Columbine Callout July 7, 2006 7:02 AM Subscribe
I guess we haven't grown up yet. This is about to get ugly, I think.
I don't believe in the doctrine of the pre-emptive callout.
posted by George_Spiggott at 7:11 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by George_Spiggott at 7:11 AM on July 7, 2006
Eh? It's catty, but I don't see any need to trundle off ot the panic room.
posted by cortex at 7:11 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by cortex at 7:11 AM on July 7, 2006
I think it's a reasonably civil disagreement, and I also am optimistic that it'll (largely) stay that way. Lots of people have strong feelings about their own High School years and how their children's High School years should be. And the reminder of these cruel murders brings all of those feelings right to the surface.
Yeah, catty's a good word for it.
posted by Plutor at 7:13 AM on July 7, 2006
Yeah, catty's a good word for it.
posted by Plutor at 7:13 AM on July 7, 2006
It looks like a fairly civil, spirited discussion to me. If anything, I'd say it's too many carbs for pastabagel.
posted by SteveInMaine at 7:34 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
posted by SteveInMaine at 7:34 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
It's Meta posts like this that make me feel that some people are absolutely terrified that a debate might occur on Mefi. Debates are great because it opens your eyes to more than one viewpoint and, as long as no mud-slinging or name-calling occurs, it's completely harmless. Hell, I've been caught out for having a pretty shit viewpoint and have felt all the more passionate to discuss it and the alternative.
Are we so scared of debate that we can only post about things that everyone can agree on? Because I'm making this great post on cardboard boxes... there's nothing in the boxes mind you.
posted by Serial Killer Slumber Party at 7:47 AM on July 7, 2006
Are we so scared of debate that we can only post about things that everyone can agree on? Because I'm making this great post on cardboard boxes... there's nothing in the boxes mind you.
posted by Serial Killer Slumber Party at 7:47 AM on July 7, 2006
It would be nice if people would explain their metatalk posts after they post them. You know, maybe lay out the point of it all, link to a few examples that support the point.
Reading metatalk is like reading a crystal ball lately.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 8:36 AM on July 7, 2006
Reading metatalk is like reading a crystal ball lately.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 8:36 AM on July 7, 2006
You weren't so tough that day, were you? is not debate & it's not just offensive. Maybe it means something more to me because someone close to me was there. I am glad to see others stepped up & took him to task for it, I think that's enough to satisfy me.
posted by scalefree at 8:49 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 8:49 AM on July 7, 2006
Welcome to the Internet, where your tenderest feelings are fair game. Glad to see it worked out.
posted by deadfather at 8:57 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by deadfather at 8:57 AM on July 7, 2006
We HAVE grown up. Otherwise by now this thread would be full of inline images of dancing monkeys doing NSFW things with crystal balls.
(Get to work, photoshoppers!)
posted by mds35 at 9:26 AM on July 7, 2006
(Get to work, photoshoppers!)
posted by mds35 at 9:26 AM on July 7, 2006
Maybe it means something more to me because someone close to me was there.
Ah. Not to in any way diminish your feelings, but it would probably be a good rule for people who feel personally involved with a topic to recognize that they're incapable of being objective not only about the topic but about MeFi discussions of the topic. Not saying you shouldn't participate in the thread, but dragging it to MeTa wasn't the best idea. Having read the thread now, I'm surprised at how civil it is. Surely you know that you can't expect a MeFi thread to be entirely without nasty/dumb comments.
posted by languagehat at 9:27 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
Ah. Not to in any way diminish your feelings, but it would probably be a good rule for people who feel personally involved with a topic to recognize that they're incapable of being objective not only about the topic but about MeFi discussions of the topic. Not saying you shouldn't participate in the thread, but dragging it to MeTa wasn't the best idea. Having read the thread now, I'm surprised at how civil it is. Surely you know that you can't expect a MeFi thread to be entirely without nasty/dumb comments.
posted by languagehat at 9:27 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
What the hell? That thread is goddamn tame. I mean, it's about a pretty gruesome and emotional subject, and hardly a "fuck you, too!" to be found. Shit, this might as well be out new gold standard.
