Following the posting guidelines April 28, 2005 12:06 PM   Subscribe


It's on the web, it's good imho, it's worth discussing, and I felt it was of interest to people at metafilter.
posted by beth at 12:10 PM on April 28, 2005


Didn't you read the new policy?

• We flag and delete all non-left posts
• We're the new LGF, but on the left: Death to Teh Right

How dare you?
posted by AlexReynolds at 12:11 PM on April 28, 2005


and I felt it was of interest to people at metafilter
more like metalefter am i rite
posted by angry modem at 12:12 PM on April 28, 2005


MAY GLORIOUS RIN DIK RAIN BOILING GORGONZOLA UPON THY SUNBURNED PATE
posted by quonsar at 12:13 PM on April 28, 2005


Never mind.
posted by sonofsamiam at 12:13 PM on April 28, 2005


Mmm. Fondue.
posted by loquacious at 12:15 PM on April 28, 2005


Actually I think this is because I made a humorous crack at #mefi or something. C'mon Steve, haven't you got some good arguments in your pocket defending what the Republicans are going to try to do to the Senate rules?

You know one might start to think you *lacked* such arguments and were really just whining and being a poor sport or something, if one were being ungenerous.
posted by beth at 12:16 PM on April 28, 2005


Seriously. What is this, whiny rightwinger day? I liked the Gore post and I don't even like Gore. Unless we're talkin' gore-slicked zombie hordes.
posted by loquacious at 12:19 PM on April 28, 2005


I don't think it's a good post, but I fail to see how it breaks the guidelines. Could you elaborate?
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 12:19 PM on April 28, 2005


I'm persuaded. I believe I'll have another drink.
posted by warbaby at 12:22 PM on April 28, 2005


Practical question:

Which guideline do you find this in contradiction to? (Not a challenge, a question)
posted by Bugbread at 12:22 PM on April 28, 2005


No beth, this has nothing to do with what anyone has said in the place which should not be spoken of here.

And indeed, I do have some very good arguments regarding the so-called "Nuclear Option." But I long ago gave up on debating here on MetaFilter. Makes as much sense as nofundy sparing with people on Free Republic.

Sorry beth, but that is just an awful FPP. A link to a opinion piece by a washed up politician? Come on... Single link FPP to Op/Ed type pieces, especially on a subject that has been covered to death = not a good post.
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 12:23 PM on April 28, 2005


Let's be honest.

Steve posted to MeTa because of his political leanings, not because of any supposed guidelines being violated.

The second whining crybaby MeTa post in a row today!
posted by nofundy at 12:24 PM on April 28, 2005


But I long ago gave up on debating here on MetaFilter.

So you admit that you're really just staying to fling poo?

Or is there some subtler purpose to your presence and posting that I am missing?
posted by beth at 12:27 PM on April 28, 2005


The second whining crybaby MeTa post in a row today!

Seriously.


posted by AlexReynolds at 12:29 PM on April 28, 2005


God, Republicans are really whiny, their macho gun-loving bluster notwithstanding

and Stevie, if you're really against people posting weak fpp's with an obvious political agenda, why don't you drag this guy's ass on MeTa first?
posted by matteo at 12:32 PM on April 28, 2005


Alex, you freaking drama queen. As someone who acted so mortally offended for being (appropriately) called a drama queen, you are working extra hard to keep that meme alive. You've alluded to it a half dozen times or so recently.

So since I guess you don't care any more, we are free to point how you are just a big old drama queen.
posted by dios at 12:33 PM on April 28, 2005


Makes as much sense as nofundy sparing(sic) with people on Free Republic.

Gee, I'm getting all kinds of righty tighty attention today!

Steve,
See, If I posted just one time at freeperville, my post would be deleted and my account banned.
But here at MeFi, where it's purportedly jam-packed with lefties, divergent views (even god dios and many others) are actually tolerated.

I consider that a vital part of the American way of doing things myself. I enjoy hearing what others have to say, and yes, even those I disagree with, 'cause an echo chamber would be no fun at all.

Strange how I'm such a boogeyman to some on particular days.
posted by nofundy at 12:33 PM on April 28, 2005


Steve just needs to get on the dance floor and show us how right he is.
posted by Mean Mr. Bucket at 12:33 PM on April 28, 2005


Let's be honest, nofundy... no matter what I post, a hack like you will attack me....

