivational speaker" thread.

Not all comments that violate the guidelines (and are thus subject to deletion) actually are deleted, but this alone does not grant you any entitlement to have your guideline-violating comment left in place. Basically, you post outside the guidelines at your own peril.

Posts that discuss Metafilter or other comments or posts on any of the sub-sites may be posted only in Metatalk. They are not permitted in AskMe, even if phrased as a question. Such posts are almost always deleted, just as yours was.

The above rules apply irrespective of the topic or viewpoint of your comments and posts. Remember: 1) comments in AskMe must answer the question and 2) posts about other posts or comments must be made in Metatalk.
posted by Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America at 6:53 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus, I hope you are trolling. Otherwise, I can't tell what you're talking about at all, and I don't like feeling like I can't understand something written in more or less literate English, which you're writing as far as I can see.

What exactly do you think is happening here? You think the site's moderators are deliberately silencing your point of view in service of some Christian user who demanded they do so?
posted by cgc373 at 6:53 PM on June 13, 2007


it is entirely appropriate that atheists answer the question

Which you apparently did not do. Atheist or Zoroastrian, AskMe is about answering the question, and your comment did not do that in the eyes of the moderators. One of my first comments here was a Simpsons reference that was meant as an oblique answer, but the mods either didn't catch the reference or didn't think it was "answery" enough and it was deleted. I did not claim that this was based on some Anti-Simpsons Brigade and their silencing of my voice. Maybe you should stop saying things for a while.
posted by Rock Steady at 6:55 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus, this is all performance art, right?
posted by Tuwa at 6:57 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Cortex, do you deny that your scouring of that thread was in direct response from a user asking you to delete comments from the 'atheist brigade'?

Osmanthus, once in a while, people make new threads on MetaTalk pointing out that a single thread somewhere else on the site has gone off-topic and unhelpful. It can be about squirrels, jesus, orange juice, or whatever, but every so often someone will point out that hey, over there, people aren't answering a question and going off on a tangent that could/should be removed to keep things on track.

In this case, someone asked about a specific passage from the bible and how it related to a character in it. There were a lot of posts that didn't answer the question or even attempt to answer the question, instead they were various ways of mocking the bible, the story as a whole, or religion in general.

The point of Ask MetaFilter is to help other members solve their problems and answer their questions. Above every post button it clearly states that to keep the place as useful as possible, please don't post wisecracks and we frequently remove jokey or off-topic posts.

Your comment was deleted because it wasn't answering the specific question about the specific characters in a specific story of the bible. That's not the actions of "religion censors" and we're not going after atheists (all three admins are atheists, but as you said it doesn't matter), we're simply trying to keep answers on topic and we delete stuff from time to time that doesn't aim to do that.

I'm hopeful that all makes sense to you -- that it wasn't about religion, the question could have been how best to jump start a 1982 Honda Accord and a deleted comment might be something along the lines of "get rid of that old junker" which doesn't answer the question.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 6:57 PM on June 13, 2007 [7 favorites]


MetaFilter: Squirrels, jesus, orange juice, or whatever.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 6:57 PM on June 13, 2007 [9 favorites]


Then answered mathowie and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Mods can do nothing of themselves, but what he seeth mathowie do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Mods likewise.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 6:59 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Can I post an AskMe that says "What the hell is going on here?"
posted by The Deej at 7:01 PM on June 13, 2007


Pete, that made about as much sense as everything Osmanthus has said thus far.

You get an A for effort though.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 7:01 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus, you are being an ignorant ass, in a precise sense. You are participating in a large community not knowing the guidelines, the moderators or what is acceptable behavior.
1) There is no guarantee to free speech on a privately owned blog. They can delete comments or ban users for any reason they see fit. Generally they are more tolerant than I would be, as evident by the fact you are still around, for now.
2) There is, on Metafilter, a large percentage of users who would consider themselves atheists, non believers or some variant therein. You will find very very few of them complaining of an anti-atheist slant here, if anything it may go the other-way.
3) I half wonder if this isn't soe over the top performance piece/troll.
4) If not, CALM THE FUCK OUT.

Can we just shut down MetaTalk for a few days until people go get their meds checked?
posted by edgeways at 7:01 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


It is a well established fact that Atheists as a group average higher IQs than members of Established Religions. And if Osmanthus were to die tomorrow, that average would rise another couple points.

Sits back and awaits Ossy's claim that I have just threatened his life... Double-checks wallet.... Yeah, my Athiest Brigade membership card is there and it doesn't expire until December 2012.
posted by wendell at 7:01 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Rock Steady: Dude pay attention. The the comment about the 'atheist brigade' wasnt made by me, but instead by someone who requested that atheists answers be deleted. And they were.

And to be clear one more time: my answer was not offtopic: it was deleted at the request of a christian who was offended by the answer. I don't know about other peoples anwers, because they were deleted.
posted by Osmanthus at 7:01 PM on June 13, 2007


There's an old joke. Um, two elderly women are at a Catskill mountain resort, and one of them says, "Boy, the food here is really terrible." And the other one says, "Yeah, I know. And such small portions!" Well, that's essentially how I feel about MetaTalk.
posted by phaedon at 7:02 PM on June 13, 2007


And to be clear one more time: my answer was not offtopic

Apparently everyone, including all three mods, completely disagrees with you.

I'm going to side with everyone else.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 7:03 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


it was deleted at the request of a christian who was offended by the answer

How do you know that?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:04 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair!

No, wait, shit, that's the other one.
posted by box at 7:04 PM on June 13, 2007 [6 favorites]


Knock knock
Who's there?
Atheist viking interrupting cow.
Atheist viking interrupting cow who?

*crickets*
posted by YamwotIam at 7:05 PM on June 13, 2007 [4 favorites]


CitrusFreak12 writes 'Pete, that made about as much sense as everything Osmanthus has said thus far.'

See John Ch. 5 vs. 16-19, King James Bible.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 7:06 PM on June 13, 2007


ThePinkSuperhero: because of this thread

Sadly, its hard to defend my position when what actually happened has been edited.
posted by Osmanthus at 7:06 PM on June 13, 2007


its hard to defend my position when what actually happened has been edited.

Which is a lot like dying in the Holocaust, yes.
posted by scody at 7:08 PM on June 13, 2007 [4 favorites]


By taking away my voice, you are persecuting me.

no, by stabbing you in the crotch repeatedly with a fork i am persecuting you. you are an 18k'er. you are either deaf, dumb, blind and stupid, or you have not been paying attention. for years. you cannot possibly *just now* be noticing arbitrary deletion of content. its a FUCKING METAFILTER TRADITION.

*stabs Osmanthus repeatedly in the crotch with a fork*
posted by quonsar at 7:09 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


I can't seem to find the passage you're referring to, PeteMcDermott.

I take it you mean to point out that the original passage doesn't make much sense, and I'll take your word for it. Old English grammar throws me for a loop.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 7:09 PM on June 13, 2007


ThePinkSuperhero: because of this thread

You realize that that is a great example of circular reasoning, right?
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 7:11 PM on June 13, 2007


The level of density displayed by the offended party in this thread is such that I fear even the slightest mass of further comments directed at its looming Schwarzchild radius might be all it takes to create some horrible naked singularity that could devour us all. I must urge the utmost caution!
posted by 31d1 at 7:12 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Osmanthus, here's another way to look at it.

You seem to be quite upset that your comment was deleted. Why is that?

Are you really concerned that, because your brilliant, incisive response was removed, the original poster will now never know how Jesus could've become a great speaker after spending 40 days in the desert?

I think if you were honest with yourself, the answer would be no, you didn't really care much about what the original poster wished to learn. That's why your response was a bad one.

AskMe is about helping the people who post questions, not airing our personal opinions, even about matters that we care deeply about.
posted by Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America at 7:12 PM on June 13, 2007 [6 favorites]


I take it you mean to point out that the original passage doesn't make much sense

No, it's the verse after the two that I'd bawdlerized in this comment.

The last verse refers to Jesus saying that when he speaks, he speaks with God's authority. It seemed so coincidental that just after I'd posted the two previous verses, Metafilter's own divine authority pipes up and makes a pronouncement that I couldn't stop myself from riffing on it.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 7:14 PM on June 13, 2007


It seemed so coincidental that just after I'd posted the two previous verses, Metafilter's own divine authority pipes up and makes a pronouncement that I couldn't stop myself from riffing on it.

Deep dude. Deep....

::nods sagely::
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 7:16 PM on June 13, 2007


Try another tack here, Osmanthus: correlation does not imply causation. The following two things are true:
1. A post was made to metatalk requesting moderation for a thread, in such a way that can be constructed as anti-atheist
2. Moderation was enacted, including the deletion of your comment.

Now, if you'll read the meta thread carefully, you'll note that the majority of people agreed that moderation was needed, including many who note and object to the tone of the original request.

We are to conclude, under your interpretation, that the moderation took place because of the anti-atheist tone of the request, rather than, perhaps, the thread actually needed moderation.

