Personal attacks suck

November 3, 2004 6:14 PM

Haven't we been talking about putting a stop to this type of personal attack?
posted by fenriq to Etiquette/Policy at 6:14 PM (63 comments total)

quonsar adds nothing to the thread, intentionally derails and persists in personally attacking me on a thread that could have and should have been a discussion of Kerry's concession speech. Instead I get to spend my time on the thread defending myself from unwarranted attacks.

How are his comments of any use whatsoever?
posted by fenriq at 6:16 PM on November 3, 2004

Yeah, that's lame. I'd go in and delete them, but there's a ton of shit slinging there. I really should program a "close this thread" button for stuff like this.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 6:17 PM on November 3, 2004

The thread is ok other than that little back and forth. People need somewhere to vent; if you closed it, it'd end up somewhere else.
posted by The God Complex at 6:22 PM on November 3, 2004

Instead I get to spend my time on the thread defending myself from unwarranted attacks

Unwarranted?! HA! Both of you went at each other in that thread and you really didn't try to play nice or ignore Q. Stop trying to act innocent.
posted by Stynxno at 6:26 PM on November 3, 2004

It'll be over in a couple of days. This kind of seething anger doesn't just shake off with a banana split.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 6:27 PM on November 3, 2004

Jesus Christ, fenriq, talk about chutzpah. You'd been baiting q for hours. Does any of this ring a bell?

You sound just like someone who needs his ass kicked. Badly.
posted by fenriq at 3:21 PM EST

Whatever, go fuck yourself.
posted by fenriq at 6:46 PM EST

Whatever, you're an idiot troll loser. I hope you choke on the next bag of Doritos you inhale.
Thanks for being part of the further degeneration of MetaFilter. You're a shining example of exactly what's wrong here. Wow, you're a poster child for assholes! Congratulations!
posted by fenriq at 7:52 PM EST

And then you have the balls to whine about his response? Give me a break. If you can't take the heat, don't set fire to the kitchen.
posted by languagehat at 6:54 PM on November 3, 2004

Man, this callout takes the cake. This is like blaming someone for breaking your hand when you punch them in the face.
posted by scarabic at 6:59 PM on November 3, 2004

But it's true! This quonsar guy regularly uses four-letter words, is often curt and dismissive, sometimes fails to treat fellow users with all due respect, has been known to make risqué jokes one would hate one's mother to see and, to crown it all, he's a bit liberal and often shows it.

On the plus side, I admit he's very funny - but surely that's no excuse for being so outside the norm here on MetaFilter?

It's entirely appropriate that proper gentlemen like fenriq bring this matter up, if we are to quell this unholy torrent.
posted by MiguelCardoso at 7:14 PM on November 3, 2004

About a month ago I promised myself not to comment here until the election was over. I read the crap, over and over again, bit my tongue, just to hope that it might go away. I didn't read the site back in 2000 (I started lurking in early 2001), but the time before 9/11, though political at times, wasn't nearly as bitter, partisan, or nauseatingly repetitive.

I write this because the original poster of this thread (fenriq) has been so ridiculously loud, partisan, and annoying that I can't help but defend quonsar. I'm defending quonsar for God's sake. fenriq, all day today I was screaming at my desk, trying to understand how so many people could vote for "morality". All day today I pounded my head, thinking about all the issues Bush can now control and manipulate with his new found power.

But this site is not the official "bitch session" for Kerry supporters, nor should it be. Many people here are hurt; many people are angry. More important, many people need to take a break from MeFi, take in some fresh air, and get over it SOMEWHERE ELSE. Please. This site has suffered enough of American politics, specifically because so many of the threads and ideas have been so damn repetitive. Let's not forget that US politics, though important, are only a tiny, teeny, tiny portion of everyday life in the world.
posted by BlueTrain at 7:24 PM on November 3, 2004

quonsar's comments are never any use. And people who think he/she is "funny" have some seriously different concepts of humor.
posted by Snyder at 7:29 PM on November 3, 2004

Amen and fucking A well said, Miguel. If it's one thing we don't need is anything outside The Norm Right Now.

