Have you heard of MetaChat? September 14, 2015 11:56 AM Subscribe
"MetaChat is an informal place for MeFites to touch base and post, discuss and chatter about topics that may not belong on MetaFilter." It's less structured than MetaFilter, often with posts about things going on the poster's life, things that annoy the poster, the poster's favorite band, etc. Once pretty darn lively, it has slowed down over the past few years, and we're trying to liven things up. C'mon by and contribute to the last-half-of-September Postathon!
For anybody who doesn't know this fact: MetaChat is a different thing from Metafilter's onsite Chat section. MetaChat is a separate site, with its own history and leadership and culture and whatnot, and folks who don't know it should go check it out.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 12:21 PM on September 14, 2015 [9 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 12:21 PM on September 14, 2015 [9 favorites]
And you'll find new user guidelines there, so take a look if you're curious about what it is. It works differently from MeFi. Posting is totally low-stakes; you can post about what's for lunch. But it shares a lot of community members with MeFi. If MeFi is an online city, MetaChat is one of its neighborhood coffee houses.
posted by Miko at 12:24 PM on September 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by Miko at 12:24 PM on September 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
I signed up but if the New User Approval Committee really takes up to 12 hours my ADD-infested brain will probably move on to something more shiny.
posted by bondcliff at 12:27 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by bondcliff at 12:27 PM on September 14, 2015
If MetaFilter is a ______________ , MetaChat is a ______________
posted by Wolfdog at 12:31 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by Wolfdog at 12:31 PM on September 14, 2015
For all you newbies, here are some traditions that you can create or participate in:
The 3-point update thread
The OMG bunny thread
The Photo Friday thread
THE SHOUTING THREAD
The Friday Question thread
Here is a famous thread that was so good it made it to MeTa.
MeCha really does have an awesome history, and I too am sad that it has declined. It's a great place to talk about MetaFilter stuff or just anything else, really.
posted by Melismata at 12:36 PM on September 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
The 3-point update thread
The OMG bunny thread
The Photo Friday thread
THE SHOUTING THREAD
The Friday Question thread
Here is a famous thread that was so good it made it to MeTa.
MeCha really does have an awesome history, and I too am sad that it has declined. It's a great place to talk about MetaFilter stuff or just anything else, really.
posted by Melismata at 12:36 PM on September 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
I rarely try to take credit for anything, but it appears my MetaChat.org post on Saturday with the wording "Have we become so inactive here that The Other Meta gets an OMG BUNNY post?"* seems to have triggered the revival.
For the record, as a participant in both, I'm always going to refer with the 'longform' names to MetaChat.org and Chat.Metafilter to avoid confusion... of course, there is the previously used 'shortform' for MetaChat.org, "MeCha", but I am always so tempted to add two more "Cha"s to it, or just visualize what Chairface Chippendale wrote on the moon on "The Tick" cartoon.
*OMG BUNNY is the longtime meme on MetaChat.org, started by a post about the "giant pink bunny on the hill" and leading to many posts just to point out especially cute or weird pictures of bunnies online (of which I contributed a semi-embarrassing large number of). And we are about a week away from the 10th anniversary of that first OMG BUNNY. OMG!
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:41 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
For the record, as a participant in both, I'm always going to refer with the 'longform' names to MetaChat.org and Chat.Metafilter to avoid confusion... of course, there is the previously used 'shortform' for MetaChat.org, "MeCha", but I am always so tempted to add two more "Cha"s to it, or just visualize what Chairface Chippendale wrote on the moon on "The Tick" cartoon.
*OMG BUNNY is the longtime meme on MetaChat.org, started by a post about the "giant pink bunny on the hill" and leading to many posts just to point out especially cute or weird pictures of bunnies online (of which I contributed a semi-embarrassing large number of). And we are about a week away from the 10th anniversary of that first OMG BUNNY. OMG!
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:41 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
Trufax: I was on MetaChat before I joined MetaFilter, and it was all jonmc's fault.
