reason for deletion? March 9, 2005 7:00 PM Subscribe
I don't think deleting Metatalk threads asking to clarify the deletions of Ask Metafilter threads is good for the community. [+]
It's certainly left me completely confused, to find out that this is going on. Why delete that post? Was it chatty? It doesn't sound like too bad a question. Or is it now illegal to discuss alcohol? How is anyone else ever going to know what they aren't supposed to post?
posted by Jimbob at 7:07 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by Jimbob at 7:07 PM on March 9, 2005
Having read Justin's blog post, the reasons for the askme deletion are actually quite clear. So why not put them in metatalk thread for all to see?
posted by Jimbob at 7:09 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by Jimbob at 7:09 PM on March 9, 2005
What will really be cool is when matt deletes this thread and we get another thread asking about the deletion of this thread. Fun times! (let it go people ;)
posted by justgary at 7:10 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by justgary at 7:10 PM on March 9, 2005
it's mathowie's site, you 'community' buttholes can just go blow it out your ear if you don't like it.
/sieg heil
posted by quonsar at 7:11 PM on March 9, 2005
/sieg heil
posted by quonsar at 7:11 PM on March 9, 2005
Okay - well I just advocated that Matt should do more of this kind of thing and he argued convincingly that I was wrong. He also argued against "consistency." So there you have it!
;)
posted by scarabic at 7:13 PM on March 9, 2005
;)
posted by scarabic at 7:13 PM on March 9, 2005
Obviously, he deleted the thing because it was a stupid chatty question ("What's your favorite color?"). Soon he'll finish narrowing down the AskMe guidelines, maybe give us a seperate site or something for the stupid questions people like to ask.
I'm not sure why he deleted the MeTa, though. You really must've pissed him off.
posted by graventy at 7:17 PM on March 9, 2005
I'm not sure why he deleted the MeTa, though. You really must've pissed him off.
posted by graventy at 7:17 PM on March 9, 2005
Sometimes it feels like there's a blind man playing pinata in a crowded living room around here.
Jumping back to the topic, though - "how does alcohol enhance your creative process" is a long, long mile from "who here likes pancakes?" One is inviting methodologies regarding the creative process, the other is inviting people to say "Yo!", "Me 2!!!", "Me 3 lol!", and possibly to post the lyrics to a song about pancakes. That's not to say it wasn't a dumb question, just that far, far dumber and more general have slipped by and recently so.
posted by Ryvar at 7:22 PM on March 9, 2005
Jumping back to the topic, though - "how does alcohol enhance your creative process" is a long, long mile from "who here likes pancakes?" One is inviting methodologies regarding the creative process, the other is inviting people to say "Yo!", "Me 2!!!", "Me 3 lol!", and possibly to post the lyrics to a song about pancakes. That's not to say it wasn't a dumb question, just that far, far dumber and more general have slipped by and recently so.
posted by Ryvar at 7:22 PM on March 9, 2005
matt probably deleted the meta thread because he sent justin a response in email.
posted by puke & cry at 7:24 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by puke & cry at 7:24 PM on March 9, 2005
At a guess, the MeTa thread got deleted because its sole link was to his own blog. Which is a nice place to host his question, but it doesn't need to be squatting on the front page of MeTa.
posted by Wolfdog at 7:25 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by Wolfdog at 7:25 PM on March 9, 2005
A few of you are missing my point. I'm not saying that the question was good. I'm saying that suppressing the discussion of why it was bad is bad. It's not just a matter of informing the original poster. Seeing something (that's not outrageously offensive or otherwise beyond the pale) disappear without a trace in front of my eyes doesn't make me want to read the site. It makes me think, "what else am I not seeing because a biased moderator is deleting it?" My problem is more with transparency than with integrity at this point.
posted by azazello at 7:29 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by azazello at 7:29 PM on March 9, 2005
Okay - well I just advocated that Matt should do more of this kind of thing and he argued convincingly that I was wrong. He also argued against "consistency." So there you have it!
