Bush Go George Bush FPP callout January 18, 2005 2:43 PM   Subscribe

Could we just get it over with and delete this childish tit for tat response?
posted by Specklet to Etiquette/Policy at 2:43 PM (61 comments total)

This should go too, in the spirit of fairness.

I think Matt should charge people $5 for obviously crummy front page posts.
posted by Mark Doner at 2:48 PM on January 18, 2005


honestly, meta the boxer post if it bothers you so much, but don't crap on the front page.
posted by rks404 at 2:49 PM on January 18, 2005


Yes, they are both shitty posts and need to die.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 2:55 PM on January 18, 2005


Fairness: "Shape of World: Perspectives Differ"
posted by Freen at 2:55 PM on January 18, 2005


Bullshit, the Boxer post actually has some substance, Steve's response post is childish and stupid.
posted by fenriq at 2:57 PM on January 18, 2005


Yep. Steve, I personally think that your post sucked. Alot. And you know, I'm inclined to believe that perhaps, just maybe, you suck too. But the jury is still out.
posted by Freen at 3:01 PM on January 18, 2005


The SOL post was just thrown up there so that wise Stevie could show us all what a crap post looked like. And it was truly crappy, indeed.

The Boxer post, except for the typo, should stay. It's interesting and actually belongs on the front page.
posted by bshort at 3:05 PM on January 18, 2005


An internet petition, a transcript of the hearings that are the top news story all over the place, and a press release are not the best of the web IMHO, but mere agendafilter. But whatever, I'll just scroll past. Just wanted to note that I agree with Boxer but the post is still lacking in merit.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 3:10 PM on January 18, 2005


The Boxer post was an attempt in good faith to bring up a topic, albeit in a fairly mediocre manner. Steve on the other hand, was trying to be derogatory and trollish. In a fairly mediocre manner. Thus making Steve's post score significantly higher on the suck-o-meter.
posted by Freen at 3:14 PM on January 18, 2005


What fenriq and freen said. Done.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 3:16 PM on January 18, 2005


BEST OF THE WEB UNLESS IT FITS OUR GROUPTHINK AGENDA
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 3:17 PM on January 18, 2005


PinkStainlessTail, it wasn't the Boxer post I took umbrage with, it was Steve_at_Linnwood's response post.
posted by Specklet at 3:18 PM on January 18, 2005


You're misusing the term "groupthink." Just because there's a general consensus doesn't make it groupthink.
posted by Mayor Curley at 3:19 PM on January 18, 2005


S@Lly does even more damage to the right on MeFi than PP, so at least he serves a purpose. It's just sad to see the sharp decrease in conservative mental capacity in recent times. We need more kablams and pardonyou?s to provide interesting discourse.

On preview: it's gone. Thanks Matt.
posted by cosmonik at 3:19 PM on January 18, 2005


damage to the right

Are you kidding? I'm not here to defend or to prop up 'the right'.
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 3:20 PM on January 18, 2005


Steve - really, stop pissing in the pool. If you want to contribute something of substance, then that's awesome, but all you're doing lately is snarking and then crapping on the front page.

What's up with that?

GYOBFW
posted by bshort at 3:20 PM on January 18, 2005


For the life of me I can't figure S@L out, sometimes.

I agree with him on almost nothing politically, but in apolitical contexts and in #mefi, he comes across as genuinely nice guy with a decent sense of humor. But oftentimes here on the blue, he throws out some dumb, trollish posts and overly nasty comments. Not that it excuses people who like to use him as a tackling dummy, but that's a whole other story.

Steve, i know that there are plenty of shrill, confrontational leftists here and that they annoy you. They annoy me, too, but that's not the point. I assume you come to MeFi for a reason. After all if you just wanted to post right-wing screeds and bile all day and hear it applauded, you could hang out at Freep. But you don't and I suspect it's because you're too smart and decent to find that satisfying.

Mefi has had several lucid, intelligent conservative posters over the years: unclefes, aaron, Midas in his less bellicose moments, and I for one would welcome thoughtful conservative commentary here. I think you have the brains to provide it. Just because some people would like to use you as a punching bag, dosen't mean you have to walk into their hangout and say "You think you're tough, huh?" and then be surprised when they chase after you in a mob.