Beth, just because I am no longer interested in debating with people on this site does not mean I like front page being crapped on. There are still the occasional posts worth reading.

Alex... well that is rich coming from you... but I suppose you were being "ironic."

And, finally, matteo learn to read....
posted by Steve_at_Linnwood at 12:33 PM on April 28, 2005


Whatever, Steve. What a bunch of baloney. You used to be one of my favorite common taters, but ever since the elections, you get less and less coherent, and more and more petty.
The reason you aren't debating the issues and are resorting to metacritique is because you know deep down your boys are screwing up bigtime, and rather than admit that, you continue blaming the liberals, claiming that it is MeFi that has changed, not the nature of the debate.
posted by sonofsamiam at 12:36 PM on April 28, 2005


Kudos to everyone for bolstering a political environment that drives people to vote for the political candidate you hate the most.
posted by angry modem at 12:37 PM on April 28, 2005


Vintage Stevie fpp op-ed, re: the liberal media
What is going on at the New York Times?
More than 100 years ago, the New York Times, under owner Adolph Ochs, adopted the slogan: "All the news that's fit to print". But, critics are now asking if the New York Times only prints news it considers ideologically fit. What has been happening at the Times is far more ominous than just veering to the support of one party or one ideology. There is a type of liberalism, pioneered in America, which tries to be fairer than fair. But trying to be better than fair is like trying to bend over backwards to be straighter than vertical or defining "objective" as being neutral between good and evil. That path leads straight to moral equivalence. Perhaps the slogan should be re-written: "All the Newspeak fit to print".
posted on Aug 26, 2002
I guess we are not even going to pretend to follow the guidelines for posts anymore. sigh.

learn to read....

I'll be happy to, Allah knows I need it. I just hope to avoid the teachers who taught you to write
posted by matteo at 12:37 PM on April 28, 2005


Lame callout.
posted by OmieWise at 12:37 PM on April 28, 2005


even god dios
posted by nofundy at 12:33 PM PST on April 28


Did you think yourself clever the first time you came up with the construction seeing as how it is the obvious translation of the word? Do you still imagine yourself clever after the 20th time using it? At what point do you realize that it is just petty nonsense that really has no point?
posted by dios at 12:37 PM on April 28, 2005


Alex, you freaking drama queen.

Aren't you the same creep who said we'd all be singing and dancing when Terry Schiavo passed away? I seem to remember you saying something completely offensive along these lines. Feel free to jog our memories with your words of wisdom.
posted by AlexReynolds at 12:38 PM on April 28, 2005


I've been labeled a "socialist feminised intellectual", and *I* thought that post was sub-par. You know, Steve_ may have a point, and the next election is 4 years away.
posted by gsb at 12:39 PM on April 28, 2005


I hardly think it was crapping on the front page. I invite you to point out (as others have also requested) which specific guideline(s) I violated when posting this.

And as has been said here oh-so-many times, you know if you really don't like the post, you are free to scroll past it and pretend that you didn't see it. No one is forcing you to click on it. Clearly other people were interested in talking about it. Your purpose seems to be to tell them it's not worth discussing. I don't see how you are in a position to judge that fairly, to be honest.
posted by beth at 12:41 PM on April 28, 2005


Let's be honest, nofundy... no matter what I post, a hack like you will attack me....

OOhhh!!! Name calling!!! I'm telling daddy!!!

I recall attacking your silly posts and your weak assertions but I don't recall attacking you. Not my style to attack the messenger, just their motivations. Whatever.
posted by nofundy at 12:42 PM on April 28, 2005


Why do you act like that is such a revealing or damning comment I made? I stand by the comment. Many people cheered when Schiavo died... just like there were black people cheering after O.J. was acquitted and saying "we won!"

It's politics as sport. My comment was pointing that out. Why do keep bringing it up as if I should be embarrassed for saying that? You're like a big old broken record drama queen.
posted by dios at 12:42 PM on April 28, 2005


If you had to call out this post (which I agree is not best of the web, but that hardly merits a call out), you could have done so in another MeTa thread, like the one still open right beneath this one. You're calling it out for the same reason as dios called out that one. There was no reason for yet another MeTa thread. (Yeah, I know I write that sentence more than any other sentence, but I have reason to write it so very often around here these days.)
posted by anapestic at 12:42 PM on April 28, 2005


Steve_at_Linnwood writes " And indeed, I do have some very good arguments regarding the so-called 'Nuclear Option.' But I long ago gave up on debating here on MetaFilter. Makes as much sense as nofundy sparing with people on Free Republic."