Oddly enough, scarabic, although we'll have to agree to disagree about the relative merits of goosestepping (OMGodwin), I think you're correct regarding consistency. The only faster method to turn your users against you than being ironfisted is to be both ironfisted and arbitrary.
My problem is more with transparency than with integrity at this point.
Couldn't have put it better myself. A MeTa and AskMe lofi seem to be the most requested ponies lately.
posted by Ryvar at 7:36 PM on March 9, 2005
Oddly enough, scarabic, although we'll have to agree to disagree about the relative merits of goosestepping (OMGodwin), I think you're correct regarding consistency. The only faster method to turn your users against you than being ironfisted is to be both ironfisted and arbitrary.
My problem is more with transparency than with integrity at this point.
Couldn't have put it better myself. A MeTa and AskMe lofi seem to be the most requested ponies lately.
posted by Ryvar at 7:36 PM on March 9, 2005
Mountain or molehill? You decide!
posted by puke & cry at 7:58 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by puke & cry at 7:58 PM on March 9, 2005
Dude, MeTa displays only ten posts. It's tough enough to keep up here without having every single AskMe deletion storming into the grey. Sets a bad precedent. You asked, he answered, done.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 8:17 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by DrJohnEvans at 8:17 PM on March 9, 2005
Quonsar, how do you manage to strike me as a jerk even when I agree with you?
posted by NickDouglas at 8:27 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by NickDouglas at 8:27 PM on March 9, 2005
Yep, deleting Metatalk threads asking to clarify the deletions of Ask Metafilter threads is one of the most important issues of our time.
Next to finding the evildoers who hacked Paris Hilton's Sidekick and crucifying them in the public square.
;-)
posted by wendell at 8:43 PM on March 9, 2005
Next to finding the evildoers who hacked Paris Hilton's Sidekick and crucifying them in the public square.
;-)
posted by wendell at 8:43 PM on March 9, 2005
Seriously, if we had stopped Hitler when he began arbitrarily deleting posts, we wouldnever have needed to fight WWII.
;-)
posted by wendell at 8:45 PM on March 9, 2005
;-)
posted by wendell at 8:45 PM on March 9, 2005
The community is bad for the community.
posted by weretable and the undead chairs at 8:48 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by weretable and the undead chairs at 8:48 PM on March 9, 2005
Quonsar, how do you manage to strike me as a jerk even when I agree with you?
WHOOSH!
posted by quonsar at 8:50 PM on March 9, 2005
Contrary to azazello's wishes, I have to respond to the deletion of the question, which I find bizarre. Without counting, I'm going to estimate there's about a gazillion questions in AskMe in which which people seek advice on accomplishing x by asking how other people have accomplished x. The fact that the question was framed around whether people have found that y is a good tool for accomplishing x doesn't make a whit of difference. Jesus, just the tech questions following this template could fill a cockbucket to overflowing.
And then, of course, Matt's (oddly verbose) private explanation to Justin also bugs me -- as if Justin were the only one who would care that the question got deleted. A lot of people spend a lot of their own time reading AskMe questions and contributing answers, and the site would wither away without them. Explaining to them why something that was here yesterday is gone today is not only respectful of those people, but helps future askers stay within whatever (weird) guidelines Matt is trying to elucidate.
Wendell, if you don't think it's an important question, move along.
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 8:53 PM on March 9, 2005
And then, of course, Matt's (oddly verbose) private explanation to Justin also bugs me -- as if Justin were the only one who would care that the question got deleted. A lot of people spend a lot of their own time reading AskMe questions and contributing answers, and the site would wither away without them. Explaining to them why something that was here yesterday is gone today is not only respectful of those people, but helps future askers stay within whatever (weird) guidelines Matt is trying to elucidate.
Wendell, if you don't think it's an important question, move along.
