Grr, arg. January 28, 2010 10:09 AM Subscribe

Why doesn't everyone bring the derails, the intercommenter crankiness, and the haterade from the infidelity AskMe over here?

Below-the-fold-bonus: If you think something is obnoxious and should be deleted, don't embed a quote from it it in your otherwise on-topic answer. It increases the likelihood that the comment will stick around within your answer, or get deleted as part of a derail.

posted by kathrineg to MetaFilter-Related at 10:09 AM (645 comments total)

This post was deleted for the following reason: Poster's Request -- Brandon Blatcher

I am sleeping with all your husbands.
posted by hermitosis at 10:14 AM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

Ah, faithful MetaTalk.
posted by gman at 10:14 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Maybe she was taking a pottery course every Thursday.
posted by smackfu at 10:17 AM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?

I truly hope you weren't saying that with a straight face. Have you seriously never been in a relationship with a person who had a job out of the house? Or do you just sit next to your partner and hold hands 24 hours a day?
posted by kate blank at 10:18 AM on January 28, 2010 [15 favorites]

I am sleeping with all your husbands.

Ralph's really in trouble now!
posted by gman at 10:23 AM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

Maybe she was taking a pottery course every Thursday.
posted by smackfu at 1:17 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

oh, more euphemisms. is that the new "hiking the Appalachian Trail"?
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:25 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I have a question for those of you who suggested that he shouldn't tell the wife about the affair— If your partner was having an affair, would you want to know about it?

I would assume the vast majority of people would say "yes, of course!" which makes me wonder why they would go on to suggest the silence.
posted by Static Vagabond at 10:25 AM on January 28, 2010

Gender of anonymous and anonymous's partner were left neutral, btw.
posted by desuetude at 10:25 AM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

why they would go on to suggest the silence.

self defense. everybody knows the messenger always gets shot.
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:26 AM on January 28, 2010

Yeah, didn't understand your position at first. But fixed my misunderstanding as soon as you pointed it out.

Zambrano's "I knew you were American" needs to go, though. He can say "Of course not" and that's fine, but "I knew you were American" doesn't answer the question at all.

His usual "Its okay to break the promises you make to other people" is tiring, but he's entitled to bring that opinion to the table. Just calling out someone for being "American," especially someone who is in a lot of pain and facing moral dilemmas is really galling.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:27 AM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

I don't think "take it to MetaTalk" threads should be made for other people. If you think there's a discussion that needs to be had, then kick it off. If you don't think there's a discussion that needs to be had, then this is just an invitation for people to be crappy and fighty, when that kind of stuff could just be kept off the site altogether by being safely deleted.

Agreed. Opening a MetaTalk thread about controversial topics on behalf of noone in particular has become too common a practice. MeTa is for policy discussions, meetups, and other things related to MetaFilter, not just a dumping grounds where people can get free reign to be jerks to one another.
posted by moviehawk at 10:27 AM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Gender of anonymous and anonymous's partner were left neutral, btw.

Yep. but everyone's talking divorce, and "she." Some people even assumed it was a guy that was cheating. Amazing.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:28 AM on January 28, 2010

Sometimes I feel like the real purpose of 'taking it to MeTa' is that here everyone will mostly just threadshit and make Futurama references and bring up old memes and generally get everyone to stop taking things so damn seriously.
posted by shakespeherian at 10:28 AM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

You're my wife now, Dave!
posted by Artw at 10:29 AM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

not just a dumping grounds where people can get free reign to be jerks to one another.

Well, I do apologize to katherineng for not understanding her comment, so I guess we get some good out of this.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:29 AM on January 28, 2010

This reminds me of when I found out that my tag team partner had secretly been plotting to betray me at next week's Inferno Match versus the Millionaire Legend Boys. You start to question all those folding chairs to the head ... did they mean anything at all?
posted by Damn That Television at 10:29 AM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?

Happens all the time, dude.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:30 AM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

I couldn't even make it through that whole thread. I started getting a Charlie Brown-esque stomach ache.
posted by Skot at 10:31 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

agree with shakespeherian. it's kinda the blue equivalent of the cool buddy taking the antagonists outside to throw bottles at the side of the building and let off some steam, so they can go back in and behave more decorously at somebody else's party.
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:31 AM on January 28, 2010

whatever color, I mean. I'm running the white config and I get the colors mixed up...
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:32 AM on January 28, 2010

Optimus Chyme: Wow, you must really hate his kids, huh?

Wow, that was uncalled for. The guy's honestly conflicted about this, and is asking what the right thing to do is. Suggesting that kind of malice is pretty shitty.

For what it's worth, I'd want to know. And as others have said teenagers are much better at coming to terms with these things than young children. Not to mention the probable ongoing harm that is associated with not telling her (e.g. wife's health, even greater feelings of betrayal and general fallout when it finally does come out, etc.). In any case, I do think it's a tough decision. And n'thing giving yourself some time to really think all of this over.
posted by the other side at 8:36 AM on January 28

what the fuck i didn't post in that thread
posted by Optimus Chyme at 10:33 AM on January 28, 2010 [23 favorites]

Sometimes the person doesn't want to know, or already knows, and either way doesn't necessarily welcome your intervention. Case in point, Marti Webb singing "Take That Look Off Your Face."
posted by hermitosis at 10:34 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Wow, you must really hate his kids, huh?

Yes, seems like that was a deleted comment that someone misattributed, which is pretty messed up.
posted by smackfu at 10:36 AM on January 28, 2010

"what the fuck i didn't post in that thread"

Maybe you did, and everyone just decided to spare your feelings by not telling you.
posted by mr_crash_davis mark II: Jazz Odyssey at 10:38 AM on January 28, 2010 [42 favorites]

This thread is now about misattributing quotes to people.

That's what she said.
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:39 AM on January 28, 2010 [21 favorites]

what the fuck i didn't post in that thread

Poster confused you with someone else [I know, crazy] and I emailed them to clear that up and they said it was okay if I just removed their comment.

Zambrano's "I knew you were American" needs to go, though.

It did. He did also.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 10:39 AM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

I hear J.D. Salinger died.
posted by fixedgear at 10:40 AM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

lotta accounts shutting down lately.
posted by boo_radley at 10:41 AM on January 28, 2010

mr_crash_davis mark II: Jazz Odyssey: "This thread is now about misattributing quotes to people."

I'm in.
posted by Plutor at 10:41 AM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?

A surprising number of people sleepwalk through their relationships.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 10:42 AM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

You know what? I would absolutely want to know if my spouse was cheating, but if one of our mutual friends came up to me and was all, "Your spouse has been cheating on you," I would not believe them.

That's why friends don't want to tell their friends about known infidelity. Because absent of photographic evidence, we're going to side with our spouses. Sure, it'll plant the seed in our minds and we'll probably find the truth of it, but the friendship will be ruined until that point and perhaps even beyond.
posted by muddgirl at 10:43 AM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

fixedgear: "I hear J.D. Salinger died"

On wikipedia briefly. Franny and Zooey were a big influence on me as a kid, but I don't think I could really pull a good obit together. I hope one of the 5 (!) on the front page does a good job.
posted by boo_radley at 10:43 AM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

I hear J.D. Salinger died.

What?! I didn't even know he was sick. Fuck.

Someone better post that to the front page....
posted by marxchivist at 10:44 AM on January 28, 2010

I hear J.D. Salinger died.
posted by fixedgear at 1:40 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

I thought you were trolling but apparently it's true
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:44 AM on January 28, 2010

Oh my gosh, Optimus Chyme, I can't stop laughing for no good reason and it started with your comment here.

(Though I agree the incorrect attribution should be corrected.)
posted by zizzle at 10:44 AM on January 28, 2010

Burhanistan: "So Zambrano finally got the boot"

Oh? I always assume that it's people disabling their own accounts.
posted by boo_radley at 10:44 AM on January 28, 2010

optimus chyme: So flag it? Someone probably just had a brain malfunction.
posted by ODiV at 10:45 AM on January 28, 2010

I think most the material that would justify this Meta has long since been deleted.
posted by French Fry at 10:45 AM on January 28, 2010

wow, 5 FPPs on Salinger. Mods, quit watching the playground fight and get back to work! { / }
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:45 AM on January 28, 2010

You should be in tune enough with the state of your partner to notice if they've been having intercourse.

I see someone is a follower of Smell Yo Dick doctrine.
posted by Rhomboid at 10:45 AM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

Zambrano was J.D. Salinger. It's not widely known, but MeFi accounts have a deadman switch and deactivate when we do.
posted by COBRA! at 10:45 AM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

"Hitler had some good ideas. Also I am a babyfur fetishist."
— Optimus Chyme

"The greatest of all human artifacts is TruckNutz."
— hermitosis
posted by Optimus Chyme at 10:45 AM on January 28, 2010 [14 favorites]

Whoops. Didn't refresh and I was way too late.
posted by ODiV at 10:46 AM on January 28, 2010

It did. He did also.

Ahahaha!!!!! How will we ever be able to have another Philly related AskMe without Zambrano riding in on his private jet draped in beautiful diamond drenched European women to tell us how disgusting we are?!?!
posted by The Straightener at 10:48 AM on January 28, 2010 [39 favorites]

"Piss on my face and in my mouth and throw me off a bridge onto some rocks until I'm dead."
-- Damn That Television
posted by Damn That Television at 10:49 AM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Gender of anonymous and anonymous's partner were left neutral, btw.

The question wasn't originally anonymous; I don't still have the tab open, but at least one of the genders was obvious.

Speaking of which, maybe there should be a big bold notice on the "ask a question" page: IF YOUR QUESTION INVOLVES SOMETHING YOU DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO FIND OUT ABOUT, DON'T POST IT TO THE ENTIRE INTERNET UNDER YOUR REAL NAME.
posted by teraflop at 10:49 AM on January 28, 2010

Godard! Goddam! Godwit?

- toodleydoodley
posted by toodleydoodley at 10:50 AM on January 28, 2010

Looks like the mods are spending all their time on BoingBoing and not deleting doubles.

I'm kidding! Please don't ban me!
posted by blue_beetle at 10:51 AM on January 28, 2010

"I am the lizard queen!"
-never used baby shoes
posted by never used baby shoes at 10:52 AM on January 28, 2010

Oh? I always assume that it's people disabling their own accounts.

The few lately that were points of discussion were, yeah, though some of them have since returned.

In this case, no. Zambrano has been a noise machine his entire time here, has been timed out several times, and hasn't seemed to notice or to make any attempt to change his behavior. He's never engaged the community directly enough to really create a visible flashpoint or flame out or whatever, but we've given him a tremendous number of chances to basically just refrain from lazily shitting in Ask and this was easily into Too Many Times territory.
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:52 AM on January 28, 2010 [25 favorites]

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?

Marriages in which affairs take place are frequently lacking the kind of open and honest communication that makes such things obvious, is how. That plus a certain measure of active denial is how a good friend of mine managed to avoid noticing that her husband was having an affair with her sister who was working as their live-in nanny. For, yes, two years.
posted by KathrynT at 10:56 AM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

"Disabling your own account is for the weak."

-False Dichotomy
posted by False Dichotomy at 10:56 AM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

It did. He did also.

Ahahaha!!!!! How will we ever be able to have another Philly related AskMe without Zambrano riding in on his private jet draped in beautiful diamond drenched European women to tell us how disgusting we are?!?!

Dude was like, all for cheating. I think he assumed he was the only person who was doing the cheating. Its one thing to be for polyamory between consenting adults. Its another thing to be for breaking promises to one you supposedly love.

He thought he was way better than everyone else. Frankly, I think he was a troll and was not living this incredible life he claimed to live.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:57 AM on January 28, 2010

Zambrano has been a noise machine his entire time here, has been timed out several times, and hasn't seemed to notice or to make any attempt to change his behavior.