And I'm not saying you have to become overly stiff. Feel free to make a fart joke every once in a while just like the rest of us. But you're better than this.
posted by jonmc at 3:21 PM on January 18, 2005


S@L: The right appreciates that.
posted by xmutex at 3:21 PM on January 18, 2005


Specklet, I know. I was just tossing in my 2 cents. No1 sez it stays tho', so that's that.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 3:21 PM on January 18, 2005


Are you kidding? I never said, nor cared about, what you are or are not 'here for'.
posted by cosmonik at 3:22 PM on January 18, 2005


oh, add kablam, loquax, and krrlson to the list of MeFi conservatives who manage to not start brushfires. pardonyou is a good poster but would be pissed at being called conservative.
posted by jonmc at 3:23 PM on January 18, 2005


ah yes...krrlson and Midas most def. I thought Seth used to be okay, in discussions about Constitutional Law he was particularly informative, but lately he seems to act more like his castrated namesake.

FWIW, I thought for a bit for a better descriptor for pardonyou. 'conservative' does mislabel him. Apologies.
posted by cosmonik at 3:27 PM on January 18, 2005


the content of Steve's post was fine. I personally have no problem with it.

The childish schoolyard manner in which it was presented was far less than noble, but that doesn't mean the links were bad.
posted by auslander at 3:28 PM on January 18, 2005


it was very Seth of you to do that, Steve--i'm disappointed.
posted by amberglow at 3:30 PM on January 18, 2005


Stevie's lectures are increasingly less and less funny. and his fpp record, since he's so fond of 0-8 dumb snarks against new users, is worth, like, a small bucket of very small right-winger cocks.

I suppose he's trying to get himself banned and try to turn the ban into a political thing, asking for a spot on his local right-wing shock jock favorite program.

Steve, if you ever get banned by Matt it'll be because of your very low "acceptable content" vs "shit" ratio.

and your jokes are unfunny.

but I agree that you're not here to help the right -- you make the right look much, much dumber than it actually is.
posted by matteo at 3:33 PM on January 18, 2005


All that wanking in the boxer thread kinda gave me a chubby...

DENNY CRANE
posted by Dreamghost at 3:33 PM on January 18, 2005


"BEST OF THE WEB UNLESS IT FITS OUR GROUPTHINK AGENDA"

Or happens to be an agenda-filter, op-ed link deliberately attempting to mock a previous post that was wholly unrelated, well except that is pointed out quite effectively that Rice lied under oath. Somehow you think they are related. This is the reason Steve's post sucks.

Steve:
Try again. Don't snark. Present information, be willing to explain. Don't be an asshole and maybe people will listen to you and be civil to you.

There will certainly be people who won't be civil. You unfortunately are among them. No one pays any attention to them. No one pays any attention to you, other than highly negative, critical attention. I.E. My heartfelt belief that you really really suck.

But then again, you do suck. So well, go away. Or at least don't shout. No one, even ParisParamus likes people who shout.

He's here to keep the rabble in line
posted by Freen at 3:37 PM on January 18, 2005


The boxer post was more a request for a pat on the back than anything else; and unabashedly political. Less petty than S@L's, true, but so what.
posted by Mark Doner at 3:39 PM on January 18, 2005


his fpp record....is worth, like, a small bucket of very small right-winger cocks.

My heartfelt belief that you really really suck.

But then again, you do suck. So well, go away.


You know, Steve may sometimes "ask for" that kind of response, but that's no reason to give it to him. This goes to what I said in another MeTa thread about maybe not couching our comments and criticisms in ways that make people feel small and demeaned since it oftentimes only provokes people to come back twice as hard, thus turning everything into a shitfest.

Now, I know it can be emotionally satisfying to join a pile on of someone you dislike, especially since many of the pile-onners here were the ones wringing their hands over what happened to AlexReynolds. It was wrong when me and others did it there, and it's wrong here.

And I'd hate to have to cry hypocrisy...
posted by jonmc at 3:44 PM on January 18, 2005


Mark Doner: Um. Precisely the less petty part is the difference.

Plus usually you don't get to hear cabinet member called out like that nor have repeated snarking thread-jockey type behavior.
posted by Freen at 3:45 PM on January 18, 2005


What a pussy...
posted by SweetJesus at 3:49 PM on January 18, 2005


My point, Freen, was that despite being less lame than one of the worst posts ever, it still sucks. And having a little bit of amusement value doesn't make up for its obvious faults.
posted by Mark Doner at 3:51 PM on January 18, 2005


jonmc: He's been behaving particularly bad.