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 8:53 PM on March 9, 2005
Thanks, stupidsexyFlanders, for lifting us out of the trough of idiotic snark. I agree with you completely.
posted by squirrel at 9:03 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by squirrel at 9:03 PM on March 9, 2005
Wendell, I know you might be using them because of the recent meta thread on sarcasm, but those emoticons have got to go.
Also, to those concerned with this: take a breath and go outside for awhile. This is not a huge issue that will kill the site or ruin it. Matt is not a CommiNazi and is not trying to kill your internet funtime.
posted by puke & cry at 9:08 PM on March 9, 2005
Also, to those concerned with this: take a breath and go outside for awhile. This is not a huge issue that will kill the site or ruin it. Matt is not a CommiNazi and is not trying to kill your internet funtime.
posted by puke & cry at 9:08 PM on March 9, 2005
I had already emailed justin a detailed response, and he posted the thread after he sent me the email and later said I could remove the post, but I had removed it at the time because explaining it over email privately is a lot easier and the path I had taken already.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:26 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:26 PM on March 9, 2005
Okay - well I just advocated that Matt should do more of this kind of thing and he argued convincingly that I was wrong
Not quite, you said I should close things, and close followups. To follow that advice, I would close this thread right now.
He also argued against "consistency."
No, I said it was impossible to be perfectly consistent and doing something that could be viewed as harmful to the community just for the sake of being consistent isn't a course I would take.
My problem is more with transparency than with integrity at this point.
I was discussing things with him already over email, which is easier to manage. Part of his issues are that there are no guidelines for ask metafilter, which is something I need to rectify soon. Basically, I felt it was just headaches to handle him in email which I'd already done, and at the same time have to defend myself in front of everyone else on the same issues with the same person.
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:32 PM on March 9, 2005
Not quite, you said I should close things, and close followups. To follow that advice, I would close this thread right now.
He also argued against "consistency."
No, I said it was impossible to be perfectly consistent and doing something that could be viewed as harmful to the community just for the sake of being consistent isn't a course I would take.
My problem is more with transparency than with integrity at this point.
I was discussing things with him already over email, which is easier to manage. Part of his issues are that there are no guidelines for ask metafilter, which is something I need to rectify soon. Basically, I felt it was just headaches to handle him in email which I'd already done, and at the same time have to defend myself in front of everyone else on the same issues with the same person.
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:32 PM on March 9, 2005
For the sake of the small bits of sanity I have left, I occasionally briefly immerse myself in the environment of those who take things way too seriously and laugh my ass off at them. Thank you for helping to fill my spare time between the news reports of Russell Crowe's 'terrorist threat' and the American Idol results show.
:-P
posted by wendell at 9:58 PM on March 9, 2005
:-P
posted by wendell at 9:58 PM on March 9, 2005
I don't think deleting Metatalk threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads is good dental hygiene.
I'm sorry. That's just the way I feel.
posted by Shane at 10:13 PM on March 9, 2005
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads asking to clarify the
deletions of Ask Metafilter threads is good dental hygiene.
I'm sorry. That's just the way I feel.
posted by Shane at 10:13 PM on March 9, 2005
goddmnit wendell :)
also: what a surprise, justin asked him to delete the post. quite a waste of a freak-out.
posted by puke & cry at 10:17 PM on March 9, 2005
also: what a surprise, justin asked him to delete the post. quite a waste of a freak-out.
posted by puke & cry at 10:17 PM on March 9, 2005
Pancake Song
Mix a pancake,
Beat a pancake,
Put it in a pan.
Cook a pancake,
Toss a pancake,
Catch it if you can.
posted by Dreamghost at 10:28 PM on March 9, 2005
Mix a pancake,
Beat a pancake,
Put it in a pan.