Plus he pitches for the Cubs. That's the real sin.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:58 AM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

The "incredible life" is when you don't have to call it cheating.
posted by French Fry at 10:59 AM on January 28, 2010

Nobody here knows anything about relationships. When your partner returns home from anywhere, you must immediately hold them at gunpoint while you examine them with a blacklight and wide-spectrum gas chromatograph. Emphasize the genitals. ALWAYS EMPHASIZE THE GENITALS.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 11:04 AM on January 28, 2010 [19 favorites]

Ha ha my genitals do their own emphasizing ha ha nice
posted by Damn That Television at 11:08 AM on January 28, 2010 [36 favorites]

It seems really tasteless to keep dumping on a guy that just got banned. Even if that guy was incredibly trollish.
posted by muddgirl at 11:10 AM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Marti Webb singing "Take That Look Off Your Face."

That is one terifying jumpsuit. Does the fact that I got that reference immediately mean that I'm gay?

Take me to a park that's covered in trees
Tell me on a Sunday, please
posted by Sparx at 11:12 AM on January 28, 2010

Hey Zambrano I bet I'm taller than you and could beat you up. Also I bet I know more famous people than you do (I met that guy who always lost another loan to Ditch at a party once. WE're tight + hang out constantly.) Also I own a boat
posted by Damn That Television at 11:12 AM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Yeah, he's gone and folks are welcome to feel about that how they please, but we can probably skip the post-mortem.
posted by cortex (staff) at 11:12 AM on January 28, 2010

Oh my god Howard Zinn died :( Where are his 5 FPPs?
posted by Juicy Avenger at 11:16 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

It took me a good 10 minutes to figure out why the title of this post sounded familiar. God, I'm a nerd.
posted by zap rowsdower at 11:21 AM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

It seems really tasteless to keep dumping on a guy that just got banned. Even if that guy was incredibly trollish.

Where's Zed?

Zed's dead, baby
posted by Ironmouth at 11:23 AM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Ahahaha!!!!! How will we ever be able to have another Philly related AskMe without Zambrano riding in on his private jet draped in beautiful diamond drenched European women to tell us how disgusting we are?!?!

I know! Now we'll never get him to a Meetup!! There's goes another dream, down the tubes.
posted by desuetude at 11:24 AM on January 28, 2010

You know what? I would absolutely want to know if my spouse was cheating, but if one of our mutual friends came up to me and was all, "Your spouse has been cheating on you," I would not believe them.

It happened to me, muddgirl. A mutual friend of both of ours called me up and told me. It was true. But then again, given the context of the relationship at that point, it was no shock.
posted by futureisunwritten at 11:24 AM on January 28, 2010

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?

It's easy to miss cues or to look past uneasy feelings because you don't have solid proof and you don't want to believe it's happening to you.

Or something like that.
posted by FunkyHelix at 11:26 AM on January 28, 2010

Looks like the mods are spending all their time on BoingBoing and not deleting doubles.

One of is is also posting to BoingBoing. One of us deleted three JD Salinger obit threads. I have some news about these two data points that may surprise you....
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 11:28 AM on January 28, 2010 [9 favorites]

Wait, Zambrano is gone? Damn, now I have to drop the "vitamins are psychosomatic" injoke which was comedy GOLD.
posted by DU at 11:29 AM on January 28, 2010

I'm also joining the sing-a-long, btw, but it's Bernadette in my head.
posted by desuetude at 11:30 AM on January 28, 2010

Just out of curiosity, what does banning look like to the bannee? I was joke-banned by a friend from a forum once and I couldn't even access the site as a visitor from my IP until I was reinstated. Do we do that or is Zambrano reading all this shit right now.
posted by shakespeherian at 11:33 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

We don't have any funny banning options. Banning looks just like the site looks to a guest, except that when you try to log in or comment, you can't. I'd love to see An Overview of Banning, of what other sites do, like the hellban [you can keep commenting, no one sees you] or the sort of banning mathowie used to do way back when, when he'd redirect any requests from your IP address to plastic.com.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 11:37 AM on January 28, 2010 [30 favorites]

Hellban is hilarious.
posted by shakespeherian at 11:41 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

"There is no way this thread could be improved with a long-story about robots"

-The Whelk
posted by The Whelk at 11:42 AM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

"Ralph's really in trouble now!"

Oh please. It's not like he was marrying hermitosis.
posted by Eideteker at 11:43 AM on January 28, 2010

*threateningly hovers finger over "spouse" checkbox*
posted by hermitosis at 11:48 AM on January 28, 2010

Pony Request: Hellbanning.
posted by Lutoslawski at 11:50 AM on January 28, 2010

oh no not again
posted by The Whelk at 11:50 AM on January 28, 2010

I seem to recall some forum sites introducing a method where the site set a permanent cookie when a person was banned, one that wasn't cleared by logging off the site. The signup process would look for that cookie and set a flag in the account if it was found. The result is that when someone got banned and signed up with a new account it would be visible to the admins that this new account was linked to the banned person, unless they had the presence of mind to manually clear their browser's cookies before signing up.

Nowadays if you were to implement this you could make it especially devious by not using a regular cookie but with Flash local storage, which behaves just like a cookie but isn't cleared when the browser cookies are cleared and most users don't know about them at all.
posted by Rhomboid at 11:51 AM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

When your partner returns home from anywhere, you must immediately hold them at gunpoint while you examine them with a blacklight and wide-spectrum gas chromatograph. Emphasize the genitals. ALWAYS EMPHASIZE THE GENITALS.

Or, set to music...
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:52 AM on January 28, 2010

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?

It took nearly eight years for people to finally realize "oh, wait, George Bush is an idiot." A lot of people still haven't realized it.

Two years seems short by comparison.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:57 AM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

The best type of ban is to let the person comment, and they see their comment, but everyone else sees an ascii art drawing of a famous disaster.
posted by Damn That Television at 11:57 AM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

but it's Bernadette in my head.

Ah, Bernadette!. Sarah Brightman is no compettion
posted by Sparx at 11:59 AM on January 28, 2010

The best type of ban is to let the person comment, and they can see their comment, and everyone else can see their comment, but then two months later a guy shows up at their house and punches them in the face.
posted by shakespeherian at 11:59 AM on January 28, 2010 [21 favorites]

It "feels" like a woman writing this.

Words: 156
Female Score: 226
Male Score: 164

Particularly grabbing is the palpable emphasis on "with a man" (shock! horror!). You know when your partner sleeping with a man will give you the most (shock! horrorr!)? It's when you're a married heterosexual woman.

Also, "partner of 9 years"? Not that there's anything inherent or deficient or any of that rightist bullshit, but I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

In terms of pure probability, the couple in question is probably heterosexual. Given the tone of the post and the (perhaps I'm over-inferring) emphasis of "with a man," I'm strongly convinced that the poster is a female in a heterosexual marriage or long-term relationship.
posted by jock@law at 12:00 PM on January 28, 2010

I meant Sarah Brightman .
posted by Sparx at 12:01 PM on January 28, 2010

I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

Sure you do. They're on MetaFilter. What a strange thing to say.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 12:01 PM on January 28, 2010 [78 favorites]

but I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

The plural of anecdote is not data.
posted by Sparx at 12:03 PM on January 28, 2010 [19 favorites]

but I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years

Really? I mean, I wouldn't say I know many, but most of my queer friends are still in their 20s. I would say that the majority of older gay men and lesbians I know are in long-term committed relationships.
posted by muddgirl at 12:03 PM on January 28, 2010

I've been gay for MetaFilter 10 years last August.
posted by Eideteker at 12:04 PM on January 28, 2010 [7 favorites]

Zambrano's "I knew you were American" needs to go, though. He can say "Of course not" and that's fine, but "I knew you were American" doesn't answer the question at all.

I have to agree with Ironmouth. Zambrano is obviously free to say whatever he wants, but I want to add that whenever I read a comment that sounds like it's coming from someone who is saying stuff to be contrarian more than for the benefit of the asker, it's usually Zambrano who is responsible for it.
posted by anniecat at 12:04 PM on January 28, 2010

perhaps I'm over-inferring

Yeah I didn't read 'with a man' as emphatic at all. I think if we were supposed to recoil in shock at the nature of the infidelity then we would have been told directly about it.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:06 PM on January 28, 2010

"More beers, ~~less~~ fewer gears."

-fixedgear
posted by fixedgear at 12:06 PM on January 28, 2010

*threateningly hovers finger over "spouse" checkbox*

Is that like bannsination? The banns-hammer? This is a confusing thread.
posted by everichon at 12:06 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

The plural of anecdote is not data.

The plural of cliché is not wisdom.
posted by jock@law at 12:06 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

And all the queer people I know who are in relationships have been in those relationships for many, many years.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:07 PM on January 28, 2010

Pony Request: Hellbanning.

I dislike hellbanning for the same sort of reason that I dislike disemvoweling; I don't think it's a particularly good idea to make a show of smacking someone around. I feel enough discomfort as it is about the times when I feel like we need to plainly address "Mod Action Required"-type bad behavior in public here, but at the very least we keep it to a minimum and try to be fair and leave someone with whatever dignity they had to start with.

But mefi bannings for something other than spamming are exceedingly uncommon compared to some other sites as well, as far as I can tell; a lot of this is just plain cultural difference from place to place, and I think has as much as anything to do with the existing community mores (or even the existence of a community, rather than just convenient mouth-noises about same, in the first place) as it does with the efficacy and appropriateness of any specific moderation method.

I seem to recall some forum sites introducing a method where the site set a permanent cookie when a person was banned, one that wasn't cleared by logging off the site. The signup process would look for that cookie and set a flag in the account if it was found. The result is that when someone got banned and signed up with a new account it would be visible to the admins that this new account was linked to the banned person, unless they had the presence of mind to manually clear their browser's cookies before signing up.

We do something like this, but without cookies, based on heuristic matches against things like paypal records and IP. When you come down to it, no method is perfect; one of the obvious disadvantages of any client-side solution is that clearing the tracking files manually is trivial for someone who cares to and that access from a different client computer sidesteps it entirely.
posted by cortex (staff) at 12:07 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Not that there's anything inherent or deficient or any of that rightist bullshit, but I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

In terms of pure probability, the couple in question is probably heterosexual.

Gross.
posted by hermitosis at 12:08 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

paypal records

I had completely forgotten about that possibility. That makes perfect sense.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:09 PM on January 28, 2010

The plural of cliché is not wisdom.

The singular of wisdom is is dom.
posted by False Dichotomy at 12:10 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Wait, I'm not done being indignant. That is an ignorant thing to say and you should feel bad for saying it.

Also, maybe there would be a lot more really nice middle-aged couples for us all to look up to if a fucking plague hadn't wiped them off face of the earth two decades ago.
posted by hermitosis at 12:10 PM on January 28, 2010 [79 favorites]

Never mind. Zambrano is gone. Good.
posted by anniecat at 12:11 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

Well, this can be explained without concluding that gays are unlikely to have 9-year relationships. (1) Gays are a very low percentage of the population. (2) Gays are less likely to talk openly about their relationships due to stigma. I've found this to be true even in quite liberal circles. (3) Straight couples are more likely to be married, which causes "my husband" and "my wife" to come up more often in conversation, which makes you more aware of straight couples' marital status.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:12 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

The plural of cliché is not wisdom.

jock@law, you should probably be aware that this kind of makes it sound like you are defending what I was assuming was a fairly innocuous comment that you hadn't put sufficient thought into w/r/t how ignorant and offensive it was.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:12 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Damn, now I have to drop the "vitamins are psychosomatic" injoke which was comedy GOLD.

He also liked to link to some quack-y doctor that claimed back and knee pain were all in your head.
posted by electroboy at 12:15 PM on January 28, 2010

More to the point, we should err on the side of not making assumptions about things that haven't been specified. It's an anonymous poster's responsibility to spell out any facts that they feel are relevant; otherwise, we don't know who's gay or straight or a man or a woman.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:15 PM on January 28, 2010

Hermitosis, I think I'm going to join you on that bafflement -- but not just over the "no gay couples who've been together long" (one of the closest couples I know is a pair of men who just celebrated their 20th anniversary and have been calling each other "husband" as long as I've known them), but also the whole using-a-word-count-to-prove-gender thing. (The hell?)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:16 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

... a lot of this is just plain cultural difference from place to place ...