If this:
BEST OF THE WEB UNLESS IT FITS OUR GROUPTHINK AGENDA

is what he thinks of metafilter, and this is what he has to add, then frankly he is getting what he deserves. I saw what happened in the AlexReynolds thread. But shitting in the pool and then complaining about how shitty the pool is is beyond the pail for me.
posted by Freen at 3:51 PM on January 18, 2005


it was very Seth of you to do that, Steve--i'm disappointed.

amberglow, that comment redeemed this whole sad affair. I was mentally searching for a word to describe Steve's behavior and you just nailed it.
posted by nixerman at 3:53 PM on January 18, 2005


yup--beyond the pale too. ; >

Steve, if you really can't stand it that someone stood up to Rice at the hearings, you had ample opportunity to present evidence either damning Boxer (as someone did re: copyright) or praising Rice--you did neither.
posted by amberglow at 3:54 PM on January 18, 2005


Now, I know it can be emotionally satisfying to join a pile on of someone you dislike, especially since many of the pile-onners here were the ones wringing their hands over what happened to AlexReynolds. It was wrong when me and others did it there, and it's wrong here.

To quote Lincoln's inaugural speech without irony: "With malice toward none and charity for all."
posted by AlexReynolds at 3:56 PM on January 18, 2005


Fuck that! Malice toward all and charity for none.
posted by SweetJesus at 3:59 PM on January 18, 2005


jonmc: He's been behaving particularly bad.

Perhaps. But too many people seem to be enjoying this waaay to much for my tastes.

I can only speak from my own experience by I've always responded better to admonitions like "you can do better than this," or "cut it out, you're screwing up the thread for the rest of us." Personal attacks of the kind I'm seeing here bring out the "Oh yeah, I'll show you," in me. I imagine the same is true of steve.

So, if you want to improve the discourse, that's my suggestion. If you want to act like a bunch of kids in a schoolyard, carry on.

complaining about how shitty the pool is is beyond the pail for me.

He shit beyond the pail, and it wound up in the pool. That's shooting for distance, man.

On preview: Alex, I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or goofing on me. Probably just my own obtuseness, but I figured I'd ask.
posted by jonmc at 4:01 PM on January 18, 2005


if you really can't stand it that someone...

It is not a matter that I can't stand it. I am not the one(s) around here that can not handle opposing views. It is that this is not the place for it.

After the election, when Matt told troutfishing to knock off his stupidity it looked like things might, just might, get back normal (i.e. no more agendafilter). But I see that Matt's sympathies have let the place slide back to that crap.

Fine so be it.
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 4:02 PM on January 18, 2005


I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or goofing on me.

I'm agreeing with you.
posted by AlexReynolds at 4:03 PM on January 18, 2005


Steve, I thought the Boxer thread was weak, but if you thought it really merited a complaint, you should have made it here, rather than tossing a loaf on the front page. Even if your point is valid, it's lost in the animosity gained by such a display.

it was very Seth of you to do that, Steve--i'm disappointed.

Except that it wasn't. If it had been Seth, he would have come to MetaTalk and posted a 6 paragraph diatribe on why the Boxer thread signals the end of all that is good and pure about MetaFilter. Instead, he took a big steaming pile on the front page. We've been Linnwooded.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 4:05 PM on January 18, 2005


Cool. Beer Nut?

Steve, why don't you let Matt speak for himself before you make that assumption.
posted by jonmc at 4:05 PM on January 18, 2005


I am not the one(s) around here that can not handle opposing views.

The point is that you didn't offer an opposing view, just another brand of agendafilter.

Political allegiance is not akin to being a sports fan. It's about substantive issues. In this case, that Condaleeza Rice is a liar.
posted by felix betachat at 4:06 PM on January 18, 2005


Beer Nut?

Nah, I love the vino. Didn't you see Steve's photoshop work in The Thread?
posted by AlexReynolds at 4:08 PM on January 18, 2005


You're not interested in discussion Steve. You just come into threads that you dont like, and take a big dump.
posted by SweetJesus at 4:10 PM on January 18, 2005


Yeah. Sadly, I hate wine. I'm a bad Italian, I know. But I have some Tabasco Cheez-its.
posted by jonmc at 4:10 PM on January 18, 2005


I am not the one(s) around here that can not handle opposing views.

Judging from your actions around here, you're absolutely wrong on this. Any time anyone posts anything good or interesting that you disagree with you lose your shit and start complaining about the bias and the groupthink and the agendas and the whatnot.