Cook a pancake,
Toss a pancake,
Catch it if you can.
posted by Dreamghost at 10:28 PM on March 9, 2005
Man that's a bitching Windows XP tattoo...
posted by Dreamghost at 10:35 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by Dreamghost at 10:35 PM on March 9, 2005
Oh shit! Quick, did I accuse Matt of destroying the site this time???? *scrolls up* Whew, no. Thank God. *pants heavily*
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
That is pretty weird/suspicious/wtf?
posted by Ryvar at 10:57 PM on March 9, 2005
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
That is pretty weird/suspicious/wtf?
posted by Ryvar at 10:57 PM on March 9, 2005
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
I'm pretty sure Kelley would disapprove of this.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 11:06 PM on March 9, 2005
I'm pretty sure Kelley would disapprove of this.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 11:06 PM on March 9, 2005
DreamGhost: Waffles are better than pancakes.
posted by puke & cry at 11:27 PM on March 9, 2005
posted by puke & cry at 11:27 PM on March 9, 2005
Just goes to show that this community is crying for a chatfilter section. The more the Grey & Green are (understandably) cleaned up, the more the chat will squeeze out the edges and find a place, whether wanted or not. Chatfilter is a needed depository not just for AskMe queries such as this one (and many others that have been sometimes hugely popular while still clearly skirting the guidelines), but perhaps also for the now-inevitable response threads to closed MeTa threads. /pinko rant
on preview: bitchity-bitch bitch bitch, while I'm here anyway. But Matt is right as usual, and has kindly 'splained as usual too.
posted by obloquy at 12:08 AM on March 10, 2005
on preview: bitchity-bitch bitch bitch, while I'm here anyway. But Matt is right as usual, and has kindly 'splained as usual too.
posted by obloquy at 12:08 AM on March 10, 2005
I wonder if I finally broke down and built the chatfilter I never wanted to build (but everyone seems to want), but made it part of a mefi pro (at say $3-$4/month)-- if anyone would use it, and if so, would it really keep other sections of the site much clearer of folks chewing fat in the breeze? I dunno.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 1:25 AM on March 10, 2005
posted by mathowie (staff) at 1:25 AM on March 10, 2005
From (presumably) Matt's email to the question-poster:
posted by orthogonality at 1:26 AM on March 10, 2005
You're seeking experiences and opinions without a goal in mind. I can't really imagine how it could be refactored into something useful for the site. It seems like you just have some subtle curiosity about what folks do when they're drunk or something and maybe that's best just a general question floated out onto a blog.From the front page side-blog:
While it could have been fairly chatty, this Ask MeFi post on childhood experiences that changed your life is really great reading.Text of that question, which received 213 responses:
"Life-altering experiences. Can you point to a single experience in your life, as a child, which you can define as having contributed to the person you are today?Another recent Ask Mefi, not deleted, with 37 responses:
(+)
I guess I'm looking for an experience which you can look back on and say " That shaped my personality as an adult." An example might be: I went to a slaughterhouse and decided to become a vegetarian.
Richard Feynman described thinking as basically just talking to yourself. [Eleven sentences elided]Another, also not deleted (ellipses in the original), which got 88 responses:
[...] Do successful artists see something in their mind that facilitates the painting process, and if people that can't paint as well (me) know the process of of [sic] how good painters paint, can I maybe start painting a whole lot better? What are some ways that you think while doing random actions?
How were you disciplined as a child? The topic of disciplining children and corporal punishment came up on the most recent episode of Real Time with Bill Maher, in reference to Jamie Foxx's Oscar speech (in which Foxx talked about his grandmother who "whipped him"). How were you disciplined as a child? ...by your parents? ...teachers? ...other authority figures? What kind of effect did this have on you at the time and now? How has it influenced your treatment of others? (Such as how you discipline your own children.)My feeling: It's Matt's web site, and he should delete or not delete as he sees fit. I really guess it does need to be in his hands, as I'm finding it hard to see a bright line that separates useful posts "seeking experiences and opinions without a goal in mind", which should be deleted, from posts "seeking experiences and opinions without a goal in mind", which attracted much community interest.