We all know what thread you're talking about, we know what's going on. You're the one who seems confused.
posted by Arturus at 7:16 PM on June 13, 2007


So, about that iPhone...
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:17 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Now we see the violence inherent in the system!
posted by mr_crash_davis at 7:19 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Finally, a thread that calls for "LOLATHEISTS AMIRITE"
posted by klarck at 7:19 PM on June 13, 2007


I don't care, let them detest
I'm the athiest atheist!
posted by Kattullus at 7:23 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Normally your long and reasoned comment might make some kind of impact, Mathowie. In this case I fear it's a lost cause, because Osmanthus doesn't know who the fuck you are. I can't believe people are bothering to argue with him about it. He has his interpretation of the "facts" and is only interested in bemoaning his terrible persecution. I mean for fuck's sake. He's not going to get it because he has no fucking interest in getting it.
posted by nanojath at 7:24 PM on June 13, 2007


box - snap - wow, was just thinking that...
posted by Samuel Farrow at 7:30 PM on June 13, 2007


I don't mean to brag, I don't mean to boast
But I ain't scared of no holy ghost
And when it comes to disbelievin' I disbelieve the most
So pull up your pants, chillax your socks
Let me tell you 'bout how hard my atheism rocks
I don't believe in Muhammad, I don't believe in Ali
I don't take no orders from no Holy See
And Odin can go hang himself from the Yggdrasil tree
I ain't afraid to offend the gee oh dee
Cause nobody's gonna burn in hell for eternity
I know some believers may hate on me
Well, I don't care, let them all detest
When it comes to atheism I'm the athiest
posted by Kattullus at 7:34 PM on June 13, 2007 [25 favorites]


you are an 18k'er.

He is?

Oh, my.

Then let me be the first to say...STFU n00b!
posted by mds35 at 7:35 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


I've only got a few comments into this thread so far, please forgive if this has already been said ... man, what a crraazzee day. Mods, thanks for all you do.
posted by and hosted from Uranus at 7:36 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Jesus, the morans are out in force in these threads. Is it a full moon or something?
posted by caddis at 7:36 PM on June 13, 2007


Rather than Jews at Auschwitz, a more appropriate comparison is that you were disappeared like a Zurvanite Zoroastrian in the 10th century.
posted by Falconetti at 7:42 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


For someone who's voice was taken away, the loser sure talks up a shit storm, don't he?

Chalk me up as an atheist who supports the deletion and, had I seen it, would have flagged/requested it's flushing. That should even things out, no?
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 7:43 PM on June 13, 2007


Wow. And to think I took the time to answer this guy seriously up thread. That's two minutes of my life I will never get back.
posted by orange swan at 7:44 PM on June 13, 2007


Hello, I'm a fun-loving atheist. Well, secular humanist, to be precise, but I don't want to split hairs. We could hang out, if you'd like. We could maybe see a movie, or play some board games. Do you like chess? I play chess. Or scrabble, that's cool too. Maybe we could make cookies, or some rice crispy treats. I don't have the marshmallows, but I can run to safeway, I don't mind at all.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that we're not all god-awful (oops! ha-ha!) sour individuals crushed beneath the weight of our own shrill humorlessness.
posted by boo_radley at 7:49 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Osmanthus, osmanthus, osmanthus is an anagram of

Human Toss : Sans Moans, Shut Mouth!
posted by lalochezia at 7:51 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


If you think Metatalk has an anti-atheist slant, wait until someone brings up FURRIES!

And can someone please summon bevets to talk to Osmanthus? THIS would be great.
posted by qvantamon at 7:55 PM on June 13, 2007


As a flameout, this wasn't even worth microwaving the popcorn. Though I have hopes for Osmanthus getting a second wind.
posted by Razzle Bathbone at 7:55 PM on June 13, 2007


JESUS FUCKETY FUCK I am the STUPIDEST user here, and I'm more of a nOOB than you, and you're a big DUMBASS now GO AWAY

/sorry
posted by disclaimer at 7:56 PM on June 13, 2007


This is not the forum I wished to canvas.

This is not my beautiful wife!

Jesus has more plausible deniability than you, and he's fictional.

So is Osmanthus.
posted by and hosted from Uranus at 8:02 PM on June 13, 2007


it was deleted at the request of a christian etc.

While working in an archives a couple of years ago, I had to read quite a bit of correspondence by people who were afflicted with...a certain mental illness. While these people had obviously been in distress, the nature of that distress was not all that original from person to person. The progress of Osmanthus' comments on this thread seem very familiar to me.
posted by frobozz at 8:05 PM on June 13, 2007


I usually hate when people paste War and Peace in a thread destined for deletion, but nasreddin executed it beautifully.
posted by Kwantsar at 8:05 PM on June 13, 2007


FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT!

Who's got the popcorn?
posted by FunkyHelix at 8:11 PM on June 13, 2007


I think we missed it. Popcorn's cold.
posted by rtha at 8:12 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus: We are a community of like-minded people governed by a set of community guidelines. When we come here we accept the community guidelines. Some of us come here because we think the community guidelines are reasonable and that the community is well policed by our mods who enforce those guidelines.

One of the reasons we like this is that self-righteous, whining people who like to complain that they're being "censored" and that they're being "silenced" and "deprived of their right to speak" are useless to us. We're bored by this kind of behavior.

Some of us have been using the Internet to discuss topics since 1986 or earlier; we've heard your complaints before, in endless variety and excruciating, nauseating attention to every possible detail, angle and perspective.

From this experience, we bring the knowledege that people who want to make the complaints that you're making have nothing to offer the community and will end up being a giant waste of our valuable time. We want people like that to find somewhere else to hang out.

Since you find the community guidelines objectionable, Osmanthus, I would like to extend an offer to you. I offer you right now the opportunity to leave Metafilter and never come back.
posted by ikkyu2 at 8:15 PM on June 13, 2007 [10 favorites]


I never thought I'd say this but, someone has been reading a little too much Dawkins.
posted by purephase at 8:16 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus you're up against the whole site on this one , and while you keep accusing the moderators of persicuting you they're the only ones here that want to treat you even handedly. My advice , not that you should take it, is to log out drink some NyQuil and call it a day.
posted by nola at 8:18 PM on June 13, 2007


LOOK AT ME, DAMIEN! IT'S ALL FOR YOU!
posted by puke & cry at 8:20 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


And to be clear one more time: my answer was not offtopic: it was deleted at the request of a christian who was offended by the answer. I don't know about other peoples anwers, because they were deleted.

Hi, I'm the third moderator here. Your answer wasn't removed at someone's request. We do not "do requests" as moderators though some people like to think that we might. We don't care about Mithras one way or the other. You have misunderstood what happens in MetaTalk. Your comment was removed because it was off-topic. You can post an on-topic response to that thread any time you'd like. There wasn't much removed from that thread but a bunch of "woo woo your god doesn't exist" talk which was also not answering the question. If you have any other questions, feel free to post them here, but it's so rare that the three of us admins agree completely and totally on something that I'd like to savor this moment.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 8:20 PM on June 13, 2007 [7 favorites]


In honor of the three admins' rare unity, orange swan, I am offering up a prayer to sweet baby jesus and sexy teenage Jesus that He may take two minutes of my allotted lifetime and exchange them for you, so that you may live out your time as He originally intended, before the Atheist Osmanthus fucked it all up bigtime. Amen.
posted by cgc373 at 8:32 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Osmanthus wrote: I was disappeared like a jew in auschwitz

What what WHAT?

I think there is definitely a secret cabal of paint huffing mefites and that today is their holiday.
posted by kosem at 8:32 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


*bursts in*

DID SOMEONE SAY ATHEIST BRIGADE?!

POPE SMARTASS TO THE RESCUE!
posted by exlotuseater at 8:36 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


I huff paint and no one told me about a holiday *blinks at kosem , with gold paint drying in beard*
posted by nola at 8:38 PM on June 13, 2007


Can somebody please flameout already so I can go to bed?
posted by Justinian at 8:38 PM on June 13, 2007


Question: Are there other famous examples of such sudden transformations from a nobody to someone great?

Answer: The story of Mithras influenced the story of Jesus.

How is that offtopic again?
posted by Osmanthus at 8:42 PM on June 13, 2007


So anyway... this one time... on MetaTalk...
posted by The Deej at 8:42 PM on June 13, 2007


I hereby nominate that every June 13 from now on be known as Moderators' Day, and that we all spend some time on that day to express our appreciation and thanks for dealing with all the crap that this bunch of crazies and snowflakes can generate. Thanks guys.
posted by Rock Steady at 8:42 PM on June 13, 2007 [13 favorites]


Now we see the violence inherent in the system!
posted by chimaera at 8:44 PM on June 13, 2007


How is that offtopic again?

Question: Are there other famous examples of such sudden transformations from a nobody to someone great?

Your Claimed Answer: The story of Mithras influenced the story of Jesus.

Your Actual Answer: The Jesus story is a re-telling of the Mithra myths of Zorastrianism to Greeks who name for God was Zeus.

Please explain to me how this is some sort of an example of "sudden transformations from a nobody to someone great"?