And to top it all off, that curt bastard Q has hypnotically drawn me into his very politics.

Dig this, proper gentleman fenriq. I spent so much time hunting and pecking vainly for "quonsar" on the specially constructed Diebold Custom Guaranteed Fair Vote Virtual Butterfly Soft Touch SubEtha Paperless Trail SoffScreen....that I think I may have caused some inadvertent vote counting glitches in Ohio.

Sorry.
posted by fold_and_mutilate at 7:30 PM on November 3, 2004

quonsar is laughing up his fecking sleeve now, fenriq.

As far as I can see you started it. Now that doesn't mean you're 100% to blame, but please: take some responsibility. You're both on the left of centre, this is just part of the post-election fallout. Let it go.
posted by dash_slot- at 7:43 PM on November 3, 2004

"eat shit, you pouty little napoleonic toddler" is bad. Starting sentences with "whatever" is worse.

CNN projects quonsar wins with 64% of the vote.
posted by PrinceValium at 7:47 PM on November 3, 2004

i feel really sorry for that amber girl on the wal-mart shrek commercial, she seems so awkward. i say to the screen "don't be wal-mart's awkward whore!" but she does not seem to notice. the poor thing. we should free her. let us find and free her.
posted by bargle at 7:51 PM on November 3, 2004

well, fenriq is deeply dissapointed, as am i. it's just that i hate that kind of "i have seen the mountain" backwash he was spouting, it's the kind of meaningless jabber that got bush re-elected in the face of his crushing failures. the idea that people have to begin thinking and speaking blunt reality, it's something i'm passionate about. so i over reacted and scolded him and that pissed him off in turn. and then we got our dicks and rulers out and now we're both wearing the blue dress. politics suck.
posted by quonsar at 7:51 PM on November 3, 2004

who shot first? and who eats the biscuit?
posted by dash_slot- at 7:53 PM on November 3, 2004

That, by the way, is absolutely the best non-apology apology since Blair apologised for not finding WMDs in Iraq.

Skillfully played, q.
posted by dash_slot- at 7:54 PM on November 3, 2004

"eat shit, you pouty little napoleonic toddler" is bad.

yes, it really should have read "eat shit, you pouting napoleonic toddler". my syntax haves mangles.
posted by quonsar at 7:55 PM on November 3, 2004

mmm banana splits
posted by kamylyon at 7:59 PM on November 3, 2004

What about "Go ahead and pout, you toddling, Napoleonic shit-eater?"

Or "Toddle off and eat pout, you shitty little Napoleon?"
posted by MiguelCardoso at 8:02 PM on November 3, 2004

No, no, i like the "eat shit." It is a smooth, emphatic opening. I could see it amended to "eat shit and die" but no more.
posted by Krrrlson at 8:13 PM on November 3, 2004

I kinda liked quonsar's little insult, but then again, I'm a rabid fan of q's, and Canadian to boot, so what do I know. Gosh, did I use too many commas in that sentence?
posted by ashbury at 8:19 PM on November 3, 2004

"Go ahead and pout, you toddling, Napoleonic shit-eater?"

i bow before a true master!
posted by quonsar at 8:26 PM on November 3, 2004

yeah, I do fire back when fired upon. I don't deny it, why would I?

You're right, I'm certainly not a gentleman some of the time. I have a temper just like everyone else. I get pissed off, I allow things that have nothing to do with MeFi to cloud my temper and shorten my fuse.

If Matt wants to send me a vacation for what I've done then I'm definitely fine with that.

I like quonsar, I have laughed often at things he's written. What set him off of on me today I don't know, I don't really give a damn. It was unwarranted and childish and today wasn't the day to be unwarranted and childish to me.

I'm sure all of you MeFi luminati feel as if you can sit in judgment of me and think your "he's a jerky" thoughts and you can. It doesn't really matter. Matt's opinion matters and I'm happy to abide by his judgment, not yours.

ashbury, I'm not saying I didn't like the insult, I just didn't really like it leveled at me. I appreciate an imaginative insult as much as anyone. And I even get sarcasm without the /sarcasm tag sometimes.

