Self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors December 8, 2004 4:47 AM   Subscribe

I am struck by the amount of clutter which is created by apparently self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors. Comments on etiquette, self promotion etc are constructive, however what on earth (other than self promotion) is achieved by pointing out that you have seen something before or that it doesn't interest you. So what? I would have no interest whatsoever in a post linking to a 1973 article about bestiality amongst jazz lovers but that is just me and I am not small minded enough to pontificate against those who want to follow this particular hobby. The one thing I can conceive of that would be more tedious than reading the article would be wading through "old link - I've seen it before" or "this is boring". This is hypocrisy gone mad.
Anyone else?
posted by Cancergiggles to Etiquette/Policy at 4:47 AM (72 comments total)

This is hypocrisy gone mad.

So is your post, and this response.
posted by Ryvar at 4:55 AM on December 8, 2004


I was just going to post something about bestiality amongst jazz singers...but BoingBoing beat me to it.

I'm currently working on a FPP about famous goats that play the saxophone whilst being sodomized. It'll be grand.
posted by tpl1212 at 5:18 AM on December 8, 2004


Don't bother tpl1212 I've seen that before and it's pretty boring.
posted by john-paul at 5:22 AM on December 8, 2004


Is one of the goats called Clinton?
posted by Cancergiggles at 5:28 AM on December 8, 2004


Cancergiggles, please report immediately to MeFi Central for groupthink reeducation.
posted by veedubya at 5:42 AM on December 8, 2004


I've seen this metatalk thread dozens of times before and it has yet to interest me once. Dead memes are the broken dreams of the newbies on the scene. Don't make me spleen you anymore.
posted by The God Complex at 5:49 AM on December 8, 2004


I think we'd all be better off if everyone - and I'm looking squarely at you, neoFites - stopped posting dumb FPPs. Not everything your grandma forwards to you is worthy.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 5:54 AM on December 8, 2004


TGC, you must have read "Everything is Illuminated".
posted by taz at 5:55 AM on December 8, 2004


Good question that a lot of n00bs might have. I think it's useful to distinguish between criticism of a post that's inappropriate for the site, and a post that's not interesting to some people. The former is good, although people on occasion, myself included, often level such criticism with excessive glee, and within the thread, which should probably be avoided. The base impulse, though, is to encourage others to stick to the (loose) posting guidelines -- interesting things on the web that most people probably haven't seen -- and so make the site better. Again, I think that's good, but maybe not so attractive all the time.

As far as the "uninteresting" posts, I actually think MeFi is pretty tolerant of FPPs that appeal to narrow interests, and I haven't seen a lot of the "bor-ing" type callouts you refer to. Am I wrong about this?
posted by luser at 5:57 AM on December 8, 2004


Hence my cheap knock off of the Ukrainian translator last week (only more babelfishian) ;)

Although I actually have only read about 70% of it (for a class). I'll probably finish it this weekend.
posted by The God Complex at 5:58 AM on December 8, 2004


Cancergiggles, your post is an example of what we old farts call spitting into the wind. In other words, the grass is green, the sun rises in the east, sets in the west, and self-appointed sanctimonious pastel suited jackals prowl and howl. Just part of the landscape.
posted by konolia at 5:58 AM on December 8, 2004


You missed some commas and a few hyphens in there, konolia, but "pastel-suited jackals" is top notch. A good way for me to end the night (at 6AM, no less) and sleep the day away.

I dub this thread interesting.
posted by The God Complex at 6:00 AM on December 8, 2004


welcome to metafilter, cancergiggles. you're obviously very new here.
posted by crunchland at 6:01 AM on December 8, 2004


seriously, now (children), i think we're getting a little too sensitive about the need for great posts. so let's talk about me instead. when i made this comment i just wanted to discuss the ideas in the post. yet, despite my best efforts, the poster seemed to take it as criticism against the post. it wasn't. it's just more interesting to talk about how things can be improved than how good they already are.
posted by andrew cooke at 6:03 AM on December 8, 2004


What the heck is it with the lack of capitalisation at the beginning of sentences, lately? If this trend continues, pretty soon, the only reason quonsar will be special will be because he rides the short bus to school.
posted by veedubya at 6:08 AM on December 8, 2004


What are you all talking about? Now that the election's over, MetaFilter is a complete Utopia, just like all the whiners said it would be.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 6:20 AM on December 8, 2004


Good point XQUZYPHYR. Someone, post something about election fraud quick!

