Politics Callout November 7, 2004 3:56 PM Subscribe
May I say that if there must be politics in AskMe, papercake's scrupulously value-neutral question is the way to do it? And thank you, SidheDevil, for the brief teacher's-ruler-across-the-knuckles that kept us on topic.
Bravo, papercake. Absolutely first rate!
posted by NotMyselfRightNow at 5:18 PM on November 7, 2004
posted by NotMyselfRightNow at 5:18 PM on November 7, 2004
It was a dear and wonderful thread; I learned nothing from it, and I could have built it myself by spreading out a sackful of words and assembling them into predictable piles; but it was a dear and wonderful thread - so quiet and so polite. Thanks everyone!
posted by Opus Dark at 5:47 PM on November 7, 2004
posted by Opus Dark at 5:47 PM on November 7, 2004
I loved that thread: it saved me making my list of those first-against-the-wall -- they're all in one handy place.
I can't decide whether it's the nature of the thing -- do all reasons given for supporting politicians sounds like ass, much like love letters not written for you do -- or is it just Republican rhetoric that's so charmingly contorted?
Not that they were all ass, of course, some were enchantingly pragmatic, but jesus, some of them were blinkered twaddle. And they won! There's more of them than there is of us!
posted by bonaldi at 6:40 PM on November 7, 2004
I can't decide whether it's the nature of the thing -- do all reasons given for supporting politicians sounds like ass, much like love letters not written for you do -- or is it just Republican rhetoric that's so charmingly contorted?
Not that they were all ass, of course, some were enchantingly pragmatic, but jesus, some of them were blinkered twaddle. And they won! There's more of them than there is of us!
posted by bonaldi at 6:40 PM on November 7, 2004
There's more of them than there is of us!
No no no, there's actually more of us than there is of them, but some of them don't know it yet.
posted by Jimbob at 8:44 PM on November 7, 2004
No no no, there's actually more of us than there is of them, but some of them don't know it yet.
posted by Jimbob at 8:44 PM on November 7, 2004
Or rather why can't all politics on MeFi be as civilized as that discussion?
posted by jmd82 at 10:16 PM on November 7, 2004
posted by jmd82 at 10:16 PM on November 7, 2004
I think all political discussion on Mefi should be held according to Robert's (completely aggravating) Rules of Order. Move to approve this suggestion, does anyone second?
posted by Stan Chin at 11:56 PM on November 7, 2004
posted by Stan Chin at 11:56 PM on November 7, 2004
I loved that thread: it saved me making my list of those first-against-the-wall -- they're all in one handy place.
Dude, there are too many of us Bush voters for us all to be first against the wall.
posted by kindall at 11:57 PM on November 7, 2004
Dude, there are too many of us Bush voters for us all to be first against the wall.
posted by kindall at 11:57 PM on November 7, 2004
I thought it was a useful discussion and the original poster did have to be heavy handed to keep people from sniping at each others ankles or challenging each other to a duel.
Whether or not you agree with their points of view, it's great to hear a "minority" viewpoint expressed on MetaFilter: why one would vote for Bush, sans all the typical snarking.
If you guys can't listen to a Bush supporter explain their reasons with an open mind, you probably have more of a closed mind than those you rail against. Think about it.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 12:04 AM on November 8, 2004
Whether or not you agree with their points of view, it's great to hear a "minority" viewpoint expressed on MetaFilter: why one would vote for Bush, sans all the typical snarking.
If you guys can't listen to a Bush supporter explain their reasons with an open mind, you probably have more of a closed mind than those you rail against. Think about it.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 12:04 AM on November 8, 2004
Actually, I found Sidhedevil's comment to be confusing and out of place because the thread was civil and on topic as it was. It was like if you were chatting with a somebody and a random person jumped in between the two of you and started screaming for you to stop fighting.
posted by euphorb at 12:04 AM on November 8, 2004
posted by euphorb at 12:04 AM on November 8, 2004
50% of those polled after voting thought Saddam had something to do with 9/11. This is reason enough to have contempt for half of America, no matter how they voted. Cheers!
posted by The God Complex at 12:18 AM on November 8, 2004
posted by The God Complex at 12:18 AM on November 8, 2004
If you guys can't listen to a Bush supporter explain their reasons with an open mind, you probably have more of a closed mind than those you rail against. Think about it.
Matt, that thought, almost word for word, goes through my mind everytime I hear a self-proclaimed "tolerant" liberal snarling away at anything that doesn't sit with his/her viewpoint.
posted by SpaceCadet at 1:25 AM on November 8, 2004
Matt, that thought, almost word for word, goes through my mind everytime I hear a self-proclaimed "tolerant" liberal snarling away at anything that doesn't sit with his/her viewpoint.
posted by SpaceCadet at 1:25 AM on November 8, 2004
50% of those polled after voting thought Saddam had something to do with 9/11. This is reason enough to have contempt for half of America, no matter how they voted. Cheers!
Well, there was also the fact that there was massive government propoganda used to promote that view.
Not that it makes the veiw correct, but people use propoganda cause it works. Especially since most people didn't like Saddam much anyway.
posted by jonmc at 9:23 AM on November 8, 2004
Well, there was also the fact that there was massive government propoganda used to promote that view.
