Politics on slashdot instead of here. September 7, 2004 10:43 AM   Subscribe

In lieu of http://politics.metafilter.com, there is now http://politics.slashdot.org.
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood to Feature Requests at 10:43 AM (60 comments total)

Being that most of those discussions have about 500+ comments using a point system, it will be nearly impossible to have my ego stroked as easily as it does here. It's kind of like how I'd vote if more people knew I was doing it.
posted by Stan Chin at 10:48 AM on September 7, 2004


But, isn't that what devoter.com is kind of trying to be, without all the mess of slashdot?
posted by thatothrgirl at 10:49 AM on September 7, 2004


what thatothrgirl said
posted by matteo at 11:04 AM on September 7, 2004


I'm guessing by "politics" they mean "US politics". You know, judging by the flags and all. Oh, and Devoter has a little US flag too. This sucks.
posted by reklaw at 11:12 AM on September 7, 2004


Does this mean you'll stop posting in the crappy political FPPs?
posted by mosch at 11:20 AM on September 7, 2004


How about all the US politics go to those two sites? Then, that leaves world issues to be discussed on Metafilter in rational style, 'cos all the snarky yanks are over there.

Result!
posted by dash_slot- at 11:59 AM on September 7, 2004


No one's going to stop posting crappy political FPPs--the question is moot. Certain users crave the attention too badly, revel in the resulting circle-jerk too enthusiastically, push for the Clear Channelification of MetaFilter too stubbornly, and require the approval of their peers too desperately to stop.
posted by dhoyt at 12:05 PM on September 7, 2004


Ironic that one of the more political knuckleheads on this site is pushing for us to move political discussions elsewhere.
posted by crunchland at 12:31 PM on September 7, 2004


If political posts are not your cup of tea, don't read them and don't post in them. Or, you [all] might actually try to raise the level of debate. Not to be an ass, but is this too hard?
posted by plemeljr at 12:39 PM on September 7, 2004


I like the devoter idea and backend, but the design is awful for the intended purpose of the site. It would be nice for a static information site, but not for one that is meant to be read again and again.
posted by cell divide at 12:39 PM on September 7, 2004


True. All the Devotion and Slashdottery in the world won't push Newsfilter, Politifilter, Ira*filter, I/P/Filter, (I omitted your favorite on purpose) off the blue, and you'd be a fool and a communist to think otherwise.
posted by chicobangs at 12:42 PM on September 7, 2004


I've never before heard that argument before, plemeljr!
posted by trharlan at 12:43 PM on September 7, 2004


If complaints about political posts are not your cup of tea, why don't you just ignore those comments and carry on the thread around them?
posted by sebas at 12:48 PM on September 7, 2004


sebas - that would be far too sensible.
posted by falconred at 1:03 PM on September 7, 2004


sebas, I know that was in jest, but complaints in threads, along with their associated derailing of a thread is more detrimental than a handful of PoliticalFilter. I everyone had a little restraint, things might be a bit better here. But come on, crap like this from FreedomParamus just ads noise to a thread that was operating more or less in a hospitable manner. And yes, I know that (even to me) I sound like a broken record, but can we all get a little reality check here?
posted by plemeljr at 1:04 PM on September 7, 2004


The fact that you label his comments "crap", and the proceed to call him names (FreedomParamus) shows far too much about your own character. Try showing restraint with the insults and then perhaps your comments would hold water.
posted by BlueTrain at 1:17 PM on September 7, 2004


From what I said in the Blue:

I say just keep it as it is, but have a News/Polifilter category, and allow the option of filtering the filters through customization.
posted by bitpart at 1:48 PM on September 7, 2004


I think this kind of separation of topics in two different addresses would be useless . I like the fact that if I open the metafilter frontpage I'm greeted by links of many kinds that are posted by individuals with different interests , unedited by Matt ,as far as I know, unless it's a double post.

That's unlike other blogs like Slashdot, in which afaik the link must be technology related and it could be filtered just because the editor didn't deem it to be frontpage worthy and it's also unlike kuro5shin in which people vote which story goes on which doesn't.

I see metafilter as and endless graffiti wall on which people write what they think is noteworthy ; so given that now some people think politics currently is an hot topic I get to see what they deem to be politically noteworthy without somebody censoring a link because it leans the side the boss doesn't like (pro-corporate media and some extremist political blog come to mind).

As for the level of the political discussion ongoing, I think it has it highs and lows, unfortunately mostly lows in the rethoric field.
posted by elpapacito at 1:53 PM on September 7, 2004


If political posts are not your cup of tea, don't read them and don't post in them. Or, you [all] might actually try to raise the level of debate. Not to be an ass, but is this too hard?