That's a very polite way of saying that moderators on a lot of other forums are power-tripping egomaniacs that relish the thought of finding someone doing something wrong as it gives them justification to discipline and/or ban them in humiliating ways.
posted by Rhomboid at 12:18 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Just out of curiosity, what does banning look like to the bannee?

I got banned from a Commodore BBS once. When I logged on, my "level" had been reduced to ".0001" or something. The SysAdmin immediately appeared and berated me over a comment I made, which was actually totally innocent, but through a big misunderstanding made it seem like I was being a total dick.

The guy wouldn't really listen to my explanation and wanted me to literally beg for my level back. At which point I flipped the computer off, which supposedly would crash the guy's BBS, but I never really knew if that was true or an urban myth.

At any rate, I imagine it goes something like that on MeFi, too.
posted by drjimmy11 at 12:21 PM on January 28, 2010

jock@law: "The plural of cliché is not wisdom."

I disagree with your original inference, but darn if this isn't a snappy comeback.
posted by boo_radley at 12:21 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

Oh jeez. Here we go. The spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch. Again.

I never said it was improbable that a gay couple would be together for 9 years. I said it's improbable that any given couple together for 9 years would be gay. If for no other reason, this is true even assuming identical coupling rates and couple longevity because the vast majority of people are heterosexual. Those are two different propositions; treat them as such.

The comment was not ignorant, nor offensive, nor gross, nor reasonably a wellspring of indignity, nor anything of the sort.

Please have the common courtesy to read the very next sentence: "[T]here's [no]thing inherent [with regard to short relationships] or deficient [about gay couples] or any of that rightist bullshit." Yelling at me for a merely half-informed contortion of what I said is inappropriate behavior.
posted by jock@law at 12:22 PM on January 28, 2010

The plural of cliché is not wisdom.

Well, obviously. Wisdom isn't even a plural. What's the plural of truism, though?
posted by Sparx at 12:22 PM on January 28, 2010

I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

How sad for you. I frankly know plenty of them.
posted by scody at 12:23 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

In terms of pure probability, the couple in question is probably heterosexual.

Allow me to add my slight frame to the piling upon your [trollish | troglodytic] carcass.
posted by everichon at 12:24 PM on January 28, 2010

I don't know many Jewish couples who've been together more than 3 months before getting married.

posted by hermitosis at 3:10 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

WTF. Not cool man, most of the Jewish couples I know are gay!
posted by Potomac Avenue at 12:24 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

I think the ironic point is that most of the same sex happens within heterosexual couples.
posted by found missing at 12:26 PM on January 28, 2010

Yelling at me for a merely half-informed contortion of what I said is inappropriate behavior.

I am willing to believe that you merely stated your point inelegantly, in a way that made it seem like you were saying something you weren't saying. Fortunately we are all mind-readers who extend infinite benefit of doubt to people who self-identify as jocks.

it's improbable that any given couple ~~together for 9 years~~ would be gay.

See how all the relevant details are still there?
posted by hermitosis at 12:27 PM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

COBRA! writes "It's not widely known, but MeFi accounts have a deadman switch and deactivate when we do."

I've transfered mine to a baby Bowhead. This account is going to be around for a long time.
posted by Mitheral at 12:27 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Wisdom is just a bunch of cool stereotypes.

posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:10 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

noU
posted by Potomac Avenue at 12:28 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Oh jeez. Here we go. The spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch. Again.

A gentle observation:

If you've noticed that there are things you say which frequently draw ire, has it perhaps occurred to you that something about the way you are saying these things which may be provoking this reaction?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:28 PM on January 28, 2010 [26 favorites]

Oh jeez. Here we go. The spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch. Again.

You're an obnoxious twit.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 12:28 PM on January 28, 2010 [14 favorites]

In response to jessamyn, unfortunately, I don't actually know that many MeFites. Hopefully that will change soon, since I'm going to try to attend a meetup.
posted by jock@law at 12:29 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

If you've noticed that there are things you say which frequently draw ire, has it perhaps occurred to you that something about the way you are saying these things which may be provoking this reaction?

I'm guessing that that has occurred to him, yes.
posted by barrett caulk at 12:29 PM on January 28, 2010

self-identify as jocks

I'm somewhat amused.
posted by jock@law at 12:31 PM on January 28, 2010

it's improbable that any given couple ~~together for 9 years~~ would be gay.

See how all the relevant details are still there?

This.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:32 PM on January 28, 2010

Panini? That's a fuckin sandwich you wussy. Go back to Milan with that shit.

posted by EmpressCallipygos at 3:28 PM on January 28 [+]

i knew you were American
posted by Potomac Avenue at 12:32 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

I don't actually know that many MeFites.

Sure you do. They're on MetaFilter. What a strange thing to say.
posted by goodnewsfortheinsane at 12:32 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

MR. EDITOR,

As a life-long resident of Spitsburg county (God's own county, as we say 'round these parts), I take severe and mutliple umbrages at your editorial ("Gays Perhaps Not Metaphysical Demons," Jan. 21) for these reasons two: One, I don't know any gays except on the television or that fella what draws the weiners on TMZ. And b, they don't stay together long enough.

YOURS IN CHRIST,

ERNIE R. SMYTHE, SPITSBURG
posted by Optimus Chyme at 12:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [7 favorites]

The spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch. Again.

You have a problem interacting with people on this site without lapsing in to serious jerkishness. It doesn't seem to be getting any better, and we're well and truly sick of having to deal with the fallout of your crappy behavior. You've been given more than enough chances and warning to figure it out, and I'm done trying to give you the benefit of the doubt. Find another site to kill time on.
posted by cortex (staff) at 12:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [24 favorites]

Big time.
posted by chinston at 12:35 PM on January 28, 2010

I can tell the poster is a woman by looking at the pixels.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 12:35 PM on January 28, 2010

The spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch

I have several pairs of mob panties that I got in a panty raid on Paulie Walnuts' house. It was risky, but oh so worth it.
posted by COBRA! at 12:36 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

MetaTalk: the spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch.
posted by ericb at 12:38 PM on January 28, 2010

I don't know when panty-wadding became "uncool" or whatever. I cannot keep up with the youths.
posted by everichon at 12:40 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

I am sort of appalled that no one brought up the possibility of a "fourgy" in the original AskMe thread.
posted by hermitosis at 12:41 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

I wear my spittle mob commando style. 'Cause that's just how I roll. Or lurch and bob, as the case may be.
posted by False Dichotomy at 12:41 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

That plus a certain measure of active denial is how a good friend of mine managed to avoid noticing that her husband was having an affair with her sister who was working as their live-in nanny. For, yes, two years.

I used to know a woman who helped camouflager her constant casual sex with people who were not her lover by constantly going on and on about what a bad liar she was and how her lover would always know instantly if she's weren't being 100% truthful and so there was no way she would ever ever try to put one over on her sweetie...
posted by not that girl at 12:42 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

wow
posted by Rhomboid at 12:42 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Just because you start a sentence with a your personal version of "No offense, but..." doesn't actually make what you say next unoffensive

I kept trying to say this but I couldn't figure out how to put in into a sentence that was still parse-able. (I'm having trouble with that today.) It reminded me of my black best friend.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:44 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

As a closeted polyamorous heterosexual male, I am feeling very left out of this thread. Won't someone please make a sweeping generalization about me based on their limited experience, worldview, and circle of friends?
posted by Eideteker at 12:45 PM on January 28, 2010

but I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years.

Then your sample is too small, or too young, or both. Most of the (middle-aged) gay couples I know have been together at least ten years.

Anecdata fight!
posted by rtha at 12:45 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Hat trick, anyone?
posted by Rhomboid at 12:45 PM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

As a closeted polyamorous heterosexual male

Oops I mean to post that as anon.
posted by Eideteker at 12:45 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

We already know that most closeted polyamorous heterosexual males are sluts!
posted by ericb at 12:46 PM on January 28, 2010

As a closeted polyamorous heterosexual male, I am feeling very left out of this thread. Won't someone please make a sweeping generalization about me based on their limited experience, worldview, and circle of friends?

SLUT!

Is that better? :)
posted by muddgirl at 12:46 PM on January 28, 2010

Damnit.
posted by muddgirl at 12:46 PM on January 28, 2010

wow the banhammer is getting a workout today
posted by Perplexity at 12:46 PM on January 28, 2010

The ban hammer is busy, busy, busy. That's what bokononists whisper whenever they think of how complicated and unpredictable the machinery of life really is.
posted by fixedgear at 12:47 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

Yowza. I got here just in time to see the Banhammer in action.
posted by Floydd at 12:47 PM on January 28, 2010

muddgirl -- ~~great~~ dirty minds think alike!
posted by ericb at 12:47 PM on January 28, 2010

If you've noticed that there are things you say which frequently draw ire, has it perhaps occurred to you that something about the way you are saying these things which may be provoking this reaction?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 3:28 PM on January 28

I've been here longer than jock@law, and I can state with certainty that there are many mefites who spend a great amount of time on this site taking offense at things. And anyway, so what if the way he writes provokes negative reactions? Who are these people that need to be tiptoed around, lest we hurt their delicate feelings? Maybe they should question the fragility of their emotions.

jock@law stated as a fact that he does not know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years. In other words, of the gay couples he knows, very few of them have been together that long.

Drawing from his own experience (i.e. the facts he has collected throughout his life), he resolved an ambiguity in the text he read to conclude that the couple in question was heterosexual.

Neither of these things is unreasonable.

From this, however, people got upset because they assumed that what he meant was that gay people can't have relationships that long. This conclusion is totally unreasonable, and directly contradicted by other things he wrote.

So what is the problem here?
posted by Pastabagel at 12:48 PM on January 28, 2010 [14 favorites]

So the plural of Zambrano is jock@law.
posted by Sailormom at 12:48 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

As a closeted polyamorous heterosexual male

You guys are terrific!

(or was that not the kind of sweeping generalization you were looking for?)
posted by rtha at 12:48 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

damn big 'Tex bringing out the six shooters
posted by Damn That Television at 12:49 PM on January 28, 2010

the haterade has definitely been brought
posted by Solon and Thanks at 12:49 PM on January 28, 2010

Does she also have trouble writing parse-able sentences?

Oh jeez. The spittle brigade with its mob panties in a bunch. Again.
posted by shakespeherian at 12:51 PM on January 28, 2010

I frankly don't know many closeted polyamorous heterosexual males that don't have at least four stars and a broom.
posted by False Dichotomy at 12:52 PM on January 28, 2010

As your attourney, I advise you to huff this ether.
posted by Meatbomb at 12:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [16 favorites]

The gender genie thinks that my unambiguously heterosexual male best friend is a woman, and it thinks I'm male.

(Gender genie? Really? Ohhh, I haz some wishes!)
posted by desuetude at 12:55 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

jock@law stated as a fact that he does not know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years. In other words, of the gay couples he knows, very few of them have been together that long.

Drawing from his own experience (i.e. the facts he has collected throughout his life), he resolved an ambiguity in the text he read to conclude that the couple in question was heterosexual.

Neither of these things is unreasonable.

From this, however, people got upset because they assumed that what he meant was that gay people can't have relationships that long. This conclusion is totally unreasonable, and directly contradicted by other things he wrote.

Well, what if a dad were asking about local daycares, and people started talking about "well this one is not so friendly to minorities, so avoid it" and there's a discussion about race and assumptions and and I come in and say:

"From my own personal experience, not many black men care about their kids. So the odds are this guy is not black. I mean, most people aren't black so that's the odds. HEY HEY! I'm not saying they can't care about their kids, I'm just saying they don't in my experience."

Doesn't that seem like a bizarrely bad-faith thing to say? Especially if when people called me out I went "OH NOES THE PC SQUAD WITH THEIR PANTIES IN A TWIST!!" and had a history of doing things like that?