Personally speaking, Real Life troubles took me away from several online friendships (including MetaChat) and getting back to those is one of the EL things I'm working on via the Crone Island slack. Hmm.... maybe if we turned MetaChat into a Slack, it would be easier and more fun to do?
posted by TrishaLynn at 12:51 PM on September 14, 2015 [3 favorites]
Personally speaking, Real Life troubles took me away from several online friendships (including MetaChat) and getting back to those is one of the EL things I'm working on via the Crone Island slack. Hmm.... maybe if we turned MetaChat into a Slack, it would be easier and more fun to do?
posted by TrishaLynn at 12:51 PM on September 14, 2015 [3 favorites]
I haven't visited MeCha in a few years because at a certain point it just seemed to ... stop being.
Thanks for reminding me to check in over there. I liked the community.
posted by mykescipark at 12:58 PM on September 14, 2015
Thanks for reminding me to check in over there. I liked the community.
posted by mykescipark at 12:58 PM on September 14, 2015
oneswellfoop: " I'm always going to refer with the 'longform' names to MetaChat.org and Chat.Metafilter to avoid confusion..."
I've always gone with MetaChat for metachat.org and ChatFilter for chat.metafilter.com. Not that I've been on either in a while...
posted by Rock Steady at 1:18 PM on September 14, 2015
I've always gone with MetaChat for metachat.org and ChatFilter for chat.metafilter.com. Not that I've been on either in a while...
posted by Rock Steady at 1:18 PM on September 14, 2015
I signed up but if the New User Approval Committee ...
I don't remember there being a "New User Approval Committee."
Why was that instituted?
posted by jamjam at 1:20 PM on September 14, 2015
I don't remember there being a "New User Approval Committee."
Why was that instituted?
posted by jamjam at 1:20 PM on September 14, 2015
I don't remember there being a "New User Approval Committee."
I was kidding. As far as I know, there's not really a committee. It did tell me that signups need to be approved and it could take up to 12 hours though. That's certainly understandable.
posted by bondcliff at 1:21 PM on September 14, 2015
I was kidding. As far as I know, there's not really a committee. It did tell me that signups need to be approved and it could take up to 12 hours though. That's certainly understandable.
posted by bondcliff at 1:21 PM on September 14, 2015
I think I applied once and I never heard anything back, so I decided to let it drop as I wasn't all that keen after all.
posted by Too-Ticky at 1:56 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by Too-Ticky at 1:56 PM on September 14, 2015
Those domestic violence jokes sure are classy.
posted by transitional procedures at 2:05 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by transitional procedures at 2:05 PM on September 14, 2015
I was able to log in after whatever many years (didn't even know I had an account), but when I tried to post a comment I got this error:
Kometten Verbotten: Blocked!
Confused.
posted by univac at 2:08 PM on September 14, 2015
Kometten Verbotten: Blocked!
Confused.
posted by univac at 2:08 PM on September 14, 2015
Those domestic violence jokes sure are classy.
http://metachat.org/index.php/2006/06/14...
The past is a foreign country.
Seriously, go take a look at any given MetaFilter thread from 2006 and be astonished at the kind of jokes and scabrous commentary we used to consider kosher back then. It's not just a Metachat thing.
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:00 PM on September 14, 2015 [9 favorites]
http://metachat.org/index.php/2006/06/14...
The past is a foreign country.
Seriously, go take a look at any given MetaFilter thread from 2006 and be astonished at the kind of jokes and scabrous commentary we used to consider kosher back then. It's not just a Metachat thing.
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:00 PM on September 14, 2015 [9 favorites]
Ahh, I thought those were recent.
My mistake.
And yes, as a long time lurker, the site culture has certainly changed for the positive in the last 9 years.
posted by transitional procedures at 3:05 PM on September 14, 2015
My mistake.