That'all solve everything.
posted by justgary at 6:31 AM on December 8, 2004


I would just like to say that a lot of older members here have acted like stuffy aristocrats, and have welcomed new members here only to the degree that it allows them to either play the noble mentor or the wiseguy.

Why can't we just let the site be run by the admin, by-and-large? Matt does a good job of deleting posts and comments. Why the need to berate new members (typically in a condescending way)? It's more likely to get their backs up and put off other silent members from posting.

I thought new memberships would breathe new life into this site - instead it's just given an extra excuse for many older members here to exercise their (fragile?) egos.
posted by SpaceCadet at 6:32 AM on December 8, 2004


I really can't stand it when someone points out a double-post or rips on a thread for no reason. It's my least favorite thing about this place.

The old-timers need to take a cue from the newbies, some of whom came from MonkeyFilter where things aren't so uptight.

There, this kind of behavior would have been regarded as just rude and unhelpful, which is basically what I've always thought of it.
posted by xammerboy at 6:35 AM on December 8, 2004


I'm currently working on a FPP about famous goats that play the saxophone whilst being sodomized.

That is so 1998! Get with the program.

...self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors.

Oh please Cancergiggles. I've been bitch-slapped around more than I care to remember but MetaFilter is pretty fair in my experience. You post stuff thats good, the "self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors" will line up to pat you on the back. You post crap or something that would have taken a modicum of search ability to rule out, then the hounds of hell will let you know it. It so easy, its like inhaling and exhaling.
posted by KevinSkomsvold at 6:38 AM on December 8, 2004


It's called self-policing. People are dumb. Other people point it out. Then people like you whine about it. Yet the dumb people do less dumb things, because they don't want it pointed out to them.

I can use smaller words if you think that helps.
posted by FunkyHelix at 7:22 AM on December 8, 2004


I like the new guys, but the double-posting has gotten pretty bad.

Part of it is that there are just so many posts now it's easy to lose track of what's been posted here after just a couple of days. Part of it is - well, somebody needs to make a database of Weird Things on the Internet That Are Old.

The anti-double-post culture around here is very intimidating but I think it's an essential feature of the site.
posted by furiousthought at 7:25 AM on December 8, 2004


self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors

y'know, that line's been tossed around so much that people take it at face value. The fact is, they/we aren't "self-appointed". Matt designed this community to be self-policing. That was his vision for it. That doesn't mean he approves of all the snarking or piling on the newcomers. And if he doesn't like it, he's free to call out/suspend/ban anyone he thinks is consistently malicious or unfair. But he doesn't because the police are subject to policing, too--which is what's happening with this MeTa post.
posted by jpoulos at 7:27 AM on December 8, 2004


xammerboy, double-posts are called out in exactly the same way on MoFi (I once threatened to kill somebody for posting Badgers for the umpteenth time). What exactly it "this kind of behaviour"?

I have to say, I think Cancergiggles post was a little more than a formulaic retread of GleepGlop's original masterpiece, but without any of the inspired details that made that work so popular. This genre of post simply isn't as engaging when it has capitalisation and apostrophes. Although there are some nice touches ("This is hypocrisy gone mad" - because we all enjoyed and admired hypocrisy when it first became popular, but now it's just gone too far), the piece as a whole simply won't stand the test of time in the same way that "flaming" will.
posted by flashboy at 7:32 AM on December 8, 2004


I would just like to say that a lot of older members here have acted like stuffy aristocrats, and have welcomed new members here only to the degree that it allows them to either play the noble mentor or the wiseguy.

I think that this criticism is fairly true. Also, I've noticed that a bunch of the supposedly hilarious inside jokes here are pretty darn tired too, and frankly I wish they'd just die.

I do find some of the hand-wringing recently to be curious, though --there have been a surprising number of good posts recently, but I've noticed that many of the very best FPPs have the fewest comments. Perhaps people should check out some links rather than just going to the hot thread and writing some more horseshit.
posted by norm at 7:43 AM on December 8, 2004


This is hypocrisy gone mad.

on which planet did you reside the last 4 years?
posted by quonsar at 7:48 AM on December 8, 2004


What the heck is it with the lack of capitalisation [...] the only reason quonsar will be special will be because he rides the short bus to school.

sorry, dude. i was first.

