Teacher Teacher, Billy is cussing.

August 21, 2010 8:04 PM

Pony Request: Could we please have a MetaTalk flag option of Flag it and move on, for new MetaTalk posts.

Or we could call it Mod Mod, user X did Y. If the new post gets to many Flag flags the moderators can act accordingly with community backing.

This is my first pony request please be gentle.

posted by darkmatter to Feature Requests at 8:04 PM (78 comments total)

This probably belongs in MetaMetaTalk.
posted by 31d1 at 8:25 PM on August 21, 2010 [11 favorites]

I can't really tell for sure if this is intended as a joke or as a serious feature request, but assuming the latter case then the answer is no.

If someone makes a metatalk post that is inappropriate, we'll close it or delete it; if it's not that bad but people think it's out of line in some respect, they can say so in the thread.
posted by cortex (staff) at 8:25 PM on August 21, 2010

My A/C is broken and I just finished a really mediocre bottle of chardonnay and this makes no sense. Should I even bother to ask someone to explain it to me? Can you convince my AC people to work on Sunday? No?
posted by zinfandel at 8:45 PM on August 21, 2010 [2 favorites]

I knew it. I always suspected that user X was diddling user Y.
posted by special-k at 8:45 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

The whole concept of "Flag it and move on" isn't exactly intuitive, so making a flag for it would be confusing to new users. The phrase is sorta in-jokey to begin with.
posted by hellojed at 8:46 PM on August 21, 2010

Mm. I can see how this might seem like a good idea, but the thing is that the mods really don't need 'community backing' to do anything in Metatalk (the only thing they really do is close threads, most of the time). And even if they did, the flags, which are by design invisible, wouldn't really show community support for thread closings; or, at least, they wouldn't show community support for those thread closings to anyone but the mods themselves. The upshot is that this feature would only really help the mods feel better about closing threads, and I'm thinking they don't really need that.

I think the mechanisms that already exist pretty much take care of that. Metatalk isn't like the other subsites; here, if you think a thread should be closed (or if you even think a comment should be deleted) you can just say so. You're free to do that, and I think it works. The nice thing is that the mods will usually even respond to comments that say "why haven't we closed this thread?" – so it's much better than just having a flag.
posted by koeselitz at 8:47 PM on August 21, 2010

I get it. This is like a viral ad for the new Sundance movie Harold and Mod starring Jessamyn as Mod. amirite?
posted by special-k at 8:48 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

This isn't a joke but a legitimate request. I'm curious as to why the answer is no, after all the flag is only seen by the moderators, or am I missing something? How are flags handled? Does it generate an email? If that is the case I could see how that would be a pain.

I guess I was aiming for silently supporting the moderators and protesting whiny call outs. Some of these call out/flame wars are tiresome, so instead of increasing the chatter I was looking for quick Flag it and move on.
posted by darkmatter at 8:59 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

Take your own advice.
posted by liketitanic at 9:02 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

Take your own advice.
posted by liketitanic at 12:02 AM on August 22 [+] [!]

I can't the flag doesn't exist yet.
posted by darkmatter at 9:04 PM on August 21, 2010 [8 favorites]

Use the "breaks the guidelines" flag.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 9:05 PM on August 21, 2010

Use the "breaks the guidelines" flag.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 12:05 AM on August 22 [+] [!]


Some call outs are legitimate. The beauty of my Flag it and move on flag is it uses crowd wisdom to highlight problem call outs without increasing the chatter/flames.
posted by darkmatter at 9:13 PM on August 21, 2010

I guess I was aiming for silently supporting the moderators and protesting whiny call outs. Some of these call out/flame wars are tiresome, so instead of increasing the chatter I was looking for quick Flag it and move on.

I appreciate the idea of being supportive, but we don't really have any need for some additional channel on that front. If you want to give us private feedback, flag it under the current system, or write us an email if your take is more nuanced somehow. If you want to give us or other public feedback, just speak up in the metatalk thread itself and explain why you think that particular thread is problematic or unnecessary. That's basically all there is to it.

