Let's hope the FBI understands sarcasm. November 7, 2006 1:40 PM   Subscribe

Let's hope the FBI understands sarcasm.
posted by fandango_matt to Bugs at 1:40 PM (40 comments total)

"I'm not an American, but I consider the American people to be my friends and would like, in a friendly sort of a way, to give you some advice of my own on what you should do during this hectic election season.

You need to go to your neighbourhood voting station. You need to take with you some gasoline (or another suitable accelerant), an ample store of ammunition and enough food to keep you alive during the siege that will follow.

You need to pour that gasoline out in the lobby of the church/school/whatever. You need to ignite it. Shoot some rounds into the air. Do not sleep until your government has been reduced to a pile of ashes, and the fat and blood of your arrogant national leaders runs down the gutters that line the killing fields of your urban warzone.

Then, you can start over. Try not to fuck it up again."
posted by kfx at 12:50 PM PST on November 7
posted by fandango_matt at 1:43 PM on November 7, 2006


what makes you think it was sarcasm?
posted by bob sarabia at 1:47 PM on November 7, 2006


Don't drag that shit to meta. Address the arguments. Tell the poster WHY the charred fat of your leaders shouldn't run down your gutters.
posted by Jimbob at 1:48 PM on November 7, 2006 [2 favorites]


And since we're here already, that post sucked.
posted by bob sarabia at 1:52 PM on November 7, 2006


That post was dumb, that comment was dumb. I despair for American, some days more than others.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 1:52 PM on November 7, 2006


I removed the comment because yeah it was really dumb.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 1:57 PM on November 7, 2006


This makes no damned sense. If the government has been reduced to a pile of ashes, where is the fat and the blood coming from? Or were there steps left out where we bleed and render them before incineration?

Please, people! Try to make your rants at least somewhat internally consistant!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:10 PM on November 7, 2006 [3 favorites]


If the government has been reduced to a pile of ashes, where is the fat and the blood coming from?

From the politicians. And just think -- with the ashes and fat, you can make soap!
posted by solid-one-love at 3:13 PM on November 7, 2006


I guess that'd be one way to clean house.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:16 PM on November 7, 2006


From the politicians. And just think -- with the ashes and fat, you can make soap!

And dynamite for the revolution, too?
posted by IronLizard at 3:27 PM on November 7, 2006


and he wonders why no one invites him to parties.
posted by th3ph17 at 3:29 PM on November 7, 2006


The post was lame and rightly deleted, but I fail to understand the reason for this callout. What is fandango_matt afraid of, exactly? That the FBI is going to read that call for bloody revolution and round us all up for extraordinary rendition? I thought that was the CIA's job.
Seriously, fandango, what was this about? Are you really afraid that having seditious comments on this interweb forum is dangerous? If so, the terrorists or the neo-cons or somebody like that has already won.
posted by nowonmai at 3:46 PM on November 7, 2006


Hell, we just imprisoned a guy for 40 years because he wrote down plans to blow shit up. He didn't have any money, or resources, or anything at all really except a computer full of documents saying what he was going to do ...
posted by bonaldi at 3:49 PM on November 7, 2006


That the FBI is going to read that call for bloody revolution and round us all up for extraordinary rendition?

Reasonable, more that the FBI is going to be humorousless and give Matt grief. Nobody needs unexpected love from the Feds, etc.
posted by cortex at 3:53 PM on November 7, 2006


humourousless? fuck this noise, I'm going home
posted by cortex at 3:53 PM on November 7, 2006


posted by nowonmai Seriously, fandango, what was this about? Are you really afraid that having seditious comments on this interweb forum is dangerous? If so, the terrorists or the neo-cons or somebody like that has already won.

You are aware threatening to kill elected officials and overthrow the government is a crime, yes?
posted by fandango_matt at 4:01 PM on November 7, 2006


I think it was an incitement, not a direct threat.
posted by Jimbob at 4:07 PM on November 7, 2006


Here, Jimbob:

§ 2385. Advocating overthrow of Government

Whoever knowingly or willfully advocates, abets, advises, or teaches the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying the government of the United States or the government of any State, Territory, District or Possession thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein, by force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of any such government; or

Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues, circulates, sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or attempts to do so; or

Whoever organizes or helps or attempts to organize any society, group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage the overthrow or destruction of any such government by force or violence; or becomes or is a member of, or affiliates with, any such society, group, or assembly of persons, knowing the purposes thereof—

Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both, and shall be ineligible for employment by the United States or any department or agency thereof, for the five years next following his conviction.

If two or more persons conspire to commit any offense named in this section, each shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both, and shall be ineligible for employment by the United States or any department or agency thereof, for the five years next following his conviction.

As used in this section, the terms “organizes” and “organize”, with respect to any society, group, or assembly of persons, include the recruiting of new members, the forming of new units, and the regrouping or expansion of existing clubs, classes, and other units of such society, group, or assembly of persons.

posted by fandango_matt at 4:13 PM on November 7, 2006


Cheney and Hastert are indeed overweight, but Bush, Rice and Rumsfeld appear to be in shape -- not much charred fat to speak of, even if MetaFilter's American users actually follow kfx's suggestion. it's not like Rush Limbaugh is part of the cabinet.

yet.
posted by matteo at 4:15 PM on November 7, 2006 [1 favorite]


Advocating overthrowing the government is, indeed, a serious crime. Hence, I always recommend the pitchout, instead.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:18 PM on November 7, 2006


fandango_matt : You are aware threatening to kill elected officials and overthrow the government is a crime, yes?