Not that it makes the veiw correct, but people use propoganda cause it works. Especially since most people didn't like Saddam much anyway.
posted by jonmc at 9:23 AM on November 8, 2004
The thread has been very useful for me. It's helped me to come down from my post-election freakout. My jaw has closed and my fists (and other things) have unclenched and I've finally started to see the Other Side as human beings who had their reasons, instead of Morons Who Voted The Wrong Way, as I found myself thinking. So, thanks to jfuller, jmd82 and the rest.
posted by papercake at 9:34 AM on November 8, 2004
posted by papercake at 9:34 AM on November 8, 2004
I didn't think that anyone's comments were uncivil at all. I just feared (and later posts seemed to bear this out) that if people felt that they would need to defend their rationales even to the kind of extraordinarily polite and civil and well-informed challenges that were being posted, they wouldn't post to the thread at all.
We've had a bunch of threads in the Blue that started off as intelligent, well-informed back-and-forth discussions and wound up devolving into slanging matches. I interpreted papercake's original post as asking for, just once, a simple outlet for statements rather than discussions, and it was something that I wanted desperately myself.
I found the thread really helpful for the following reasons: a) I think that I had very little sense of how many people are one-issue voters on the topic of abortion; and b) I was interested to hear people's rationales for supporting the war in Iraq.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:59 AM on November 8, 2004
We've had a bunch of threads in the Blue that started off as intelligent, well-informed back-and-forth discussions and wound up devolving into slanging matches. I interpreted papercake's original post as asking for, just once, a simple outlet for statements rather than discussions, and it was something that I wanted desperately myself.
I found the thread really helpful for the following reasons: a) I think that I had very little sense of how many people are one-issue voters on the topic of abortion; and b) I was interested to hear people's rationales for supporting the war in Iraq.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:59 AM on November 8, 2004
If you guys can't listen to a Bush supporter explain their reasons with an open mind, you probably have more of a closed mind than those you rail against. Think about it.
I can listen, consider, and comprehend your point, and still conclude that you're completely full of shit, can't I?
posted by crunchland at 10:59 AM on November 8, 2004
I can listen, consider, and comprehend your point, and still conclude that you're completely full of shit, can't I?
posted by crunchland at 10:59 AM on November 8, 2004
no, crunchland.
matt now has a frontal lobe entrothalpy para-modul-crapalyzer with internet extensions, so if you conclude the wrong thing he will take control of your mind and make you post stupid rhetorical questions to the grey until you're bitchslapped into submission by the newly formed metafiler thought police.
(what does bitchslapped mean? all the cool kids use it. i hope it's not rude.)
posted by andrew cooke at 11:52 AM on November 8, 2004
matt now has a frontal lobe entrothalpy para-modul-crapalyzer with internet extensions, so if you conclude the wrong thing he will take control of your mind and make you post stupid rhetorical questions to the grey until you're bitchslapped into submission by the newly formed metafiler thought police.
(what does bitchslapped mean? all the cool kids use it. i hope it's not rude.)
posted by andrew cooke at 11:52 AM on November 8, 2004
it *was* rude!
posted by andrew cooke at 12:09 PM on November 8, 2004
posted by andrew cooke at 12:09 PM on November 8, 2004
I can listen, consider, and comprehend your point, and still conclude that you're completely full of shit, can't I?
Yes, but you'll get more mileage out of the euphemism "agree to disagree."
:)
posted by scarabic at 1:10 PM on November 8, 2004
Yes, but you'll get more mileage out of the euphemism "agree to disagree."
:)
posted by scarabic at 1:10 PM on November 8, 2004
Whether or not you agree with their points of view, it's great to hear a "minority" viewpoint expressed on MetaFilter: why one would vote for Bush, sans all the typical snarking.
The only remarkable thing revealed by the thread in question is that nothing remarkable was revealed by the thread in question - which satisfies my twitchy fondness for ironic diagnosis, but not much else.
And of course a shell-shocked plea for Bush voters to please explain themselves is annoying; it's melodramatic kitsch, and it reinforces the liberals-are-pod-people caricature.
Now if you'll excuse me, one of my hollow-eyed Borgesian reflections is telling me that a meaty Republican has arrived to fix the hive's central hair dryer, and everyone is hurrying to get a look at him because none of us has ever actually seen one before.
posted by Opus Dark at 8:15 PM on November 8, 2004
The only remarkable thing revealed by the thread in question is that nothing remarkable was revealed by the thread in question - which satisfies my twitchy fondness for ironic diagnosis, but not much else.
And of course a shell-shocked plea for Bush voters to please explain themselves is annoying; it's melodramatic kitsch, and it reinforces the liberals-are-pod-people caricature.
Now if you'll excuse me, one of my hollow-eyed Borgesian reflections is telling me that a meaty Republican has arrived to fix the hive's central hair dryer, and everyone is hurrying to get a look at him because none of us has ever actually seen one before.
posted by Opus Dark at 8:15 PM on November 8, 2004
They'll get theirs.
posted by interrobang at 9:15 PM on November 8, 2004
posted by interrobang at 9:15 PM on November 8, 2004
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NO MORE US POLITICS FILTER!
posted by Quartermass at 5:04 PM on November 7, 2004