I'm putting this in completely other terms because the fact that you see nothing problematic about jock@law's response astounds me.
posted by Solon and Thanks at 12:56 PM on January 28, 2010 [32 favorites]

Did you bring enough for the whole class Metabomb?
posted by The Whelk at 12:58 PM on January 28, 2010

Jeez this thread is making me inexplicably horny.
posted by Mister_A at 12:58 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Pastabagel, come on: he even said 'frankly'. Saying 'frankly' is like saying, 'I'm not racist but...'.
posted by dirtdirt at 12:59 PM on January 28, 2010

I also thought that the anonymous couple was a male and female, and that the male was having a homosexual affair with a married man. That's how the text read to me. But I didn't come to that conclusion because of some weird just-so justification about homosexual relationships, and if I had, I wouldn't say it, because it's pointlessly mean and totally unsupported by facts.

What's bizarre is that I'm almost 100% positive jock@law is under 30, and that he should know closely very few people in general who have been together for 9 years.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 12:59 PM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

And anyway, so what if the way he writes provokes negative reactions? Who are these people that need to be tiptoed around, lest we hurt their delicate feelings? Maybe they should question the fragility of their emotions.

Man, maybe you should ditch the fucking real-talkin'-pragmatist routine. I respect you a ton, and generally like your mefi contributions, but you have this thing where you pop into threads to drop science on how silly we sensitive mefites are, and it's god damn tired. so here's the real-talkin'-pragmatism:

you don't get to tell people what they're offended by or how they should react to something. what you think is reasonable or offensive is the yardstick by which measure precisely nothing, and trying not to offend people, even when you think they shouldn't be offended, is basically the foundation on which the best parts of metafilter are built.

so. fucking. tired of this shit. not just you, but the handful of very vocal mefites who seem to feel like it's their job to let us all know how stupid our feelings are in the grand scheme of things, from their lofty perch as internet warrior supreme.
posted by shmegegge at 1:00 PM on January 28, 2010 [40 favorites]

I'm hoping that jock@law re-registers as 'mob panties'.
posted by found missing at 1:01 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

jock@law stated as a fact that he does not know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years. In other words, of the gay couples he knows, very few of them have been together that long.

Drawing from his own experience (i.e. the facts he has collected throughout his life), he resolved an ambiguity in the text he read to conclude that the couple in question was heterosexual.

The problem is that that's not a sound inference. (1) He doesn't know many gay couples who have been together at least 9 years (maybe he knows a few). (2) Someone who jock@law doesn't know posted a question on this site about their 9-year relationship. (3) Therefore ... it's a straight couple? No, that doesn't follow.

However, Pastabagel, I strongly agree with your first paragraph. If you had just written that as a comment unto itself, I would so favorite it. Too often on this site, people use being offended as a tool for dismissing politically incorrect insights, ignoring inconvenient truths, and enforcing dogma. Unfortunately, jock@law's comment isn't a very good example of this since it was just poorly reasoned and deserved most of the criticism it's getting.
posted by Jaltcoh at 1:01 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

shmegegge I am fighting so hard not to tell you how sensitive and stupid you are to be tired of people telling others how sensitive and stupid they are.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:02 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Drawing from his own experience (i.e. the facts he has collected throughout his life), he resolved an ambiguity in the text he read to conclude that the couple in question was heterosexual.

See, I saw that as furious backpedaling, couched in angry condescension.

I don't know whether you include me in your list of people who take offense, and if so, I don't mind. I am pretty quick to point out statements that contain bias or prejudice w/r/t GLBT issues. This is not always because I am personally offended or even angry -- it's because people (apparently) need to be made aware of the gaps in their reasoning which lead them to embed these opinions within otherwise intelligent discourse. I try to do this with humor, or at least without anger, but the idea that I am the asshole for taking offense at a really blindly and offensively constructed statement is more offensive to me than even jock@law's original implication.

I'm not so sure I would have called for his banning -- it's more interesting and fun for me to watch him stick his foot in his mouth and create "teachable" moments for others here on the site. But he does seem to always turn up on whatever end of the ship is pointed straight toward the ocean floor. I don't think he contributes to the community, he just likes to score points off of it, and then foam when anyone scores any off of him.
posted by hermitosis at 1:03 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

people please! I'm trying to logout and go to class!!!!111!
posted by toodleydoodley at 1:03 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Optimus, sorry, I assure that it was indeed some sort of brain hiccup I had there. Jess emailed me about it, just before you did, and I gave her the okay to remove the attribution.

My bad.
posted by the other side at 1:04 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Do dogs eat eggs? Wouldn't an egg confuse the shit out of a dog?
posted by Damn That Television at 1:04 PM on January 28, 2010

Dog's brain: "EGG = BIRD ROCK FOR EAT? GOTO 10"
posted by Damn That Television at 1:05 PM on January 28, 2010 [35 favorites]

/me goes for the 20-foot jumper while hermitosis is explaining jock@law's behavior.

score!
posted by electroboy at 1:06 PM on January 28, 2010

I am the egg man.
posted by The Whelk at 1:06 PM on January 28, 2010

EGG = BIRD ROCK FOR EAT? GOTO 10

Man even I know that won't compile.

Stupid dogs.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:06 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

did jock@law just get lockjaw?
posted by roger ackroyd at 1:07 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Pastabagel: "Neither of these things is unreasonable."

It is unreasonable. This is a perfect example of a weak induction, and is logically sound as concluding that all men are Socrates.
posted by boo_radley at 1:09 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

This dog seems slightly confused.
posted by barrett caulk at 1:09 PM on January 28, 2010

I've been here longer than jock@law, and I can state with certainty that there are many mefites who spend a great amount of time on this site taking offense at things. And anyway, so what if the way he writes provokes negative reactions?

Hey, I was only commenting because HE seemed angry about it. Also, the fact that he noticed it happened repeatedly could be a sign that he was in some way responsible for it -- possibly because he hadn't realized how he was coming across.

But I was commenting because HE seemed upset by it. In a similar vein, if I saw someone randomly scattering breadcrumbs around their seat at the park, and then heard them complaining that "gee, I'm getting awfully bothered by these ducks here," I'd point out that, "you know, they'd probably leave you alone is if you stopped scattering the bread crumbs."

But he's banned, so enh.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:09 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

It's all good; still, if my name is the first thing that pops up when people think "asshole comment" maybe I should stick to fake letters to the editor for a while.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 1:12 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

And anyway, so what if the way he writes provokes negative reactions?

If what he wrote provokes a negative reaction because of the way he phrased it then he needs to be clearer. He has tendency to write opaquely, and to tell people who take issue with what he said that they should just re-read what he wrote, and that's not helpful, and it doesn't make me think that he was interested in a genuine exchange. And it happened so often that I have trouble believing that he didn't know it was a problem.
posted by rtha at 1:13 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

whoa - was just about to send a memail and saw the account disabled.
posted by nadawi at 1:13 PM on January 28, 2010

they'd probably leave you alone is if you stopped scattering the bread crumbs

*slaps forehead, puts breadsack away, goes to 10*
posted by False Dichotomy at 1:13 PM on January 28, 2010

It took me awhile to figure out why the arguments being made by the bigots in California last week (you know, that homosexuals are rilly rilly powerful and therefore don't need any special protection) seemed so familiar to me. I see those same arguments here at Metafilter whenever someone acts like a jerk. It's like, "oooh, all you sensitive PC ninnies are stomping all over this jerk! You're so powerful, you don't need to be protected from this jerk! This jerk is speaking truth to power!"
posted by muddgirl at 1:14 PM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

What's bizarre is that I'm almost 100% positive jock@law is under 30, and that he should know closely very few people in general who have been together for 9 years.

Contemporaries of his parents? Relatives?
posted by fixedgear at 1:15 PM on January 28, 2010

jock@law stated as a fact that he does not know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years. In other words, of the gay couples he knows, very few of them have been together that long.

You're misreading the colloquialism. There's a colloquial difference between "I only know a few gay couples that have been together for 9 years" and "I don't know very many gay couples that have been together for 9 years."

The first one is derived from personal anecdotal data. The second one is an attempt to state a truth while admitting that you don't have any facts to base it on.

Substitute another subject:
"I only know a few fast food restaurants that serve healthy meals" = "I know that McDonald's, Wendy's, and KFC all serve salads."

vs.

"I don't know very many fast food restaurants that serve healthy meals" = "Fast food restaurants serve unhealthy crap."

You need to give some of us more credit than sitting around, spending "great amount of time on this site taking offense at things." I've been following the Prop 8 trial really closely over the past couple weeks. There ARE people who believe that gay people are incapable of having a loving, monogamous relationship that won't damage the moral fiber of our country and its children -- much less for nine whole years.

jock@law's statement sounded very much like those people. He didn't get jumped on ENOUGH for it by people who know better, but maybe that's because he was already hammered away at that point.
posted by mudpuppie at 1:15 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

OK, "mob panties" is a little over-the-top.

However I have to say that jock@law mailed me about some comment I made before and we talked and he seems like a very reasonable person (usually). He and I actually agreed on a lot of stuff, even though I am liberal and he is more towards the conservative-side. I can see why people took offense at the "no gay couples together" thing, but I really don't see any malice in it either.

So, I hope things cool off and he gets to come back at some point.
posted by drjimmy11 at 1:16 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Listen, at this point, by begin mentioned in or participating in this thread, a given mefite has an abnormally high chance of being banned.

Do you want that to happen?
posted by boo_radley at 1:18 PM on January 28, 2010

Ugh, I had something to say to jock@law but I see he's disabled his account (or had it done for him? I'm not done reading this thread) so I'll refrain. Plus SOMEONE STOLE MY FUCKING LUNCH TODAY so I am not in the best of mindsets.
posted by desjardins at 1:20 PM on January 28, 2010

I'm glad I found Metafilter to share my love of poetry, long walks on the beach, and poking dead things with a stick
posted by Juicy Avenger at 1:20 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

SOMEONE STOLE MY FUCKING LUNCH TODAY

Dude, that sucks. Who does that?
posted by shakespeherian at 1:21 PM on January 28, 2010

So, no pie then?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:23 PM on January 28, 2010

*mentions boo_radley*
*cackles*
*goes to 10 11*
posted by Mister_A at 1:23 PM on January 28, 2010

The first one is derived from personal anecdotal data. The second one is an attempt to state a truth while admitting that you don't have any facts to base it on.

I'm a native speaker of English. I got a 700 on the SAT Verbal section back in the day. I write in complete, coherent sentences. If you really think you can infer that sort of intent in the speaker based on two phrases which the vast majority of people would consider to be virtually identical, you are mistaken. They're both equally dumb things to say.

Is it your serious contention that if he had phrased it the other way, people would have have left it alone?
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:23 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

SOMEONE STOLE MY FUCKING LUNCH TODAY

Forgive me. It was delicious. So sweet and so crumbly.
posted by False Dichotomy at 1:24 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

OK, "mob panties" is a little over-the-top.

No, it's more than just "a little over-the-top." The whole "panties in a bunch" thing is noxious misogyny. It refers to nasty stereotypes of "hysterical" women, and someone uses that phrase only when they want to explicitly get a rise out of people -- i.e., only a fucking troll uses the phrase "panties in a bunch." Substitute the "panties" for any vicious racial stereotype and perhaps you'll see why.
posted by Frobenius Twist at 1:25 PM on January 28, 2010 [24 favorites]

Sensible boxer-briefs uncomfortably wedged.
posted by The Whelk at 1:27 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

HEY GUYS! I'M WEARING MY MOB PANTIES ON MY HEAD!!!! lulz!!!
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:29 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

It's getting awfully contentious around here. Maybe it's the time of year.
posted by dunkadunc at 1:29 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

It's getting awfully contentious around here.

I know! I know what to do!