And yes, as a long time lurker, the site culture has certainly changed for the positive in the last 9 years.
posted by transitional procedures at 3:05 PM on September 14, 2015
It's a great place to talk about MetaFilter
Hate to be a wet blanket, but...not really. MetaChat was started as a chatty offshoot of MetaFilter, but it also committed early on to not being a backchannel place to gossip or beef about MetaFilter. That would be a bad dynamic and not one to encourage - the occasional mention is ok, but not extended commentary. Do check out the user guidelines:
Hate to be a wet blanket, but...not really. MetaChat was started as a chatty offshoot of MetaFilter, but it also committed early on to not being a backchannel place to gossip or beef about MetaFilter. That would be a bad dynamic and not one to encourage - the occasional mention is ok, but not extended commentary. Do check out the user guidelines:
Offsite issues stay offsite. Some MetaChatters know each other offsite, and most of that is none of MetaChat’s business. We know y'all go to meetups and toast marshmallows and get married and get up to all kinds of wild stuff. But there are occasionally times where interactions offsite overflow onto the site in a negative way. In those cases, moderators will address the problem. This site is not a place to target someone for harassment or to carry over real-life grudges. Evidence of that kind of behavior (stalking, ongoing nitpicking, harassment) may be cause for banning. This applies also to MetaFilter issues: they belong on MetaFilter, not here. A good relationship with MetaFilter is important to MetaChat.posted by Miko at 3:10 PM on September 14, 2015 [3 favorites]
the first time i went to metachat someone glomped me and i never felt the need to return.
posted by poffin boffin at 3:18 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by poffin boffin at 3:18 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
New user signups can take a little bit because I and only I am approving them and making sure new users are not spammers. And I have a job and a kid and am not always online.
If you want to make sure it goes quickly, then sign up with your mefi username.
posted by gaspode at 3:23 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
If you want to make sure it goes quickly, then sign up with your mefi username.
posted by gaspode at 3:23 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
someone glomped me and i never felt the need to return.
*glomp*
posted by Wolfdog at 4:12 PM on September 14, 2015
*glomp*
posted by Wolfdog at 4:12 PM on September 14, 2015
I can't count the number of times I've been glomped. But then "enjoys glomping" is in my profile and I guess people don't realize it means I like DOING it, not HAVING IT DONE.
The 2006 post transitional procedure linked to: "If you wanted to post an Ask Metafilter question that would generate a lot of controversy, a flamewar, or just incredulity, what would you post?" was a bit of an outlier even then, referring back to AskMe and doing so in a "wink wink" "Politically Incorrect" "say what you'd be afraid to say at MeFi" format. I think it was part of the reason we decided the Fourth Rule of MetaChat.org is you never talk about MetaFilter.com (unless you have a REALLY good reason). (I forgot what the first Three Rules are) Which was why I was hesitant to make my Saturday "OMG MEFI BUNNY" post there, but now I am so glad I did.
I'm going to start posting more regularly there too, with stuff that I wouldn't do here. Turtle GIFs, anyone?
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:02 PM on September 14, 2015
The 2006 post transitional procedure linked to: "If you wanted to post an Ask Metafilter question that would generate a lot of controversy, a flamewar, or just incredulity, what would you post?" was a bit of an outlier even then, referring back to AskMe and doing so in a "wink wink" "Politically Incorrect" "say what you'd be afraid to say at MeFi" format. I think it was part of the reason we decided the Fourth Rule of MetaChat.org is you never talk about MetaFilter.com (unless you have a REALLY good reason). (I forgot what the first Three Rules are) Which was why I was hesitant to make my Saturday "OMG MEFI BUNNY" post there, but now I am so glad I did.
I'm going to start posting more regularly there too, with stuff that I wouldn't do here. Turtle GIFs, anyone?
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:02 PM on September 14, 2015
Warren Buffett still hasn't responded to our mutiple emails and snailmail letters.
And I don't know if we can get Jimmy Buffett... maybe we can do like Colbert's Late Show last Thursday and get Toby Keith doing an imitation of Jimmy Buffett. (did you SEE that?)
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:26 PM on September 14, 2015
And I don't know if we can get Jimmy Buffett... maybe we can do like Colbert's Late Show last Thursday and get Toby Keith doing an imitation of Jimmy Buffett. (did you SEE that?)
