We use Ajax, but we're still Web 1.0

May 19, 2009 5:25 AM

Pony 2.0: a live updating notification thingie on the front page?

I have a feeling this is going to get shot down, but I'd like to know how possible it is to do the kind of live updating that there is on Kottke or Tumblr or Facebook. It's something I appreciate on other sites, and would appreciate on Metafilter. It's probably pretty complicated to implement, though, isn't it?

posted by ocherdraco to Feature Requests at 5:25 AM (45 comments total)

ReloadEvery "reloads web pages every so many seconds or minutes. The function is accessible ... via a drop down menu on the reload button."
posted by Plutor at 5:36 AM on May 19, 2009

Ctrl+R or F5 "reloads web pages every time they are pushed. The function should be accessible on your keyboard"
posted by FuManchu at 6:02 AM on May 19, 2009 [2 favorites]

PUT THE CHIP IN MA HEAD ALREADY, JEEZ!
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:25 AM on May 19, 2009 [1 favorite]

Thanks, folks, I know how to reload. Reloading and live updating serve slightly different purposes. It's just nice to know when I've been reading a page for a while, if new things have been posted without having to reload and lose the spot where I'm reading.
posted by ocherdraco at 6:25 AM on May 19, 2009

This might be a useful feature, actually, in comment threads. On the front page, I'm not sure. Posts don't really come in that fast and furious, and how long do people really spend reading it?
posted by Plutor at 6:48 AM on May 19, 2009

This would be really cool in threads.
posted by dunkadunc at 6:58 AM on May 19, 2009

> how long do people really spend reading it?

I spend hours at a time mournfully gazing at the front page, reflecting on the lack of zing in my life. An auto-update feature would remind me that, for other people, life is rolling on whilst I stew in my contempt for my own inability to bring the zing, deepening my funk of self-loathing immeasurably. So I'm all for it.
posted by nowonmai at 7:03 AM on May 19, 2009

When I reload mid-thread in Firefox, it takes me back to the correct place that I was at when I hit the reload button.
posted by abc123xyzinfinity at 7:23 AM on May 19, 2009

I like this idea. obviously [NOT SHOTIST]
posted by tellurian at 7:24 AM on May 19, 2009

From a user's perspective, this would be great at the bottom of a thread, before the comment box. Especially if it didn't require a full reload to display the new comments. Make it a feature for logged-in users only if it's resource intensive?
posted by These Premises Are Alarmed at 8:25 AM on May 19, 2009

I think this is a very good idea because HELP ME MY F5 FINGER IS ABOUT TO FALL OFF SERIOUSLY THE SWELLING WON'T GO DOWN AND I'VE LOST ALL FEELING
posted by koeselitz at 8:35 AM on May 19, 2009

Could we update the Blue to be an AOL chatroom ca. 1997? I think that would help me out.
posted by shakespeherian at 8:49 AM on May 19, 2009

Can't tell which way the wind is blowing on this one, so I would like to ask: If this pony is added, could we have the option to disable it? I typically open 20-30 posts in tabs at that start of the day, and read them over the course of the day, and I really, really wouldn't want each of them to be making JS calls all day long.

Not to mention that if there was some indication in the title of the tab, like there is on kottke, my tab bar would flash like a friggin' disco.

(Actually, I'd probably want to turn it on once to see that happen.)
posted by SpiffyRob at 8:50 AM on May 19, 2009

I could see this creating new order-of-magnitude load problems for the server.

Also, the cool kids read the site via RSS, which updates itself for you. Booya!
posted by mkultra at 9:29 AM on May 19, 2009

But what are the stodgy old men using? Whatever it is, that is probably the speed at which I'll want to go.

Soon, I hope to have someone come over and show me how to get the youtube on my Victrola.
posted by quin at 10:11 AM on May 19, 2009

This would make more sense in threads, especially ones that a busy. search.twitter.com does this, and it works well there. Some of the longer threads here are a pain in the ass to load, so only having to pull data for recent messages might be nice.
posted by chunking express at 11:13 AM on May 19, 2009

I think this would be a pretty annoying feature. I can just picture the page changing on me while I'm reading/typing in a comment box and getting all stabby.
posted by cj_ at 11:51 AM on May 19, 2009

It's just nice to know when I've been reading a page for a while, if new things have been posted without having to reload and lose the spot where I'm reading.

Click on the timestamp of the post you're reading and hit F5. Easy.
posted by oaf at 12:18 PM on May 19, 2009

Do that on a page with several hundred comments. It's not the same thing as just pulling up the recent comments and appending them to the end of the comment thread.
posted by chunking express at 12:22 PM on May 19, 2009

Do that on a page with several hundred comments.

Use those several seconds to meditate?
posted by oaf at 12:24 PM on May 19, 2009

I like how the page doesn't reload while I'm away.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 1:22 PM on May 19, 2009 [1 favorite]

search.twitter.com has this little note that shows up that lets you know how many new posts there are. And if you click a link, it will load them. It's not the worse thing in the world. Mind you, MetaFilter gets along just fine with out this stuff.
posted by chunking express at 1:27 PM on May 19, 2009

I think I would find this annoying. What I can imagine would be useful would be a small live updating ajaxy thing down around the comment-entry box that read something like "N new comments since page loaded (click here to show)". That would let me know "hey, someone else is maybe commenting on the same thing I'm commenting on."

Then I'd load those new comments, and incorporate a response to that comment. During which time a few more comments would appear, so I'd view them, and work a response in to those…

You know what? Forget it.
posted by adamrice at 3:35 PM on May 19, 2009

I'll bet someone could do this via greasemonkey (maybe using rss)?
posted by philomathoholic at 4:03 PM on May 19, 2009

oh: My opinion is that it'd be cool.
posted by philomathoholic at 4:04 PM on May 19, 2009

What I can imagine would be useful would be a small live updating ajaxy thing down around the comment-entry box that read something like "N new comments since page loaded (click here to show)".