* jumps on table *

C'mon, everyone! Let's all sing! "If you're happy and you know it, clap your hands..."
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:31 PM on January 28, 2010

You can't spell "contentious" without "content". You also can't spell it without "snotti." "Contentious" is an awesome word for the Jumble, is my point.
posted by Mister_A at 1:31 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

*CLAP! CLAP!*
posted by The Whelk at 1:32 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Won't someone please make a sweeping generalization about me based on their limited experience, worldview, and circle of friends?

From my extensive experience with polyamorous men, you have long straight hair and your name rhymes with "Fred."
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 1:33 PM on January 28, 2010

Ked Luverlots, that dastardly rouge!
posted by The Whelk at 1:34 PM on January 28, 2010

If you google "fightiness" this thread is the fourth thing that comes up.

AskMetafilter is the first.
posted by Doublewhiskeycokenoice at 1:34 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

Dude, that sucks. Who does that?

Someone who likes Lean Cuisine microwavable crap, apparently. Unfortunately there are about 100 people on my floor, so there's no real way to narrow down the suspect. I've had other stuff stolen here before, including a $100 jacket. People suck.
posted by desjardins at 1:34 PM on January 28, 2010

Substitute the "panties" for any vicious racial stereotype and perhaps you'll see why.

"Panties have one thing on their minds, getting into women's pants."

I see what you mean.
posted by found missing at 1:35 PM on January 28, 2010 [15 favorites]

It refers to nasty stereotypes of "hysterical" women

I think it's likely derived from "knickers in a twist," which I believe is gender-neutral in British English.

But "panties in a bunch" in American jargon is certainly sexist, but it usually is used in a derisive fashion by men toward other men in a double irony backflip, as it infers that a man is acting so weakly and displaying stereotypical feminine traits that he must also be wearing women's underpants.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:36 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Moar dastardly rouge.
posted by Mister_A at 1:37 PM on January 28, 2010

Wow! This is the banning thread!

Strike up the b&.
And the b& played on.
The Five-man electric b&.
B& of brothers.
Ab&on all hope, ye who enter here.
posted by Eideteker at 1:38 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

desjardins - i use to bring my lunch in a plastic grocery sack, opened the corner of the microwavable meal and include the note "i have licked one thing in my lunch. you could believe me or not, but before you take the chance, feel free to stop by my cube - i'll be the sneezing, generally sickly looking one". never got my meal stolen again.

(it might have helped that i have horrible allergies so i always look like i'm just coming off a horrific cold)
posted by nadawi at 1:40 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Listen, at this point, by begin mentioned in or participating in this thread, a given mefite has an abnormally high chance of being banned.

Do you want that to happen?

HAI GUYS WATS UP/^h?
posted by Slap*Happy at 1:41 PM on January 28, 2010

Dastardly Rouge is the name I use when I do my Palin act at the drag show.
posted by box at 1:41 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Somewhere (most likely a villa in Capri), the suddenly forgotten Zambrano is curling up under a mink Slanket with his nubile girlfriend who uses $400/oz. skin cream to stay perfectly fertile and foxy at all times, and smiles.
posted by scody at 1:41 PM on January 28, 2010 [19 favorites]

You have a problem interacting with people on this site without lapsing in to serious jerkishness. It doesn't seem to be getting any better, and we're well and truly sick of having to deal with the fallout of your crappy behavior. You've been given more than enough chances and warning to figure it out, and I'm done trying to give you the benefit of the doubt. Find another site to kill time on.

Wow. An attempt at clarification results in banning now?
posted by Big_B at 1:42 PM on January 28, 2010

Someone who likes Lean Cuisine microwavable crap, apparently.

Oh, shit, I think it was me and that you're my boss.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:43 PM on January 28, 2010

Is it your serious contention that if he had phrased it the other way, people would have have left it alone?
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:23 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

It is my serious contention that if he had phrased it more like a real example from his life, rather than sounding like he was making a statement about a much broader sample of gay people, *I* would have taken his meaning differently. I would have just assumed that his sample was small, or limited, or something, rather than assuming he was implying that gay couples just don't last for that long. And yes, I'll admit, that's how I took his statement. And yes, that's based on *my* assumptions, not his actual words. But you know, you hear this thing often enough, and it's not that much of a leap to believe that you're hearing it one more fucking time.

But no, I won't speak for anyone else. And honestly, I'm not really itching to get into an argument with someone whose opening parry is a citation of his SAT score.
posted by mudpuppie at 1:43 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

Wow. An attempt at clarification results in banning now?

No, persistent jerk-ness does. It was entirely possible for Jock@law to have clarified things without sounding like a prat in the process.

But he didn't want to do it the nice way.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:44 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Every time I attempt to clarify something, you chump-ass chumps start chumping it up. Why you gotta be such chumps?
posted by box at 1:44 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Wow. An attempt at clarification results in banning now?

Yes, that is exactly the lesson here.

*protip: to sound less stupid, start by citing your SAT score*
posted by found missing at 1:46 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Fucking chumpist!

*closes box*
posted by Mister_A at 1:47 PM on January 28, 2010

This is not always because I am personally offended or even angry -- it's because people (apparently) need to be made aware of the gaps in their reasoning which lead them to embed these opinions within otherwise intelligent discourse.

I've been following the Prop 8 trial really closely over the past couple weeks. There ARE people who believe that gay people are incapable of having a loving, monogamous relationship that won't damage the moral fiber of our country and its children -- much less for nine whole years.

These two things, Pastabagel, are the problem here (rather, why jock@law's comments were a problem). It's not necessarily that the comment was offensive, though it was, but that it helps feed into negative stereotypes of people, in this case, homosexual people. It's not just a matter of people sitting around looking for ways to get offended; that shit needs to be called out.

It was also a matter of his general conduct on this website, of which this is but one of many incidents. Which is, you know, why he's banned now, so I guess it's not really worth detailing. I'd be happy to if you want to MeMail me, though.

But "panties in a bunch" in American jargon is certainly sexist, but it usually is used in a derisive fashion by men toward other men in a double irony backflip, as it infers that a man is acting so weakly and displaying stereotypical feminine traits that he must also be wearing women's underpants.

Which makes it no less misogynistic.
posted by Caduceus at 1:47 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

It's not a parry, I'm just letting you know that I am reasonably aware of how our language works. Nor am I trying to argue with you, just letting you know that I think it's not the case that a slight rephrasing would make jock@law any less of a dolt.
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:49 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

So how'd you do in math?
posted by Mister_A at 1:49 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Why you gotta be such chumps?

Because I am Lancelot Lunk, Secret Chump.

*Gets banned, goes to 10*
posted by False Dichotomy at 1:50 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I skipped the math section because I was too busy arguing on the internet.
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:50 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Wow. An attempt at clarification results in banning now?

No, a long string of problematic jerky behavior eventually results in a banning now and then. Clarifying and disagreeing are not problems, and aren't why jock@law is banned, and if he could have found a way to manage those things without some of the recurring fighty bullshit he engaged in he'd be here right now, clarifying away.
posted by cortex (staff) at 1:50 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Etymology of panties.
posted by electroboy at 1:50 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Well played, ox dude.
posted by Mister_A at 1:51 PM on January 28, 2010

My SAT score looked like a really, really good ACT score.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:51 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

However I have to say that jock@law mailed me about some comment I made before and we talked and he seems like a very reasonable person (usually). He and I actually agreed on a lot of stuff, even though I am liberal and he is more towards the conservative-side. I can see why people took offense at the "no gay couples together" thing, but I really don't see any malice in it either.

Yeah I also thought jock@law seemed reasonable in most of his comments on the site. He was often one of the only one taking a conservative stance in a lot of threads, which I think probably made his comments more contentious than they otherwise would have been.

On a related note, I'm also a member on a forum that is the opposite of MetaFilter in terms of politics, and I pretty much have to completely avoid any political topics unless I want the entire forum posting comments telling me I'm an idiot librul. Which wouldn't be as bad if one of the mods there wasn't constantly posting about how Obama wants to take away everyone's guns and establish a New World Order. And they also recently instituted a Fuck You button, to make it easy for people to hate on other people's posts. The more I think about it, that place is probably the closest I'll ever get to seeing the Bizarro MetaFilter.
posted by burnmp3s at 1:51 PM on January 28, 2010 [12 favorites]

Desjardins - get yourself a new Lean Cuisine and leave it sit on the counter in your kitchen at home for a week. Then, refreeze it, bring it in to work and put it in the freezer, wait for it to be stolen and consumed, and then follow the sound of retching and explosive intestinal distress, and you have the culprit.

Actually, maybe you wouldn't even have to wait for it to be consumed - you could tell by the smell when the lunchtime bandit nuked that poisonous thing.
posted by dirtdirt at 1:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

if he could have found a way to manage those things without some of the recurring fighty bullshit he engaged in he'd be here right now, clarifying away

Like butter.
posted by False Dichotomy at 1:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Wow. An attempt at clarification results in banning now?

There's presumably been more going on behind the scenes than you or I could know - the mods make a point of contacting someone who is doing something troublesome to talk about it, often many times.
posted by Solon and Thanks at 1:53 PM on January 28, 2010

"I got a 700 on the SAT Verbal section back in the day."

Bless your heart.
posted by HopperFan at 1:55 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

scody: "mink Slanket"

a manklet?
posted by boo_radley at 1:56 PM on January 28, 2010

Desjardins - get yourself a new Lean Cuisine and leave it sit on the counter in your kitchen at home for a week. Then, refreeze it, bring it in to work and put it in the freezer, wait for it to be stolen and consumed, and then follow the sound of retching and explosive intestinal distress, and you have the culprit.

Hellban!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 1:57 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

follow the sound of retching and explosive intestinal distress

This is the first and last time this has ever been given as advice.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:59 PM on January 28, 2010 [15 favorites]

dirtdirt - That is the most brilliant suggestion I have ever seen to catch an office food thief.
posted by 8dot3 at 2:00 PM on January 28, 2010

Burhanistan: “How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice your wife has been diddling another guy for two years?”

EmpressCallipygos: “It took nearly eight years for people to finally realize "oh, wait, George Bush is an idiot." A lot of people still haven't realized it.”

I was going to say that someone might be that blind if she or he just wasn't very intimate with her or his wife, but EmpressCallipygos is right – that can't be it. Most of us didn't figure it out with George W Bush, and he was fucking us all regularly the whole time.
posted by koeselitz at 2:05 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

Oh my god this thread is like a all-you-can-eat favorites buffet for me. I'm just going down the line, hitting [+] [+] [+] all the way.
posted by ocherdraco at 2:07 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

boo_radley:
Oh? I always assume that it's people disabling their own accounts"

How the hell can you be so blind as to not notice a MeFite got banned?

I keed.
posted by IndigoRain at 2:08 PM on January 28, 2010

I don't think there's anything wrong with starting threads like this. I hope it kept some people from trying to sneak inappropriate comments into AskMe. I don't like to call out specific comments that will just get deleted; I don't like to call out people because it sucks to get singled out in a thread where lots of people are acting the fool.

I don't think there's anything wrong wrong with it either, but the way I see it there's usually a best-fit approach for any given "thread gone awry" situation:

1. If the problem is with some specific comments in the thread or a specific derail, flag and maybe drop the mods a note.

2. If the problem is with some derail that is likely to keep recurring due to the nature of the thread itself, consider making a metatalk specifically addressing that off-topic conversation and clearly noting the existence of said metatalk thread in the derail-prone original thread. Or drop the mods a note.

3. If the problem is with the original thread itself, consider making a metatalk specifically addressing that thread-inherent problem. Or drop the mods a note.

With this thread, it's hard to say if we're looking at (1) or (2); you're right that making a callout that quotes likely-to-be-deleted comments is usually kind of questionable, but if the main problem here was with such comments, making the metatalk thread without any reference to them and without something more specific about a point-(2) type situation can leave people blinking a little about what's supposed to happen here.