Jesus, Steve. You have good arguments, you claim. But you've given up on sharing them here. So rather than argue your claim, you just want claims you disagree with deleted, because it's too hard for widdle Stevie to argue with all the big bad Lefties?

You'd rather just whine in MetaTalk in hopes matt will make it all better by suppressing opinions you disagree with. And then no one will have a chance to point the holes in your argument, because you conveniently won;'t even have to make an argument at all.

If it's such a bad post, go refute it. I frankly love it when the other side's Poor_Arguers_at_Metafilter contribute, because they're so easy to refute. Or ignore it -- if MetaFilter is such a hotbed of Lefties, then we're all already convinced anyway, so what's the point of deleting it?

But whatever you do, stop whining. MetaFilter should not be a 'whiner-ocracy', where whoever can whine loudest on MetaTalk wins by getting posts that threaten his ideology deleted.

If the post presents a weak argument, then comment in the post and win the argument, Steve_at_Linnwood. If you can't win the arguments on the merits, don't come to MetaTalk whining to have the post thrown out of court.


Oh, and Steve, after you made your ad hominem attack here, I asked you to please just state your honest opinion without distracting us with derails and attacks. To date, you haven't done that. Since you seem to have time enough on your hands to whine in MetaTalk, how about taking the time to show us that your sole contribution in the Blue isn't just mocking what you are incapable of refuting?
posted by orthogonality at 12:46 PM on April 28, 2005


Did you think yourself clever the first time you came up with the construction seeing as how it is the obvious translation of the word? Do you still imagine yourself clever after the 20th time using it? At what point do you realize that it is just petty nonsense that really has no point?
posted by dios at 12:37 PM PST


Hey, you're the one chose the appelation, God. Not me.
Did you expect me to bow before you, God?
Will you please hand me my copy of the right wing nut fundamentalist Ten Commandments? In stone please.
Good to see someone with such a high opinion of themselves.
Could be a compliment you know, God.

I mean, how do I know you're not really that fun loving person I saw in Dogma?
posted by nofundy at 12:48 PM on April 28, 2005


I wouldn't call that an ad hominem attack so much as a random insult. "Ad hominem" gets used too easily and loosely around here.

A true example of an ad hominem attack would be, "orthogonality's arguments about language can't be trusted because he's square." That's an explicit attempt to refute an argument by referring to the man who made it rather than to the argument itself.

Oh, and nofundy, shut up already.
posted by anapestic at 12:52 PM on April 28, 2005


You are calling it out for the same reason as dios called out that one.
posted by anapestic at 12:42 PM PST on April 28


That's incorrect. He is calling it out because it is an Op/Ed single link newsfilter thing. Those used to be considered not sufficient (if I recall it correctly).

I called the other one out because of the tone in how it was framed; you can't have a good discussion if you start out in such a divisive way. It is a shrill and insulting way to begin a discussion when you start out from the baseline that (at least half) of the Country is evil.... if you can't recognize that, then you must be looking for ways to excuse the issue for partisan reasons.

By just saying that it is partisan whining, you are just trying to pigeonhole it so that you don't have to consider the validity of it. That is just not right.

_________
As to those of you who keep saying that MeTa posts are whining...... THAT IS WHAT METATALK IS FOR. People making use of the thing for the very reason it was created shouldn't be castigated as whiners.
posted by dios at 12:52 PM on April 28, 2005


Many people cheered when Schiavo died... just like there were black people cheering after O.J. was acquitted and saying "we won!"

???
posted by matteo at 12:54 PM on April 28, 2005


You people are fucking hilarious.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 12:55 PM on April 28, 2005


Now this is the MetaFilter I remember. Feh.
posted by sciurus at 12:55 PM on April 28, 2005


Steve, my man, a little advice from your old pal and erstwhile defender here: someone once asked why I enjoy being a contrarian here, especially since I'm often doing it with people I fundamentally agree with, when I could go over to LGF or Freep and be a contrarian with people who I fundamentally disagree with.

The reasons are manifold, but I do what I do here because, unlike those other places, those crazy lefty MeFite's are often likely to actually consider the merits of another perspective than their own. The Freepers won't.