By the way, if not a callout then what? Further escalating insults on the thread until Matt does step in? Now who's being childish? Sure, I could be the bigger man and let it go since it really isn't worth it and it does play right to what quonsar was looking for, a reaction to be all surprised about, yeah, go quonsar! Yeah!

So yeah, I brought it here and that upsets some folks. Boo hoo. Its what MeTa is here for.
posted by fenriq at 8:37 PM on November 3, 2004

(checks watch, taps foot)

c'mon already, group hug, so I can go!
posted by mwhybark at 8:58 PM on November 3, 2004

I didn't read the site back in 2000 (I started lurking in early 2001), but the time before 9/11, though political at times, wasn't nearly as bitter, partisan, or nauseatingly repetitive.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but neither was American culture at large.

you can sit in judgment of me and think your "he's a jerky" thoughts and you can. It doesn't really matter. Matt's opinion matters and I'm happy to abide by his judgment, not yours.

It doesn't look like he cared too much. He's certainly stepped in to censure quonsar on other occasions.

if not a callout then what?

I suggest actual masturbation.
posted by scarabic at 9:06 PM on November 3, 2004

"By the way, if not a callout then what? Further escalating insults on the thread until Matt does step in?"

As I have some experience in the matter, I would suggest an alternate strategy. Just let it go. Nobody's keeping score, it's ok if someone else raises the stupidity bar and you don't take them up on the challenge. (In that example, I had the most perfect, mean-spirited zinger to answer your response, much better than "Jerk-Store", but I let you have the last insult because it really wasn't worth it. Most people don't come into a thread to read some petty bickering.)

My point is, re-focus your anger someplace more productive, take a deep breath and start rolling that giant boulder up the friggin' mountain once again, even though we know it's just gonna come rolling back down again. Now you know what it's like to be a Red Sox fan. Sometimes you win, but usually not.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 9:09 PM on November 3, 2004

It was unwarranted

Way to miss the point, fenriq. He insulted you after you had a go at him, remember? Time to let it go.
posted by dash_slot- at 9:10 PM on November 3, 2004

MetaFilter: Toddle off and eat pout, you shitty little Napoleon!
posted by Vidiot at 9:11 PM on November 3, 2004

oh, and:

q wins. Hands down.
posted by Vidiot at 9:11 PM on November 3, 2004

look in my eyes, what do you see?
posted by namespan at 9:16 PM on November 3, 2004

Haven't we been talking about putting a stop to this type of MetaTalk thread?
posted by soyjoy at 9:16 PM on November 3, 2004

Scarabic, you're right, Matt didn't step in. I stepped out. To try and head off the inevitable escalation since no one likes the other guy to get the last word. So I brought it here, fully knowing that I'd be ridiculed but so what?

Insults from people I don't respect don't really mean very much. I am willing to try harder to let the stupid crap slide as much as I can. But that means that I expect other people to ease back on their fury throttles as well.

Until that happens, the threads will be free-for-alls and more members will drift off. Or is that what you uber-cool MeFi Elders want?
posted by fenriq at 9:20 PM on November 3, 2004

eat shit, you pouty little napoleonic toddler

I honestly thought he was talking about Bush.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 10:14 PM on November 3, 2004

I am willing to try harder to let the stupid crap slide as much as I can. But that means that I expect other people to ease back on their fury throttles as well.

"letting it slide only if the other guy lets it slide" != "letting it slide"
posted by Krrrlson at 10:26 PM on November 3, 2004

Let me put it this way: if you don't say anything rude yourself in the thread, at all, and someone pops off with a string of four-letter words, then you're in decent shape to call them out - IF you're into that kind of thing. But when you've already called someone an asshole in the thread, making a callout about their next retort can hardly be confused with taking the high road.
posted by scarabic at 10:44 PM on November 3, 2004

IF you're into that kind of thing

Precisely, scarabic. I find it ridiculous and self-defeating to be repressive about things merely expressive.
posted by MiguelCardoso at 11:02 PM on November 3, 2004

Any sensible moderator who wanted to discourage this sort of behavior would give both parties a time out. They totally trashed the thread and disrespected the site and its other members. A little judicious discouragement of the most egregious cases would make a "close thread button" (yeah, punish the innocent for the misbehavior of a few...give them more power to disrupt than they already have!) unnecessary.
posted by rushmc at 11:07 PM on November 3, 2004

Grow some skin and calm down, fenriq. Drink some herb tea or something.