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:26 PM on September 14, 2015
I'll join the postathon.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
posted by jouke at 6:30 PM on September 14, 2015
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
posted by jouke at 6:30 PM on September 14, 2015
I think it was part of the reason we decided the Fourth Rule of MetaChat.org is you never talk about MetaFilter.com
No - it was actually beacause people were using MetaChat as a place to gang up on other people. I wasn't a mod at the time but I understand there was some heartfelt interchange at that time between the two mod teams and this was the truce they struck. And it served us well. There were a few times people tried to come over to MeCha and basically say "look at those assholes" and most of them were nipped in the bud.
That said, at its best MeCha has been a very nice place. For those who were saying in the thread below that MetaFilter didn't feel meaningfully like a community to them, I would say that MetaChat was my bridge to that feeling. It is small enough that you can really get to know a few people. Many of the MeFites I feel closest to are those who I was also able to interact with, at a more personal level, at MetaChat. The fact that discussion doesn't need to stay focused on a topic lets people relax and just chat about nothing much, and can be themselves instead of always rendering an opinion - something that MetaFilter is, sort of, by default set up for people to do. There are really no requirements for what makes a good post. You can just chat about things you like or what's coming up in your life or a good recipe or a book you loved or whatever. So, if anyone's interested in that sort of mostly calm, friendly hanging out, try it out.
posted by Miko at 7:17 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
No - it was actually beacause people were using MetaChat as a place to gang up on other people. I wasn't a mod at the time but I understand there was some heartfelt interchange at that time between the two mod teams and this was the truce they struck. And it served us well. There were a few times people tried to come over to MeCha and basically say "look at those assholes" and most of them were nipped in the bud.
That said, at its best MeCha has been a very nice place. For those who were saying in the thread below that MetaFilter didn't feel meaningfully like a community to them, I would say that MetaChat was my bridge to that feeling. It is small enough that you can really get to know a few people. Many of the MeFites I feel closest to are those who I was also able to interact with, at a more personal level, at MetaChat. The fact that discussion doesn't need to stay focused on a topic lets people relax and just chat about nothing much, and can be themselves instead of always rendering an opinion - something that MetaFilter is, sort of, by default set up for people to do. There are really no requirements for what makes a good post. You can just chat about things you like or what's coming up in your life or a good recipe or a book you loved or whatever. So, if anyone's interested in that sort of mostly calm, friendly hanging out, try it out.
posted by Miko at 7:17 PM on September 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
The "look at those MeFi assholes" place seems to be r/metafilter, from what I can see.
posted by Chrysostom at 7:28 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by Chrysostom at 7:28 PM on September 14, 2015
I just ran out of time, like 5 years ago. The going got tough & I had to cut way back on the web traffic. Things have smoothed out a bit finally this spring (though lord knows it won't last - did I mention I put my daughter through engineering school & she's now an assistant rocket scientist? I did? Sorry) and I just forgot to look back in. Not like I was that prolific or popular as a member, but it had its moments.
I sure hope the usual username/password (2008) combo works.
posted by Devils Rancher at 7:44 PM on September 14, 2015
I sure hope the usual username/password (2008) combo works.
posted by Devils Rancher at 7:44 PM on September 14, 2015
I sure hope the usual username/password (2008) combo works.
If it doesn't you'll find some avenues in the thread to help out, but it should.
The "look at those MeFi assholes" place seems to be r/metafilter, from what I can see.
Hm. Enlightening.
posted by Miko at 7:45 PM on September 14, 2015
If it doesn't you'll find some avenues in the thread to help out, but it should.
The "look at those MeFi assholes" place seems to be r/metafilter, from what I can see.
Hm. Enlightening.
posted by Miko at 7:45 PM on September 14, 2015
I just increased my comment count there by 60%. I hope it can be brought back from the brink.
posted by double block and bleed at 10:34 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by double block and bleed at 10:34 PM on September 14, 2015
I just headed over to sign up, because it always sounded like a fun place.
Turns out I've been a member for more than ten years, made 8 posts and left 182 comments.
How can my memory be that bad? How?!
posted by jack_mo at 1:57 AM on September 15, 2015 [13 favorites]
Turns out I've been a member for more than ten years, made 8 posts and left 182 comments.