posted by orthogonality at 1:26 AM on March 10, 2005
Er, last para. s/useful/non-useful/
As usual, I blame my spellchecker and my staff.
posted by orthogonality at 1:29 AM on March 10, 2005
As usual, I blame my spellchecker and my staff.
posted by orthogonality at 1:29 AM on March 10, 2005
I wonder if I finally broke down and built the chatfilter I never wanted to build (but everyone seems to want), but made it part of a mefi pro (at say $3-$4/month)-- if anyone would use it, and if so, would it really keep other sections of the site much clearer of folks chewing fat in the breeze? I dunno.
I dunno, too. People will always want an audience for their sallies and drolleries and bibble-bibble, and MeTa inevitably seems to offer the highly-trafficked Speaker's Corner where it happens, for better or worse.
Anyway, it already exists, doesn't it, in the form of #mefi?
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:36 AM on March 10, 2005
I dunno, too. People will always want an audience for their sallies and drolleries and bibble-bibble, and MeTa inevitably seems to offer the highly-trafficked Speaker's Corner where it happens, for better or worse.
Anyway, it already exists, doesn't it, in the form of #mefi?
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:36 AM on March 10, 2005
But yeah, that said, build it and charge through the nose! Metaghetto!
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:37 AM on March 10, 2005
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:37 AM on March 10, 2005
Anyway, it already exists, doesn't it, in the form of #mefi?
Well, since you brought it up (bleh) . . .
Yes and no. #mefi is composed largely of frequently posting/commenting MeFi users, and a large fraction of the discussion there is about Metafilter. However the real time nature of it and the fact that anything said more than 15 minutes ago basically does not exist make for a completely different dynamic. There is little interpersonal hostility in #mefi although the flavor of irony takes some newcomers a bit to adapt to and there is little tolerance for idiocy. I've never been in a channel with such a pervasive sense of community and I'm a very, very old hand at IRC.
I don't think the particular brand of irony, the communication dynamic, nor the general lack of fights/politics/bullshit is at all something that could be replicated on a web forum (Matt if you're reading this feel free to take that as a constructively intentioned challenge) and it seems increasingly apparent with the steady progression of Matt-questioning threads that perhaps some sort of pressure release is needed around here. Yes, I acknowledge my frequent participation in such threads and corresponding lack of impartiality.
Both IRC and web forums have the fact that they're on the Internet in common, but outside of that the two are completely different in the way people interact with them and with each other on them that they are for all intents and purposes exist as wholly different mediums.
posted by Ryvar at 2:08 AM on March 10, 2005
Well, since you brought it up (bleh) . . .
Yes and no. #mefi is composed largely of frequently posting/commenting MeFi users, and a large fraction of the discussion there is about Metafilter. However the real time nature of it and the fact that anything said more than 15 minutes ago basically does not exist make for a completely different dynamic. There is little interpersonal hostility in #mefi although the flavor of irony takes some newcomers a bit to adapt to and there is little tolerance for idiocy. I've never been in a channel with such a pervasive sense of community and I'm a very, very old hand at IRC.
I don't think the particular brand of irony, the communication dynamic, nor the general lack of fights/politics/bullshit is at all something that could be replicated on a web forum (Matt if you're reading this feel free to take that as a constructively intentioned challenge) and it seems increasingly apparent with the steady progression of Matt-questioning threads that perhaps some sort of pressure release is needed around here. Yes, I acknowledge my frequent participation in such threads and corresponding lack of impartiality.
Both IRC and web forums have the fact that they're on the Internet in common, but outside of that the two are completely different in the way people interact with them and with each other on them that they are for all intents and purposes exist as wholly different mediums.
posted by Ryvar at 2:08 AM on March 10, 2005
Go, on, , delete the thread about deleting a thread about a deleted thread. I dare you.