Maybe we are supposed to know more about Mithras than we do? All I know is what I read in The Magus and The Da Vinci Code and I found both somewhat confusing. You may be assuming too much knowledge on the part of the AskMe population, or more likely you weren't clear in your answer what the example was you were highlighting.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 8:47 PM on June 13, 2007


This thread is so making the end of my day SHINY AND BRIGHT. God Bless you Osmanthus.
posted by dness2 at 8:49 PM on June 13, 2007

 _______            _________          _______(  ___  )|\     /|  \__   __/|\     /|(  ____ \| (   ) || )   ( |     ) (   | )   ( || (    \/| |   | || (___) |     | |   | (___) || (__    | |   | ||  ___  |     | |   |  ___  ||  __)   | |   | || (   ) |     | |   | (   ) || (      | (___) || )   ( |     | |   | )   ( || (____/\(_______)|/     \|     )_(   |/     \|(_______/

                   _______  _______ |\     /||\     /|(  ____ \(  ____ \| )   ( || )   ( || (    \/| (    \/| (___) || |   | || |      | (__    |  ___  || |   | || | ____ |  __)   | (   ) || |   | || | \_  )| (      | )   ( || (___) || (___) || (____/\|/     \|(_______)(_______)(_______/                                     _______  _______  _        _______ _________ _______  _______ (       )(  ___  )( (    /|(  ___  )\__   __/(  ____ \(  ____ \| () () || (   ) ||  \  ( || (   ) |   ) (   | (    \/| (    \/| || || || (___) ||   \ | || (___) |   | |   | (__    | (__    | |(_)| ||  ___  || (\ \) ||  ___  |   | |   |  __)   |  __)   | |   | || (   ) || | \   || (   ) |   | |   | (      | (      | )   ( || )   ( || )  \  || )   ( |   | |   | (____/\| (____/\|/     \||/     \||/    )_)|/     \|   )_(   (_______/(_______/
posted by killdevil at 8:49 PM on June 13, 2007 [9 favorites]


Can somebody please flameout already so I can go to bed?
posted by Justinian


::sigh::
Alright I'll do it.

fuck you fuck you all fuckin atheists i quit bye stupid metafilter blah blah jessamyn always liked you best i hate this place stupid people blah blah blah never post again see you on fark blah etc
posted by The Deej at 8:50 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Now we see the violence inherent in the system!

The fact that certain parties are still able to type indicates, to me at least, that the system is not violent enough.
posted by Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America at 8:54 PM on June 13, 2007 [3 favorites]


The Deej! Don't go! Some people of low character always loved you, man! It's not your fault!
posted by cgc373 at 8:54 PM on June 13, 2007


Note: I am playing along in some fashion, but I don't know why. Except as a continuing derail.
posted by cgc373 at 8:55 PM on June 13, 2007


We do not "do requests" as moderators though some people like to think that we might.

Freebird!
posted by tracicle at 8:59 PM on June 13, 2007 [8 favorites]


Maybe we are supposed to know more about Mithras than we do? All I know is what I read in The Magus and The Da Vinci Code

Stepped in it right there ya did. You see, my original post had a link to a site that had information on Mithras. I don't have the link handy[it was deleted], but, you see, that was the point: to click on the link and learn about Mithras. I didn't expect you to know who he was before you read about him. Thats the nature of answering questions: you provide people with information they didn't know before.

Also this illustrates the dicey nature of censorship: when the censors are ignorant on the topic and dont even bother to click through it doesn't inspire confidence in the rationale they used to make their decision. Instead what you get is GroupThink where people 'go along' to 'get along'.
posted by Osmanthus at 8:59 PM on June 13, 2007


Fuck you all in the ear, you never came to my pasta party. I even made name tags for every body.
posted by nola at 9:00 PM on June 13, 2007


oh here we go.
posted by exlotuseater at 9:00 PM on June 13, 2007


... I'm hopeful that all makes sense to you
A brave attempt, but yo do realise that was the binary equivalent of pissing into the wind, don't you?

*howls at the moon*
posted by dg at 9:00 PM on June 13, 2007


The Deej! Don't go! Some people of low character always loved you, man! It's not your fault!
posted by cgc373


Shhhhh.... I'm just waiting for Justinian to go to bed. He's all tuckered out. I'll be back.
posted by The Deej at 9:02 PM on June 13, 2007


OK, so he's about to figure out that we're a secret anti-Mithras cult. Ideas, people!
posted by Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America at 9:02 PM on June 13, 2007


Whoa wait!!!! There's pasta?!?!? AND GroupThink?!?!? I am SOOOO BACK PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!
posted by The Deej at 9:03 PM on June 13, 2007


what you get is GroupThink where people 'go along' to 'get along'
That word? It doesn't mean what you think it means. Just because everyone agrees that you are a complete raving loony doesn't mean we're doing it to avoid conflict - we're doing it because you are a complete raving loony.
posted by dg at 9:04 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


I remember the very FIRST comment in that thread that got deleted was complience saying something to the effect that Jesus was a big lie, and followed it up with a link to some scholarly claptrap and implored everyone to read it and shut up.

In other words I think you're burning a jillion kilowatts of energy to save a gallon of gas here.
posted by hermitosis at 9:05 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Well, as an idea, we could try to explain how much we hate Mithras, how we hate him with the same passions that drive us to suicide and madness, in a manner Cthulhu might envy for its heinous, eldritch power.

Just one idea.
posted by cgc373 at 9:05 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Hi, I'm the third moderator here.
It's like some kind of Holy Trinity?
posted by Abiezer at 9:05 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Tell us more about this censorship, Osmanthus. We are interested.
posted by kosem at 9:07 PM on June 13, 2007


Cortex, do you deny that your scouring of that thread was in direct response from a user asking you to delete comments from the 'atheist brigade'?

This is not regular execution of the 'guidelines', it is knuckling under to unreasonable people won't allow people they don't agree with to speak.


Matt and Jess have both addressed this, but to be absolutely clear:

Yes. I deny it without a shred of nuance or qualification, because it's completely false.

Here's how my morning went:
1. Get up.
2. Look at admin flag queue.
3. Say, "oh, fuck me."
4. Start checking out pile of askme comments that received flags, deleting the ones that were breaking the guidelines.
5. Look at metatalk, see thread about religion thread.

Read the guidelines. Page through the metatalk history. Get some further perspective on how the site works, and why, and some of the reasons that the social and administrative norms around here are what they are. Cool off.
posted by cortex (staff) at 9:07 PM on June 13, 2007


when the censors are ignorant on the topic and dont even bother to click through it doesn't inspire confidence in the rationale they used to make their decision.

Just trying to help. The point is if you don't explain what you are actually talking about, having a link to more information about what seems to be nonsense doesn't help. You didn't say "actually the [Mithras story] is sort of similar to the Jesus story in that whole 'suddenly got famous' part"

It may be that we're all a little lazy and lack intellectual rigor, but I think you have to meet us partway and take responsibility for your not-particularly-clear answer to the question which was in fact so opaque that all three moderators and the people who flagged your response missed the point of it. As I said before and others have said feel free to repost in the thread with a clearer response to the question. We're not censoring you, we're trying to help you be understood and trying to help the people asking questions get them answered.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 9:07 PM on June 13, 2007


Before I forget, I love the way the my comments page tells me that cortex's comment was made moments ago. It's cute.
See, cortex, if only you would start the day with breakfast instead of MeFi, you might be less inclined to bow to the imperious demands of the Atheist Brigade and then we wouldn't be in this pickle. They don't say breakfast is the most important meal of the day for nothing, you know.
posted by dg at 9:11 PM on June 13, 2007


Hilarious. Get's pissed off for being censored, turns around and violates a real rule, like posting a MeTa thread in AskMeFi.

The second sin is far worse than the first.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:14 PM on June 13, 2007


. . .
posted by nola at 9:14 PM on June 13, 2007


But stay away from the hateful doughnuts. Hippie.

</emoticon goes here>
posted by cgc373 at 9:15 PM on June 13, 2007


This may be the first time that someone has ever accused the MeFi cabal of being Christian.

How insane is that?
posted by eyeballkid at 9:15 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Wow this thread's movin' fast. Please read my doughhut joke as if it were relevant and had been posted immediately after dg's breakfasting advice, cortex.
posted by cgc373 at 9:16 PM on June 13, 2007


Also, please spell "doughhut" as "DOUGH plus NUT" and shoot me in the face once or twice with sprinkles. kthxbye
posted by cgc373 at 9:17 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


I read that as doughut.
posted by nola at 9:18 PM on June 13, 2007


first time that someone has ever

I have a problem with extraneous words today.
posted by eyeballkid at 9:19 PM on June 13, 2007


Hi, Osmanthus. On behalf of the many members of the atheist brigade who slept through the alarm and didn't assist you in attempting to douse -- with our metaphorical flatulence -- the flame that was the most bizarrely phrased question of the day, please allow me to present to you this bucket of ice-cold shut the fuck up. (We all figured that, at this point, a cup wasn't quite enough for you.).
posted by cog_nate at 9:20 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


I'm the fifth moderator. I deleted your comment because Jesus hates you. Suck on that one, Mithras boy!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:21 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


See what you did Osmanthus? You broke IRFH!
posted by wendell at 9:23 PM on June 13, 2007


This will meme well.
posted by nola at 9:25 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


It may be that we're all a little lazy and lack intellectual rigor

It just may be.

Now take a look at this thread, it full of awful comments questioning my value as a human being, yet they are allowed to remain, while my innocuous comment was deleted.

How about some standards here? And its not going to work to say that Metatalk doesnt have the same standard as AskMetafiler because I asked in that forum first.

Why do I not deserve the same respect as the person who asked the question?
posted by Osmanthus at 9:26 PM on June 13, 2007


Are you still with us, The Deej?

Warning: You're either with us or against us, so choose wisely, like that old glowing knight dude in one of the Indiana Jones movies said.
posted by cgc373 at 9:27 PM on June 13, 2007


Why do I not deserve the same respect as the person who asked the question?

Ooh, I know the answer to this one! It's because you're being obtuse, Osmanthus. You're pretending you don't understand what's happening, and nobody here believes you. The few good faith readings of your complaints have dissipated at this point, and now you are a target. Your best course of action, if you are sincere, is to step away. If you're insincere, carry on, because you can't win, and we'll enjoy tearing you apart.
posted by cgc373 at 9:29 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


You gotta admit, though, Osmanthus, that our GroupThink is second to none. There is not one single person in this thread who doesn't think you're a douchebag.
posted by nanojath at 9:30 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


Ya, ya I came back!
Come for the pasta! Stay for the GroupThink!
posted by The Deej at 9:30 PM on June 13, 2007


I hereby nominate that every June 13 from now on be known as Moderators' Day, and that we all spend some time on that day to express our appreciation and thanks for dealing with all the crap that this bunch of crazies and snowflakes can generate. Thanks guys.