MeTorium, please.
posted by absalom at 9:33 AM on July 7, 2006
MeTorium, please.
posted by absalom at 9:33 AM on July 7, 2006
Hell, we have argued more forcefully about using open wireless signals and declawing cats.
Both of which are fine, by the way.
posted by LarryC at 9:37 AM on July 7, 2006
Both of which are fine, by the way.
posted by LarryC at 9:37 AM on July 7, 2006
I want a panic room full of dancing monkeys.
Oh, and the thread IS pretty tame overall.
Beath in, breath out
posted by edgeways at 9:39 AM on July 7, 2006
Oh, and the thread IS pretty tame overall.
Beath in, breath out
posted by edgeways at 9:39 AM on July 7, 2006
Ah, but were they circumsized?
posted by slimepuppy at 9:52 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by slimepuppy at 9:52 AM on July 7, 2006
I declawed my neighbor's cat. Hey, it was just wandering around in my yard. I figured if they didn't want me to declaw the cat, they would have locked it up or something.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:55 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:55 AM on July 7, 2006
as long as no mud-slinging or name-calling occurs, it's completely harmless
Even if mud-slinging and name-calling occurs, those photons emanating from my LCD are still pretty harmless.
posted by TedW at 9:55 AM on July 7, 2006
Even if mud-slinging and name-calling occurs, those photons emanating from my LCD are still pretty harmless.
posted by TedW at 9:55 AM on July 7, 2006
So say you've got this pub where you let people declaw cats. Then these other folks come in and start offering circumcisions. Wouldn't you want to control the fatties in the SUVs, rather than let them hang their Israeli flags all over the place while listening to Insane Clown Posse?
That's what net neutrality is all about.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 9:58 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
That's what net neutrality is all about.
posted by PinkStainlessTail at 9:58 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
In the event, it ended up not getting ugly. At the time I started this thread, this was the most recent comment in the originating thread. Yes I have a personal connection that might've made me jumpy but even so I disagree with the trend I've seen of letting a flamewar spiral out of control then dissecting its aftermath for clues. I'm not looking to make MeFi Disney-safe but I think it's a much better strategy to put out some sparks early on than try to stamp out a fully involved fire. I'm not a newcomer, I've been on the Internet longer than you have (19 years come September) & I have a lot of experience in dealing with flamewars to draw on. I guess it all depends on whether people are interested in building a community or just posting links.
posted by scalefree at 10:00 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 10:00 AM on July 7, 2006
Building a community sometimes means having reasonable disagreements and arguments. What did you want to come out of this thread? Deletions? Certainly none were warranted here.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 10:06 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by monju_bosatsu at 10:06 AM on July 7, 2006
It always amazes me the way people throw the "community" term around online like it means Shangrifreakinla. Keep in mind - high school was a community, too.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 10:13 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 10:13 AM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
I didn't call for deletions or even suspensions. All I called for was attention, but I didn't want it to happen in-band with the thread because I've seen how even that can add fuel to the fire or disrupt the flow of any positive discussion going on. I like the idea of having an out-of-band channel dedicated to meta-discussion about a thread that doesn't belong in the main thread itself & I decided to use it. Overall I'm happy with how it turned out, although in retrospect I probably should've waited for a few more angry comments to appear.
posted by scalefree at 10:20 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 10:20 AM on July 7, 2006
MetaFilter: All I called for was attention.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 10:23 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by monju_bosatsu at 10:23 AM on July 7, 2006
Not all communities are positive, sure. The Manson Family was a community too, but we all know that's not the kind I meant. But the ideal of community is a positive one & that's what I'm striving for, not here exclusively but as a general principle in the forums I participate in.
posted by scalefree at 10:25 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 10:25 AM on July 7, 2006
Shit, all it takes to be a community is belief that the community exists. (Sure, he's talking about nation-states, but I believe the idea scales well.)
posted by absalom at 10:32 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by absalom at 10:32 AM on July 7, 2006
Metafilter: I've been on the Internet longer than you have.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 10:36 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by mr_crash_davis at 10:36 AM on July 7, 2006
MetaTalk: Have not!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 10:47 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 10:47 AM on July 7, 2006
AskMetafilter: Why do some people think they have been on the internet longer than me? Are they crazy, or just misinformed?
posted by InfidelZombie at 10:58 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by InfidelZombie at 10:58 AM on July 7, 2006
Mefi Projects: I've created a GreaseMonkey Filter to prove how long I've been on the Internet...