Deletion callouts are so cliche, anyway.
posted by mek at 2:22 AM on March 10, 2005
Deletion callouts are so cliche, anyway.
posted by mek at 2:22 AM on March 10, 2005
I wonder if I finally broke down and built the chatfilter I never wanted to build (but everyone seems to want), but made it part of a mefi pro (at say $3-$4/month)-- if anyone would use it, and if so, would it really keep other sections of the site much clearer of folks chewing fat in the breeze? I dunno.
Hey, I have a cunning plan:
Put a link in the masthead saying "MetaChat," or "ChatFilter." Then, when people click on the link, it leads to a page that directs them to a decent irc client for their platform of choice and the #mefi channel.
I'm actually serious about this. I think that people who want to chat aimlessly with MeFi folk (not a bad thing, necessarily) would then go "HOLY SHIT! THE UNTAPPED RESOURCE!" and then be sated. I think anyone who would ignore the page and post here anyway is going to be a problem no matter WHAT you do. I know, for myself, that I didn't even know #mefi existed until someone mentioned it offhandedly as a comment to a thread I was following a couple weeks ago.
posted by shmegegge at 3:10 AM on March 10, 2005
Hey, I have a cunning plan:
Put a link in the masthead saying "MetaChat," or "ChatFilter." Then, when people click on the link, it leads to a page that directs them to a decent irc client for their platform of choice and the #mefi channel.
I'm actually serious about this. I think that people who want to chat aimlessly with MeFi folk (not a bad thing, necessarily) would then go "HOLY SHIT! THE UNTAPPED RESOURCE!" and then be sated. I think anyone who would ignore the page and post here anyway is going to be a problem no matter WHAT you do. I know, for myself, that I didn't even know #mefi existed until someone mentioned it offhandedly as a comment to a thread I was following a couple weeks ago.
posted by shmegegge at 3:10 AM on March 10, 2005
orthogonality, I also talked specifically to the original poster about how there aren't hard and fast rules and that sometimes questions that don't fit the norm do turn out to be successful.
The first one, about childhood experiences had a goal. A new father wanted to know what his two year old was going through. The other two are chatty and I honestly didn't see them or read about them until now, and do follow.
My point is that asking folks if they think they're creative when they're drunk seems not just like a hypothetical that is typically frowned upon, but a hypothetical that isn't one of those universal, shared things. He tried to couch it in a quote from someone famous that contradicted the point in the first place, so it looked like grasping at straws to make this hypothetical look like it had a reason for being.
The problem as I see it is that if everyone got to ask their personal hypothetical question they've always wanted to ask, it wouldn't be a very good shared community resource.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:14 AM on March 10, 2005 [1 favorite]
The first one, about childhood experiences had a goal. A new father wanted to know what his two year old was going through. The other two are chatty and I honestly didn't see them or read about them until now, and do follow.
My point is that asking folks if they think they're creative when they're drunk seems not just like a hypothetical that is typically frowned upon, but a hypothetical that isn't one of those universal, shared things. He tried to couch it in a quote from someone famous that contradicted the point in the first place, so it looked like grasping at straws to make this hypothetical look like it had a reason for being.
The problem as I see it is that if everyone got to ask their personal hypothetical question they've always wanted to ask, it wouldn't be a very good shared community resource.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 9:14 AM on March 10, 2005 [1 favorite]
just wait till justin's cousin amber hears about this.
I just heard. It shouldn't have been deleted--and what orthogonality said. Why do some stay, and even get sidebar'd and others deleted?
we're third cousins, twice removed ; >
posted by amberglow at 9:18 AM on March 10, 2005
I just heard. It shouldn't have been deleted--and what orthogonality said. Why do some stay, and even get sidebar'd and others deleted?
we're third cousins, twice removed ; >
posted by amberglow at 9:18 AM on March 10, 2005
on preview: It's not a hypothetical, matt--we've most of us worked under influences and not, and can share that and whether it changed the work or didn't or whatever. Quoting King simply shows that some people disagree that it helps or is necessary.
posted by amberglow at 9:22 AM on March 10, 2005
posted by amberglow at 9:22 AM on March 10, 2005
Waffles are better than pancakes.
posted by puke & cry at 11:27 PM PST on March 9 [!]