How can my memory be that bad? How?!
posted by jack_mo at 1:57 AM on September 15, 2015 [13 favorites]
There was a bunny (large, white) on the side of the road when I was cycling home tonight. I stopped and asked the nearest human (large, white, collecting mail from his letterbox) if it belonged to him.
"OMG BUNNY," I said.
"Yeah, it hangs around here," he answered.
"Do you think someone's looking for it?"
"No, it's been here for months."
"We should do something!" I exclaimed. I offered to call the council.
He answered sheepishly, "No, don't. It can come and live with me. I have a lot of lettuce."
OMG BUNNY!
(I am glad to have found an appropriate thread for that story, and if this isn't an appropriate thread I will ask you please not to disabuse me of the notion.)
posted by lollusc at 4:19 AM on September 15, 2015 [2 favorites]
"OMG BUNNY," I said.
"Yeah, it hangs around here," he answered.
"Do you think someone's looking for it?"
"No, it's been here for months."
"We should do something!" I exclaimed. I offered to call the council.
He answered sheepishly, "No, don't. It can come and live with me. I have a lot of lettuce."
OMG BUNNY!
(I am glad to have found an appropriate thread for that story, and if this isn't an appropriate thread I will ask you please not to disabuse me of the notion.)
posted by lollusc at 4:19 AM on September 15, 2015 [2 favorites]
I used to MeCha. I even have been known to OMG BUNNY! at times.
Perhaps I'll head back, if I can remember my password.
posted by eriko at 4:25 AM on September 15, 2015
Perhaps I'll head back, if I can remember my password.
posted by eriko at 4:25 AM on September 15, 2015
Glomping is an acronym. I had no idea.
posted by jessamyn (retired) at 6:02 AM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by jessamyn (retired) at 6:02 AM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
Backronym, or folk etymology, I think. It didn't originate as an acronym.
posted by Wolfdog at 7:22 AM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Wolfdog at 7:22 AM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
I am always so tempted to add two more "Cha"s to it, or just visualize what Chairface Chippendale wrote on the moon on "The Tick" cartoon.
Metafilter's own.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 12:19 PM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
Metafilter's own.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 12:19 PM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
Chrystostom, yeah, we had a bit of a rough go there for a while, but I assure you that Rhaomi and I are both committed to not letting /r/metafilter turn into a place where people can crap on the mothership. The issue we had basically came down to not posting our expectations/the rules about what we allow to be discussed about metafilter, and since doing that, the really negative stuff has basically stopped. Hopefully for good.
I was a member on metachat for a while, but real life caused me to scale back on participating there. I may go back, but I'm glad to see it get some love from mefi.
posted by disclaimer at 1:24 PM on September 15, 2015
I was a member on metachat for a while, but real life caused me to scale back on participating there. I may go back, but I'm glad to see it get some love from mefi.
posted by disclaimer at 1:24 PM on September 15, 2015
Yeah, sorry, did not mean that as a criticism. Just the couple of times I took a look over there, it was some MeFi expats complaining about the iron heel of moderation, etc.
Looking now, looks like good discussions.
posted by Chrysostom at 2:06 PM on September 15, 2015
Looking now, looks like good discussions.
posted by Chrysostom at 2:06 PM on September 15, 2015
GLOMP: Get Lots Of Metafilter Posts, right?
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:19 PM on September 15, 2015
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:19 PM on September 15, 2015
Interesting if only for the bizarro-world emotional labor thread.
posted by Miko at 2:19 PM on September 15, 2015
posted by Miko at 2:19 PM on September 15, 2015
I created an account yesterday. I can edit my profile and I show up in a user search. Still getting "Kometten Verbotten: Blocked!" when I try to say hello.
posted by kimberussell at 4:18 PM on September 15, 2015
posted by kimberussell at 4:18 PM on September 15, 2015
I love MeCha because I love the bunnies there. But it would be fabulous to bring back the bunnies who haven't been for awhile and add some new ones, too.
posted by bearwife at 4:54 PM on September 15, 2015
posted by bearwife at 4:54 PM on September 15, 2015
Posted. Can't find the post, but I found the title. It must be me.
posted by mule98J at 4:58 PM on September 15, 2015
posted by mule98J at 4:58 PM on September 15, 2015
Still getting "Kometten Verbotten: Blocked!"