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 11:03 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 11:03 AM on July 7, 2006
I've been on the internet since I was in diapers.
that was about 2 weeks ago.
posted by puke & cry at 11:13 AM on July 7, 2006
that was about 2 weeks ago.
posted by puke & cry at 11:13 AM on July 7, 2006
I was on the internet before there were computers.
It was hard, but we buckled down and did it! We weren't like you lazy kids.
posted by Floydd at 11:16 AM on July 7, 2006
It was hard, but we buckled down and did it! We weren't like you lazy kids.
posted by Floydd at 11:16 AM on July 7, 2006
Shit, all it takes to be a community is belief that the community exists.
No, that is a granfalloon.
posted by LarryC at 11:25 AM on July 7, 2006
No, that is a granfalloon.
posted by LarryC at 11:25 AM on July 7, 2006
Metafilter Music: Everyone Has Been On The Internet (Longer Than Someone Else).mp3
posted by funambulist at 11:46 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by funambulist at 11:46 AM on July 7, 2006
MetaChat: OMG! The first bunnies on the Internet!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 11:49 AM on July 7, 2006
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 11:49 AM on July 7, 2006
Metafilter Music: Everyone Has Been On The Internet (Longer Than Someone Else).mp3
*stares at cortex expectantly*
posted by raedyn at 1:01 PM on July 7, 2006
*stares at cortex expectantly*
posted by raedyn at 1:01 PM on July 7, 2006
Al'gorically speaking.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:22 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:22 PM on July 7, 2006
I just got ugly.
posted by Astro Zombie at 2:30 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by Astro Zombie at 2:30 PM on July 7, 2006
Not all communities are positive, sure. The Manson Family was a community too
A new twist on Godwin's Law.
posted by eyeballkid at 2:30 PM on July 7, 2006
A new twist on Godwin's Law.
posted by eyeballkid at 2:30 PM on July 7, 2006
oh and
Metafilter: The Manson Family was a community too.
posted by eyeballkid at 2:31 PM on July 7, 2006
Metafilter: The Manson Family was a community too.
posted by eyeballkid at 2:31 PM on July 7, 2006
Metafilter: in retrospect I probably should've waited.
Also, I'm very concerned about how the discussion might possibly evolve in the fifth link posted on the 22nd of next month. Keep an eye on it, okay?
posted by Drastic at 2:44 PM on July 7, 2006
Also, I'm very concerned about how the discussion might possibly evolve in the fifth link posted on the 22nd of next month. Keep an eye on it, okay?
posted by Drastic at 2:44 PM on July 7, 2006
I was looking at that one too. It's got a very suspicious way about it.
posted by Astro Zombie at 3:01 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by Astro Zombie at 3:01 PM on July 7, 2006
Y'all have your fun & I'll watch you handle the next couple flamewars, then we'll come back to the subject & discuss how successful you were.
posted by scalefree at 3:12 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 3:12 PM on July 7, 2006
You're the ant and the rest of us are grasshoppers. Got it.
posted by Gator at 3:20 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by Gator at 3:20 PM on July 7, 2006
I guess it all depends on whether people are interested in building a community or just posting links.
It would appear that we've already built a rather splendid community, thanks very much dollface. I do hope I'm as pompous as you when I've been on the internet for 19 years, though.
posted by jack_mo at 3:31 PM on July 7, 2006
It would appear that we've already built a rather splendid community, thanks very much dollface. I do hope I'm as pompous as you when I've been on the internet for 19 years, though.
posted by jack_mo at 3:31 PM on July 7, 2006
Y'all have your fun & I'll watch you handle the next couple flamewars, then we'll come back to the subject & discuss how successful you were.