You're pathetic.
posted by azazello at 11:07 PM on November 3, 2004

They totally trashed the thread and disrespected the site and its other members

I'm sorry, rushmc - I am happy to consider you a friend and agree with a lot of your brave and intelligent opinions, but surely you must be aware that accusing fenriq and quonsar of totally trashing and disrespecting the site and its other members is far more offensive, unjust and downright exaggerated than any of the put-downs they exchanged?

Isn't even the most violent "fuck you" (which expresses agression towards an individual member and, by its own words, shows it's a hot-headed reaction) a lot less pejorative than stating drily that they totally trashed the thread and disrespected the site and its other members?

You alone are extending what's openly subjective banter (however rude) into a desire to insult everyone else here. This was something between fenriq and quonsar. Perhaps they "shouldn't" have vented. But they certainly didn't mean to extend their highly individual insults to the rest of us and it's offensive to state that they did.

Honestly, for someone so libertarian you sure come across as a closet puritan!
posted by MiguelCardoso at 11:59 PM on November 3, 2004

I'm not saying I didn't like the insult, I just didn't really like it leveled at me.

Snort. This makes my night complete.
posted by ook at 12:04 AM on November 4, 2004

Awww, thanks guys and gals. I needed a laugh.
posted by stet at 12:07 AM on November 4, 2004

You're pathetic.

Gosh, that was unnecessary.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:01 AM on November 4, 2004

Please keep all this bullshit except for the really extreme stuff, Matt. I honestly want to read this all again a few years from now. Please?
posted by Keyser Soze at 2:21 AM on November 4, 2004

Jesus Christ, fenriq, talk about chutzpah

Man, this callout takes the cake.

fenriq can dish it out, but can't take it. pouty little napoleonic toddler is a pretty damn good description, imho.
posted by andrew cooke at 3:26 AM on November 4, 2004

So I brought it here, fully knowing that I'd be ridiculed

Is that because you knew you were being ridiculous?

Insults from people I don't respect don't really mean very much.

Yes, when things don't matter to me I always go off on one too.

I am willing to try harder to let the stupid crap slide as much as I can. But that means that I expect other people to ease back on their fury throttles as well.

Who else is furious here? Everyone is just laughing at you.
posted by biffa at 3:46 AM on November 4, 2004

I hope you choke on the next bag of Doritos you inhale.







I hope you choke on the next bag of Doritos you inhale.







I hope you choke on the next bag of Doritos you inhale.






Once again, I HOPE YOU CHOKE ON THE NEXT BAG OF DORITOS YOU INHALE.
posted by Pretty_Generic at 4:58 AM on November 4, 2004

What stet said.
posted by adampsyche at 5:34 AM on November 4, 2004

what languagehat said -- fenriq, either lose the trash talk or lose the whining about other people's manners
posted by matteo at 6:19 AM on November 4, 2004

eat shit, you pouty little napoleonic toddler

For me, far too self-consciously verbal.