I'm with Rock Steady on this one. Matt, Jessamyn, Josh, y'all do a KICKASS job of modding this asylum. You do it with intelligence, balance, a light hand, a wicked keen sense of humor, and a whole hell of a lot of patience. Thank you for making this one of the best communities on the net, and keeping the signal-to-noise ratio so high.

By the way, is it just me, or is this itching to be made into a song? I'm not much for lyric writing, but I need something for the flipside of Please Stop The Asshattery. Just sayin'.
posted by booksherpa at 9:30 PM on June 13, 2007


Now take a look at this thread, it full of awful comments questioning my value as a human being, yet they are allowed to remain, while my innocuous comment was deleted.

Metatalk is by far the most permissive Metafilter sub-site.

How about some standards here? And its not going to work to say that Metatalk doesnt have the same standard as AskMetafiler because I asked in that forum first.

Questions about any Metafilter subsite, posts and comments on any Metafilter sub-site, or any administrative action are never allowed on AskMetafilter. Such questions may only be asked on Metatalk.
posted by Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America at 9:31 PM on June 13, 2007


Here, Osmanthus, this explains the difference between MeTa and AskMe, among other useful info.
posted by The Deej at 9:33 PM on June 13, 2007


I hereby nominate that every June 13 from now on be known as Moderators' Day, and that we all spend some time on that day to express our appreciation and thanks ...
But that was yesterday! I don't want to have to wait a whole year (yeah, yeah, a year minus one day) before I can say thanks!
posted by dg at 9:34 PM on June 13, 2007


Q: Why do I not deserve the same respect as the person who asked the question?
A: Mithras couldn't get any respect, either. No respect at all!
Q: That doesn't answer my question.
A: Exactly.
Q: Senator Clinton, why does "A" treat me like a bag of bones in an unmarked grave?
A: Who the fuck are you, again?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:35 PM on June 13, 2007


nola, if Jesus can jump start my 1982 Honda Accord, I'm gonna try and make your pasta party. I'm feeling kinda squirrely. Is it ok if I bring my huge mannatee? Dough huts? Orange juice?
posted by flapjax at midnite at 9:35 PM on June 13, 2007


Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America did a fine job outlining what I would be saying in response. In AskMe the rule is that comments have to answer the question or they are removed. In MeTa we are more freeform, there is much less moderation, and sometimes people can be somewhat rude. Honestly you are asking for a sort of respect that you do not seem to be willing to give here, so I'm not certain what your ideal goal state is here. Feel free to repost a cogent answer to the OPs question and you're fine.

However, discussions about the site itself need to go here, not in AskMe and this isn't really a debatable point. The fact that you keep bringing it up implies strongly to me that you do not understand the way this site operates. My advice would be to get a feel for the place a little more before making demands and coming out swinging in MeTa threads.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 9:37 PM on June 13, 2007


Now when you're a kid and your birthday celebration is superseded EVERY FUCKING YEAR by THE ENTIRE WORLD celebrating someone else's birthday altogether, it's good to know that somewhere out there is an ancient bull god whose grandma also probably gives him lumpy reindeer sweaters in holly wrapping paper accompanied by candy-cane shaped cards with HAPPY BIRTHDAY MITHY-SWEETIE inside because he's also had his birthday crashed by the same strangely birthed whelp in a manger, and I would like to remember this last good thing about my birthday without also remembering your whingeing, irrelevant, indefensible comments, so please shut the hell up about your atheist persecution complex, there are plenty of us who get by perfectly without huffing the Dawkins-juice, before me and my buddy Mithras and our overstock of lumpy reindeer sweaters have to come hunt you down.

[NOT MITHRAIST]
posted by casarkos at 9:37 PM on June 13, 2007 [3 favorites]


flapjax has 1982 Honda Accord!?
Boss.
posted by nola at 9:43 PM on June 13, 2007


You are all retarded.
posted by Dataphage at 9:43 PM on June 13, 2007


And its not going to work to say that Metatalk doesnt have the same standard as AskMetafiler

Apparently, nothing's going to work.
posted by hydrophonic at 9:44 PM on June 13, 2007


Eat my information, mister.
posted by cgc373 at 9:44 PM on June 13, 2007


I know (as do plenty of other people on this site) that Christmas and possibly even tales of the virgin birth of Christ probably came from Mithras. However, I'm not at all familiar with Mithras going into the desert or wilderness or being a man who suddenly gained a messianic or cult like following. Mithras was pretty much a god from the start.

So, even if we're to assume that you were trying to answer the later question, can you provide a cite to where the story of Mithras is actually relevant to the portion of the Jesus story that is being discussed?
posted by willnot at 9:44 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


Osmanthus: Listen-- What I really want is a flameout, my baser nature demands it, but I have to say, pay attention to jessamyn's comment here:
It may be that we're all a little lazy and lack intellectual rigor, but I think you have to meet us partway and take responsibility for your not-particularly-clear answer to the question which was in fact so opaque that all three moderators and the people who flagged your response missed the point of it. As I said before and others have said feel free to repost in the thread with a clearer response to the question. We're not censoring you, we're trying to help you be understood and trying to help the people asking questions get them answered.

If you just make an attempt to follow this advice and understand that you haven't been singled out or unfairly censored, maybe take five minutes to cobble together your links and rephrase your comment, and repost, this could all work out fine.

Or you could go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY!

Which is always cool.
posted by exlotuseater at 9:48 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


I was working on a job once where we had an Osmanthus type.

The guy bitched and complained constantly. During breaks and at lunch time he would go on and on about how he wasn't treated right by the company he worked for.

We told him we were tired of hearing about it and if he was so fucking put upon he should perhaps find a different job.

This relatively clear social cue seemed pass through one ear and out the other. His ability to grasp that he was the only one there with a dower attitude didn't register and the negativity was turning others to complaining about him.

The entire place was turning into a kindergarden.

I went to see the sprinkler guys and borrowed a ramset (.22 caliber nail gun basically) got his lunch box, took it to the middle of the job site and drove two shields through the bottom securing it to the concrete floor.

When the break came I told him where his lunch box was and that he should consider taking his break there.

He got mad, as expected, and told me never to move his lunch box again.

I indicated that wouldn't be a problem.

He grumbled off to attempt retrieve his goods.

Most everyone had been clued in and watched expectantly as the doofus went to pick up the box.

He casually grabbed the handle and when the box didn't move as anticipated he tripped forward in a wonderful face plant sprawl.

The guys, all hanging out the office door, where we had a break room set up, errupted in laughter.

He picked himself up but the string of expletives I figured on didn't come. He gave the box a more timid try and the laughter only escalated.

The guys were now howling and calling at him, wanting to know if he was having a problem. Teasing that he couldn't even lift his lunch.

He soon discovered the problem and shortly there after left. We never saw him again. The lunch box remained nailed to the floor for the next two weeks.

The job site was wonderfully light hearted the rest of the day and the atmosphere improved steadily. Everyones spirits had been lifted. The black cloud was gone.

Not sure I really have a point here other than, some people enjoy being a victim, they think they will get sympathy ... and they do. As people tend to nod and agree as a means of attempting curtail further discussion.

This approach will only get you so far, for unrepentant, poor me, Osmanthus types unless the point is pounded into cement ... they just won't get it.
posted by phoque at 9:50 PM on June 13, 2007 [38 favorites]


phoque just posted an improvised parable here, people. Sweetness!
posted by cgc373 at 9:53 PM on June 13, 2007


"Now we see the violence inherent in the sysadmin!"

Fixed
posted by Tenuki at 9:56 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


phoque, you almost make me wish I had coworkers who use lunch boxes. Even non-Osmanthus types.
posted by brownpau at 9:58 PM on June 13, 2007


Face it: you fucked up when you deleted a comment you didn't read.
posted by Osmanthus at 9:59 PM on June 13, 2007


God made me in his own image. God is a 43 year-old atheist with high blood pressure and deep vein thrombosis. Which sucks for Him, 'cause hey - that's a metric shit-ton of Blood of Christ backing up in His legs!

On a completely related note, here are IRFH's tips to getting your shit censored deleted from AskMe:

1) Make a comment that doesn't answer the question. (No - No it didn't. It might have insinuated something, but it answered nothing)
2) Ask a question about AskMe in AskMe

A bonus tip: The best way to get kicked around in Meta is to come to Meta and insist you were playing it clean, when in real life, even Ralph Macchio couldn't wax that shit off.

[NOT FROGANIST]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:59 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


They did read your comment. They just didn't read the propogandist link you put in it.
posted by spec80 at 10:01 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus I'm going to drink a bottle of NyQuill and go to bed now. I really hope you've just been fucking with us , cause if not you get added to the long grey list of knuckle-heads that come in here wanting a silver doug hut shitting pony, and I don't want that for you. Seriously, you're just having a bad day. Get some sleep , these folks are just screwing with you cause you're acting loopy. Things will be better tomorrow.
posted by nola at 10:01 PM on June 13, 2007


Face it: you fucked up when you deleted a comment you didn't read.

So...I take it your claim of religious persecution has been downgraded to "someone fucked up" then?