Sorry about that. This was a little wonky because the site's been so quiet that the mods and admins haven't really had to be fulltime about it in ages. There was a spark of interest in reviving site activity a couple days ago that resulted in this post, which is all great, but the few of us with mod powers who are still hanging around didn't know about it right away, so we weren't able to react super fast. I'm sure gaspode will get around to okaying the new users before long, but it's never going to be the react-on-a-dime site that MeFi is, and we never wanted to automate signups because there have been spammers, bots and other crap in the past. I used to have admin keys back in the day, but with that particular platform, there's really only one set, and she has it - so I am sorry, but can't help. Patience, grasshopper.
posted by Miko at 5:10 PM on September 15, 2015
Sorry about that. This was a little wonky because the site's been so quiet that the mods and admins haven't really had to be fulltime about it in ages. There was a spark of interest in reviving site activity a couple days ago that resulted in this post, which is all great, but the few of us with mod powers who are still hanging around didn't know about it right away, so we weren't able to react super fast. I'm sure gaspode will get around to okaying the new users before long, but it's never going to be the react-on-a-dime site that MeFi is, and we never wanted to automate signups because there have been spammers, bots and other crap in the past. I used to have admin keys back in the day, but with that particular platform, there's really only one set, and she has it - so I am sorry, but can't help. Patience, grasshopper.
posted by Miko at 5:10 PM on September 15, 2015
Yeah, for some reason, the metachat email isn't getting the automatic email for new user signups. Very odd. (The process is, new users are automatically blocked and I unblock them). Anyway, if you email the metachat email or me (same username over there) I'll sort you out. Sorry about that.
posted by gaspode at 6:21 PM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by gaspode at 6:21 PM on September 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
Metachat Eye seems pretty broken, on my iPad, anyway. I'd probably post pics to the group now & again if I get active on the site. Is it permanently broken due to Flickr changes or is there hope?
posted by Devils Rancher at 4:35 AM on September 16, 2015
posted by Devils Rancher at 4:35 AM on September 16, 2015
I don't think MetaChat Eye has been used since well before the new Flickr, so I'd suspect it's a new Flickr platform issue. I also don't know who admin'd it. If you can see that info, let me know and maybe we can message them.
posted by Miko at 11:27 AM on September 16, 2015
posted by Miko at 11:27 AM on September 16, 2015
I brought this up over there, but will say it here too: When I did a search to see when the last time a certain user posted, I got the search results plus this message:
"We've recently updated this screen, so please email any bugs or suggestions to seanyboy."
IIRC, seanyboy isn't around at all anymore? Shouldn't this be removed?
posted by Melismata at 11:01 AM on September 17, 2015
"We've recently updated this screen, so please email any bugs or suggestions to seanyboy."
IIRC, seanyboy isn't around at all anymore? Shouldn't this be removed?
posted by Melismata at 11:01 AM on September 17, 2015
Shouldn't this be removed?
In an ideal world, sure, but it's really kind of a patchwork operation at this point. We couldn't fix things like that even five years ago; I'm not an admin anymore and don't think anyone is really minding the store at that level.
At this point I think it's about enjoying the conversation people are having there, and not worrying about all the broken bits. I just don't think we have the kind of situation we'd really need to fix them.
posted by Miko at 9:22 PM on September 17, 2015
In an ideal world, sure, but it's really kind of a patchwork operation at this point. We couldn't fix things like that even five years ago; I'm not an admin anymore and don't think anyone is really minding the store at that level.
At this point I think it's about enjoying the conversation people are having there, and not worrying about all the broken bits. I just don't think we have the kind of situation we'd really need to fix them.
posted by Miko at 9:22 PM on September 17, 2015
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posted by Melismata at 12:08 PM on September 14, 2015 [2 favorites]