Links that inspire little or no discussion.

February 7, 2002 12:52 PM

Links that inspire little or no discussion. I don't generally play MeFi cop, and this is by no means the worst link I've ever seen, but it really doesn't generate any level of discussion, and frankly invites snarky attempts at wit. What should be foremost in a poster's mind: "Wow factor" or "Hey, I bet folks will want to talk about this"?
posted by kokogiak to Etiquette/Policy at 12:52 PM (29 comments total)

"I wish Ted Kennedy would just stop dating."

That's excellent.
posted by dong_resin at 12:57 PM on February 7, 2002

my grandmother lost one of her husbands when he fell asleep on the railroad tracks and was decapitated by an oncoming train.

We still have the newspaper clipping.
posted by bunnyfire at 12:59 PM on February 7, 2002

Bunnyfire - have you seen 'O Brother Where Art Thou'? That's what came to mind here.
posted by GriffX at 1:05 PM on February 7, 2002

While the train in question was not derailed, the thread most certainly was, so I'll post my question for bunnyfire here:

How does someone fall asleep on train tracks, exactly? I'm certain I've heard of similar instances before and, while I'm not trying to be insensitive, I don't understand why they'd be a (comfortable|ideal) place to sleep.
posted by Danelope at 1:10 PM on February 7, 2002

The thought- and discussion-provoking requirement is what separates MeFi from lesser community blogs. Oh, OK, Fark.
posted by luser at 1:13 PM on February 7, 2002

I once fell asleep/passed out next to train tracks (about a foot away). No alarm clock before or since will match my awakening the next morning.

My secret theory on people who "fall asleep" on train tracks: Suicide, or murder (killed beforehand, dumped on tracks). You just CAN'T mistake a 3-foot wide gravel bed between two 10" high metal rails for a comfortable place to sleep.
posted by luser at 1:17 PM on February 7, 2002

To griffx: to answer your question...as i type this, the soggy bottom boys are singing I Am a Man of Constant Sorrow in the background....in other words it is My Favorite Movie.

To Danelope: The only explanation I can come up with is he was drunk. It is also possible he had "help". I do know that my grandmother spent time in "the penitentiary", and had a tattoo. (it was filled in, so i have no idea who or what it was in honor of.)

I believe this was either my grandmother's second or third husband, out of a total of four. (mom was raised by an aunt...) She was widowed twice, divorced twice, and at the time of her death, in her early fifties, kept company with a married man. But she loved me to pieces.......

She never appreciated me finding and pouring out her liquor stash though.
posted by bunnyfire at 1:23 PM on February 7, 2002

As the discussion generated here seems to show - my belief that this post (Danelope's original post) would have generated no discussion seems to be wrong, I apologized already to danelope in email, and will say here that this was probably not the best thread to call out as an example, but I still think my original question is/was valid.
posted by kokogiak at 1:28 PM on February 7, 2002

While the train in question was not derailed, the thread most certainly was

Well, now you've derailed this thread, friend. kokogiak handled this exactly right, pointing from the orginal thread to MeTa. Your condescending little quip in response, Danelope, did as much to derail that thread as anyone else's.
posted by jpoulos at 1:31 PM on February 7, 2002

I was being deliberately obtuse by posting the (great) snark line from the MeFi thread, because I don't think kokogiak has a valid point, here.
How can one second guess what is discussion worthy?
I would stop coming here if this were every thread, but it seems unlikely that either the diverse readership who contribute posts, or Mathowie, would allow this.
posted by dong_resin at 1:47 PM on February 7, 2002

You just CAN'T mistake a 3-foot wide gravel bed between two 10" high metal rails for a comfortable place to sleep.

I fell asleep under a car once, back in my hoodlum days. Hardpack gravel driveway beneath me, face six inches from the oilpan, rust and crap from the frame falling in my hair and eyes and clothes. Next morning, car started up, I woke up, slid out from under just as casual as you please, car backed out and drove off. Never saw me, I'm certain. I may not have died had I not woken up, but I'd have lost a serious amount of skin minimum.