It's getting to be. Those posts breed faster than tribbles.
posted by Salmonberry at 1:58 PM on September 7, 2004


Oh fie! The innarnet contains certain topics I don't much care for. Therefore they must not enter my sphere! Lest I shall whine and bitch about it like a fucking broken minstrel for evermore making mine whining far worse than even the most bottom-dwelling of the topics that I care not for.

Just to make the point, like.
posted by i_cola at 2:17 PM on September 7, 2004


The nice thing about slashdot is that you can turn off certain categories of stories. And they've had that for years.
posted by smackfu at 2:46 PM on September 7, 2004


I think we should all use this metatalk post as a unique opportunity to put this newsfilter thing to rest once and for all.
posted by mcsweetie at 3:30 PM on September 7, 2004


Hahaha! Nice one ;-)
posted by i_cola at 3:33 PM on September 7, 2004


Could you please not walk on that carpet?
posted by majick at 4:09 PM on September 7, 2004


BlueTrain: The fact that you label his comments "crap", and the proceed to call him names (FreedomParamus) shows far too much about your own character. Try showing restraint with the insults and then perhaps your comments would hold water.

So I take it you'd be positively outraged to hear that another MeFite called a Gulf War veteran (not to mention plenty of other people in the thread) an asshole and a cocksucker? What would that say about his character? Or is your tut-tutting reserved only for names being slung at the delicate flower that is ParisParamus?
posted by scody at 4:28 PM on September 7, 2004


scody, this has been said about ParisParamus countless times, yet people still engage his obviously inflammatory rhetoric, just to feed their own, massive "liberal" egos...but I will repeat what has been said regarding Paris for your benefit:

Do not feed the trolls.

If a comment is so obviously over-the-top, your best response is to ignore it. Yet every single day people engage ParisParamus in political threads, thinking that they will be the one to change him. For all the bitching regarding ParisParamus's ego, seems to me that all those who bluster back at him suffer a similar fate.
posted by BlueTrain at 5:24 PM on September 7, 2004


The best way to deal with paramus is to ask him a specific question he can't answer and pin him down on it, Wulfgar! being the best at this.
posted by Space Coyote at 5:34 PM on September 7, 2004


ust to feed their own, massive "liberal" egos

I'm familiar with massive, but what is a liberal ego?
posted by juiceCake at 5:36 PM on September 7, 2004


BlueTrain, evidently you misunderstand (either that, or you're side-stepping the question). I agree that ParisParamus is a troll of Brothers Grimm propotions. However, it's not ParisParamus who called Jackspace and others cocksuckers and assholes in that thread -- it's Witty, who said so in part because others were disagreeing with PP (i.e., claiming that arguments with PP are the reason why "Mefi doesn't do politics well") and in part because they were arguing a position he (Witty) and PP disagree with (i.e., that the current war is unjustified).

So I ask again: is your tut-tutting over namecalling only reserved for people (i.e., The Dread MeFi Liberal Cabal) whose buttons get pushed by PP, or for anyone who -- to paraphrase your earlier comment -- fails to show restraint? Because I'd really like to know what you think when a conservative member of this community (who is not PP) calls someone a cocksucker for holding a position he disagrees with. I mean, since you're such a defender of restrained discourse and all. (Or would condeming Witty just be considered "feeding the troll"? In other words: liberals should be held to a strict standard of reasoned, measured discourse, but when conservatives start foaming at the mouth, it's best to shrug it off? You know, like when Dick Cheney gets a little hot under the collar on the Senate floor...)
posted by scody at 5:58 PM on September 7, 2004


Apologies for not clicking on your link. I should have. Witty was out of line. Call him out in MeTa or move on...

Quite frankly, political leanings don't mean much to me anymore. I'm harder on "liberals" because I identify with their issues and despise rhetoric over logic, which I read here quite often. So to suggest that I hold "liberals" to a higher standard than "conservatives" is true...because there are a hell of a lot more self-proclaimed liberals here, and many of the "conservatives" here are cranks who take pride in pissing ya'll off, which works beautifully I've noticed.

BTW, I should make it clear that I don't believe that Paris is a troll. When I refer to "trolls", I'm referring to comments, not people. At several points I was considered a troll for good reason. But like me, I don't believe Paris is a terrible guy. He just knows the average liberal MeFite's button and can't help but push it, repetitively.
posted by BlueTrain at 6:14 PM on September 7, 2004


He just knows the average liberal MeFite's button and can't help but push it, repetitively.