I suspect you realize this, and that's why you still hang out here. But perhaps you might want to adjust your style to reflect that.
posted by jonmc at 12:56 PM on April 28, 2005


"You're like a big old broken record drama queen" said the impotent chump.

The End
posted by dfowler at 12:57 PM on April 28, 2005


Hey it's not fair to make fun of dios because of his name. It's not as if he chose it for himself.

Er.

Well I mean certainly his nick doesn't betray a sense of superiority or a tendency to look down on the rest of us or anything disrespectful like that... right?
posted by beth at 12:57 PM on April 28, 2005


You people are fucking hilarious

Yeah, I second that... Metatalk is non-stop parade of delusion, and it makes my day.
posted by SweetJesus at 12:57 PM on April 28, 2005


You people are hilarious. Keep all this earnest and righteous arguin' going, cos it's passing my idle time.
posted by xmutex at 12:57 PM on April 28, 2005


Hey back there--Don't make me pull this thread over!
posted by OmieWise at 1:00 PM on April 28, 2005


Well I mean certainly [dios'] nick doesn't betray a sense of superiority or a tendency to look down on the rest of us or anything disrespectful like that... right?

It is lowercase, which seems pretty modest to me.

MetaFilter: At what point do you realize that it is just petty nonsense that really has no point?
posted by kirkaracha at 1:02 PM on April 28, 2005


I've developed a taste for the bittersweet tears of the crybaby conservatives.
Why am I not surprised that the only family member of mine that leans that direction was the same one that would throw a board game on the floor when it didn't go his way?

Any links to video of people cheering when Terri Schiavo died?
posted by 2sheets at 1:03 PM on April 28, 2005


Thus we see, as has been true throughout history, that "guidelines" themselves become a new epistemology within which to contextualize opposition as a structural, rather than positional, relationship.

It's clear that's what Steve@ and Nofundy are both trying to say, but using different vernaculars, they mistakenly percive themselves at odds. I am here to help bridge these gaps.
posted by freebird at 1:03 PM on April 28, 2005


Many people cheered when Schiavo died... just like there were black people cheering after O.J. was acquitted and saying "we won!"

Dios, just when you can't fit any more of your foot into your mouth, you surprise even me.

Where's your foot now? Your stomach? Lower intestine? We'll need a crew from FOX News to keep us abreast of the latest developments.
posted by AlexReynolds at 1:04 PM on April 28, 2005


So this thread is running about 50 comments and the post that spawned it is stalled at 26.

Maybe we could just skip the Blue entirely....? heh.

I never MetaFilter I didn't like.
posted by warbaby at 1:04 PM on April 28, 2005


Anyway, I hope Snoop steps in for a swing at SOMEbody.
posted by dfowler at 1:04 PM on April 28, 2005


Steve and dios, bringing sandpaper to a circle-jerk.
posted by felix betachat at 1:06 PM on April 28, 2005


This seems like it should be the next callout in MeTa. Does anyone have the guts to stand up to the ravening hoardes of liberal MeFites and call it out?
posted by OmieWise at 1:07 PM on April 28, 2005


WAIT!!! wait wait wait wait wait!

i just figured it out! dios is 111!

hey, welcome back 111!
posted by dfowler at 1:07 PM on April 28, 2005


Sweet! Trainwreck!
posted by Bugbread at 1:08 PM on April 28, 2005


Alex, you drama queen, your faux outrage notwithstanding, you haven't explained why I should be embarassed by my comment. All you have done is suggest that what I said is shocking and thrown in some weak-minded boogeyman about FOX News.

I stand by my comment. You can try to act like it is the MOST REVEALING THING EVAR, but I don't think so. There were clearly people who wanted her to die because they say it as a political victory. Do you deny it? If not, then wtf do you keep bringing it up?
posted by dios at 1:09 PM on April 28, 2005


I stand by my comment.

With one foot in your mouth, you must look pretty funny hopping around on the other.
posted by AlexReynolds at 1:12 PM on April 28, 2005


i just figured it out! dios is 111
posted by dfowler at 1:07 PM PST on April 28


If trying to lump in people together makes things easier for you, then go right ahead.