So, yes, if you think it's flagworthy in its badness or inappropriateness, go ahead and flag it with one of the existing choices. "Other" is fine if you don't feel like anything else fits. If you wouldn't flag it with any of the existing options, just don't flag it.
posted by cortex (staff) at 9:16 PM on August 21, 2010 [2 favorites]

So, yes, if you think it's flagworthy in its badness or inappropriateness, go ahead and flag it with one of the existing choices. "Other" is fine if you don't feel like anything else fits. If you wouldn't flag it with any of the existing options, just don't flag it.
posted by cortex at 12:16 AM on August 22

Ok, will do.


Take your own advice.
posted by liketitanic at 12:02 AM on August 22 [+] [!]

Just flagged my post as Other.

Cortex, still curious, what happened when I flagged my post?
posted by darkmatter at 9:26 PM on August 21, 2010

Some call outs are legitimate.

So, don't flag those as breaking the guidelines, in fact don't flag those at all. Flag the ones that you find to not be legitimate as breaking the guidelines; it's the generic go-to "I don't like this" flag. How is this not clear? The labels really don't matter, as all it amounts to is "this is good", "this is bad", and "this is broken and needs fixing."
posted by Rhomboid at 9:31 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

So, don't flag those as breaking the guidelines...
posted by Rhomboid at 12:31 AM on August 22 [+] [!]

I don't see whiny call outs as breaking the guidelines, just whiny. So, in the future I'll just Other them and move on.
posted by darkmatter at 9:37 PM on August 21, 2010

I believe the appropriate way to indicate this is to write a comment saying, "I'm going to go ahead and close this up," despite lacking any authority to do so.
posted by Jaltcoh at 9:40 PM on August 21, 2010 [7 favorites]

I guess I was aiming for silently supporting the moderators ...

I think us behaving more like adults and less like assholes is all the support the mods need.
posted by nomadicink at 9:42 PM on August 21, 2010 [4 favorites]

I believe the appropriate way to indicate this is to write a comment saying, "I'm going to go ahead and close this up," despite lacking any authority to do so.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:40 AM on August 22 [1 favorite -] Favorite added! [Flagged]

Snort, favorited and flagged as fantastic.
posted by darkmatter at 9:44 PM on August 21, 2010

I'm going to go ahead and close this up, then.
posted by Devils Rancher at 9:47 PM on August 21, 2010 [2 favorites]

Nah, I'm going to keep it open for a bit longer.
posted by nomadicink at 9:49 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

Nuh-uh, I'm closing it riggggghhhht now...
posted by P.o.B. at 9:52 PM on August 21, 2010

I said NO.
posted by nomadicink at 9:53 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

I don't see whiny call outs as breaking the guidelines, just whiny.

But can't you see how that's irrelevant? No matter what the text of the flag says, it registers as "I don't like this" to the moderators. There is no functional difference between "I don't like this because it's whiny" and "I don't like this because I think it breaks the guidelines", it's all going in the same bucket so to speak. The flag reasons might as well be "Bad", "Good", "Broken formatting".
posted by Rhomboid at 9:53 PM on August 21, 2010

Lobotomies for everyone!
posted by Burhanistan at 9:54 PM on August 21, 2010 [4 favorites]

I think us behaving more like adults and less like assholes is all the support the mods need.

Exactly. If you think a callout is over the top or otherwise problematic, you can mention it in the thread in a diplomatic way. We don't pay too much attention to individual flags in MetaTalk since we rarely delete stuff in MetaTalk; that's unlikely to change, but you're welcome to just drop us a note or otherwise communicate with us if you feel like it.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 9:57 PM on August 21, 2010

But can't you see how that's irrelevant?
posted by Rhomboid at 12:53 AM on August 22 [+] [!]

No. If that is the case than why do they give us more than two or three choices? I almost always like more detail not less.
posted by darkmatter at 10:00 PM on August 21, 2010

I like that there are exactly 7 reasons to flag, nothing more, nothing less. Please maintain this as an invariant.
posted by polymodus at 10:01 PM on August 21, 2010

> No. If that is the case than why do they give us more than two or three choices? I almost always like more detail not less.

Because every time you flag something, the special jacket that the mods are required to wear when they are on duty gives them a little 9v shock. That is enough of an alert. Then they can attend to the flagged item as they deem fit.
posted by Burhanistan at 10:04 PM on August 21, 2010 [1 favorite]

I almost always like more detail not less.