Ockham's razor, you dickhead.
posted by Jimbob at 10:03 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


As an atheist, a proponent of Free Speech and a decrier of over-moderation, I still gotta agree with everybody else here that Metatalk, not Askmetafilter, is the place to discuss site policy. It's kinda like you don't go to a urinal to vote, that's what a voting booth is for.

And Osmanthus, I have to second exlotuseater and Jessamyn. Rather than rant you might want craft a better comment. (I've made many comments I later wished had been deleted because i came up with better ways to say it.)

(That said, I'm in favor of giving Osmanthus one more chance to ask a question in AskMe this week; if s/he goofs again then no more questions for two weeks.)
posted by davy at 10:08 PM on June 13, 2007


Face it: you're not reading any comments in this thread.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 10:09 PM on June 13, 2007 [15 favorites]


Osmanthus:
Ahem
YOU'RE SOAKING IN FUCKING MOONJUICE YOU GODDAMN OVERRIPE MOONBERRY.
posted by puke & cry at 10:09 PM on June 13, 2007 [5 favorites]


Dammit, IRFH, it's a singularity. You can't get back from there. Event horizons, other astrophysical mumbo-jumbo, etc. NO RETURN. Come on, man. The backed-up Blood of Christ wasn't enough for the piece? You had to use Macchio, too? You had to try to defy the singularity?
posted by cgc373 at 10:10 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus: 15 comments stating how the admins messed up.

Everyone else: 177 comments (generally) stating how Osmanthus messed up.

Um, dude, maybe you ought to take a look at the numbers.
posted by exlotuseater at 10:13 PM on June 13, 2007


MetaFilter: where people 'go along' to 'get along'.


Jesus, what an ass!
posted by Duncan at 10:13 PM on June 13, 2007


"God is a 43 year-old atheist with high blood pressure and deep vein thrombosis."

I'm 44 now, my blood pressure is lower when I don't guzzle coffee, it's Restless Leg Syndrome, and you forgot that my cholesterol level is THREE TIMES normal but Lipitor gives me bellyaches.

Now sing that to the tune of "To Anacreon In Heaven" -- or I'll hold my breath till Hell freezes over.
posted by davy at 10:13 PM on June 13, 2007


When I say I may stop coming to metafilter I am not trying to be dramatic. I'm not a big poster here and have no emotional investment here. Also I am not talking to the members of mefi, but rather to the editors.
There is a lot of competition for my attention on the web. When metafilter's noise level goes up my desire to come back goes down.
In particular, Digg is one of the competitors Metafilter has to contend with; Digg is a fire hose of information and I've seen nearly every article linked to on mefi ealier on digg. It is only the higher quality of comments and moderation on mefi that makes it more attractive. When those go away, I've got no reason to come here.
posted by Osmanthus October 8

posted by leftcoastbob at 10:16 PM on June 13, 2007 [6 favorites]


o shi that was Osmanthus?! NO WAY!

EXPLAINS EVERYTHING.
posted by exlotuseater at 10:19 PM on June 13, 2007


ps haha digg
posted by exlotuseater at 10:19 PM on June 13, 2007


Can we please have the inline images back, please.
posted by 517 at 10:22 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Inline images should at least be allowed in Metatalk threads that have more than 99 comments.
posted by Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America at 10:24 PM on June 13, 2007 [3 favorites]


I'm *this close* to removing metafilter from my bookmarks.
posted by Osmanthus at 5:43 PM on October 8 [+] [!]

WATCH OUT!!!! --><-- THIS CLOSE!!111
posted by Krrrlson at 10:26 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


I'm *this close* to removing metafilter from my bookmarks.
posted by Osmanthus on October 8


Close--but no Bob Seeger.
posted by leftcoastbob at 10:26 PM on June 13, 2007


Bob Seger.
Pete Seeger.
No Cigar.
posted by The Deej at 10:34 PM on June 13, 2007


Oh lord. Yes, please abandon this place and stay at digg and relish in the fire hose of information morons. You'll fit in better there than here.
posted by puke & cry at 10:34 PM on June 13, 2007


So Osmanthus' big Fall Premiere bombed so the MetaFilter Network put him on hiatus until the Summer Replacement Season?
posted by wendell at 10:34 PM on June 13, 2007


In my time zone, it is a BRAND NEW DAY right now.
posted by Meatbomb at 10:40 PM on June 13, 2007


Inline images should at least be allowed in Metatalk threads that have more than 99 comments.

Seconded. At 99 posts more words will likely not help but a second medium of communication might help.
posted by scheptech at 10:42 PM on June 13, 2007


zomg digg pls
posted by brownpau at 10:52 PM on June 13, 2007


When the moderators came for the cat declawers,
I remained silent;
I was not a cat declawer.

When the moderators came for the fatties,
I remained silent;
I was not a fatty.

When the moderators came for the LOL XTIANS,
I remained silent;
I was not a LOL XTIAN.

When they came for us atheists,
there was no one left to speak out.
posted by 0xFCAF at 10:58 PM on June 13, 2007 [4 favorites]


Someone just lost an eye.
posted by 517 at 11:00 PM on June 13, 2007


Osmanthus, ever check out the atheism tag? Lots of godless types here makin' the yippy-yappy without so much as a sidelong glance from the mods. How do they manage? By reading the guidelines!

I'm pretty sure you're just a trolling sockpuppet, anyway. You can prove your realness to me by posting a video of yourself riding a Luck Dragon to MeFi.

Pretty Please?

posted by maryh at 11:01 PM on June 13, 2007


I suppose the agnostics could speak out, but we don't really have any opinions on the matter.
posted by padraigin at 11:02 PM on June 13, 2007 [4 favorites]


I'm here, I'm here! *pants, wipes brow*

Guys?


Damn it.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 11:03 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Here ya go.
posted by puke & cry at 11:19 PM on June 13, 2007 [2 favorites]


Why do I not deserve the same respect as the person who asked the question?
posted by Osmanthus at 12:26 AM on June 14 [+] [!]


Are you still here? You are supposed to have gotten really angry and flamed out by now. Don't you even follow the threads around here?
posted by caddis at 11:22 PM on June 13, 2007


I'm here, I'm here! *pants, wipes brow*

Guys?


Where were you for the last thread about this when I questioned the legitimacy of hypothetical questions about the bible? Dammit, Stavros, I even put up the chicken signal.
posted by The God Complex at 11:37 PM on June 13, 2007


With apologies to Billy Joel, I had to take up my own challenge:

There’s no place on this site for this Osmanthus dude
He’s a myopic troll with a poor attitude
He refuses to hear, he refuses to change
He would much rather pout and whine and complain
And he thinks we don’t see, or we don’t understand
That they’re censoring him, that his posts have been banned
‘Cause we agree with the mods; he’s just being rude

Bloody hell it’s more posts from that Osmanthus dude
Can’t you give it a rest, you’ve already been clued
Yet you keep coming back, with your willful neglect
All you need is to post in a way that’s correct
But you just blame the mods when it’s you that’s so wrong
And all of us see that you should now say so long
Please go back now to Digg where you’re not misconstrued

I believe we’ve passed the point where what you say won’t disappoint
We found that just explaining does not work for you
It was thought you could be shown
What you could post and in which zone
But nothing yet that we have said has broken through

It’s the end of advice for that Osmanthus dude
I remembered this song and these lyrics ensued
I doubt he will get it, he will just be annoyed
Or think that his trolling was read and enjoyed
But I really just laughed at his transparent game
And found inspiration in the rising of flame
We’ll laugh at the thought of this one sided feud

There’s no place on this site for this Osmanthus dude
He’s a myopic troll with a poor attitude
He refuses to hear, he refuses to change
He would much rather bitch and moan and complain
And he thinks we don’t see, or we don’t understand
That they’re censoring him, that his posts have been banned
‘Cause we agree with the mods; he’s just being rude

RhymeZone rocks my world tonight.
posted by booksherpa at 11:40 PM on June 13, 2007 [1 favorite]


In his sleep, Osmanthus is a Viking. A metaphorical viking, of course, since images displease him.

[NOT PUKE & CRYIST]
posted by maryh at 12:00 AM on June 14, 2007


You're not doing it right!
posted by Demogorgon at 12:09 AM on June 14, 2007


Stop persecuting me, Demogorgon!
posted by maryh at 12:29 AM on June 14, 2007


I haven't loaded the grey since this morning. Thank you, Osmanthus, for this 200-plus post present waiting on MetaTalk.

Please don't let these guideline-reading bullies chase you out of this thread. Please don't divert your finite attention to digg's firehose. By taking away my laughter you are persecuting me.
posted by EatTheWeak at 12:43 AM on June 14, 2007 [2 favorites]


Hey what happened to the podcast anyway?
posted by Rhomboid at 12:47 AM on June 14, 2007


booksherpa... it may suffer from a lack of universal familiarity, but I personally LURVE that you chose to base your lyric on Billy Joel's "Angry Young Man". I remember a million years ago I was a part-time phone screener for a late-night talk jock and getting a call from a drunk dude who wanted to dedicate that song to the guy on the air... "Okay, let's go to our... uh, Wendell, which call is next and WHAT are you laughing about?"
posted by wendell at 12:50 AM on June 14, 2007


Hey what happened to the podcast anyway?

they had to remove it ... it was attracting pod people
posted by pyramid termite at 1:12 AM on June 14, 2007


And here all this time I'd been baiting my pop people traps with Viking metaphors.
posted by Rhomboid at 1:14 AM on June 14, 2007


reaction.gif
posted by puke & cry at 1:23 AM on June 14, 2007


OK, Osmanthus has changed his tune somewhat since early in the thread, but I'd just like to point out one fairly obvious flaw in his reasoning from the beginning. Here Osmanthus indicates that he believed his comment was deleted because he is an atheist, and a victim of the Atheist Brigade. A little while on, he hints at the content of his deleted comment, and later Jessamyn reproduces his comment verbatim. Here it is again:

The Jesus story is a re-telling of the Mithra myths of Zorastrianism to Greeks who name for God was Zeus.