But this:

stop talking in platitudes. you sound JUST like Chimpy McAWOL

GEORGE BUSH IS YOUR DADDY

teenagers are so cute these days

pure name-calling genius.
posted by Summer at 6:31 AM on November 4, 2004

I've been on the receiving end of Quonsar's reverse-ageism and I think it's kinda disappointing that someone of such obvious wit has to resort to crass categorical slurs toward the young. This week, anyway, quonsar should all be acutely conscious of how many people *over* the age of 18 are fucked in the head.
posted by scarabic at 8:42 AM on November 4, 2004

I've been on the receiving end of Quonsar's reverse-ageism and I think it's kinda disappointing that someone of such obvious wit has to resort to crass categorical slurs toward the young. This week, anyway, quonsar should be acutely conscious of how many people *over* the age of 18 are fucked in the head.
posted by scarabic at 8:43 AM on November 4, 2004

duh
posted by scarabic at 8:43 AM on November 4, 2004

I think everyone who's posted twenty or more comments in the last week should get an enforced break of a week or more, and see what happens here.
posted by norm at 9:08 AM on November 4, 2004

This was something between fenriq and quonsar. Perhaps they "shouldn't" have vented. But they certainly didn't mean to extend their highly individual insults to the rest of us and it's offensive to state that they did.

Sorry to hear that you fall on the side of peurile namecalling rather than civil discourse, Miguel. The insult to the rest of us is in lowering the quality of debate on the site and encouraging personal attacks upon fellow members by example (for every one that is allowed, three more are born, it seems). If you prefer a site devolved into little more than shouting, profanity, and nasty personal attacks, then I suggest you visit Usenet. I don't think that a desire for respectful interaction even among those who disagree is in any sense "prudish."

This was something between fenriq and quonsar.

And they should have kept it between them. That's what email is for. You should ask yourself why they feel the need for an audience for their little "performance." There are thousands of other people here who are not here to watch two hotheads spew venom at one another. It is DISRUPTIVE, and the rest of us deserve better. Or do you really want the following to become the typical comment on Metafilter?

ARE YOU A FUCKING MENTAL PATIENT? YOU ARE IN DENIAL.
posted by ParisParamus at 7:55 AM PST on November 4
posted by rushmc at 9:22 AM on November 4, 2004

ARE YOU A FUCKING MENTAL PATIENT? YOU ARE IN DENIAL.

yes. and yes.

any more questions?
posted by quonsar at 10:10 AM on November 4, 2004

Motivation can come from anywhere and anger is a good one. I've been angry and misusing that anger to respond to childish personal attacks. I'm going to try harder to redirect my anger into a positive outlet.

Good job, fenriq. Many of us have been bummed out in the past two days because of the implications of what's happening. My disdain in the comment above is not toward your sentiment - I'm willing to fight for it - but toward the useless grandeur and attacks in which you initially expressed your anger. I hope you understand.
posted by azazello at 10:33 AM on November 4, 2004

azaello, yep, I understand. I'm working on a standing 8 count before posting replies.

I appreciate the constructive feedback, the deconstructive I'm just working on ignoring.

By the way, thanks for taking the time to clarify your perspective.
posted by fenriq at 10:55 AM on November 4, 2004

oops, sorry, that should azazello. Sorry.
posted by fenriq at 10:56 AM on November 4, 2004

i think quonsar's usually highlarious, but scarabic wins this one hands down. that is, before he pooed all over himself.

i agree with C_D (it really isn't that hard to let it go. egoizers!), and Keyser Soze. an abridged or sanitized version of MF would be blasphemy.
posted by mrgrimm at 10:59 AM on November 4, 2004

Sorry to hear that you fall on the side of peurile namecalling rather than civil discourse

Hmm... isn't that a little bit of resorting to the old pejorative swipe yourself, there? What is it you want to see, rushmc? A metafilter without profanity? I don't see how we can possibly legislate argument itself out of existence... nor should we. So what is it you're suggesting, in absolute terms, please?
posted by scarabic at 3:08 PM on November 4, 2004

Fenriq: You're still missing a point about how this game is played. You can't take an etiquette problem to MetaTalk when you're the person being mistreated.

Next time, do the right thing: Nurse your grievance, wait for your tormentor to abuse someone else, and then bring it here.

It's the difference between Heroic Bystander and Petulant Child Running to Mommy.
posted by rcade at 9:03 PM on November 4, 2004

rcade, got it! Thanks for the explanation.

I must have lost my rulebook or skimmed that page.
posted by fenriq at 12:30 PM on November 5, 2004