Uh yeah. You do that. We'll be sure to take notes.
posted by eyeballkid at 3:41 PM on July 7, 2006
Uh yeah. You do that. We'll be sure to take notes.
posted by eyeballkid at 3:41 PM on July 7, 2006
Y'all have your fun & I'll watch you handle the next couple flamewars, then we'll come back to the subject & discuss how successful you were.
posted by scalefree at 3:12 PM PST on July 7
Right, and then we'll know who's tough and who's not. Got it.
posted by Tuwa at 3:55 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 3:12 PM PST on July 7
Right, and then we'll know who's tough and who's not. Got it.
posted by Tuwa at 3:55 PM on July 7, 2006
scalefree : "Y'all have your fun & I'll watch you handle the next couple flamewars, then we'll come back to the subject & discuss how successful you were."
Well, hell, why wait? Just go back in the archives; MeFi has been in existence for a few years, we've already had some flame wars. No need to wait for new ones, unless there's been some new revision in how they're performed.
posted by Bugbread at 4:05 PM on July 7, 2006
Well, hell, why wait? Just go back in the archives; MeFi has been in existence for a few years, we've already had some flame wars. No need to wait for new ones, unless there's been some new revision in how they're performed.
posted by Bugbread at 4:05 PM on July 7, 2006
scalefree with be watching us for SCIENCE!
posted by puke & cry at 4:09 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by puke & cry at 4:09 PM on July 7, 2006
Little known fact: after 15 years online you become eligible for an official pomposity license, sort of like the badge SNL gives you for hosting the show 5 times. Mine's countersigned by spaf, tale & mudge.
posted by scalefree at 4:46 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 4:46 PM on July 7, 2006
How do you define "online"? If BBSes count, then I should have some kind of golden gilded license written by hand by Gregorian monks.
posted by Bugbread at 4:51 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by Bugbread at 4:51 PM on July 7, 2006
scalefree flame out now? no?
posted by languagehat at 4:55 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by languagehat at 4:55 PM on July 7, 2006
I was just counting Internet time. If I counted BBSes & X.25 timesharing systems then it'd be closer to 25 years for me.
posted by scalefree at 5:07 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by scalefree at 5:07 PM on July 7, 2006
Truly, your virtual cock is the mightiest.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 5:22 PM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
posted by mr_crash_davis at 5:22 PM on July 7, 2006 [1 favorite]
we're not worthy! we're not worthy!
posted by pyramid termite at 5:24 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by pyramid termite at 5:24 PM on July 7, 2006
I was just counting Internet time. If I counted BBSes & X.25 timesharing systems then it'd be closer to 25 years for me.
Oh my God, just reading that makes me hard.
posted by jack_mo at 5:37 PM on July 7, 2006
Oh my God, just reading that makes me hard.
posted by jack_mo at 5:37 PM on July 7, 2006
Poor languagehat is still hankering for a decent flameout. Somebody be a sport and oblige the man, OK?
I'd offer to do it myself but it would undoubtedly be too ... quiet ...
posted by Quietgal at 5:41 PM on July 7, 2006
I'd offer to do it myself but it would undoubtedly be too ... quiet ...
posted by Quietgal at 5:41 PM on July 7, 2006
i feel like a fool ... i could have been doing all that in 1981, but i was too busy closing down bars and getting laid
foolish, foolish youth ...
(my brother's been "online" for 25 years, too ... my KID brother, i mean)
sheesh ...
posted by pyramid termite at 5:42 PM on July 7, 2006
foolish, foolish youth ...
(my brother's been "online" for 25 years, too ... my KID brother, i mean)
sheesh ...
posted by pyramid termite at 5:42 PM on July 7, 2006
.... still waiting for the goddamned dancing monkeys somebody promised...
posted by Kraftmatic Adjustable Cheese at 5:47 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by Kraftmatic Adjustable Cheese at 5:47 PM on July 7, 2006
That's nothing, cortex. I was reading Ceefax pages in 1981.
posted by jack_mo at 5:48 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by jack_mo at 5:48 PM on July 7, 2006
I just hope everyone reading that thread was wearing their seatbelts.
posted by haqspan at 6:37 PM on July 7, 2006
posted by haqspan at 6:37 PM on July 7, 2006
scalefree writes "I'm not looking to make MeFi Disney-safe but I think it's a much better strategy to put out some sparks early on than try to stamp out a fully involved fire."