[watches server sob in a corner as everyone attempts to download quonsar's posting history]
posted by andrew cooke at 7:53 AM on December 8, 2004


I am struck by the amount of clutter which is created by apparently self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors.

A few points come to mind:

- As jpoulos pointed out, take it in stride. If you're here long enough, you're going to get bitchslapped sooner or later. It happens to all of us.

- Some are assholes about it, but the majority of us pipe up because we care about preserving the integrity of the site. MeFi is the sum of us, and we've collectively invested quite a bit into it. We actively try not to let it turn into a Fark-ish free-for-all.

- (This is not directed at you, but at the countless new folks who feel compelled to say it) I don't fucking care how long you've "been a lurker" here. There's a different dynamic at work when you actually contribute to a community instead of sit on the sidelines. I see more meta-commentary about posts these days from new users than old timers. Your $5 does not automatically entitle you to lecture others about how the site should operate.
posted by mkultra at 7:56 AM on December 8, 2004


(oh, but that could be because it's a run-on sentence. in whcih case i start lower case on mefi here and quonsar wins. damn.)
posted by andrew cooke at 7:59 AM on December 8, 2004


I want to extend a humble thank-you to my fellow n00bs, GleepGlop and Cancergiggles, and to the incredible ensemble cast of veteran actors who helped create this fabulous multi-act tragicomic farce. I laughed, I cried, I threw up a little inside my mouth...

Critics may find the plot unoriginal, but is it not a hallmark of human artistry to "arrive where we started / And know the place for the first time"?

I can hardly wait for the third act, rumored to feature a dazzling pyrotechnic array, a bloody duel to the death between quonsar's ghost and the miraculously resurrected Son of Minya, an original operatic score by MiguelCardoso (performed flawlessly in a major key by the entire nation of Portugal) and all-you-can-eat-24-hour pancakes.

This could be the best five bucks I've ever spent.
posted by naomi at 8:23 AM on December 8, 2004


The only thing worth protesting at length is abusive behavior. Silence is usually the best response to most other sins.
posted by rushmc at 8:39 AM on December 8, 2004


This is hypocrisy gone mad.

Yes it's hypocrisy gone mad! You won't belive your eyes as we catch the most hot hot hot hypocritical action! Pay just $19.99 and we'll include Sarcastic College Women free! Order now!
posted by petebest at 9:01 AM on December 8, 2004


petebest wins.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:05 AM on December 8, 2004


And he had some stiff competition from naomi, too.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:05 AM on December 8, 2004


a database of Weird Things on the Internet That Are Old

I'm pretty sure it's called the MetaFilter Archives. Searchable here.
posted by me3dia at 9:09 AM on December 8, 2004


I used to be a lot stiffer, but yoga really took it out of me.
posted by naomi at 9:15 AM on December 8, 2004


I think my resolve just stiffened.
posted by Armitage Shanks at 9:44 AM on December 8, 2004


If you're here long enough, you're going to get bitchslapped sooner or later. It happens to all of us.

mkultra, you make it sound like Lord Of The Flies.
posted by SpaceCadet at 9:46 AM on December 8, 2004


Well I guess that little lot ran to a couple of thousand words, of which, I think I understood thirteen, but thanks anyway.
I don't fucking care how long you've "been a lurker" here. There's a different dynamic at work when you actually contribute to a community instead of sit on the sidelines. mkultra Very valid point, but lurkers (as I've been for a long time due to closed membership) have the luxury of being able to spot the crap because they aren't tied up with commenting on it. The point is that, the vast majority of MeFi is an excellent place or I wouldn't have come back here time after time and read so much interesting and funny stuff.
I love fresh air
posted by Cancergiggles at 9:52 AM on December 8, 2004


what
posted by darukaru at 9:59 AM on December 8, 2004


Oh, I know, CG, the whole self-policing thing is just so TIRESOME. Why can't everybody just stop being suck DICKs, man? Sounds like you need to stay away from MetaTalk, #1, and #2, you need to contemplate the wisdom of crticizing something you yourself obviously wanted to be a part of. I know you think you're just making a recommendation for how MeFi could be improved, but spend half a second considering how it got to be the way it is. Hm?