While we are creating false personas for people, can I just assume that you are Abe Vigoda?
posted by dios at 1:12 PM on April 28, 2005


No, no, no, warbaby! I said it a long time ago - MetaFilter exists to fuel MetaTalk. There's no point in getting rid of it; that would ruin all our fun.
posted by deborah at 1:13 PM on April 28, 2005


Hey xmutex, pass the popcorn.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 1:13 PM on April 28, 2005


dios writes "That's incorrect. He is calling it out because it is an Op/Ed single link newsfilter thing. Those used to be considered not sufficient (if I recall it correctly)."

dios, perhaps your problem is that in your zeal, you didn't stop to read matteo's comment, in which matteo points out Steve's own Op/Ed single-link newsfilter "contribution"

dios continues "As to those of you who keep saying that MeTa posts are whining...... THAT IS WHAT METATALK IS FOR. People making use of the thing for the very reason it was created shouldn't be castigated as whiners."

And stop whining. You're not contributing to the site, you're not trying to contribute to the site, you and Steve are both just trying to suppress posts you haven't the ability to refute.
posted by orthogonality at 1:13 PM on April 28, 2005


ahh, good times, good times.
posted by ashbury at 1:13 PM on April 28, 2005


Alex, you do realize that you are doing nothing but dodging my direct questioning of you with irrelevant nothings? Not that I am surprised. You don't have anyone to me-too off of, so I can see why you are floundering.
posted by dios at 1:14 PM on April 28, 2005


Metatalk -- a forum for bitching and complaining that people post things you don't like.

Not really "catchy", but at least it's truth in advertising now.
posted by clevershark at 1:14 PM on April 28, 2005


NO, FUCK YOU!
posted by bondcliff at 1:16 PM on April 28, 2005


While we are creating false personas for people, can I just assume that you are Abe Vigoda?

Can I be Mr. T?
posted by COBRA! at 1:16 PM on April 28, 2005


Alex, you do realize that you are doing nothing but dodging my direct questioning of you with irrelevant nothings?

*chuckle*

If you have to ask why your comment is completely ridiculous, you'll never get it why so many people here think you're a clown.
posted by AlexReynolds at 1:17 PM on April 28, 2005


dios, perhaps your problem is that in your zeal, you didn't stop to read matteo's comment, in which matteo points out Steve's own Op/Ed single-link newsfilter "contribution"

How does matteo's comment diminish the correctness of Steve's point? If I concede that they are probably both correct that the single op/eds should be deleted, beth and steve's, does that spring me from this deadly trap you have set for me?

you and Steve are both just trying to suppress posts you haven't the ability to refute.
posted by orthogonality at 1:13 PM PST on April 28


I didn't have the ability to refute the shit post that I called out? Actually, if you look in it, I did make an argument against it. It doesn't detract from the fact that is a crappy way to begin a discussion. You obviously didn't read my post if you think my post was about trying to silence the poster. I don't mind the topic at all, but it was framed in a shitty way.
posted by dios at 1:18 PM on April 28, 2005


If you believe dios is a fool then yes, COBRA!, YOU are Mr. T.
posted by dfowler at 1:22 PM on April 28, 2005


Listen, I have to walk home now. Could you save the really nasty name-calling for about an hour from now. And definitely any flameouts, I don't want to miss any flameouts. I always read about those things the next day, and they read like warm eggnog tastes.

Thanks. I'll do the same for you one day, I swear.
posted by OmieWise at 1:24 PM on April 28, 2005


That sort of divisiveness will not lead to fruitful discussion.

Programs! Peanuts! GETcher PrograAms!
posted by petebest at 1:24 PM on April 28, 2005


Alex and Dios, I think what you're both trying to say is that in the dynamic throbbing tides of your penetrating discourse lies concealed a shapre revealed only by negation; missing in all your comments to each other is a bare shred of explicit mutuality and understanding. It's clear to any objective observer that, as complete absence so often implies what seems missing, the deep respect you feel for each other is reined in by a fear of being percieved as compromised. It warms my heart to see you reach out for each other in this dark and troubling time - we all must take example from your efforts and seek what solace and human contact we can find, in whatever manner is best suited to our temperament and circumstances.

I bless your rich and blooming friendship as a model for us all, and a way forward.
posted by freebird at 1:24 PM on April 28, 2005


If you believe dios is a fool then yes, COBRA!, YOU are Mr. T.

but only if you pity the foo!