I think this is sort of a muddled situation somewhere between (1) and (2), so, again, not really a big problem to make the metatalk post but at the same time some of the critical reactions to it have some merit too.
posted by cortex (staff) at 2:16 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Is it true that if you unsheath the banhammer, you can't re-sheath it until it has tasted blood? That's what one of the other mods told me.
posted by Mister_A at 2:19 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

"...unsheath the banhammer..."
Um. I do not think that means what you think it means.
posted by 8dot3 at 2:21 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

You have a problem interacting with people on this site without lapsing in to serious jerkishness.

Man, a lot more people should be banned based on that criteria. See: The iPad thread.
posted by smackfu at 2:23 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

The banhammer has a tongue?

Still no reach-around, though.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 2:24 PM on January 28, 2010

Wow. An attempt at clarification results in banning now?
[quoting myself..]

What I should have said was more along the lines of this caught me off guard. I am aware of the issues with jock@law, even from my own personal disagreements with his views. And there probably are things going on not visible to the rest of us to justify the action taken.

Okay with that out of the way, who needs a hug?
posted by Big_B at 2:24 PM on January 28, 2010

jock@law should come back as lock@jaw. I'm a little bummed that he's gone, but more bummed that the lede is getting buried:

Zambrano is gone and the coveted Kwine's Least Favorite MeFite award is once again up for grabs! Send applications to my MeMail inbox.
posted by Kwine at 2:29 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

What would a sheath for a hammer look like?
posted by flatluigi at 2:30 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Who's up for some Centrifugal Bumble-Puppy?
posted by The Whelk at 2:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Food theft is so common here that they have signs on the refrigerator reminding people not to take food that isn't theirs. I am not making this up.

Tell me about it. It's getting really hard to take someone else's lunch without people getting suspicious.
posted by shakespeherian at 2:34 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I hear ya, Big_B.

One of the things that comes from our hesitance to ban folks is that when it does eventually happen it's often not preceded by some tremendously over-top sufficient-reason-just-by-itself comment or other milestone of awfulness. So the sense of "really, that was it" that someone not following the history involved can have is understandable.

Hopefully it's enough here to say that our hesitance to drop a ban is about the only thing that makes me feel okay about it when we do go there, and even then it's after a lot of effort (much of it behind the scenes) to not have to go there. I'd be thrilled never to feel like we had to ban anyone ever again, but realistically the best we can do is work with folks when there's a problem and hope things improve.

Man, a lot more people should be banned based on that criteria. See: The iPad thread.

There are ongoing problems with jerkish behavior on the site, definitely. jock@law is hardly the only person who has trouble getting along with other folks, and he's far from the first to get banned for it over the long history of the site. We are working pretty much daily both in public and in private to try and make this place work in terms of mitigating the bad behavior that does occur and recur; a small portion of the userbase is on varyingly thin ice at any given time, but, again, we try not to give up on 'em if we can manage it and one of the things that we try to account for is an active effort on a given individual's part to really address the problems and improve their behavior.

Short of moving to a policy of hair-trigger bans, we're all collectively stuck seeing (and the mods in particular are stuck dealing with most of the weight of) a certain amount of jerky behavior on the site. I wish it was less, and I wish it took less effort to keep it in check.
posted by cortex (staff) at 2:35 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

What would a sheath for a hammer look like?

it's a loop. the hitting end of the hammer is on top.
posted by shmegegge at 2:35 PM on January 28, 2010

No time to swing the hammer that was hanging from his farmers.
posted by box at 2:41 PM on January 28, 2010

Do you have to be wearing a jumpsuit to use a hammer sheath?
posted by qvantamon at 2:44 PM on January 28, 2010

However I have to say that jock@law mailed me about some comment I made before and we talked and he seems like a very reasonable person (usually). He and I actually agreed on a lot of stuff, even though I am liberal and he is more towards the conservative-side.

Well, he memailed me once and was a total prick, so I'm not too broken up about it.
posted by Caduceus at 2:46 PM on January 28, 2010

I once got banned from a forum because I made a post asking how to cope when my ex (who everyone thought was a liar/jerk) told me he was dying.

The next day he happens to stumble upon the forum and find the post, and mentions it to me.

So I PM a mod asking to change my username so he can't go back and read through all my posts. The mod is like, "No, because if he's dying it won't matter in the long run anyway."

I told him the 'no' was fine but I could do without the snarkiness, and he perma-banned me for calling him out on that in PM. xD

Two years later I moved and rejoined -shifty-eyes-, but I never visit anymore.

So, so very different from MeFi mods.
posted by biochemist at 2:47 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

One of the things that comes from our hesitance to ban folks is that when it does eventually happen it's often not preceded by some tremendously over-top sufficient-reason-just-by-itself comment or other milestone of awfulness. So the sense of "really, that was it" that someone not following the history involved can have is understandable.

I've always liked the Something Awful system. Clearly it's a different philosophy, but it's all done in public. You get probation for minor things and you get banned for major things and there's a page that lists all of it. No one ever goes "why did he get banned?"
posted by smackfu at 2:50 PM on January 28, 2010

Zambrano was one of my very favorite mefites and I'm really sad to see him go. I know the mods are doing an amazing job and that they have to make these choices to make the site work as well as it does - but it is a sad side effect that the most entertaining people get let go. Sixcolors - kdickson - and now Zambrano? He was just so fancy.
posted by moxiedoll at 2:51 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Food theft is so common here that they have signs on the refrigerator reminding people not to take food that isn't theirs. I am not making this up.

Had that happen at an old place of business. That all came to a screeching halt when one of the anonymous signs said, "I AM HIV POSITIVE AND YOU ARE AFFECTING MY HEALTH BY STEALING MY LUNCH."

This was in the bad old days, right before the real widespread use of AZT and similar cocktail regimens. I didn't hear another story of lunch theft again. I'd like to think the sign actually worked, but who knows....
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 2:51 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

"I AM HIV POSITIVE AND YOU ARE AFFECTING MY HEALTH BY STEALING MY LUNCH."

Boy, someone really got their panties in a twist there. I'm just imagining the spittle-flecks on the note.
posted by hermitosis at 2:57 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Zambrano was one of my very favorite mefites and I'm really sad to see him go. I know the mods are doing an amazing job and that they have to make these choices to make the site work as well as it does - but it is a sad side effect that the most entertaining people get let go. Sixcolors - kdickson - and now Zambrano? He was just so fancy.

Yeah--I loved how he was the biggest proponent of upscale, expensive mens' cosmetics on the site.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:59 PM on January 28, 2010

"LUNCH EXPERIMENT"
posted by Artw at 2:59 PM on January 28, 2010

desjardins: "Plus SOMEONE STOLE MY FUCKING LUNCH TODAY so I am not in the best of mindsets."

There are many things people disagree about on MetaFilter. This is not one of them.

Do you hear that noise, anonymous lunch thief? That is the sound of thousands of MeFites adding you to our enemies lists.

In pen.
posted by FishBike at 3:04 PM on January 28, 2010 [19 favorites]

There's no way I can catch the thief. There are roughly 100 people working on this floor, and 3 refrigerators in the shared lunch room.

Food theft is so common here that they have signs on the refrigerator reminding people not to take food that isn't theirs. I am not making this up.

Three Lean Cuisines.

Also, this thread is awesome. and I <3 Optimus. I also think that the OP in the AskMe should tell the wife. (FOR GREAT HEALTH)
posted by exlotuseater at 3:06 PM on January 28, 2010

That AskMe's going to be useful if anyone learns that an unaware Mefite is being cheated on, with all the "I would want to know" replies.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:06 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

oh, oh, and I know I shouldn't but Nth-ing the ZambranoBan. ZambranoBan. Sounds like deodorant. Cheap, American deodorant.
posted by exlotuseater at 3:08 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

The whole "panties in a bunch" thing is noxious misogyny.
posted by Frobenius Twist at 1:25 PM on January 28

So..... Frobenius isn't German for knickers?
posted by Killick at 3:09 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

his private jet draped in beautiful diamond drenched European women...
just so fancy...
upscale, expensive mens' cosmetics...

Okay, all these descriptions are making me really miss the guy and I didn't even know who he was until today.

I realize that there are bigger things happening around here, and that I'm not alone in this feeling but I just have to get this off my chest:

You know what gets my knickers in a twist? The word "panities"

It just really creeps me; it's a good thing I'm not a mod or you'd all be walking on egg shells.

Also, whenever I see stuff about Obama wanting to start a "New World Order" my brain scrambles it to read "New New Order" - and I wonder, for a fleeting moment, why he'd be involved in getting the band back together? Talk about your bizarre love triangle.

(And with that, I bring us back to the askme derail that brought us here.)
posted by MCMikeNamara at 3:09 PM on January 28, 2010

There are many things people disagree about on MetaFilter. This is not one of them.

I need more information. What if the thief is impoverished and literally starving?
posted by found missing at 3:09 PM on January 28, 2010

cortex: “Short of moving to a policy of hair-trigger bans, we're all collectively stuck seeing (and the mods in particular are stuck dealing with most of the weight of) a certain amount of jerky behavior on the site. I wish it was less, and I wish it took less effort to keep it in check.”

But being a mod has its tiny perks, right? Like the other day, when you got to close no less than four different metatalk threads. B L A M!

I like to pretend that the mod interface has a big red button at the bottom of every post that says "CLOZE THS THREDDD!!!!!!" and that the button makes that nice, satisfying BLAM! sound when you click it, but I have a feeling that's just in my imagination.
posted by koeselitz at 3:09 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

You know what gets my knickers in a twist? The word "panities"

I think I see your problem
posted by found missing at 3:10 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

Food theft is so common here that they have signs on the refrigerator reminding people not to take food that isn't theirs. I am not making this up.

It is neither a sin nor a crime if no one sees you commit the act or fail to commit the act, as the case may be--this is apparently the operating principle for a larger segment of the population than you would think and in regards to any number of behaviors at that.
posted by y2karl at 3:13 PM on January 28, 2010

You know what gets my knickers in a twist? The word "panities"

I think I see your problem

Yes one of many, one of many. Thanks.

(By the way, just so were clear, my dislike of "panties" (no matter how I spell it) isn't misogynistic -- I'm sure I hated the word in the 19th century too)
posted by MCMikeNamara at 3:15 PM on January 28, 2010

But being a mod has its tiny perks, right?

Totally. It's a great job. Today has not been a great day, but that's the way it goes.
posted by cortex (staff) at 3:17 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

What if the thief is impoverished and literally starving?

This is a white collar job in a multimillion dollar company. No one here is impoverished or starving.

That all came to a screeching halt when one of the anonymous signs said, "I AM HIV POSITIVE AND YOU ARE AFFECTING MY HEALTH BY STEALING MY LUNCH."

This would probably be effective, but having watched friends die, it would squick me out. Plus, there are gay guys who work on this floor, and even though I don't think the culture here is particularly homophobic, they'd probably be seen as prime suspects.

sorry for the seriousness. bad day all around.
posted by desjardins at 3:18 PM on January 28, 2010

The p-word didn't bother me until I saw Deliverance.
posted by electroboy at 3:19 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

You know what gets my knickers in a twist? The word "panities"

I think I see your problem
posted by found missing at 6:10 PM on January 28 [1 favorite +] [!]

Whenever I hear the word "underpants," I can't help cracking up. What is it about that word?
posted by Maisie at 3:19 PM on January 28, 2010

It is neither a sin nor a crime if no one sees you commit the act or fail to commit the act, as the case may be--this is apparently the operating principle for a larger segment of the population than you would think and in regards to any number of behaviors at that.

With regards to theft, this only applies to lighters and flip flops.
posted by gman at 3:20 PM on January 28, 2010

I haven't read this whole thread yet but could it be true?? is jockatlaw finally a proud recipient of the banhammer????? thank you cortex!! not to dance on his grave but he's rarely contributed anything of value imho...good riddance :)
posted by supermedusa at 3:22 PM on January 28, 2010

How do you feel about underpants?
posted by found missing at 3:23 PM on January 28, 2010

Desjardins - get yourself a new Lean Cuisine and leave it sit on the counter in your kitchen at home for a week. Then, refreeze it, bring it in to work and put it in the freezer, wait for it to be stolen and consumed, and then follow the sound of retching and explosive intestinal distress, and you have the culprit.