Maybe once you've experienced this process on the inside and the outside for a while you will have some interesting things to say about it. Meanwhile, sample the "less flinging" environment over at MonkeyFilter. You may find it more to your liking. It has advantages, but so do our standards here.

lurkers (as I've been for a long time due to closed membership) have the luxury of being able to spot the crap because they aren't tied up with commenting on it.

Or, to rephrase, they can judge from afar with impunity, because they're completely unaccountable. Obviously, you've been doing this armchair moderation for a long time. But now that you have an account to toss around, you find it's all just so much more complicated than it looked.
posted by scarabic at 10:02 AM on December 8, 2004


you find it's all just so much more complicated than it looked. Damn right it is but I'm happy to learn
posted by Cancergiggles at 10:11 AM on December 8, 2004


Cancer, they'll always be assholes here--and Mefi self-appointed "cops," but you already know to skip over them. It's the most important thing here, i think. We can all always do that, unless they're derailing a thread entirely, in which case you can take it here.

on a related whining note, does every single thread about anything in the South have to become a Red/Blue thing? That Greensboro Klan thing is a great post, but the comments not so much.
posted by amberglow at 10:24 AM on December 8, 2004


amberglow. Forthwith they shall be but mist to my eyes. Never did like looking at assholes anyway.
posted by Cancergiggles at 10:37 AM on December 8, 2004


I'm happy to learn

Then keep your eye on Matt.
posted by scarabic at 10:38 AM on December 8, 2004


ACAB!
posted by stinkycheese at 10:49 AM on December 8, 2004


I am struck by the amount of clutter which is created by apparently self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors.

So your solution to the "clutter" is to post yet another thread to MetaTalk, adding to the "clutter" ?
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 12:17 PM on December 8, 2004


Damn, where were the noobs in the weeks leading up to the election when the shrill whining was at an all-time high?

Since the deflation of the election, I was of the mind that MeFi has started to return to its roots and has gotten better and better since. And yes, I know I risk assault by justgary or bob sarabia for even mentioning politics.

There are gleeful jerks here who love to swoop in on double posts just to get the first snark. Get to recognize who they are and then ignore them. You'll be alot happier and they'll barely notice that no one's paying them any attention.
posted by fenriq at 12:20 PM on December 8, 2004


As a years-long lurker and co-n00b I must say, CG, hush, migosh! You're blebbling, as my sainted ma used to say.
posted by thinkpiece at 12:29 PM on December 8, 2004


There are gleeful jerks here who love to swoop in on double posts just to get the first snark.

Bullshit. I can't recall the last time I saw a double-post note that was anything but cursory, to the point, and polite. I don't much bother, myself, when I see 'em, unless they're dirt stick stone stupid (ie the same link was posted 6 hours ago or something).

As far as Cangergiggles' thread, well, it's surprising how large a sense of entitlement 5 bucks will buy you these days, innit?
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 12:54 PM on December 8, 2004


As you may well imagine Cass I am a little sheepish when discussing matters in such baaaahhhhhd (oops) taste. I hate inserting myself into old conversations however as they say here in Alberta: Officer, I was just helping that sheep over the fence. I do have another example of etiquette:
posted by Ranger03 at 1:08 PM on December 8, 2004


As you may well imagine Cass I am a little sheepish when discussing matters in such baaaahhhhhd (oops) taste. I hate inserting myself into old conversations however as they say here in Alberta: Officer, I was just helping that sheep over the fence. I do have another example of etiquette:
http://ranger03.blog-city.com

posted by Ranger03 at 1:12 PM on December 8, 2004


Geez talk about reading the same shitte over and over.
posted by Ranger03 at 1:14 PM on December 8, 2004


they just don't call out double posts like they used to.

whippersnappers! get off my lawn.
posted by norm at 1:59 PM on December 8, 2004


I refuse to take someone named "cancergiggles" even remotely seriously.
posted by crunchland at 2:17 PM on December 8, 2004


Thats fine crunchland - I don't take my terminal cancer seriously either.
posted by Cancergiggles at 2:57 PM on December 8, 2004


a lot of older members here have acted like stuffy aristocrats

/extends pinkies while typing. Further than that.
posted by yerfatma at 3:36 PM on December 8, 2004


Guys, unclench. Really. The two posts today that generated most of the comments were the ones where the old seasoned MeFis bitch and moan about how bad those posts are. The insecurity is becoming glaring. If the quality is not up to your expectations, why not post something that is (because surely, you would be the only ones to know what's best) and show us n00bs how it's done? Or are the wounds just too extensive?
posted by c13 at 3:47 PM on December 8, 2004


I am struck by the amount of clutter which is created by apparently self appointed sanctimonious MeFi gods/censors.