Which is to say, some places that appear to be rather unattractive sleeping spots in sober daylight can be viewed otherwise late, when deep in one's cups.
posted by UncleFes at 1:52 PM on February 7, 2002

It's okay for links to generate no discussion. It doesn't mean they're bad links - in fact I find my favorite links tend to have very little yammering appended to them.
posted by D at 3:02 PM on February 7, 2002

I don't generally play MeFi cop

That's right, kiddo. Just leave that to the professionals.
posted by MUD at 3:07 PM on February 7, 2002

I have an idea. How 'bout you people lay off the whole over-played, redundant "self-policing" fascination for a while and stop being so darn negative. How many potential discussions have been derailed, halted or prevented from even starting because of comments attacking the "Mefi-worthyness" (oh how I hate that phrase) of a post?
posted by tomorama at 3:21 PM on February 7, 2002

Read the guidelines before you comment on the validity of an FPP or STFU, friend

STFU? Let me get this straight, you're trying to convince people to see your point of view by telling the people that oppose you to "shut the fuck up?" I don't think that's the right way to convince anyone of anything on this site.

Also, aside from the editorial comments on the thread (uh, people there's a reason for metatalk), what's there to say about this post? It's definitely Oddly Enough news material more at home on fark. The entire story is a handful of sentences, I'd say it's not very disucssion worthy.

But then again, maybe I should just shut the fuck up.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 3:32 PM on February 7, 2002

Uh, people there's a reason for metatalk - okay, point taken, the editorializing didn't belong on the MeFi thread - but how do you best point people to a relevant MeTa thread?

I've seen some comments that just say "MeTa", with a link, others that say "whisper -> Meta", and some that say "take it to MetaTalk"... none of these look that transparent to me. What do newbies make of a link that just says "MeTa"? Maybe I'm just oversimplifying.
posted by kokogiak at 3:42 PM on February 7, 2002

Uh, people there's a reason for metatalk - okay, point taken, the editorializing didn't belong on the MeFi thread - but how do you best point people to a relevant MeTa thread?

Just make a new metatalk thread then post a single link to it, so everyone can discuss it there instead of on metafilter. There's a few editorial links on it now, and it was derailed as a result.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 3:44 PM on February 7, 2002

...you're trying to convince people to see your point of view...

No, Matt. I realized long ago that there is very little room to convince anyone of anything on MetaFilter, especially when it's an attempt to curb the self-righteous "duty of self-policing". As I stated in my (rather amicable) e-mail exchange with kokogiak, the validity of every other FPP is called into question in-thread, based solely on whichever MeFi Cop felt the content was 'lame' or 'not worthwhile' or [insert purely subjective statement here]. "Take it to MeTa" is often little more than an excuse to escalate the argument by giving complaintants a forum for expounding their hatred for said post.

People have gone to great lengths to point out that MeFi is a 'community weblog' and not a discussion board or a guestbook. I've never seen a weblog or weblog post that is everything to everyone and, as witnessed here and in MeFi, links that are dubbed unworthy of discussion sometimes generate discussion when given the opportunity.

I think it's clear to everyone that I disapprove of certain practices exercised on Metafilter, the most frequent response to this being "then don't visit Metafilter". I'll take that into consideration.
posted by Danelope at 4:10 PM on February 7, 2002

"Take it to MeTa" is often little more than an excuse to escalate the argument by giving complaintants a forum for expounding their hatred for said post.

So what? Who cares if someone hates your post? Let them go to MetaTalk with it, and leave the MeFi thread (almost) untouched. If your post is truly discussion-worthy, the thread will reflect that. If your detractor's complaint is bullshit, his MetaTalk thread will reflect *that*.

All this whining about "self-righteous" MeFi cops is nothing more than a by-product of thin skins and bruised egos.
posted by jpoulos at 4:19 PM on February 7, 2002

I'd agree wholeheartedly with jpoulos above.