Eh, I bet the thing has so many preservatives in it that even if you injected it with bacteria, it would attack and kill the invading organism.
posted by desuetude at 3:25 PM on January 28, 2010

The p-word didn't bother me until I saw Deliverance.

Piggy?
posted by Sparx at 3:25 PM on January 28, 2010

How do you feel about underpants?

Frequently and enthusiastically.
posted by Skot at 3:26 PM on January 28, 2010 [25 favorites]

Never took the SATs. Dropped out in 11th grade, eventually got a GED. Went to a public college (Go Owls!) but I did graduate with honors. Please don't judge me.

Food theft reminds me that in my workplace (2,000 of us) we have no official kitchen areas. In my luxurious converted warehouse, if you want a fridge or microwave you chip in with people in your workgroup and buy one. Then you get a 'mess permit' from the Navy fire inspector, who posts it on the 'bulkhead.' We had a really whiny question posted to our official Q&A board (which reminds me that I should copy and post to passive aggressive notes) from someone who was denied use of a common fridge and who complained bitterly that they should be allowed to use it since Uncle Sam was paying for the electricity. Thank God I go home for lunch on the 3 days a week that I do go into the office.
posted by fixedgear at 3:26 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

ZambranoBan. ZambranoBan. Sounds like deodorant

I would frequently misread his name as Zamboni, which made me smirk-giggle a little (an activity I hereby dub smirggling) because I would think "heh heh, ZamBONER" in my juvenile American I-buy-drugstore-skin-products-and-don't-cheat-on-my-boyfriend fashion. also: haha fake fancy guy thinks we believe he's off bagging supermodels when he's really just resurfacing ice.
posted by scody at 3:31 PM on January 28, 2010 [17 favorites]

Oh, and:

The hammer is my penis.
posted by desuetude at 3:31 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

jock@law is now ~~banned~~ jock@law with lemon.
posted by davejay at 3:32 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Oh, and:

The hammer is my penis.
posted by desuetude at 6:31 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

Really? I always thought you were female for some reason.
posted by Maisie at 3:34 PM on January 28, 2010

Really? I always thought you were female for some reason. (Maisie)

It's a reference.
posted by ocherdraco at 3:38 PM on January 28, 2010

I remember once I had some Arby's food in the fridge at work, back when I was a low-level production flunky, and I go into the lunchroom and my food is gone, and it's not a very big office.

So I'm bummed, but I'm about to move on, and I notice the wrapper from one of my sandwiches is in the garbage, with burn marks and holes in it; I realize someone tried to microwave it without taking it out of the foil wrapper first.

I start asking around about someone accidentally setting the microwave on fire, and one person tells me that the CFO -- the makes-a-fuckload-of-money, runs-the-joint, part-owner CFO -- accidentally nuked a foil-wrapped Arby's sandwich earlier that day while they were in the lunchroom. Yep, the CFO who signs my checks stole my lunch.

Rather than confront him directly, and risk getting canned at some point in the future for having called him on it, I figure he doesn't know whose sandwiches they were. I took the burnt wrapper, spread it out and taped it to a piece of paper, and taped it to the wall of the lunchroom with something along the lines of "[name of finance guy], the next time you steal my lunch make sure you take it out of the wrapper before you microwave it."

About an hour later, he sent a mea culpa email to everyone at the company, since he had no idea whose lunch it was, apologizing and admitting he was being a dick. It was very win-win.

Wait, what were we talking about again?
posted by davejay at 3:38 PM on January 28, 2010 [87 favorites]

We need to have MORE TRYOUTS!
posted by turgid dahlia at 3:39 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

Metafilter: follow the sound of retching and explosive intestinal distress
posted by nomisxid at 3:45 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

i really hope people are getting this out of their system right now... ugh.
posted by modernnomad at 3:48 PM on January 28, 2010

You got a guilty look about you, modernnomad.
posted by turgid dahlia at 3:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Um, you guys know there is a MeFite named zamboni as well, right?

By the way, has the www.metafilter.com/username/username link to user profiles broken for anyone else? I've tried it from a couple of machines and it keeps sending me to my own profile regardless of whose name I put in there.
posted by FishBike at 3:54 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

i really hope people are getting this out of their system right now... ugh.

From the sounds of retching and explosive intestinal distress, I'd say so.
posted by darkstar at 3:55 PM on January 28, 2010

but I frankly don't know many gay couples that have been together for 9 years

Most of the couples I know who are in genuinely long term relationships-- 25 and 30 and 35 years-- are gay. I now sort of have this stereotype in my head that it's heterosexual relationships that don't last. My anecdote cancels yours.
posted by jokeefe at 4:00 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

I'm gonna go eat cheetos and listen to the music my Friend From Japan sent me. Maybe share them on MeChatRadio. Who knows!
posted by The Whelk at 4:00 PM on January 28, 2010

Well, shit. I guess I waited too long to unveil my sockpuppet.
posted by lock@jaw at 4:02 PM on January 28, 2010 [7 favorites]

I accidentally ate raw cuttlefish last night and I gotta tell you, it was comprehensively disgusting. Warm, and sort of chewy, like having a piece of rubber in your mouth*. I wanted to spit it out but it was a sushi train place and I didn't want to put off the other diners. So I just left it there for the rest of the night. Forgot about it when I went to bed. It's still there now.

*amirite, ladies?
posted by turgid dahlia at 4:04 PM on January 28, 2010

jock@law should come back as reklaw
posted by pelham at 4:04 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Here's the thing.

I have never seen a man eat Lean Cuisine. (I know, more stereotypical anecdotes, just what we need.) Therefore, if I "discourage" someone from eating it per dirtdirt's suggestion, the thief is likely going to be a woman, which means I'll have to share the same bathroom with someone who is retching and exploding. I'll pass on that.
posted by desjardins at 4:13 PM on January 28, 2010

With regards to theft, this only applies to lighters and flip flops.

The hell you say? You steal my flip flops, I steal a punch. We take our flip flops seriously here (Rainbows and those Old Navy ones you can get for 2 for $5, equally).
posted by librarylis at 4:13 PM on January 28, 2010

The ban hammer is busy, busy, busy.

I like to imagine the mods saying "By the power of Grey Skull!" just before the banhammer comes down.

It's a shame Zambrano is banned. That dude had a real purpose here; you could always count on him to demonstrate that lefties can be assholes, too.

You know what gets my knickers in a twist? The word "panties"

Even worse: "moist panties." Those might be the two most unpleasant words in the English language.
posted by octobersurprise at 4:15 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

octobersurprise: I can think of plenty of mefits who fit that niche.
posted by aspo at 4:16 PM on January 28, 2010

Short of moving to a policy of hair-trigger bans, we're all collectively stuck seeing (and the mods in particular are stuck dealing with most of the weight of) a certain amount of jerky behavior on the site. I wish it was less, and I wish it took less effort to keep it in check.

Add custom CSS classes to comments that are comprised of the poster's username. Everytime an admin clicks a SPANK button in the backend, the text of a problem user's comments gets progressively closer to the current background color, until eventually it's completely invisible. That'd be fun.

Except dealing with all the 'why are my comments hard to read' Metatalk threads.

No, I'm not serious. That'd let people write killfile Greasemonkey scripts waaayyy too easily. Heh.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:16 PM on January 28, 2010

Even worse: "moist panties."

No, the two most unpleasant words in the English language are "wet jocks".
posted by turgid dahlia at 4:17 PM on January 28, 2010

Like Michael Phelps?
posted by found missing at 4:19 PM on January 28, 2010

HATERADE? ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?

_{just fuckin' with you katherineg don't get mad}
posted by mr_crash_davis mark II: Jazz Odyssey at 4:23 PM on January 28, 2010

Those might be the two most unpleasant words in the English language.

"cummerbund"

Yeah, I know it's one word. That's how unpleasant it is; it would still win this contest.
posted by Durn Bronzefist at 4:25 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

lock@jaw's user number is the zipcode for my hometown. QUIT STALKING ME, GOD.
posted by rhapsodie at 4:27 PM on January 28, 2010

> Zambrano was one of my very favorite mefites and I'm really sad to see him go. ...

Yeah--I loved how he was the biggest proponent of upscale, expensive mens' cosmetics on the site.

And John Sarno! Don't forget John Sarno!
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:28 PM on January 28, 2010

Wow, a meta first. A thread I can't make it through and a metatalk about it that I can't make it through. There's little good to be seen in either.
posted by cjorgensen at 4:31 PM on January 28, 2010

Yeah--I loved how he was the biggest proponent of upscale, expensive mens' cosmetics on the site.

And John Sarno! Don't forget John Sarno!

Oh, Dr. John Sarno is a proponent of upscale, expensive mens' cosmetics, as well?
posted by scody at 4:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

The Bonfire of the Panities.
posted by webmutant at 4:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

You know what gets my knickers in a twist? The word "panities"

Moist panties must be the world's most hideous combination of words. eeewww!
posted by The Light Fantastic at 4:38 PM on January 28, 2010

No one steals my lunch, but I never get to eat it because my food is WAY MORE INTERESTING than the meal being served and if I try to sit down and eat it, crying and screaming ensues. And if I try to eat surreptitiously, some kind of shenanigans will break out and I won't be able to get near the food until it's gone cold and needs to be re-heated.

The first rule of childcare is that the childcare provider will never, ever be able to eat uninterrupted.
posted by grapefruitmoon at 4:40 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

How to Write a Passive Aggressive Note, y'know for those with lunch-time larceny.
posted by netbros at 4:43 PM on January 28, 2010

Moist panties must be the world's most hideous combination of words. eeewww!

I consider "rancid ****" to hold this title, where "****" is understood to be a particularly foul descriptor of assorted orificular anatomy. Enjoy!
posted by False Dichotomy at 4:44 PM on January 28, 2010

And with that: *pfft!* He's gone!
posted by False Dichotomy at 4:47 PM on January 28, 2010

I have never seen a man eat Lean Cuisine.

I'll eat'em sometimes. The Healthy Choice steamers are better tasting though.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:50 PM on January 28, 2010

False Dichotomy, indeed.
posted by gman at 4:57 PM on January 28, 2010

I'm going to miss jock@law. I appreciated his perspective in a lot of threads and his positions - while maybe not the ones I would take - were useful for considering whatever issue was at hand. I liked him a hell of a lot more than JD Salinger. And knowing that his thinking isn't available here anymore makes me sad. You should be sad too.

Because I bet the part of this site that you like is insightful commentary left by commenters who have experience and expertise unlike your own. And you just cattle prodded one into extinction.

Turn your responses down from 11 MetaFilter. That doesn't make you right. It doesn't help you win. It doesn't fix the problem or person you are fighting. It just makes you shrill and adds to the noise here.

Picking apart someone else's comments - even when they're damned stupid and wrong - is not helpful when you do it in a combative way. And that's all I see in this thread. You all are so good at recognizing trolls. (Though in the case of jock@law I think you all are wrong.) And yet this community is so spectacularly bad at dealing with them. What gives?

I only point this out because you all are better than this. You aren't here to have a proxy hatefuck with George Bush or the Pope. So stop behaving like it, use your words and if you have to engage someone who is being an idiot, do it with civility.

Be the bigger person, MetaFilter. I know you can.
posted by greekphilosophy at 5:00 PM on January 28, 2010 [26 favorites]

you all are better than this

I'm not.
posted by Pot at 5:06 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

Me neither.
posted by Kettle at 5:07 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Can I point out that this is in fact the first time I have ever been on television?
posted by mr_crash_davis mark II: Jazz Odyssey at 5:09 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

'scuse me? I'm here for the proxy hatefuck?
posted by toodleydoodley at 5:10 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

God, yes. panties is a horrible word.