You're not the one handling the flag queue though, so it doesn't matter what you like. The mods have said numerous times that that's how they see it (good/bad/needs fixing) and that they don't want any more flag options because it would not be of any benefit to them. The 'offensive/sexism/racism' choice was only added a couple years ago and it was done as a symbolic gesture to remind people that they wanted those types of behaviors to be reported, not because they needed specific classifications for those kinds of abuse.
posted by Rhomboid at 10:07 PM on August 21, 2010 [3 favorites]

Because every time you flag something, the special jacket that the mods are required to wear when they are on duty gives them a little 9v shock. That is enough of an alert. Then they can attend to the flagged item as they deem fit.
posted by Burhanistan at 1:04 AM on August 22 [+] [!]

Ah, I think you are onto something. Has anybody noticed that they won't tell me what happens when I flag something? ;-)


You're not the one handling the flag queue though, so it doesn't matter what you like. The mods have said numerous times that that's how they see it (good/bad/needs fixing) and that they don't want any more flag options because it would not be of any benefit to them. The 'offensive/sexism/racism' choice was only added a couple years ago and it was done as a symbolic gesture to remind people that they wanted those types of behaviors to be reported, not because they needed specific classifications for those kinds of abuse.
posted by Rhomboid at 1:07 AM on August 22

Sounds reasonable.


Off to bed.
posted by darkmatter at 10:12 PM on August 21, 2010

I changed my mind. Talk it out, then hug it out people.
posted by P.o.B. at 10:13 PM on August 21, 2010

special-k: "I get it. This is like a viral ad for the new Sundance movie Harold and Mod starring Jessamyn as Mod. amirite"

Trying to picture this movie analogy... Jessamyn hangs around at strangers' thread closings and Cortex keeps trying to banhammer himself?
posted by Hardcore Poser at 10:16 PM on August 21, 2010

Ah, I think you are onto something. Has anybody noticed that they won't tell me what happens when I flag something? ;-)

They're probably too busy resetting all the dominoes, restocking the bowling balls, retying the burnt strings, getting a new parakeet, and refilling the seltzer bottle.
posted by aubilenon at 10:24 PM on August 21, 2010 [7 favorites]

Flag it and move on it and move on.
posted by Rinku at 11:09 PM on August 21, 2010

Has anybody noticed that they won't tell me what happens when I flag something?

It's not a secret or anything, but I'm entertaining houseguests and now I'm crawling into bed. I wish I knew offhand where the last thread we laid out the flagging system was; I'd link to it and leave it at that. As is, I'd be happy to give it a rundown in the morning. Very short version is we see a queue of recent flags on posts and comments and use that as a jumping off point to take a look at what folks have been noting as problematic and make decisions about what to do in any given case based on the context and the number of flags. Not everything that gets flagged gets action taken, but most of it gets at least looked at by one of us.

It'd be a good thing in any case to put on the new work-in-progress Mod Explanations page on the wiki, since it comes up now and then and it'd save us some typing and/or searching.
posted by cortex (staff) at 11:27 PM on August 21, 2010

I prefer to flag it and move it on up.
posted by salvia at 11:29 PM on August 21, 2010

Some call outs are legitimate. The beauty of my Flag it and move on flag is it uses crowd wisdom to highlight problem call outs without increasing the chatter/flames.

The moderators are in charge of moderation. Not the "crowd" which is rarely wise.
posted by Ironmouth at 12:23 AM on August 22, 2010

Flag it and move it on over.
posted by rhizome at 12:26 AM on August 22, 2010

We bought a new flag yesterday. The old one was pretty ratty. There is an old mailbox that is used to collect worn out flags where I work. Twice a year they have a ceremony with boy scouts and the local VFW post, where flags are burned.
posted by fixedgear at 2:24 AM on August 22, 2010

Flagging, flagging, flagging
Flagging, flagging, flagging
Flagging, flagging, flagging
Flagging, flagging, flagging

Keep moving, moving, moving
Though they're disapproving
Keep them doggies moving
Meh Fight

Don't try to understand 'em
Just rope, throw and brand 'em
Soon we'll be living high and wide