While I agree that people discussing the validity of the link on metafilter itself is the worst thing about this site, a single link to discuss it on metatalk doesn't harm the post, and if it's good, it'll continue on over that, and people can discuss it elsewhere.

Frankly, I've had enough of "oddly enough" types of posts. There's nothing very interesting about a simple "man bites dog" story, nothing interesting to discuss, and espeically when the story linked is only a few sentences long.

I posted something a long time ago here and it was certainly an oddly enough link, but I came up with another angle, and gave it some context so it was about something other than just the simple goofy news link.

One could write a front page post about this new story, but add infromation about seat belts or train safety or something to bulk it up a bit. Otherwise, it's just wacky news more at home on fark.

No, Matt. I realized long ago that there is very little room to convince anyone of anything on MetaFilter

I think my use of the word "convince" was a poor choice, but you were trying to make a point that you were right and others were wrong, and in so doing, told all that disagree to "shut the fuck up." I don't think that attitude will go very far in any sort of community and just undermines whatever position you're taking.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 4:42 PM on February 7, 2002

Danelope, are you trying to tell the people who self-police the site to stop? What does that make you? Who appointed you? Because ~I know you wouldn't be self-righteous enough to try to tell other people what's okay to post~.
posted by daveadams at 4:48 PM on February 7, 2002

I'm not telling anyone to do anything, Dave. I'm defending my thoughts on those who arbitrarily draw the line between a 'good' FPP and a 'valid' post.

I may disagree or dislike what's posted to the front page of MetaFilter, but I possess the stunning ability to look past it in search of things that interest me, rather than starting a crusade against it.

Apparently, the only 'worthwhile' MeFi post is one that inspires dozens of people to comment, which flies in the face of the not-a-discussion-board crowd. Similarly, even if the post conforms to the established guidelines, its fate rests solely in the judgement of the select few MetaFilterati who deem all things worthy.

I apologize sincerely for having posted.
posted by Danelope at 5:13 PM on February 7, 2002

Apparently, the only 'worthwhile' MeFi post is one that inspires dozens of people to comment

That's not the only conclusion to draw. There are a few good posts today (the circular life among them) that aren't great discussion fodder, but they're interesting enough to stand on their own as links to something good.

If people are going to post links to news, I would hope they are links to interesting news and not just wacky things. Fark is the home of wacky links.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 5:43 PM on February 7, 2002

I forgot to comment on this:
which flies in the face of the not-a-discussion-board crowd

What I think people in the not-a-discussion-board camp mean (myself included most times), is that people shouldn't bring pointless links here to discuss things like so:

"I like movies. What movies do you like?"

That's a pure-discussion post, and it sucks. It appropriates metafilter as a mailing list for people to shoot the breeze.

At the other end of the spectrum is this:
Nude man handcuffs self to railing in a mall.

What's to discuss? Is that interesting? Does it cause anyone reading it to do anything besides perhaps a "wow, that's wacky" comment?

Half of the links on obscurestore.com could end up here on any given day, and unless there's something really interesting about them, or a bigger issue than just the subject of the news, I'd rather not see them on metafilter.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 5:49 PM on February 7, 2002

I apologize sincerely for having posted.

Danelope, you don't know how happy you've made MeFi's smug, self-appointed arbiters.
posted by KLAX at 6:53 PM on February 7, 2002

*Puts on smug, self-appointed arbiter costume (which, interestingly enough is a cardigan and one of those tweed jackets with patches on the elbows...no pants)*

Ahhhh! It just feels good!
posted by Kafkaesque at 7:08 PM on February 7, 2002

"the man was last seen walking slowly down the tracks, placing pancakes on the rails...."
posted by bunnyfire at 7:18 PM on February 7, 2002

nude man handcuffed to rail: "Hey buddy, got paperclip?"
posted by clavdivs at 7:57 PM on February 7, 2002

* Dances the Dance of the Smug Self-Appointed Arbiter *
posted by jpoulos at 8:04 PM on February 7, 2002