[Off topic] You know, I really wish this wasn't illegal. I mean how many times do we have to make some Jefferson reference with an implied *wink wink nudge nudge* before some clever Fed comes and asks us why we are stockpiling food and ammunition.

I always tell them that I'm planning on hosting a hunting party for three to four thousand really close friends who prefer to duck hunt with military grade small arms. The grenades, mortars and RPGs are for some tree stump related projects that I'm working on. And those aren't armored personnel carriers, they are off road vehicles. Because I'm extreme. To the max.

Those signs and pamphlets that say "Join the New American Revolution" are a misprint, it's supposed to be talking about the New American Evolution. It's a health club I'm starting... Our slogan is, uh, "Evolve into a better you", yeah that's it. Health club. Definitely.

And what do you mean "That looks like a retrofitted Gazelle attack helicopter?" What are you talking about? That's a sno-cone maker.

So yeah. My life would be much easier if it wasn't illegal. That's all I'm saying.

[/Off topic]
posted by quin at 4:31 PM on November 7, 2006 [1 favorite]


"That "looks like a retrofitted Gazelle attack helicopter?" What are you talking about? That's a sno-cone maker."

Drink the frozen Kool-Aid®. The revolution will be hella-iced.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:43 PM on November 7, 2006


...or heli-iced, even...
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:44 PM on November 7, 2006


Thanks, fandango_matt.
So kfx (if he is in the USA) did indeed commit a crime with that comment. I think that Mathowie would be off the hook for publishing the comment however, as he would need to do so "with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government" to be breaking the law.
posted by nowonmai at 4:52 PM on November 7, 2006


mathowie is totally off-the-hook. Totally!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:57 PM on November 7, 2006


From the politicians. And just think -- with the ashes and fat, you can make soap!

and if in the rubble, you happen to find an intact ass, you can make a hat1
posted by jonmc at 4:58 PM on November 7, 2006


I think the more salient point is the one made by cortex. Put yourself in Mathowie's shoes and remember the FBI and the Secret Service probably don't find kfx's idiotic remark as funny or flip as kfx did.
posted by fandango_matt at 5:02 PM on November 7, 2006


So if kfx really did commit a crime by saying what he said, did #1 destroy evidence by removing the comment?
posted by popechunk at 7:28 PM on November 7, 2006


Oh well, someone beat me to the Jefferson quote already.
posted by clevershark at 7:46 PM on November 7, 2006


You are all under arrest.
posted by TwelveTwo at 8:04 PM on November 7, 2006


The thing about kfx is, apart from his awful pretentions as a writer, he always waits about five, ten minutes, comes back and undermines himself.

I bet if he'd been able, he'd have posted something whiny like "guys, don't hate me, I was being satirical".
posted by AmbroseChapel at 8:37 PM on November 7, 2006


delete it for being dumb-assed "liberal" chicken-hawking.

Try not to spill soda on your Mao t-shirt while you advocate violence from behind a keyboard.
posted by drjimmy11 at 8:37 PM on November 7, 2006


Doesn't it seem rather odd that the original comment was deleted, but it remains here in this thread? If it's illegal, it's still illegal.

Sedition and incitement to riot are not protected speech under the First Amendment, and the "Just a joke" defense is a bit weak in cases like this. Probably better to at least severely abridge the first post of this thread, if not to delete the entire thread outright.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 8:39 PM on November 7, 2006


If kfx wants to advocate the overthrow of the American government, good for him. That will put him in a club with about a billion other worldwide members.

As per usual some blowhards are making a big deal out of a stupid, nothing comment. They should go take their medications and watch some porn. Maybe then they can stop using MeTa to jack off.
posted by Tacos Are Pretty Great at 9:08 PM on November 7, 2006 [2 favorites]


since we're all insane, let me ask this question:

In what country besides america (since kfx is not american, as his post says) is it illegal to tell people in america to revolt?

now, mathowie's decision to delete comment and post makes perfect sense. but as far as the legality is concerned...
posted by shmegegge at 9:39 PM on November 7, 2006


in fact, let me go as far as this:

I'd like to give everyone in Uruguay some advice, because i love them. Set the lobbies of your voting places on fire and fire some rounds into the air. Revolt.

First one to arrest me gets a cookie.
posted by shmegegge at 9:42 PM on November 7, 2006


More illegal speech:

[W]henever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness... [W]hen a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

Arrest those bastards!
posted by languagehat at 6:27 AM on November 8, 2006 [2 favorites]


Doesn't it seem rather odd that the original comment was deleted, but it remains here in this thread? If it's illegal, it's still illegal.

We can draw a distinction between using words and mentioning words--called, somewhat uncreatively, the use/mention distinction. If I make a statement about apples, I use my words to refer to the fruit. If I make a statement about "apples", I mention the fruit, but can intend to refer to the word used to describe the fruit. In this case, fandango_matt quoted the kfx passage; the discussion in this thread is about the words kfx used and the context in which he used them, not about the actions he suggests.

This is why if you hear someone threaten to kill someone else and you tell your buddy, "I heard that guy say, 'I'm gonna stab you in the face!'", the cops don't arrest you for criminal menacing.
posted by Kwine at 7:20 AM on November 8, 2006


Whether or not he can be brought to understand it at this time, whether you intended it or not, kfx is very lucky to have someone acting in his interests the way you did with these merciful deletions, mathowie.
posted by jamjam at 10:53 AM on November 8, 2006


I see consent being manufactured through the weapons of alleged "dumbness".

Governments should be afraid of their people.
posted by meehawl at 5:43 AM on December 7, 2006


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