Cut 'em out, ride 'em in
Ride 'em in, cut 'em out
Call 'em out, ride 'em in
Mefite

Move 'em on, head' em up
Head 'em up, move' em on
Move 'em on, head' em up
Meh Fight

Cut 'em out, ride 'em in
Ride 'em in, cut 'em out
Call 'em out, ride 'em in
Mefite

Flagging, flagging, flagging
Flagging, flagging, flagging
Flagging, flagging, flagging
Flagging, flagging, flagging
Meh Fight

Meh Fight
posted by Elmore at 3:21 AM on August 22, 2010 [1 favorite]

Movin' on up
Get on up
Get up, Stand up
Get up
Start Me Up
posted by Meatbomb at 3:29 AM on August 22, 2010

This is going well, I'm gonna keep it open.
posted by nomadicink at 5:57 AM on August 22, 2010

crowd wisdom

New here, are you?
posted by modernnomad at 6:20 AM on August 22, 2010 [2 favorites]

My question is why there are flags in MetaTalk at all. I assume it's mainly for consistency among the sites, since it seems like they are completely ignored, except maybe when you flag the mods' comments which they have said they don't appreciate.
posted by smackfu at 8:08 AM on August 22, 2010

My question is why there are flags in MetaTalk at all.

Because there's still stuff that occurs here that needs to be flagged, such as people getting super nasty, or revealing personal or profile info, etc, etc.
posted by nomadicink at 8:17 AM on August 22, 2010

Yet the "threatening bodily harm" flag is still not an option.
posted by gman at 8:27 AM on August 22, 2010

My question is why there are flags in MetaTalk at all. I assume it's mainly for consistency among the sites, since it seems like they are completely ignored

They're not completely ignored, and in fact a flag on a metatalk comment can be a useful indicator to us that something might be getting weird in a thread one of us hasn't been actively watching. It's just that that threshold for action in the direct sense of deleting-something-that-got-flagged is a lot higher for Metatalk since we're more permissive about stuff over here than anywhere else on the site.

If you see something problematic in metatalk, flag it. If you see something in metatalk that just kind of annoys you but you don't think it's actually like actionable in any way, maybe not so much. If you see a mod comment that bothers you, probably just address it in-thread or send us an email because, yeah, flagging it is kind of worse than useless. If you want to give us detailed feedback on a metatalk issue, send us an email or just comment in thread if it's locally appropriate.

It's the whole collection of these feedback mechanisms that works best, and flagging is an important part of that.

As for darkmatter's request for explanation, I went glancing through my posting history now but didn't find anything perfect yet as an outline of the flagging process, but for now here's a few comments on the subject:

- answering a few questions
- discussing when we're likely to notice who is flagging what (short answer: rarely)
- loooong comment discussing some of why the flag system is how it is
- A Day In The Life
posted by cortex (staff) at 8:48 AM on August 22, 2010 [2 favorites]

A Day In The Life

I checked the queue today oh boy...
posted by The Whelk at 8:50 AM on August 22, 2010 [4 favorites]

The beauty of my Flag
posted by The Lady is a designer at 9:04 AM on August 22, 2010

I can't really tell for sure if this is intended as a joke or as a serious feature request, but assuming the latter case then the answer is no.

This does not bode well for my Shut Up You Fucking Baby flag proposal.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 9:16 AM on August 22, 2010 [5 favorites]

As for darkmatter's request for explanation...
posted by cortex at 11:48 AM on August 22 [1 favorite +] [!]


Thanks, they were genuinely helpful.
posted by darkmatter at 9:54 AM on August 22, 2010

#1 sign your feature request in unlikely to be granted: the administrators can't tell whether you're just kidding.
posted by dersins at 9:58 AM on August 22, 2010

My A/C is broken and I just finished a really mediocre bottle of chardonnay ...
posted by zinfandel at 10:45 PM on August 21 [1 favorite +] [!]