Blasphemer!
posted by deborah at 9:26 AM on March 10, 2005
posted by puke & cry at 11:27 PM PST on March 9 [!]
Blasphemer!
posted by deborah at 9:26 AM on March 10, 2005
Matt,
If you build it, they will come :-)
Actually, I would probably sign up for this, as I don't mind to chat every once in a while as opposed to just reading the answers to specific questions.
posted by xammerboy at 9:28 AM on March 10, 2005
If you build it, they will come :-)
Actually, I would probably sign up for this, as I don't mind to chat every once in a while as opposed to just reading the answers to specific questions.
posted by xammerboy at 9:28 AM on March 10, 2005
What a shame.
I would have liked to know how pot/alcohol/meth is used in people's creative process
I think it's absolutely fascinating. I have tried an altered state or two...and it doesn't help. but I'm curious about those it does.
"What role does alcohol (specifically) play in your personal creative process?"
"It's basically asking folks to chat about alcohol without any point. The quote from King goes against what you're asking about which makes it all the more strange that you asked about it."
Let's see: How does alcohol act as a factor in creativity. It has a specific point. The role alcohol plays.
It's your site, do what you want, but I think this is just as relative of a question as the how to balance my table or how to fix my ipod.
posted by filmgeek at 2:00 PM on March 10, 2005
I would have liked to know how pot/alcohol/meth is used in people's creative process
I think it's absolutely fascinating. I have tried an altered state or two...and it doesn't help. but I'm curious about those it does.
"What role does alcohol (specifically) play in your personal creative process?"
"It's basically asking folks to chat about alcohol without any point. The quote from King goes against what you're asking about which makes it all the more strange that you asked about it."
Let's see: How does alcohol act as a factor in creativity. It has a specific point. The role alcohol plays.
It's your site, do what you want, but I think this is just as relative of a question as the how to balance my table or how to fix my ipod.
posted by filmgeek at 2:00 PM on March 10, 2005
Related query: what positive role do you mistakenly assume substance use plays in your creative output because you're too drunk/stoned to tell shit from shinola and your critical support structure is a bunch of unemployed twenty-something losers who can't find their own assholes on a bet?
Not that I specifically feel this way in general, but, hello, other side of the coin.
posted by cortex at 3:06 PM on March 10, 2005
Not that I specifically feel this way in general, but, hello, other side of the coin.
posted by cortex at 3:06 PM on March 10, 2005
Put a link in the masthead saying "MetaChat," or "ChatFilter." Then, when people click on the link, it leads to a page that directs them to a decent irc client for their platform of choice and the #mefi channel.
Bad idea, and let me explain why. What an IRC channel needs to stay healthy is not a massive loss or influx of users but rather a steady trickle. Right now this is accomplished with the irc.metafilter.com DNS pointer, the mention in the Etc. page, and sporadic references in MeTa. It's good, it works. We have a very slow trickle of newcomers, and retain anywhere between 30-50% of them longterm (educated guess here). Too many people in or out and the sense of continuity within the community is destroyed, and a more or less new community forms that may not work as well as the previous one.
I don't hold out a lot of hope, having seen what a lot of IRC channels are generally like, for any reformation of #mefi being for the better. A while back there was discussion between various #mefi people and Matt, who was considering cutting off all ties between MeFi and #mefi. All of us argued against it not just for the stated reasons but because it would result in stagnation and eventual death of the channel (not to mention internal politics would almost certainly arise). Formally recognizing/broadcasting its existence would kill it just as surely, not only because the text flow rate would render it unreadable, but the sense that we all know and like each other would be lost.