Because that's a real intelligent, sensible and dare I say "conservative" way to act... By the way, isn't believing someone "can't help" but do something a liberal way of thinking? Surely conservatives believe people are responsible for and should be punished for their own actions...?
posted by Jimbob at 6:44 PM on September 7, 2004


Paris is a Mets fan. Leave him be. He's depraved on account he's deprived.
posted by languagehat at 6:59 PM on September 7, 2004


when it comes to cocksuckers and assholes, i always rely on Witty®
posted by quonsar at 8:52 PM on September 7, 2004 [1 favorite]


i was on vacation for the last week or so and now fruit flies have taken over my apartment.
posted by eastlakestandard at 9:29 PM on September 7, 2004


good god! depeche mode is awful!
posted by mcsweetie at 9:40 PM on September 7, 2004


If we're talking about Witty, then this deserves to be said again here.

People aren't allowed to just say what they think and feel unless they're anti-Bush and/or anti-war. If they do open their mouth, they'd better be an expert in foriegn policy, global economics and international law in order to justify their position or it just isn't good enough for Mefi's left. Yet, all that's necessary for the majority of you is a silly quip about George or any emotionally charge condemnation of the Bush administration and you're in the club, one of the gang.

Sure, there are many contributors who have tons of links and facts about this and that, that help backup their position... and that's fantastic. But the majority don't, on both sides, and they should still be allowed to freely express their opinion unhindered and insult-free. But that doesn't hold true for people like PP or DD or any of the handful of minority viewpoints around here. They get blasted at the first mention of an unpopular position.


I wonder how many times someone has wanted to participate in a political thread but has feared being not corrected, or dismissed, but viciously and relentlessly mocked.
posted by loquax at 9:40 PM on September 7, 2004


(Sorry about posting this on the Blue, I was in too much of a hurry today to read Metatalk, I triple dog searched and of course didn't come up... Yet another in my long line of FPP failures.

In my defense I know that some of the most egregious politics newsfilter posters don't read MetaTalk, but then again they'd probably never read politics.metafilter.com either.

That said... I can't believe that with all of the potential snark that is MeFi that no one mentioned the color scheme of politics.slashdot.org... I mean come on people the IT khaki color was fodder on its first day...

Also... to appease the denizens of the non US of A MeFi cabal... I would have suggested that Matt figure out when the voting days were for the various countries in the world, and change the colors that month to match the flag du jour... it's a patriotic pony. Instead I'll just crawl back under my rock and shut up.)

posted by togdon at 9:55 PM on September 7, 2004


>http://politics.slashdot.org.

So what? Its just a slashdot subdomain, articles in that section still get promoted to the front page. There is also a games, linux, bsd, etc subdomains.

Or are our token rightly information controllers trying to suggest politics be taken off the front page, be put somewhere where casual visitors can't find it, and just turn on Fox News and nod in unison with them? Of course you guys are.
posted by skallas at 9:57 PM on September 7, 2004


Take comfort, friends--we are friends here, aren't we?--in that no matter how badly MetaFilter might fare at political discussion, Slashdot will fare much, much worse.
posted by kjh at 2:25 AM on September 8, 2004


Isn't it homophobic for a man to be offended when he is called a cocksucker? What is the latest politically correct take on this?
posted by SpaceCadet at 2:54 AM on September 8, 2004


SpaceCadet:
I doubt it - it's conceivable [hehehe] that there are gay men who dislike performing fellatio. Why is 'cocksucker' something only men are called: surely, statistically*, more [straight] women cocksuck than any men, gay or straight? It may depend on things like your take on being called any names at all.

Many a time and oft have I heard it said on Mefi that the free speech we enjoy does not protect anyone from being offended: I never had any such right anyway, as far as I can tell. But we are allegedly a community: and we mostly enjoy certain democratic rights in our home lands. That esentially includes protecting the diversity of opinion, not assuming a malign intent on all who disagree with you.

Shouldn't we refrain from verbal abuse [whether it be cocksucker, nigger, redneck, slut - whatever], simply because discourse is more efficient that way? Because your point is more easily understood, that way [and isn't that the whole point - to get your opinion understood?]

I have argued similarly before, not just on Mefi, but those plain speaking yanks keep peppering the screen with their expletives. Is it just me, or does it seem that other nationalities tend to be less aggressive, threatening, abusive and rude?

