A political broadside

November 27, 2002 10:49 AM

Am I the only one that doesn't like FPPs that begin the political arguement in the post itself. See a post today for what I mean. Nothing against The Jesse Helms, but the links don't point to anything new. It appears to me to be a political broadside instead of interesting information. IMHO, interesting information is what a 'metafilter' is supposed to provide.

I thought the idea of MeFi was to let discussion occur in the comments, not on the front page.

Or am I way off base and should I head back to Slashdot & the WWDN forums?
posted by Argyle to etiquette/policy at 10:49 AM (32 comments total)

Well the amount of bullshit fpp about politics is just too much. People wanting to push their political agenda yet get overly rude when people question them, is reminding me about why I'm not going to the blue as much.
posted by mkelley at 11:04 AM on November 27, 2002

am I way off base

Nope, right on target...
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 11:50 AM on November 27, 2002

argyle:

you're not off base. in my mind, the problem is that people are trying to turn metafilter into a discussion filter rather than a link filter. i know that discussion is one of the professedly great things about mefi, but when the attraction for members is primarily the discussion then the purpose of mefi shall lean towards that end.

a balance must somehow be struck. i feel that if that balance were to be achieved, then it must by necessity alter metafilter as we know and knew. novelty must be preferred; discussion should derive only as a result of that novelty. that's not the way it works now, but it's the way it should work.

maybe i'm being naive, but i don't think novelty would exclude politics. i do think it'll exclude redundant discussion, which a lot of the political/ideological posters seemingly try to encourage.
posted by moz at 11:58 AM on November 27, 2002

WWDN

What Would Ducks Neuter? I've never heard of that community, but it sounds intriguing.
posted by mathowie at 11:58 AM on November 27, 2002

By the way, I do agree with moz, the political posts over the past few days have been rather banal and far from novel.
posted by mathowie at 11:59 AM on November 27, 2002

It seems that we all agree. Any ideas what to do about it?
posted by timeistight at 12:05 PM on November 27, 2002

(These are dangerous and unpleasant times we live in. It is no surprise that people are attempting to reach out and confirm their worst fears about what's happening to their nation. As far as the front page goes, a good post is a good post, whether it's political or not. We will never dispense with agendas, or people who have them. Focussing on what makes a good post and encouraging that will solve the 'problem' of leading, agenda-driven policital posts in and of itself, I would think, by (to borrow Matt's phrasing, sorta) banishing the banal and encouraging the novel.)
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 12:09 PM on November 27, 2002

And they're too damn long, too.
posted by mcwetboy at 12:21 PM on November 27, 2002

WWDN is Wil Wheaton Dot Net.

If you click Soapbox, they have a phpbb setup. I mainly stick to the geocaching forum and away from the *hugs*/kiss/!loves! forums. I even went to a RL meetup in a bar with WWDN people and had a good time.

Back to topic:

On some linkfilter sites, there is ability to vote posts on or off the front page. Take a peek at Kuro5hin as an example. I'm the last to call for more code writing, but the ability to signal disatisfcation on the post might make people think twice about political or 'newsfilter' posts.
posted by Argyle at 12:36 PM on November 27, 2002

OK, I'm relatively new here, but if I'd seen the front page in it's current state it's highly unlikely I'd have stuck around. It's not the content that bugs me, just the SIZE of the damn things. Can't there just be some kind of guideline re limiting posts to "x" lines or less?
posted by Raindog at 12:37 PM on November 27, 2002

Argyle, I suggest you do a quick scan of some Metatalk archives. There has been more discussion about the pros (some) and cons (many) of what you're suggesting than you can shake a very large stick at. I'm not trying to be snarky, just suggesting that the idea of modding posts (and/or comments) has been discussed to death here, literally. The consensus, at this stage, has been that it goes against the spirit of Metafilter, I think it's fair to say.

Not again, please.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 12:44 PM on November 27, 2002

The consensus, at this stage...