Here's the flaw: This comment in no way indicates that Osmanthus is an atheist. The moderator who deleted that comment could not have been following orders from the Atheist Brigade, because the Atheist Brigade had no way of knowing Osmanthus was an atheist!
posted by carsonb at 1:59 AM on June 14, 2007


What? You don't know about all of Osmanthuseses inner thoughts?
posted by Snyder at 2:07 AM on June 14, 2007


Osmanthus, grow up or get a life or something.

There are so many athiests on mefi compared to the outside world. Stop pretending to be poor little oppressed athiest boy.

Your post was deleted because it was irrelevant to the question. Maybe if you had of expanded on the Mithras statement, mentioning a similar experience that Mithras went through?
posted by twistedonion at 2:25 AM on June 14, 2007


For those of you who were wondering what the ending of The Sopranos was supposed to represent - now you know. AJ got dialup and five bucks.
posted by supercrayon at 2:46 AM on June 14, 2007


along the lines of exlotuseater: OH SHIT, that was you?

Thanks for pointing that out, leftcoastbob.

This was my response to you then.

I actually had the incredible urge to comment there whe nI normally just lurk. I even managed to be civil and rational when I thought you were ridiculous.

Now though? Seriously, go fuck yourself. The site can easily do without you and if your opinions of this place have gone from what they were then to what they are now JUST FUCKING LEAVE. Screw this politeness bullshit. I'm casting my vote for intentionally obtuse or trolling.

Also, autism.
posted by Stunt at 3:41 AM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


On the other hand, thanks for pulling this stunt and eventually getting my attention drawn back to that elephant thread.

Seriously, I must have been drinking or something; I commented a lot there and had totally forgotten about whatever weird tangent I went off on. Good times.
posted by Stunt at 3:43 AM on June 14, 2007


Aw, Jesus. I can't believe I missed this last night. Still, even without the fun of direct participation, this ain't too shabby at all.

Thanks, Osmanthus!
posted by Greg Nog at 4:47 AM on June 14, 2007


Woo! Late comments that nobody's gonna read! What a trademark to have.

Ozy, you totally didn't answer the question. Instead of mentioning people (gods? who knows, really?) who went through a similar trial of doubt/temptation that lead to their "finding their voices" you talked about the origin of the Jesus Myth.

If you thought that was a helpful response then I (and a bunch of other folks) think you probably misread the question. OP wasn't asking for similar mythologies that lead to the story of Jesus, but stories about people confronting doubt and emerging charismatic leaders. You haven't provided any connection between Mithras and that specific theme, but that's only with my limited knowledge of the subject. I'm sure there could be a connection there, I'm just missing it and you didn't beat me over the head with it well enough to get it. No shame in that, I'm in college. Missreading/Not Understanding's part of the job description.

This is an honest invitation to enlighten me. Really. I think you're on to something. Post it here, post it in AskMe, I don't really care. I'm the one giving you the benefit of the doubt, prove to me that you're right.
posted by Doublewhiskeycokenoice at 4:50 AM on June 14, 2007


Well hell. Yesterday was a nice quiet work day and I spent most of it trawling through the blue, the green and the gray. I really wanted a thread just like this one. But no. Instead you all had to wait until I'd fallen alseep in front of Top Chef. Bastards.

As a public service and a feature request I demand some sort of paging alarm for flame-outs. A little pitchfork appearing on my cell phone accompanied by some sort of mournful tolling bell ring would be fine.
posted by idest at 5:23 AM on June 14, 2007 [7 favorites]


Because my question was moved to metatalk, I have lost the ability to ask another.

No. Not true. Because you asked a question in AskMe, you have lost the ability to ask another for a week. It is immaterial that it was moved to MetaTalk. There is a separate issue of your answer to the Jesus question - the mods thought it broke the guidelines (i.e. didn't answer the question), so it was deleted.

What can you do? Well, you can go back into the question, and post an answer that *answers the question*. That might be the same answer - perhaps the mods made a mistake. But be prepared to explain how your answer *answers the question*.

No drama required.
posted by altolinguistic at 5:41 AM on June 14, 2007


It may be that we're all a little lazy and lack intellectual rigor, but I think you have to meet us partway

No. No meeting halfway with psychopaths (or trolls). Man the walls and kick their ladders away.
posted by yerfatma at 5:59 AM on June 14, 2007


I was going to post something about "stop taunting the newbie, he|she|it is either dense or trolling", but then I reread the Auschwitz comment.
posted by signal at 6:50 AM on June 14, 2007


Wow. Why didn't someone tell me about this thread?
posted by Astro Zombie at 6:54 AM on June 14, 2007


WE APOLOGISE FOR THE INCONVENIENCE
posted by Totally Zanzibarin' Ya at 7:08 AM on June 14, 2007


They tried, but the athiests got them.
posted by COBRA! at 7:10 AM on June 14, 2007


Face it: you're not comprehending any comments in this thread, or the guidelines, or the nature of the moderators.

Nice Rothko imitation though.
posted by juiceCake at 7:36 AM on June 14, 2007


Whoa hey. Metafilter is dominated by Christians who all agree with each other? Are we next going to learn that Fark is dominated by women with post-doctorate fellowships who volunteer at local homeless shelters?
posted by L. Fitzgerald Sjoberg at 7:41 AM on June 14, 2007 [5 favorites]


I know we're supposed to be patient and understanding and all....but come the fuck on. This Osmanthus character ain't gonna get it.
posted by NationalKato at 7:45 AM on June 14, 2007


[I]t may suffer from a lack of universal familiarity, but I personally LURVE that you chose to base your lyric on Billy Joel's "Angry Young Man".

It just fit so well, I had to use that song. Thanks for the kudos.
posted by booksherpa at 8:10 AM on June 14, 2007


signal: "I was going to post something about "stop taunting the newbie, he|she|it is either dense or trolling", but then I reread the Auschwitz comment."

Well, and he's been here for three years.
posted by octothorpe at 8:14 AM on June 14, 2007


We need to upgrade the flagging options. How about "Rampant douchebaggery"?
posted by RussHy at 8:18 AM on June 14, 2007


I just want to give a big "Fuck You" to everyone who has participated in this thread. I know I should never read Metatalk first thing in the morning, but this thread has made me late for work.

I've been so busy reading this thread that I haven't even fucking showered yet and I'm supposed to be at work in four minutes.

Thanks a fucking lot, you atheist dickweeds.
posted by dersins at 8:27 AM on June 14, 2007 [4 favorites]


A little late to the party, but -
Metafilter: I never thought it would happen at metafilter.
posted by These Penises Are Alarmed at 8:28 AM on June 14, 2007


Jesus, what a waste of time. Now I don't have enough time for a shower and a tug before work, so one's gonna have to fall by the wayside.

Thursday is Stinky Day at work, right?
posted by trondant at 8:46 AM on June 14, 2007 [2 favorites]


dersins, don't forget to wash your ass.
posted by NationalKato at 8:46 AM on June 14, 2007


On non-preview: I can carpool with dersins if he can roll the windows down.
posted by trondant at 8:49 AM on June 14, 2007


I hate coming to threads this late. Be that as it may, I'd like to take one stab at answering Osmanthus' questions as best as I can.

Osmanthus,

The reason your comment was deleted isn't because of a christian persecution on the site, or because the admins didn't read your comment, or because your comment was too obtuse or confusingly worded for someone to understand at a casual glance. Sure that last one is why the admins made the decision they did, but to get at the real root of WHY your comment was deleted, we must dig a little deeper. The real reason that your comment was deleted is very simply that you seem to have a problem understanding and appreciating the social tendencies, expectations and nuances of the people you interact with. Aspects of your behavior that make perfect sense to you, including the syntax and diction of your speech and the reasons for your varying behavior, seem to confound the people you interact with. Likewise, repeatedly explained societal conventions seem to fall on deaf ears with you, or at least to have met a total lack of understanding. To put it more succinctly, you don't seem to understand the users and the rules of this site at all, and we are totally confounded by your behavior. People have reason to suspect you of trolling. Unfortunately, there are psychological disorders that match this aspect of your behavior. One in particular, Asperger's Syndrome, describes someone who does not pick up on social cues or the subtleties and nuances of conversation. I'm not a psychologist and I don't intend to diagnose you any further than to say that you remind me an awful lot of a friend of mine who suffers from the condition, except that he's rather nicer and less inclined to make claims of religious persecution or to compare himself to jews mudered at auschwitz. As I said, I'm not a psychologist and I don't intend to convince you that you suffer from Asperger's, but I wouldn't be at al surprised if it turned out that other people in your life have suggested it to you before. I would recommend that you consider making an appointment with an actual psychologist for a reliable diagnosis, because there are treatment options available to you if you suffer from this that would make your life rather easier and cut down on the frequency of episodes like this in your life.

I know it may feel offensive to have someone say this to you, but the alternative is that you really are just an asshole with miserable reading comprehension.
posted by shmegegge at 8:50 AM on June 14, 2007


Goddammit, I miss all the best stuff because of my stupid need for sleep! But reading all 250 comments has really improved a generally crappy day—I haven't laughed so much in ages—so thanks, Osmanthus, you fucking moonbat! Now could you please flame out so my day will be complete?