It's better off as it is right now.
posted by Ryvar at 6:14 PM on March 10, 2005
Bad idea, and let me explain why. What an IRC channel needs to stay healthy is not a massive loss or influx of users but rather a steady trickle. Right now this is accomplished with the irc.metafilter.com DNS pointer, the mention in the Etc. page, and sporadic references in MeTa. It's good, it works. We have a very slow trickle of newcomers, and retain anywhere between 30-50% of them longterm (educated guess here). Too many people in or out and the sense of continuity within the community is destroyed, and a more or less new community forms that may not work as well as the previous one.
I don't hold out a lot of hope, having seen what a lot of IRC channels are generally like, for any reformation of #mefi being for the better. A while back there was discussion between various #mefi people and Matt, who was considering cutting off all ties between MeFi and #mefi. All of us argued against it not just for the stated reasons but because it would result in stagnation and eventual death of the channel (not to mention internal politics would almost certainly arise). Formally recognizing/broadcasting its existence would kill it just as surely, not only because the text flow rate would render it unreadable, but the sense that we all know and like each other would be lost.
It's better off as it is right now.
posted by Ryvar at 6:14 PM on March 10, 2005
Wow, this got way out of hand. I never meant to make a big deal out of it.
I originally posted the question on MetaTalk because I had recieved no email stating why the post was deleted (I had in the past). I didn't figure there was only one person doing the moderating. After I posted, I decided to send Mathowie an email, since he's the one who deleted a post of mine a few weeks back, and I thought maybe he could point me in the right direction.
just wait till justin's cousin amber hears about this.
No relation...(I don't think)
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
I'm not sure WHY you'd feel this way when I specifically told you to delete the MetaTalk thread after I got an answer from you...
posted by nitsuj at 6:40 AM on March 11, 2005
I originally posted the question on MetaTalk because I had recieved no email stating why the post was deleted (I had in the past). I didn't figure there was only one person doing the moderating. After I posted, I decided to send Mathowie an email, since he's the one who deleted a post of mine a few weeks back, and I thought maybe he could point me in the right direction.
just wait till justin's cousin amber hears about this.
No relation...(I don't think)
It also seemed like maybe there was an ulterior motive to email me, wait thirty seconds, then post the exact same thing here with a link to his own site.
I'm not sure WHY you'd feel this way when I specifically told you to delete the MetaTalk thread after I got an answer from you...
posted by nitsuj at 6:40 AM on March 11, 2005
I'd like to also mention that I'm really not trying to create a mess with this. This is Matt's site, he can moderate it how he wants to. I know the kid of position he's in; I have to moderate about 5,000 users on my website - I know how it can be.
I just feel that because I had had an earlier post to AskMefi deleted, once Matt saw this new post (the alcohol related one) he said to himself "oh great, this guy again - asking "irrelevant" questions".
I too felt that I could scour AskMefi and find other examples of questions of a similar nature which flourished, and (obviously) weren't deleted.
Again, I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass here. Actually, I hope that the now-deleted questions I've asked will help Matt create better guidelines.
posted by nitsuj at 7:02 AM on March 11, 2005
I just feel that because I had had an earlier post to AskMefi deleted, once Matt saw this new post (the alcohol related one) he said to himself "oh great, this guy again - asking "irrelevant" questions".
I too felt that I could scour AskMefi and find other examples of questions of a similar nature which flourished, and (obviously) weren't deleted.
Again, I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass here. Actually, I hope that the now-deleted questions I've asked will help Matt create better guidelines.
posted by nitsuj at 7:02 AM on March 11, 2005
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Neither Ask Metafilter nor Metatalk has a mechanism for finding deleted posts. I understand the desire to filter poor content, but I always understood Metatalk to be an area for the discussion of such content's worthiness. Suppressing such discussion (which is what this is) only alienates the users and erodes the community, instilling the feeling that the content is being censored without the users' knowledge or consent.
posted by azazello at 7:01 PM on March 9, 2005