This, for the record, is exactly what I am proposing. The page wouldn't reload, it would just notify you of new comments or posts.
posted by ocherdraco at 4:11 PM on May 19, 2009

I'd like live deletion, ie. halfway through typing out your inadvisable comment, a mod's comment pops up with "please don't do that here Fiasco" and starts back-spacing through your flame.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 6:58 PM on May 19, 2009 [2 favorites]

For me, I'd like it to be if I even think about posting an inadvisable comment, when I click in the comment box at all an older man pops up like "Aw no don't do that, that's 5-to-10", a la Dave Chappelle.
posted by cashman at 9:21 PM on May 19, 2009

MetaFilter Live New Comments is a Greasemonkey script that watches for new comments in threads, and notifies you when they're available. It doesn't automatically reload the page for you or do any fancy ajax auto-updating, but it'll let you know when reloading would be useful.

Ways that this doesn't kill MetaFilter:
* Uses the RSS feed, which I assume is faster to generate than the actual thread
* Fires off of mousemove and scroll events, so it will only update the thread in active tab/window
* Only checks a maximum of once every 30 seconds
posted by Plutor at 6:08 AM on May 20, 2009 [2 favorites]

Plutor wins at Greasemonkey. Every time.
posted by ocherdraco at 6:10 AM on May 20, 2009

Ways that this doesn't kill MetaFilter...

Thanks for building in those safeguards. We do notice some Greaseomonkey scripts more than others, and some really do add some extra strain to the server.

Do you know if your RSS-grabbing code uses If-Modified-Since headers? If so, reloading the feed every 30 seconds should be ok. Serving up the RSS version of very large threads is faster than the web version, but still fairly intensive. So I could see this script adding some load on those few threads that go supernova.
posted by pb (staff) at 8:45 AM on May 20, 2009

pb: "Do you know if your RSS-grabbing code uses If-Modified-Since headers?"

It does now. That's apparently off by default in jQuery.ajax().
posted by Plutor at 9:14 AM on May 20, 2009

I say we kidnap Plutor for a backup, just in case pb ever goes crazy from all the pony requests and runs off to Antarctica, where no one's heard of Metafilter.
posted by misha at 9:19 AM on May 20, 2009

I say we kidnap Plutor and intentionally drive pb to Antarctica so we can have meetups on every continent!
posted by SpiffyRob at 9:32 AM on May 20, 2009

Hey! I'm happy in the northern hemisphere.

Thanks for turning that on, Plutor. One snag I just thought of: RSS comment feeds are on a ten minute cache. Not a big deal when reading threads through a newsreader, but that sucks for real-time use. Maybe we should discuss alternatives for your script via MeFi Mail.
posted by pb (staff) at 9:36 AM on May 20, 2009

So if I installed this before pb mentioned the If-Modified-Since headers, ought I uninstall and reinstall a new version?
posted by ocherdraco at 11:25 AM on May 20, 2009

We use Ajax, but we're still Web 1.0

I don't know, could you possibly rephrase your request in a way that doesn't use annoying buzz-phrases that most people with a clue realized were just empty and meaningless market-tool speak a few years back? Or if you are going there, could you possibly throw in a "paradigm shift," "edgy," "next-generation," and "value added" into the mix, with perhaps a vague mangling of "interactivity" on the side?
posted by KirkJobSluder at 2:30 PM on May 20, 2009

annoying buzz-phrases that most people with a clue realized were just empty and meaningless market-tool speak a few years back

Hint to decode post title: in the sentence above, I fall within the category "most people with a clue."
posted by ocherdraco at 2:39 PM on May 20, 2009

I suggest that when you make a feature request, you actually demonstrate that you have a clue by providing a better rationale than just jumping on the rebranding flavor of two years ago.
posted by KirkJobSluder at 2:59 PM on May 20, 2009

a better rationale than just jumping on the rebranding flavor of two years ago

My rationale was that it's something I find useful. Dude, chill out, okay?
posted by ocherdraco at 3:01 PM on May 20, 2009

I suggest that when you make a feature request, you actually demonstrate that you have a clue by providing a better rationale than just jumping on the rebranding flavor of two years ago.


Angry much? Also, I very much have a clue, and I know what web 2.0 means. It's simply a shorthand for various technologies and conventions. I would guess most clued-people realize this.
posted by !Jim at 3:43 PM on May 20, 2009

Most clued-people understood what was being communicated, and noticed that it wasn't snarky, shouty or otherwise insulting. Please stop making MeTa into a place where people are afraid to ask totally normal questions.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 3:48 PM on May 20, 2009

I suggest that when you make a feature request, you actually demonstrate that you have a clue by providing a better rationale than just jumping on the rebranding flavor of two years ago.

And I suggest you STFD and stop being a jerk to people for no reason.
posted by dead cousin ted at 4:42 PM on May 20, 2009

metafilter doesn't even let you edit your comments, I think some AJAXy 2.0 shit is not likely at this juncture. Plus, I'd hate it, and I know that counts for something around here.
posted by cj_ at 12:07 AM on May 21, 2009

cj_: "metafilter doesn't even let you edit your comments, I think some AJAXy 2.0 shit is not likely at this juncture. Plus, I'd hate it, and I know that counts for something around here."

A $5 newb and a cabal member?! How is this possible?

There is no cabal.
posted by double block and bleed at 9:58 AM on May 22, 2009