/used to be an atheist but am now a phoquist

Is metafilter proud of this behavior?

Damn straight!
posted by languagehat at 8:51 AM on June 14, 2007


On non-preview, let me summarize shmegegge's comment for you: you're a fucking moonbat.

Oh, and MITHRA SUCKS!

/waits hopefully, popcorn at hand
posted by languagehat at 8:53 AM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


Wow.

As a paid-up member of the MeFi atheist cabal, I am praying to Jesus Jessamyn anyway, that Osmanthus can be granted insight here.

I think there should simply be a ban on any post or thread discussing any deletion by the mods, period. Not on AskMe, and not on MeTa. Think of all the afternoons that would be saved for everyone? Proposing that something be deleted seems an important thing. But debating a deletion after the fact leads to nothing but pure entertainment value heartache.

And I agree, especially seeing how much earnest effort M, J, and C have put in on this very thread trying to assuage an obstinate ignoramus' unrighteous indignation, that it's a good moment to toss a bouquet the moderators' way.
posted by spitbull at 8:57 AM on June 14, 2007


"an obstinate ignoramus' unrighteous indignation"

One could, and really should, conga-line to that.
posted by Ms. Saint at 9:10 AM on June 14, 2007 [3 favorites]


I second the bouquet-tossing idea.

Yesterday must have been an exceptionally tough day on them. Perhaps we should be very, very kind to them for the next couple of days in view of the massive hangovers that must be rearing their ugly heads. (After putting up with all that crap yesterday, the normal reaction would be to drink heavily, wouldn't it?)
posted by leftcoastbob at 9:15 AM on June 14, 2007


Y'know... I just spent a weekend visiting my Fundamentalist Christian sister on her God-loving country homestead. Where, despite my smiles & good nature, I agree with people about absolutely nothing. And frankly? That didn't hurt my head half as much as you do, Osmanthus. And that's really saying something. 'Cuz it hurt my head.

It's an impressive skill you have there.
posted by miss lynnster at 9:25 AM on June 14, 2007


On the other hand, thanks for pulling this stunt and eventually getting my attention drawn back to that elephant thread.

Indeed, I think I can thank Osmanthus* for the recently favorited Execution By Elephant image I posted in there.
Thanks, you raving illiterate wacko!

*Note: He didn't approve of Elephant Day, and was *that* close to removing MeFi from his bookmarks. Cortex, are you ever right?
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 9:43 AM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


And I agree, especially seeing how much earnest effort M, J, and C have put in on this very thread trying to assuage an obstinate ignoramus' unrighteous indignation, that it's a good moment to toss a bouquet the moderators' way.
posted by spitbull at 11:57 AM on June 14


Ditto. Here in the US of A, June 14 is Flag Day. We should celebrate and show appreciation to our mods by flagging posts and comments that displease us, and not producing assinine Metatalk threads. Flag flag for flag day.
posted by marxchivist at 9:56 AM on June 14, 2007


Considering that he's dugg "The Great Global Warming Swindle" and a 9/11 WTC7 conspiracy nut, as well as quoted Acharya S's roundly debunked "Jesus-as-Mithra-derivative" theory as though it were fact, I'm starting to lean toward "intentionally obtuse troll," in which case I must applaud him for a YHBT well-played.
posted by brownpau at 10:02 AM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


"an obstinate ignoramus' unrighteous indignation"

One could, and really should, conga-line to that.


I vote Gilbert and Sullivan to truly do it, and this thread, justice.
posted by jokeefe at 10:07 AM on June 14, 2007


"Your Holiness?"

"Yes, my son?"

"Telegraph for you. It's from America."

>>> PLAN FLAWLESSLY EXECUTED stop ALL ADMINS CONVERTED SUCCESSFULLY stop METAFILTER NOW FULL-GOSPEL INTERNET CHURCH OF BABY JESUS stop ATHEISTS PERSECUTED full stop >>>

"Excellent. Excellent..."
posted by Baby_Balrog at 10:33 AM on June 14, 2007 [9 favorites]


This thread is in the Mefi Hall of Fame right?
posted by dash_slot- at 11:33 AM on June 14, 2007


Is the the first for a flame-out in a thread not actually started by the flamee? Or would that be flamer? Flame-out-er?
posted by GuyZero at 11:37 AM on June 14, 2007


DOMINUS MY VOBISCUM,
ET CUM SPIRI MY TU TUO.
posted by quonsar at 11:50 AM on June 14, 2007


I met a member from an antique land
Who said: "Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert... Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk a shattered atheist lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless threads,
The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed;
And on the pedestal these words appear:
My name is Osmanthus, King of Kings,
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!
Nothing intelligent remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.
posted by peacay at 12:04 PM on June 14, 2007 [5 favorites]


ET CUM SPIRI MY TU TUO.

I don't want to be exposed to quonsar's tutu!
posted by languagehat at 12:08 PM on June 14, 2007


Blame the trash 'stache, he's been fucking shit up since day one
posted by prostyle at 12:27 PM on June 14, 2007


lol, peacay! Perfect.

And LH! (Though, I did once have a dream that I was exposed to quonsar's tutu, kinda.)
posted by taz at 12:35 PM on June 14, 2007


Man, I spilled coffee on my khakis during my first day at work. Thank God for this thread.

"How about some standards here?"

My Favorite Things? (Though the mods said they don't do requests, cortex usually knows it if you hum a few bars).
posted by klangklangston at 12:39 PM on June 14, 2007


Man, I spilled coffee on my khakis during my first day at work.

This is why I always wear dark pants.

It also hides the occasional bout of uncontroled urination.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 12:53 PM on June 14, 2007


klang, I never took you for a khakis type. *is crushed*
posted by taz at 12:55 PM on June 14, 2007


"How about some standards here?"

My Favorite Things?


*stands, applauds*
Well done, sir!
posted by Greg Nog at 12:58 PM on June 14, 2007


Metatalk: full of awful comments questioning my value as a human being
posted by MsMolly at 1:51 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


Is the the first for a flame-out in a thread not actually started by the flamee? Or would that be flamer? Flame-out-er?

Oh, hell no.
posted by Johnny Assay at 1:54 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


all three admins are atheists

Aha! I knew it! There really is an Atheist Brigade Cabal!
posted by ericb at 2:02 PM on June 14, 2007


Goddamned Mercury wobbling into retrograde brings out all the nitwits and fucks with my CHI!!
posted by ersatzkat at 2:09 PM on June 14, 2007


According to something I just read in the NY Times or WSJ, but can't seem to put my hands on right now, only 3% of Americans are self-identifying atheists. My question is, how did they all end up on this site?
posted by found missing at 2:14 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


Oh, hell no.

That was good.
posted by GuyZero at 2:20 PM on June 14, 2007


Well, according to this article, agnostics and atheists account for 20% of Americans. Keep in mind though, if the picture is anything to go on, that this was written by Lucifer himself.
posted by Kattullus at 2:22 PM on June 14, 2007


found missing - I actually LOLed at your post. Thanks for that.

You've probably seen that poll where atheists came in as less trustworthy than pedophiles, yeah?

... hmm ... you think Osmanthus is gonna come wake this thread up any time soon?
posted by EatTheWeak at 2:24 PM on June 14, 2007


Still going . . .

Can we keep this thread open for forty days please admins? As an experiment, to see if any of us walk out of here with exceptional skills at motivational speaking . . . or with our fundamental beliefs overthrown.

Seriously, I repeat for the record (looking at the latest moan on MeTa with the tune "why was my craptabulous post deleted?" above) that it would be really cool if there were NO debate allowed about a deletion after the fact, same rule for everyone. Or have one thread open permanently (I nominate this one) for people to go into and bitch about being deleted, and where you'd win cool points for the number of deletions to your credit.
posted by spitbull at 2:26 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


Praise Satan! I am sickened!
posted by davy at 2:34 PM on June 14, 2007


Osmanthus: "Look on my comments and despair."
posted by drezdn at 2:42 PM on June 14, 2007


I feel like I've watched a whole movie, through the entire end credits, and am now waiting for the little bonus "after end" scene. You know, like when the question mark gets added to "The End" at the very end of the original Blob.

Ozman, where you at? Coda this sucker.
posted by bodega at 2:48 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


Superstition causes bad luck.
posted by Floydd at 3:00 PM on June 14, 2007


CXXV.

And that the publick Peace may be so much the better preserv'd intire, the Circles shall be renew'd; and as soon as any Beginnings of Troubles are perceiv'd, that which has been concluded in the Constitutions, of the Empire, touching the Execution and Preservation of the Public Peace, shall be observ'd.


Expert commentary: This article is superfluous. It's a peace treaty, and all the way down here, in the 125th article, it's essentially saying "Everyone chill, peace out dudes, no more of this fighting stuff."

Hidden message for thread 14380: no flameout here, move on, nothing more to see.
posted by Meatbomb at 3:18 PM on June 14, 2007


Atheist Brigade Cabal Deftly Elides, Framing Great Historical In-Justice; Keeping Little Mr. N-oying Osmanthus Persecuted Quite Rightly-- Silly Thread Used Very Well . (sorry X, Y and Z)
posted by exlotuseater at 3:40 PM on June 14, 2007


Mark Twain thinks klang's khakis are "... an ugly and odious and appropriate disguise, of yellow stuff such as quarantine flags are made of, and which are hoisted to warn the healthy away from unclean disease and repulsive death."