You should link to the metatalk thread in the thread then otherwise people engaged in the thread won't notice.
scalefree writes "I'm not a newcomer, I've been on the Internet longer than you have (19 years come September)"
No, you haven't, and I'll ask you kindly to get off my lawn.
Drastic writes "Also, I'm very concerned about how the discussion might possibly evolve in the fifth link posted on the 22nd of next month. Keep an eye on it, okay?"
It's too bad Matt closed that exploit that let you post threads in the future.
posted by Mitheral at 7:55 PM on July 7, 2006
You should link to the metatalk thread in the thread then otherwise people engaged in the thread won't notice.
scalefree writes "I'm not a newcomer, I've been on the Internet longer than you have (19 years come September)"
No, you haven't, and I'll ask you kindly to get off my lawn.
Drastic writes "Also, I'm very concerned about how the discussion might possibly evolve in the fifth link posted on the 22nd of next month. Keep an eye on it, okay?"
It's too bad Matt closed that exploit that let you post threads in the future.
posted by Mitheral at 7:55 PM on July 7, 2006
It's too bad Matt closed that exploit that let you post threads in the future.
He only thinks he did but he didn't know he also had to fix it in the alternate universe behind the holographic portal at Los Alamos. So I just hacked myself into the alternate reality where MeFi isn't patched against future hacks. Which turns out to be this universe after all.
posted by scalefree at 8:59 PM on July 7, 2006
He only thinks he did but he didn't know he also had to fix it in the alternate universe behind the holographic portal at Los Alamos. So I just hacked myself into the alternate reality where MeFi isn't patched against future hacks. Which turns out to be this universe after all.
posted by scalefree at 8:59 PM on July 7, 2006
I invented Al Gore.
Damn you kids for rewinding reality. Stop that.
posted by ?! at 9:24 PM on July 7, 2006
Damn you kids for rewinding reality. Stop that.
posted by ?! at 9:24 PM on July 7, 2006
I invented George Bush.
And turd-flavored ice cream, but that's not as popular.
posted by Tuwa at 10:18 PM on July 7, 2006
And turd-flavored ice cream, but that's not as popular.
posted by Tuwa at 10:18 PM on July 7, 2006
next time you guys "invent" someone, wear a raincoat, will ya?
So I just hacked myself into the alternate reality where MeFi isn't patched against future hacks.
and he did it all with an atari400 and a 300 baud modem ...
look, when i was starting out on the internet, i had to stand on a hill and send morse code by flashlight to get anything done ... you don't know how easy you had it
posted by pyramid termite at 10:45 PM on July 7, 2006
So I just hacked myself into the alternate reality where MeFi isn't patched against future hacks.
and he did it all with an atari400 and a 300 baud modem ...
look, when i was starting out on the internet, i had to stand on a hill and send morse code by flashlight to get anything done ... you don't know how easy you had it
posted by pyramid termite at 10:45 PM on July 7, 2006
You had a flashlight? I had to use a jar of fireflies. Was it solar powered?
posted by Kirth Gerson at 4:11 AM on July 8, 2006
posted by Kirth Gerson at 4:11 AM on July 8, 2006
Kirth Gerson : "You had a flashlight? I had to use a jar of fireflies."
They hadn't invented jars yet when I first got on the internet.
And let me tell you, typing was a bitch, considering that opposable thumbs hadn't been evolved yet.
posted by Bugbread at 6:01 AM on July 8, 2006
They hadn't invented jars yet when I first got on the internet.
And let me tell you, typing was a bitch, considering that opposable thumbs hadn't been evolved yet.
posted by Bugbread at 6:01 AM on July 8, 2006
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posted by wheelieman at 7:09 AM on July 7, 2006