*Back of the envelope: 5% of men are gay, of whom 80% fellate = 4% of men are cocksuckers [give or take the minority of 'straight' men who cocksuck]; if any proportion of women higher than say 5% fellate, it's them who should be deemed 'cocksucker'.
posted by dash_slot- at 4:59 AM on September 8, 2004


Wait, wait, wait, you mean they put in .. in their MOUTH? I'm shocked.
posted by Space Coyote at 6:09 AM on September 8, 2004


Why is 'cocksucker' something only men are called: surely, statistically*, more [straight] women cocksuck than any men, gay or straight?

.....because it's offensive in that it is insinuating (in a homophobic way) that the person being called a "cocksucker" is a gay (my take on it). Calling a woman a cocksucker is like calling a guy a "pussyfucker".
posted by SpaceCadet at 7:28 AM on September 8, 2004


I think the real reason "cocksucker" is an insult is that it's because of cocksuckers that MeFi doesn't do politics well.
posted by soyjoy at 8:03 AM on September 8, 2004


well, I'll stop sucking cocks if you guys think it will help.
posted by mcsweetie at 8:23 AM on September 8, 2004


O-o-o-kay, soyboy, that's a statement that rightfully deserves "being not corrected, or dismissed, but viciously and relentlessly mocked."


Soysucker.
posted by wendell at 8:26 AM on September 8, 2004


scratch that, I refuse to stop sucking cocks!
posted by mcsweetie at 8:26 AM on September 8, 2004


And, besides, the people with the worst attitudes are most often the "cock-suckees".
posted by wendell at 8:28 AM on September 8, 2004


I think it's sad that so many of you can't deal with humor being used to make a point (or to combat mirror-image idiocy) when it doesn't support your point of view. It's also incredibly cheap to label me a troll.
posted by ParisParamus at 8:32 AM on September 8, 2004


No, it's not.
posted by mr.marx at 8:45 AM on September 8, 2004


I thought a troll was a big hairy thing that lived under bridges in Norway.
posted by SpaceCadet at 9:00 AM on September 8, 2004


So what's the difference between ParisParamus and, say, nofundy? 'Cause I sure as hell don't see one.
posted by darukaru at 9:27 AM on September 8, 2004


darukaru, most folks around here agree with nofundy's talking points, as opposed to ParisParamus. Duh. Imply that Bush should be murdered and everything is peachy. Imply that Kerry is a coward and you're a heathen.

Oh wait, yours was a rhetorical question.
posted by BlueTrain at 9:36 AM on September 8, 2004


Paramus, witty himself would tell you that he was plainly pissed off and lashing out, and not trying to be funny. Can't hand-wave away this one, either.

Someone else who use the "just joking" defense.
posted by Space Coyote at 9:59 AM on September 8, 2004


Troll is an almost meaningless word these days.

Some people say 'take the insults with a smile', to paraphrase PP. Most others say that when you insult your opponents, you've lost the debate. Sadly, a good number of those pay only lipservice to that guideline, applying that rule only to their opponents - which leads to charges of hypocrisy and an escalation of the abuse. I don't see it getting better in this political season.

I have no idea whether there is something in the contemporary american male psyche that forces this to occur more with them than, say, europeans - is life so aggressive & competitive , or education so poor that insults and namecalling is triggered so quickly, and is so defensible by saying - 'It's just a joke, get over it'? I do not think those are comedic attacks, it's more personal stuff - and the escalation is swift. Maybe it's always been like that.

I admit that this is broad brush generalisations - there are placid and humble yanks, there are stroppy and arrogant euros/canucks/whoevers - but it is my impression. Note that I don't think all americans are like this.

If I'm right then I doubt that there is a solution, without the Swift and Just Hand of Matt wielding the Eternal and Merciless Loss of Membership.
posted by dash_slot- at 10:12 AM on September 8, 2004


that's a statement that rightfully deserves "being not corrected, or dismissed, but viciously and relentlessly mocked."

Er, yeah... that's... why... I was doing so, wendell.
posted by soyjoy at 11:07 AM on September 8, 2004


Hey, I was "just joking", soybean.

(Talk about sucking the joy out of the room)
posted by wendell at 11:43 AM on September 8, 2004


our token rightly information controllers

You've got to be kidding.
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 12:36 PM on September 8, 2004


(Talk about sucking the joy out of the room)

Yep - I admit it, I'm a joysucker! Now I've got a big ol' mouthful of joy. C'mere, you.

posted by soyjoy at 1:36 PM on September 8, 2004

"scratch that, I refuse to stop sucking cocks!"—mcsweetie
Me, too!

Mmm, hmph, mmph.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 11:05 PM on September 8, 2004


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