I can't believe we've gotten this far without an "eponysterical." Slackers.
posted by desjardins at 10:06 AM on August 22, 2010 [3 favorites]

*flags this and moves on*
posted by finite at 10:32 AM on August 22, 2010

flogs and moves in.
posted by special-k at 10:42 AM on August 22, 2010 [1 favorite]

*puts a flag on it and does it for his country
posted by kuujjuarapik at 12:16 PM on August 22, 2010

White Flag
posted by adamvasco at 12:26 PM on August 22, 2010

Isn't a 'flag it and move on' flag for MetaTalk kind of antithetical to Meta and Talking? It makes sense in MetaFilter or AskMetaFilter, as the flag serves to voice an opinion without derailing the thread. But MetaTalk is specifically for discussing things - petty, petty meta things. In other words, 'move on' where exactly? Isn't this the end of the line?
posted by iamkimiam at 12:35 PM on August 22, 2010

A blue flag, lady, with a yellow bean on it?
posted by The Lady is a designer at 12:42 PM on August 22, 2010

In other words, 'move on' where exactly? Isn't this the end of the line?

I have heard tell of a big blue room...
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 1:15 PM on August 22, 2010 [2 favorites]

I was going to say, I thought it meant "move on with your life". Extricate yourself from the computer if need be.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:20 PM on August 22, 2010

Yeah, I kind of thought the "meh" flag was that x in the upper right hand corner, and that if enough of us press it, the mods can tell that the topic is not one that Metafilter membership deems necessary of great discussion.
posted by salvia at 1:28 PM on August 22, 2010 [1 favorite]

Well, sure, for those that bother enough to read that thread and to exercise their right to flag (with or without comment). I don't know, I think there are simpler ways to express a lack of interest in something.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:43 PM on August 22, 2010

"...I thought it meant "move on with your life". Extricate yourself from the computer if need be."

Oh, now you're just inventing woo-woo sci-fi fantasy world "solutions"!
posted by iamkimiam at 1:45 PM on August 22, 2010 [4 favorites]

Didn't read the thread because whatever anyone thinks about your idea, I think IT IS AWSOME FULL STOP
posted by nola at 3:39 PM on August 22, 2010

I wish there was a flag for 'this post is bad and you are a bad person for posting it.'
posted by empath at 3:46 PM on August 22, 2010

empath, don't you have some trance music to listen to? Get ou'da here. I kid I kid.
posted by nola at 3:53 PM on August 22, 2010

⚐→
posted by unliteral at 6:29 PM on August 22, 2010 [1 favorite]

Fucking zinfandel and his or her fucking chardonnay, man.
posted by Mister_A at 8:08 PM on August 22, 2010

The flag you are seeking is C[lose]TMFA, AKA "I really wish MetaTalk had a 'Disallow: /' robots.txt file.

every time you flag something, the special jacket that the mods are required to wear when they are on duty gives them a little 9v shock.

But there is only one jacket and we do not know which mod is wearing it at any given time, so this creates a moral bind for those who especially [love|hate] [jessamyn|cortex] but [love|hate] [jessamyn|cortex] (delete as applicable).
posted by holgate at 9:03 PM on August 22, 2010

Because we [love] them both so much, and how could one possibly choose to let a beloved be shocked by said jacket while the other mods freely? You are a sick, sick man.
posted by iamkimiam at 9:12 PM on August 22, 2010

My A/C is broken and I just finished a really mediocre bottle of chardonnay ...
posted by zinfandel at 10:45 PM on August 21 [1 favorite +] [!]

I can't believe we've gotten this far without an "eponysterical." Slackers.

The word you're looking for is epononsequiturical.

Those two species of grape aren't even from the same CONTINENT...
posted by thesmophoron at 9:14 PM on August 22, 2010

Wait, you mean a MetaBat Signal doesn't go off in the skies over MetaCity when I select a flag?

That's disappointing.
posted by zarq at 7:56 AM on August 23, 2010

Why does this keep coming up?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:17 AM on August 23, 2010

Those two species of grape aren't even from the same CONTINENT...

Huh? They're different varieties of the same species (Vitis vinifera) and European in origin, although for Zinfandel that wasn't recognized until relatively recently (i.e., within the last 50 years).
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 11:48 AM on August 23, 2010

flag -> other

You know, kind of like I (would have) flagged this post (if I hadn't come to it so late).
posted by Sys Rq at 3:49 PM on August 23, 2010

The Treaty of what now?
posted by ostranenie at 5:46 AM on August 24, 2010