This made me choke on my lunch.
posted by schyler523 at 1:25 PM on April 28, 2005


The "sandpaper to a circlejerk" trope is poignant yet problematic, inasmuch as it assumes certain psychosexual predilictions and preferences propagated by the paradigmatic processes of political populists.
posted by freebird at 1:26 PM on April 28, 2005


lunch popcorn
posted by schyler523 at 1:27 PM on April 28, 2005


First, let me say thanks for posting this on MeTa rather than the main page. That was polite of you.

However, you say:

But I long ago gave up on debating here on MetaFilter.

If you're that convinced we're hopeless cases, there are many other venues where you might find more like-minded people.

Personally, I think it's because every time I've seen you get into a real debate here, folks have politely handed you your ass on a plate. You can't win by debate, so instead you're trying to attack on procedure instead.

Why don't you just let the Gore posts, you know, go by? You obviously still find something of worth in MeFi or you wouldn't keep this up.

Highly literate, creative and intelligent people have a nasty habit of ending up fairly liberal (or at least libertarian). Liberals, Steve, are the kind of people who make really interesting web pages.

I wonder if you've ever realized that the arguments you espouse so vehemently, if taken up very broadly in the general population, will end up squashing out countless pages that MeFi might draw from?

Your arguments and kvetching about procedure are damaging the thing you claim to like. This post is a good example.

Why do you hate MeFi so much?
posted by Malor at 1:30 PM on April 28, 2005


Steve: You are gasoline to the fire.

If this stuff really bothers you, you're best off to ignore it.

If you're just a troll, keep up the good work.
posted by mosch at 1:37 PM on April 28, 2005


Highly literate, creative and intelligent people have a nasty habit of ending up fairly liberal

As AlexReynolds points out above, "Correlation does not imply causality; the very thread of discourse the argument depends upon has wrapped around its throat like a garrotte, choking the life from it with the very things that kept it from death. Is not this very paradox a suiting metaphor for the nature of human creativity in all its doomed glory?"

And I couldn't agree with him more.
posted by freebird at 1:37 PM on April 28, 2005


"suitable", sorry to misquote.
posted by freebird at 1:40 PM on April 28, 2005


hi mosch! join the fun!
posted by dios at 1:40 PM on April 28, 2005


even god dios
posted by nofundy at 12:33 PM PST on April 28

Did you think yourself clever the first time you came up with the construction seeing as how it is the obvious translation of the word? Do you still imagine yourself clever after the 20th time using it? At what point do you realize that it is just petty nonsense that really has no point?
posted by dios at 12:37 PM PST on April 28 [!]


See, his name's Witty...but...but...he's not! AHHAHAHHAHA!

*Bogarts the popcorn*
posted by graventy at 1:40 PM on April 28, 2005


Highly literate, creative and intelligent people have a nasty habit of ending up fairly liberal (or at least libertarian).

Like all those Harvard MBA corporate executives?
posted by jonmc at 1:41 PM on April 28, 2005


And I couldn't agree with him more.

Me neither.
posted by AlexReynolds at 1:43 PM on April 28, 2005


"A good post to MetaFilter is something that meets the following criteria: most people haven't seen it before, there is something interesting about the content on the page, and it might warrant discussion from others."

"...[D]on't troll (quick definition: posting purposely inflammatory things for the sole purpose of baiting others to argue the points until blue in the face - basically people do this for kicks, to destroy conversations and communites [sic], for the hell of it)."

"A good thread values uniqueness over novelty."

On most political accounts, I probably disagree with Steve_At, but he has a valid point here (and despite the pile on, this thread isn't about him). If MeFi is as lefty as people say (or think) it is then they probably have seen the Salon article (or elsewhere). The framing of the post ("Al hits another one out of the park") comes across as baiting. While the post isn't novelty, it is far from unique (or interesting) when the former head of the Democratic party makes a speech about Republican power grabs.

That all being said, I still think there is something useful about the flagging system.
posted by terrapin at 1:52 PM on April 28, 2005


Heh, I've only met a few truly intelligent MBAs that had anything interesting to discuss. We are talking about MBAs here, aren't we? Most MBAs come off worse than your average PHB to me, 'cause they usually aren't actually in charge. Yeah, I generalize. Very few MBAs I've personally met do anything but follow. (I used to work at a well-known tech-intensive graduate school of management. God forbid they try to fix their own computers or even actually learn something about the technology they're bending.) I have met genuinely intelligent MBAs, though. They tended to not be conservative in their thinking, and were real risk-takers, and genuinely curious about the world around them. But then, all of these few were getting there MBAs to help run companies they already started, and Business Administration to them was just a tool to further their other interests, not a career path aimed for the bullseye of middle management. Anyways.