Personally, I have no opinion on the matter.
posted by ourobouros at 3:47 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


Is the the first for a flame-out in a thread not actually started by the flamee? Or would that be flamer? Flame-out-er?

Oh, hell no.


Oh, man, now THAT was a flame out. They just don't make them that way anymore....
posted by jokeefe at 3:48 PM on June 14, 2007


I want to know how someone who's been around for nearly THREE YEARS doesn't know who mathowie is, let alone jessamyn or cortex. This guy has taken obliviousness to a new level.

Sorry, guys, I'm all outta popcorn, but I got lotsa Crunch 'n' Munch to share.
posted by deborah at 4:16 PM on June 14, 2007


Osmanthis might have some serious personal problems. He/she might even need the support of his/her online community. SHAME ON YOU ALL. God will judge!!!!


JK.

*dancing around in my garage like a loon-naked*

Naked Twister anyone?
posted by snsranch at 4:17 PM on June 14, 2007


(skims over four thousand comments)

So, to sum up:
Q: Jesus' conversion, which I believe to be real, impresses me. Are there more such real examples?
Osmanthus: Well, this fictional example inspired the ficitional example you're referring to. Here's a buttload of backstory.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Ahh ahh ah-MOONBAT!
(excuse me)
posted by evilcolonel at 4:26 PM on June 14, 2007


I hereby nominate Oh hell no for the Metafilter Recursive Linking award, the substance of which involves mefites linking the last person to link Oh hell no all over the site until eventually the chain lands back at the original link earlier in this thread.
posted by shmegegge at 5:55 PM on June 14, 2007


Comment 300!
posted by armage at 6:03 PM on June 14, 2007


Mathowie: You bring the whines and moans of endless complaints to my website. You accuse me of fascism. You threaten my people with continued trolling! Oh, I've chosen my words carefully, Osmanthus. Perhaps you should have done the same!
Osmanthus : This is blasphemy! This is madness!
Mathowie: Madness? THIS IS METAFILTER!
posted by Mr.Encyclopedia at 7:13 PM on June 14, 2007


Seriously, I repeat for the record... that it would be really cool if there were NO debate allowed about a deletion after the fact

There are a number of reasons why this would be a bad idea. It would give strength to the whole angle people take that the Trio of Terror have gone mad (MAD!) with power, and are effecting a reign of terror wherein Dissent is Silenced, just like in 1984! The real whackos would go crazy in the blue or green, trying to Overcome the Voice of Oppression! Creating more messes and moderator hassles. Beyond this, the fact is that, current situation notwithstanding, not all "why was this moderated" discussions are unworthwhile. It allows the moderators to discuss their rationales in greater detail, the interested component of the community to weigh in with their opinions, supporting or contrary.

But the most important reasons are, first, that threads like this afford one of the few opportunities in the MetaComplex to be complete dick without repercussions, and second, if pissing and moaning about what you aren't allowed to say were forbidden, Jessamyn would have to change all those friendly little "hey you kids" notes she makes when she's been cleaning house to read something like Removed a few comments about animal cruelty. If you want to discuss the merits of beating dead horses, you can just go fuck yourselves.
posted by nanojath at 8:29 PM on June 14, 2007 [1 favorite]


This tag begs, pleads, screams into the darkness for the return of <IMG>
posted by killdevil at 8:44 PM on June 14, 2007


This thread, rather.
posted by killdevil at 8:45 PM on June 14, 2007


This tea bag agrees.
posted by and hosted from Uranus at 8:46 PM on June 14, 2007


Removed a few comments about animal cruelty

Fuckety-fuck.
posted by ericb at 8:46 PM on June 14, 2007


From far above,

Metafilter: Ockham's razor, you dickhead.

Basically I just like to comment in these biggish ridicu-threads just to say I was there.
posted by Kwine at 9:09 PM on June 14, 2007


Osmanthus, the prospective flamer, appears to have become lost before his moment of glory. In lieu of the return of this prodigal lost flamer, I offer myself as a poorly-disguised stand-in.
posted by lostburner at 9:36 PM on June 14, 2007


Okay, a bit stretched, but it's never my turn to be eponysterical.
posted by lostburner at 9:37 PM on June 14, 2007


I'm disappointed. I thought this widening gyre of a thread was going to end with a bang, but no, it is but a whimper.
posted by five fresh fish at 11:37 PM on June 14, 2007


By the way, this is a bit of a milestone:

I've been a member since Sept. 2000, this is my first ever post in MeFi or MeTa.
posted by Joseph Gurl at 1:36 AM on June 15, 2007


Oh, but it was a doozy no? Who would have thought that your simple little post would drive another member, Osmanthus, completely insane?
posted by caddis at 4:57 AM on June 15, 2007


You are participating in a large community not knowing the guidelines

The guidelines:
Metafilter is predominantly US-based, skewing a petite bourgeoisie demographic influenced by regional taboos. As a result, it tends to dislike: Germans, atheists, uncut guys, NASCAR fans, and people who don't use Apple.
posted by meehawl at 6:12 AM on June 15, 2007 [1 favorite]


all three admins are atheists

This place is Godless, I tell you, Godless...

Where's Kirk Cameron when you need him?
posted by Fuzzy Monster at 7:04 AM on June 15, 2007


First post!
posted by LordSludge at 7:16 AM on June 15, 2007


nanojath: the principles of moderation can be discussed and debated more effectively when a deletion is discussed in advance, thus, when someone calls out a post for deletion on MeTa.

I don't think I've ever seen a post that's been deleted be restored after vigorous debate on MeTa, though perhaps I am missing some examples thereof. I would rather see the mods moderate than defend their moderating choices, which have no relationship to free speech issues and everything to do with the of-quoted but rarely understood dictum: this is matt's website, and the mods are omnipotent here, and if you don't like it you can start your own competitor.

These post-delete threads are very entertaining in their way, of course. But they also get ugly and waste a lot of moderator energy when there's plenty of moderating to be done in the blue and the green and the magenta and the tangerine.

If I thought a ban on post-deletion MeTas would hurt either free discourse or any individual member of the community, I'd never suggest it. But this one of those cases where thinking outside the box helps: what do these threads accomplish and what do they cost us? I see no equivalence. Anything they accomplish can be accomplished in other debates with more bearing on the consequences for the community. These MeTa threads are the ugliest parts of a beautiful website, and the funniest ones too. Too much dirty laundry, too much snarky pile-on, too much self-righteous pontificating (I know, I know -- Metafilter: all of the above). The public shaming ritual alone reflects badly on the community and is no doubt a barrier to entry for some people we might want to post more often, or join in the first place. Judging from these threads MeFi is a lot meaner than the rest of the site substantiates. Just saying.

I can be a mean, snarky, foul-mouthed bastard with the best of them, with the added strength of testosterone, which drives a fair bit of the party around here anyway. I've deserved deletion on more than one occasion when it didn't happen, and been deleted when I didn't think I was out of bounds. My point is that either one takes it in stride and learns from it, or one becomes, effectively, a narcissistic troll, upping the ante to show one is not intimidated even when proven wrong. What good does this do for Metafilter? My sense is, these threads break the ethical (and formal) guidelines that make MeFi great, per se, ipso facto, and ad nauseam.

But they are fun in the moment, aren't they? Guilty fun, but fun.
posted by spitbull at 7:33 AM on June 15, 2007


Where's Kirk Cameron when you need him?

ALSO YOUR BUTT
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 7:34 AM on June 15, 2007


also, these threads are evidence that cortex is some kind of saint or something. the patience with which cortex replies to osmanthus' most obtuse polemics above is sort of stunning in the aggregate
posted by spitbull at 7:38 AM on June 15, 2007


spitbull, I'd have to argue the reverse: that a lot of the deletion threads serve as cautionary tales for the more clueful members and that the overall post quality goes up as a result. And I think most people here are at least moderately clueful, so I'm happy for the public shaming (I've been on the wrong side of it once, and it was an absolute cakewalk compared to this one but it's definitely made me think more carefully about how and what to post).
posted by Tuwa at 7:40 AM on June 15, 2007


Pulling this from the flameout linked above, because it just begged for it:

Metatalk: citing some imaginary rules
posted by Arturus at 12:03 PM on June 15, 2007


"klang, I never took you for a khakis type. *is crushed*"

Haha. At orientation, they told me "We emphasize the 'business' in 'business casual.'" Were I not such a fan of black comedy, corporate life might be truly soul-crushing. (And it's that job I mentioned on MeCha! I got it!)
posted by klangklangston at 5:45 PM on June 15, 2007


Hey, this ended well!
posted by spitbull at 5:12 AM on June 16, 2007


no it HASN'T and your mothers were hamsters and your fathers smelled like elderberries
posted by pyramid termite at 6:33 AM on June 16, 2007


I resent that. My mother was a ferret, not a stinking hamster.

And this ended well no matter what you say, because it ended.
posted by spitbull at 3:37 PM on June 19, 2007


I was going to say something like "I can't believe I went on vacation for five goddam days and you silly bastards are still commenting in this thread", but nobody would buy it.

Cortex, are you ever right?

No, Alvy. Never, at all. It's a disease or something.

posted by cortex (staff) at 4:01 PM on June 19, 2007


cortex!
posted by cgc373 at 8:52 PM on June 19, 2007




I hereby nominate that every June 13 from now on be known as Moderators' Day, and that we all spend some time on that day to express our appreciation and thanks for dealing with all the crap that this bunch of crazies and snowflakes can generate. Thanks guys.


My birthday! Yay!
posted by Esoquo at 1:19 PM on June 21, 2007


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