So? I'm sick of the craptacular FPP's that push really GOOD posts off the frontpage. Maybe in the new site redesign there can be a section off to the side labeled "Crap" where we can throw all the fecal posts.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 4:14 PM on December 8, 2004


Thats fine crunchland - I don't take my terminal cancer seriously either.

that remark was below the belt and probably premeditated as well. as in, you just couldn't wait for someone to ask about your handle so you could beat them with your disease. pfft.
posted by quonsar at 4:17 PM on December 8, 2004


Oh, and this line of reasoning:

If the quality is not up to your expectations, why not post something that is

... is st00pid. Good FP posts aren't easy. We (relatively) old farts understand this, which is why we bitch and moan so much when some one-line, one-link jagoff comes along and pushes a good post down.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 4:18 PM on December 8, 2004


NO quansar it absolutely was not. I don't want to beat anyone and I really do find it amusing. I sure as hell wouldn't have waited until there had been about 60 comments before making the comment if it was premeditated.
Q. If my post was so stupid then why have so many people chosen to comment on both sides. Maybe it would be best to just prohibit things people don't like - or maybe its occasionally a good thing to have or values and standards questioned.
posted by Cancergiggles at 4:39 PM on December 8, 2004


Because people here love to hear themselves talk. You haven't even figured that out yet? Fuck, we have the same discussions about the site every day.
posted by The God Complex at 4:50 PM on December 8, 2004


So, Civil_Disobedient, you understand that good post takes work. But do you not understand that bitching about a bad one does nothing but makes it even worse? That scrolling through 2-3 lines of a bad post takes a lot less effort than wading through 88 (! as far as I can tell) responses where old farts compete in degree of suffering? Do you not understand it yet, or is senility becoming a major factor?
posted by c13 at 4:50 PM on December 8, 2004


Just a side-question/comment...

Cancergiggles - Were you serious about the cancer?

And on preview:

But do you not understand that bitching about a bad one does nothing but makes it even worse?

I don't think it makes it worse. A tablespoon of piss in a barrel-ful of wine is still piss, but at least you might get a random funny snark that brightens your day.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 5:07 PM on December 8, 2004


Civil_Disobedient - yes I'm dying but no I'm not serious about it. You can't taste a tablespoon of piss in a barrel of wine - it's only when you're drinking a tablespoon of wine in a barrel of piss that you suspect something is wrong.
posted by Cancergiggles at 5:17 PM on December 8, 2004


Of course there is piss in the wine. The God Complex has a very good point. But mine is the following: the wine is getting excessively diluted.
Having said this, I suspect once everybody empty out their catheters, concentrations will return to their usual values.
posted by c13 at 5:26 PM on December 8, 2004


I think you'll live a while, Cancer--after all, you only just joined here--at least as long as it takes not to be a newbie, no?
(your site's not that full of giggles, tho, for us readers--work on that, okay?) ; >
posted by amberglow at 5:33 PM on December 8, 2004


pastel suited jackals

My God! I had forgotten all about those guys.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:45 PM on December 8, 2004


You can't taste a tablespoon of piss in a barrel of wine

Um, that's totally not the point. It's still piss -- ask a Frenchman.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 8:34 PM on December 8, 2004


I refuse to take someone named "cancergiggles" even remotely seriously.
posted by crunchland at 2:17 PM PST on December 8


Go read his blog then tell us you refuse to take him seriously. Looked at your site by the way. very professional
posted by Ranger03 at 5:06 PM on December 9, 2004


>>You can't taste a tablespoon of piss in a barrel of wine

> Um, that's totally not the point. It's still piss -- ask a Frenchman.

Yeah right. That's pretense cubed, d00d.
posted by davy at 11:10 PM on December 9, 2004


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