Seriously. Steve, you whine too much, and contribute too little to justify it. When was the last time you actually contributed something of worth rather than just trashing stuff?

That is, I agree with this: Personally, I think it's because every time I've seen you get into a real debate here, folks have politely handed you your ass on a plate. You can't win by debate, so instead you're trying to attack on procedure instead.

Contribute or g'way.
posted by loquacious at 1:54 PM on April 28, 2005


Metafilter: Why do you hate MeFi so much?
posted by breezeway at 1:56 PM on April 28, 2005


loquacious, I was just trying to make the point that the old saw "intelligent, educated people are all liberals," is facile half-truth at best. I've known very smart conservatives and mind-bogglingly stupid liberals in my time.

The MBA part was basically to acknowledge that the rich and powerful are often educated as well, but not neccessarily liberal. People choose their political positions for all kinds of reasons, good and bad, including as a status object.
posted by jonmc at 2:00 PM on April 28, 2005


When was the last time you actually contributed something of worth rather than just trashing stuff?

The assumption that "trashing stuff" is not in itself a contribution is an recidivistic throwback to earlier times before humanity exceeded the detritus carrying capacity of its surroundings. In a time when we are literally afloat in our own waste, is not "trashing stuff" an important act? Indeed, if we all "trashed stuff" more and "generated stuff" less, we would not be in the dire environmental straits we are.
posted by freebird at 2:01 PM on April 28, 2005


What this thread needs is a little nudity.
posted by breezeway at 2:02 PM on April 28, 2005


Thanks a lot, my boss is a closet furry.
posted by sonofsamiam at 2:11 PM on April 28, 2005


I am very concerned that Steve disagrees with the political slant of many people on MetaFilter.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 2:13 PM on April 28, 2005


jonmc: Agreed. I dunno, I guess I'm just a little bitter about people who gain access to fantastic and fantastically expensive schools and then don't really seem to learn anything. Or want to.

Freebird: That's what the post-flagging option is for. Yeah, we trash the trasher and things get all meta around here. But seriously. Flag the post. Move on. If the community agrees, it'll be flagged and deleted.
posted by loquacious at 2:14 PM on April 28, 2005


Highly literate, creative and intelligent people have a nasty habit of ending up fairly liberal (or at least libertarian).

Like all those Harvard MBA corporate executives?


Have you ever talked to a corporate executive? They may be inteligent in a very narrow way but literate? Creative? None of the executives I've ever known want to talk about anything but sports or cars or real estate prices.
posted by octothorpe at 2:17 PM on April 28, 2005


loquacious, you mistake me. For if we must "raise a flag" to affect the discourse, does that not inherently require flag-waving rhetoric? And I think we get enough of that.

No, this is a fundamental issue. We must not be forced to identify with one or another "flag": liberal, conservative, plushie-lover, stamp-collector. For this stifles the creative, intelligent, open-minded discourse that makes this place what it is. As Dios puts it so succinctly above, "a pluralistic hermeneutic dialectic is its own reward".

So don't tell us to "raise our flag and move on". For we will then have moved away from anything worth raising a flag for. Let us rather put a stake in the ground and move forward synergistically.
posted by freebird at 2:22 PM on April 28, 2005


I'm too lazy to check--was freebird ever not this way?
posted by hototogisu at 2:32 PM on April 28, 2005


in threads like this, never.

Oops, I mean:

In order to *not* be this way, we must have settled on a definition of what it is to *be* any given way. That is, until we have reached a consensus on the nature of identity, the question has no parseable meaning. Yet, a consensus on something as subjective as identity seems a contradiction in terms - surely this is akin to seeking a 'standard deviation' or a 'unique commonality'?
posted by freebird at 2:38 PM on April 28, 2005


Metafilter: bringing sandpaper to a circle-jerk

(felix wins)
posted by warbaby at 2:45 PM on April 28, 2005


can somebody point to this 'drama queen' thread ?
i was having a life at the time and im too lazy to look it up now and FUCK YOU TOO !
posted by sgt.serenity at 2:46 PM on April 28, 2005


Steve and dios: in the spirit of dialogue, please feel free to post an FPP to WorldNetDaily or whatever you read. Whatever you bring to Show-n-tell, we'll ask good questions like little boys and girls.
posted by moonbird at 2:53 PM on April 28, 2005


...like [good] little boys and girls. An obvious Freudian slip because we're all really Satan.
posted by moonbird at 2:54 PM on April 28, 2005


Kudos to everyone for bolstering a political environment that drives people to vote for the political candidate you hate the most.