Uh, as much as any consensus is ever reached about anything here. Read : the vague leanings of a small majority, perhaps, confirmed by the opinion of Matt, as I recall.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 12:49 PM on November 27, 2002

wot stavros said

I've always felt that these endless debates in metatalk about what exactly makes good posts and what the hell should be done about bad posts have a very limited effect on the problem. the best and most effective thing to do is try and post what you consider good posts when you've got one, non?
posted by gravelshoes at 12:49 PM on November 27, 2002

Can't there just be some kind of guideline re limiting posts to "x" lines or less?

I've often wondered the same thing - limiting characters on the front page - although it would mean more code, but then we (or anyone else) wouldn't have to deal with some posts that are 2 or 3 paragraphs long.
posted by poopy at 12:51 PM on November 27, 2002

Argyle, Rusty that runs k5 and I are friends (and former neighbors), and I've examined the issues a number of times over the past few years.

I am planning to offer some form of voting on front page posts in the future, though it won't be anywhere near as robust as k5's system.
posted by mathowie at 1:02 PM on November 27, 2002

Whoops - sorry, mathowie, and Argyle. I thought you'd actually come down against the idea, Matt...

[emily litella] Never mind. [/emily litella]
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:04 PM on November 27, 2002

well stavros, I have in the past, but since there was no way to say "hey this is good" by the community, I've decided to let up and allow that to happen.

So at least there will be positive reinforcement of some type in the future, and a way to look at the most highly rated threads. I really liked the offsite "best of mefi" voting site that someone did a short while back (the URL escapes me now).
posted by mathowie at 1:35 PM on November 27, 2002

the URL escapes me now

No chicken escapes from Tweedy's farm.
posted by mcwetboy at 1:39 PM on November 27, 2002

I agree with mcwetboy about the burgeoning length of posts recently. If we're not going to have a cap on post length, then we should strongly encourage the [more inside] technique. And I must say that y2karl seems to be the most frequent abuser of this. I don't see that making good posts excuses one from [more insiding]. When people see it, whoever is doing it, they start to feel that it is acceptable and the practice increases.
posted by rushmc at 4:00 PM on November 27, 2002

why cant the best of mefi site just be linked on the mainpage, maybe in the sidebar. The only problem I can see is that it might cause the page to get too much traffic and crash it.
posted by philcliff at 9:09 PM on November 27, 2002

Wow. Deja vu. Again.
posted by dg at 9:51 PM on November 27, 2002

mcwetboy hit my nail on the head. i want bite-size not big gulp.
posted by Frasermoo at 1:07 AM on November 28, 2002

Matt is most welcome
to use my Haiku Cruncher™
to prune leafy posts.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
And Frasermoo posts
metaphors of pain and porn
which make me squirmy.
posted by Opus Dark at 2:13 AM on November 28, 2002

Crumbs.. you're right. I blame my mother.
posted by Frasermoo at 3:06 AM on November 28, 2002

How about this: Post ANY political news, but it cannot be about politics in North America, Europe, or Asia. You've got four continents left to find interesting political sites. Go at it.
posted by blue_beetle at 11:54 AM on November 28, 2002

Wow. Deja vu. Again.

maybe for you, dg, but it's always jamais vu for me!

Wil Wheaton Dot Net? I was thinking Who Would Dhartung Nuke? ;)
posted by y2karl at 12:24 PM on November 28, 2002

it's always jamais vu for me!

That must make sex exciting!
posted by dg at 2:34 PM on November 28, 2002

Always with me!
posted by y2karl at 3:09 PM on November 28, 2002

the best and most effective thing to do is try and post what you consider good posts when you've got one, non?

Submitters of 'bad' posts probably do think that their posts are good. The definition of 'bad' is more often a community thing than a personal thing.
posted by mischief at 11:57 PM on November 28, 2002

When people see it, whoever is doing it, they start to feel that it is acceptable and the practice increases.

Constant bitching is one prime example of that.
posted by y2karl at 11:11 AM on November 30, 2002

Oh, and ten, twenty or more per post intricate explanations of the overall superiority of atheism in any religious or spiritually oriented thread, like anyone doesn't know what your opinion on the matter is.
posted by y2karl at 8:44 PM on November 30, 2002

Get over it, y2karl, sheesh. Why don't you just c&p it into every MeTa thread for a couple weeks? You just sound defensive and...well...ridiculous.
posted by rushmc at 3:29 PM on December 2, 2002