You need to learn that some people have different opinions than you. And then you need to learn to be ok with that.

As it is you're just a shrill little boy who can't understand that people may not agree with you and who takes a dump whenever and wherever he feels that he's been wronged, or even disagreed-with.

Grow the fuck up, Steve.
posted by bshort at 4:20 PM on January 18, 2005


S@L @ 14:02 I am not the one(s) around here that can not handle opposing views.

S@L @ 13:17 BEST OF THE WEB UNLESS IT FITS OUR GROUPTHINK AGENDA

Reason is not your friend, Steve.

jmc, you hate wine? But it's got, like, alcohol in it.
posted by cosmonik at 4:26 PM on January 18, 2005


jmc, you hate wine? But it's got, like, alcohol in it.

yeah, once I was sitting in my corner bar and the woman next to me was having a glass of bugundy. The smell bugged me so much, i almost had to leave.

And steve, just to counter some of the scolds here, I offer some advice. Quit thinking of yourself as a lone conservative warrior in a death cage full of slavering-jawed lefty maniacs, because it just ain't the case. Think of yourself as just another guy with a point of view and I bet the temptation to fart in the elevator will diminish.
posted by jonmc at 4:31 PM on January 18, 2005


Sweet. *digs into Cheez-its*
posted by monju_bosatsu at 4:32 PM on January 18, 2005


Steve's post was just as good, if not better, than the one he objected to. They're both complete crap (which was his point).

There is no doubt in my mind if the first link had been posted as Go Rice Go it would have been deleted or completely destroyed with off topic comments.

But it's matt's site, and no one is without bias.
posted by justgary at 7:07 PM on January 18, 2005


justgary, history dosen't bear that out. mathowie has said repeatedly that he dosen't like ax-grinders, righty or lefty.
posted by jonmc at 8:01 PM on January 18, 2005


I'm convinced that S@L and Paris are hippie anarchist moles, bent on making conservatives look like ridiculous, delusional caricatures of themselves. Could we have some more rational, intelligent conservative posters please speak up and attempt to make their actual views be heard clearly over these belligerent loonies?
posted by majcher at 8:35 PM on January 18, 2005


justgary, history dosen't bear that out. mathowie has said repeatedly that he dosen't like ax-grinders, righty or lefty.

Well, if "lefty ax-grinder" were in the dictionary, you could use that post as an example. It and the resulting discussion are nothing but.

Matt has gone out of his way to be fair, no doubt, but he's human. I don't see how anyone could look at the first link and say it belongs on metafilter.

It's a crap post. The only difference is that Paris was trying to prove a point, which I'm sure matt can't allow. But on their own I don't see any difference, and no one has pointed out any in this thread either.
posted by justgary at 8:47 PM on January 18, 2005


Perhaps it's more apparent when ...one is without bias.
posted by y2karl at 5:47 AM on January 19, 2005


Big deal. Rice's integrity was questioned, and she was not-so-subtlely mocked. People do that all the time.
posted by dhoyt at 7:24 AM on January 19, 2005


Steve, have you ever considered applying for a job as a professional victim? You'd be fantastic!
posted by mosch at 8:05 AM on January 19, 2005


dhoyt - that's hysterical!
posted by rks404 at 10:43 AM on January 19, 2005


I can probably count the number of non-lefty (or right-leaning) MeFites on two hands. Regular MeFites, that is. PP, S@L, me...and a few more...right?
posted by davidmsc at 11:21 AM on January 19, 2005


it's a commie plot.
posted by amberglow at 11:38 AM on January 19, 2005


I can probably count the number of non-lefty (or right-leaning) MeFites on two hands.

Actually, I've been noticing more "non-lefties" around here since membership opened up, and the political threads seem to have gotten better (or at least to have become less of an echo chamber), for the most part. Not exactly consistently, mind you, but not exactly the 100+ comment pile-ons of yore either. Well, maybe with a few notable exceptions.

(My personal wish? Fewer one-liners or witty little jabs about anything in political threads. That's what makes them unreadable. The same jokes over and over again by the same people who think they're being oh so clever and original. That means no more Chimpy McAwol. Or Bumsfeld. Or useless comments like "We are at war with Eurasia, we've always been at war with Eurasia." You get the idea.)
posted by loquax at 11:40 AM on January 19, 2005


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