Yeah! Thoughtful speeches from former vice-presidents are divisive! All you lefty losers forced decent regular folks to vote for our current gay-hating bible-thumping wingnut administration with your crazy extremist tactics.
posted by Armitage Shanks at 2:56 PM on April 28, 2005


sgt.serenity : "can somebody point to this 'drama queen' thread ?"

Here ya go. (Mirrored because it was deleted from MeFi, and deleted posts completely vanish in the grey)
posted by Bugbread at 2:57 PM on April 28, 2005


Please, you people are acting like anonymous posters who will never have to meet one another in person.
posted by bardic at 2:59 PM on April 28, 2005


I always have and always will love the song "Rush Rush" by Paula Abdul and I don't give a damn what any of you think about that!
posted by weretable and the undead chairs at 2:59 PM on April 28, 2005


bugbread writes "Mirrored because it was deleted from MeFi"

Weird.
posted by orthogonality at 3:02 PM on April 28, 2005


I thought the drama queen thing came from dios saying "drama queen schtick" or something or other, and mispelling "schtick," belying his anti-semitism. ;)

As I typed elsewhere, it's not really a question of anyone here being a bigot. That's going way over the top--but it's a question of good form. Like if you were farting at the dinner table I'd slap you with the butter dish. And laugh maniacally. And hand you a copy of Cornel West.
posted by bardic at 3:05 PM on April 28, 2005


... Hurry Hurry Love ... Damn you to hell weretable!
posted by AllesKlar at 3:06 PM on April 28, 2005



posted by If I Had An Anus at 3:13 PM on April 28, 2005


mathowie deleted my highly relevant image comment featuring Steve_At's dog in Steve_At's barbeque because he didn't get it. he probably only looks at his own Flikr photostreams.
posted by quonsar at 3:16 PM on April 28, 2005


This train wreck, it vibrates?
posted by grouse at 3:28 PM on April 28, 2005


I would have at least considered the merit of this callout if it had come from anyone else. Please spare me your concern for our community principles and site guidelines, S@L. You defend them only at the convenience of your own political views. As ever.
posted by scarabic at 3:34 PM on April 28, 2005


I think Steve@Linwood put it best at the top of the thread:

"since Shannon entropy is a measure of surprise, any discussion which involves politics but does not explicitly contextualize it has essentially zero information content (in the Shannon sense) - since the participants are merely seeing each other as caricatures, they cannot hear any part of each others rhetoric which is not mere cliche and bombast."
posted by freebird at 3:44 PM on April 28, 2005


If i had firefox this page would have crashed it.
posted by sgt.serenity at 3:46 PM on April 28, 2005


Huh...Two deleted comments so far: quonsar and angry modem...I can't remember what they said, though...
posted by Bugbread at 3:55 PM on April 28, 2005


Things I like about this thread:

1) Reading the phrase "If I Had An Anus' profile" in the title bar;
2) Alex calling someone a "drama queen". Complete with almond-shaped image;
3) "gun-loving bluster notwithstanding" *and* "your faux outrage notwithstanding" in one thread.

Things I dislike about this thread:

1) Its premise
posted by goodnewsfortheinsane at 4:12 PM on April 28, 2005


Metafilter: Could you save the really nasty name-calling for about an hour from now. And definitely any flameouts, I don't want to miss any flameouts. I always read about those things the next day, and they read like warm eggnog tastes.

and is today aggrieved righty day? did you two coordinate this?
posted by amberglow at 4:20 PM on April 28, 2005


THAT'S IT, I'M CALLING THE COPS YOU KIDS WERE WARNED
posted by dflemingdotorg at 4:29 PM on April 28, 2005


meh, enough of this spinning in place.
posted by mathowie (staff) at 4:36 PM on April 28, 2005


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