I'll eat'em sometimes. The Healthy Choice steamers are better tasting though.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:12 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

proxy hatefuck is an awesome name for... practically everything.
posted by Durn Bronzefist at 5:12 PM on January 28, 2010

'scuse me? I'm here for the proxy hatefuck?

Do you have your twenty bucks? Because it's the same as in town.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 5:12 PM on January 28, 2010

Can we get back to talking about this Zambrano character? Because one time, a few months ago, Brandon Blatcher was going around spousing everyone. I joined in the fun. And then someone -- I don't remember who -- issued a double-dog dare to spouse Zambrano.

The dare wasn't to me. I think it was to Brandon. Or someone else. It doesn't matter. I was all, "I will take that dare, dammit."

So I spoused Zambrano. I had no idea who he was, although I got the feeling from the dare that he was, you know, stand-offish.

Let me tell you, that man was not happy about being spoused by me. I was all, "There was a thing! On MetaTalk! And it was a joke!" And he was all, "How DARE you spouse me?" And I was all, "No, but ... the joke!"

Do you understand? Do you people understand what I did for MetaFilter, and what I suffered as a result? Okay, actually I did it for myself because I thought it would be funny. And there was no suffering, only a thing where I was like, "Wait. Is he some famous dude? Or some dude who is sort of famous, or some dude who thinks he is famous? Is this like if I had just spoused Adam Savage? I bet Adam Savage would be much nicer to me if I spoused him. Why didn't I spouse Adam Savage?"

Anyway, now I don't feel so badly about Zambrano being all mean about it. I mean, I just married him. It was a good thing. A nice thing. Wasn't it? Brandon, when you started marrying folks, you were doing it because you loved each and every one of us, right? Right?
posted by brina at 5:14 PM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

octobersurprise> It's a shame Zambrano is banned. That dude had a real purpose here; you could always count on him to demonstrate that lefties can be assholes, too.

What the fuck am I? Chopped liver?
posted by UrineSoakedRube at 5:14 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Totally. It's a great job. Today has not been a great day, but that's the way it goes.

Ditto. Mathowie's on a family vacation and I'm eating a bologna sandwich in a Memphis airport and have been sort of scarce this week already. cortex is a prince and I'm sorry I haven't been around for a little more "yeah what he said" backup on this.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 5:14 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

I try to sit down and eat it, crying and screaming ensues

I read this as "I try to sit down and eat crying and screaming anuses." I've eaten my share of intestines, but never crying and screaming.

I won't miss the trollishness of the recent bannees, but I will miss that they (albeit inelegantly) provided a political perspective that differed from the majority here. I wish the social imperfections could have been solved, because more political homogeneity is not what this site needs.
posted by Forktine at 5:15 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Most closeted polyamorous males I know use silly usernames.
posted by Monday, stony Monday at 5:20 PM on January 28, 2010

So I spoused Zambrano.

I did that too, he wasn't happy about it at all, but was very nice in his Mefimail asking me to change that connection.

when you started marrying folks, you were doing it because you loved each and every one of us, right?

Got tired of doing the laundry, thought one of you would take the hint.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:21 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

If I ain't gonna do the laundry for my lady-spouse I ain't gonna do it for you, spouse-brother.
posted by Mister_A at 5:22 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I wish the social imperfections could have been solved

I agree, badly. And we always feel terrible when we have to draw a line. If I felt that people were flagging because of the content of jock@law's posts, I'd feel very differently. As it is, this is now a few weeks of increasingly frustrated emails and receiving a lot of GRAR. While we're you're long-suffering mods in a lot of ways and love this site terribly, spending huge amounts of time going back and forth with someone who can't seem to make clearly-outlined changes in their behavior takes time away from everything else we do.

At some point we draw a line, and that line has been obviously approaching to us for weeks. This was sort of a "okay that's IT" moment, but not at all surprising or sudden from our vantage point. If he wants to come back with a new username and be a little less abusive towards people who do not share his views, he is still welcome.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 5:22 PM on January 28, 2010

I have never seen a man eat Lean Cuisine.

i've eaten a few ... but 2 or 3 at one sitting. and i've been known to add cheese.
posted by lester at 5:23 PM on January 28, 2010

bologna sandwich in a Memphis airport

Talk about words that you can't stand. Ewwww!
posted by Splunge at 5:24 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Zambrano's umbrage at being spoused is the funniest thing I've read all day seeing how he was so much cooler than everyone for not being tied down by our pedestrian need to be faithful in relationships.
posted by chiababe at 5:28 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

I got a 700 on the SAT Verbal section back in the day.

See, out of this whole thread, this sentence is the one that confuses me the most. 700 on the SAT Verbal isn't really brag-worthy. Get an 800 and then you can cite it as an example of your awesomeness.
posted by pecknpah at 5:31 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

I agree with what greekphilosophy said above minus the last 2 paragraphs. (I also think it applies, minus proper names of course, to a lot of the internet.)
I never took the SAT.
posted by vapidave at 5:35 PM on January 28, 2010

He hated fidelity and took a brave stand for sneaking and lying! He hated television and loved expensive moisturizing cremes and vitamin supplements! He was so terribly jaded and sophisticated - and I always pictured him as being this guy from BORN RICH.
posted by moxiedoll at 5:38 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

well back in those days the sat only went to 700.
posted by boo_radley at 5:39 PM on January 28, 2010

700 on an SAT is ninety-somethingth-percentile or so, isn't it?
posted by box at 5:41 PM on January 28, 2010

Zambrano doesn't need us anyway. He reads this even better website where it costs $200 to join and the mods are Ralph Lauren models. You all have never heard of it because it's invitation only, and you'll only get invited if your BMI is under 20 and you're fluent in European.
posted by Metroid Baby at 5:41 PM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

well back in those days the sat only went to 700.

This.

People weren't as smart back then. They had to add 100 points to accommodate the shift.
posted by found missing at 5:42 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Oh, and:

The hammer is my penis.
posted by desuetude at 6:31 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

Really? I always thought you were female for some reason.

a) I totally am.
b) See ocherdraco's kind linkage to reference.
c) Gender genie begs to differ!
d) I do have a penis, but it has interesting bumps in convenient places and is a slightly shimmery purple.
posted by desuetude at 5:43 PM on January 28, 2010 [14 favorites]

flatluigi writes "What would a sheath for a hammer look like?"

Like this. I've got one for my finishing hammer to keep the polished face from being nicked/scratched in my toolbox.
posted by Mitheral at 5:48 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I took the SAT but they made me give it back.
posted by cortex (staff) at 5:51 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

Really? I always thought you were female for some reason.

a) I totally am.
b) See ocherdraco's kind linkage to reference.
c) Gender genie begs to differ!
d) I do have a penis, but it has interesting bumps in convenient places and is a slightly shimmery purple.

Details! Why you wanna leave us hanging like that?
posted by Splunge at 5:53 PM on January 28, 2010

well back in those days the sat only went to 700.

Kindly ignore me as I look up the illustrious history of the SAT while sitting on your lawn.
posted by pecknpah at 5:54 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

i live in a condo :(
posted by boo_radley at 5:56 PM on January 28, 2010

well back in those days the sat only went to 700.

Mine went to 701. That's one better, see?
posted by Splunge at 5:56 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Perhaps it would help people still dwelling on apparent assumptions about the genders involved if they had read the comment earlier in this thread pointing out that the question wasn't initially anonymous? It was made anonymous later. If you missed it the first time, I'll reiterate that: The question wasn't initially anonymous.
posted by Justinian at 6:00 PM on January 28, 2010

Perhaps it would help people still dwelling on the genders and people still dwelling on the people dwelling on the genders if they remembered that gender doesn't really matter in the case of infidelity, and that old adage about assuming.

It's really annoying when people in AskMe assume that the asker is one gender and in a heterosexual relationship when the asker doesn't specify. Just because they're correct in this specific instance doesn't invalidate my general annoyance.
posted by muddgirl at 6:08 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

also: haha fake fancy guy thinks we believe he's off bagging supermodels when he's really just resurfacing ice.

Just resurfacing ice? Just? Shit, I'm not even a big hockey fan and I would push my mother through a wood chipper to drive the Zamboni. I can think of no greater joy than to operate a Zamboni to the accolades of the crowd, and I'm sorry to say that people who feel otherwise have always angered me.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 6:09 PM on January 28, 2010 [12 favorites]

For example, even knowing that the asker was female doesn't preclude the possibility that her partner was also a woman.
posted by muddgirl at 6:09 PM on January 28, 2010

I'm not entirely sure that's true. There's certainly a different range of possible excuses there, whether or not they are ultimately bullshit excuses.

We all read Savage Love here, right? Would Dan Savage treat this as orientation neutral?
posted by Artw at 6:13 PM on January 28, 2010

I was consistently amazed by Zambrano's indefatigable ability to give the most incorrect answer in any AskMefi question whatsoever. I suppose if you checked his user history, he may have given the correct answer to some question such as "what is the boiling point of water in degrees Celsius," but point for point he was just the absolute wrongest sumbitch in every question he answered. If Metafilter profiles had "custom titles" that you could buy other posters, I'd have bought him a nice little award .jpeg for it.
posted by Countess Elena at 6:13 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

And knowing that his thinking isn't available here anymore makes me sad. You should be sad too.

The majority of his posting history here reads something like this gem, from just yesterday:

Sadly, this is not false. I know women who have had to terminate wanted pregnancies in order to avoid that harm.

No, you don't.

">posted by jock@law at 9:04 PM on January 27

So yeah, count me amongst the not at all sad.
posted by rollbiz at 6:17 PM on January 28, 2010 [11 favorites]

Yeah, I'm gonna have to go with J.D. Salinger over jock@law, sorry.
posted by fixedgear at 6:18 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

crap, link should've gone here.
posted by rollbiz at 6:18 PM on January 28, 2010

We all read Savage Love here, right? Would Dan Savage treat this as orientation neutral?

Uh, yeah, probably.
posted by desuetude at 6:18 PM on January 28, 2010

Before the infidelity question was made anonymous, it linked to an account with a male given name in the name field of the person's user page. So it seems reasonable to assume the OP was male. And, since he referred to his partner's light of love as "the other man", it seems reasonable to suppose that there were only two men in the situation: himself and "the other man". Therefore, especially given the fact that the man on the side was in a heterosexual marriage, the OP's cheating partner was likely female.
posted by orange swan at 6:22 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

also: haha fake fancy guy thinks we believe he's off bagging supermodels when he's really just resurfacing ice.

At least he didn't try to make us believe that once he was the King of Spain while the Habs are calling him up to drive the Zamboni.
posted by orange swan at 6:24 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

I can think of no greater joy than to operate a Zamboni to the accolades of the crowd, and I'm sorry to say that people who feel otherwise have always angered me.

Oh, I think the Zamboni is awesome, too. The point is that it's the trifecta of proletarian labor -- the antithesis of everything Mr. "I Used to Be at the Food Channel and Banged the Olsen Twins at Chateau Marmont Also I Wear Cologne Made by Italian Monks from the Musk of the Rare Italian Musk-Badger, But You Peasants Wouldn't Know Anything about That" Zambrano pretended to be. I mean, operating a vehicle at a hockey game in front of a bunch of sports fans? Just as there is no crying in baseball, there is no $400 skin cream at hockey games. Ergo: haha dig fancypants on the Zamboni.
posted by scody at 6:25 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

This thread is like falling don a bottomless hole
posted by The Whelk at 6:30 PM on January 28, 2010

Splunge: "bologna sandwich in a Memphis airport

Talk about words that you can't stand. Ewwww"

I know. I hate airports too.
posted by IndigoRain at 6:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

He was sort of Patrick Bateman-esque. I wouldn't have been surprised if he had written a glowing review of No Jacket Required.
posted by exlotuseater at 6:36 PM on January 28, 2010

It's really annoying when people in AskMe assume that the asker is one gender and in a heterosexual relationship when the asker doesn't specify. Just because they're correct in this specific instance doesn't invalidate my general annoyance.

I don't understand why Anony posters can't just make it clear so that it becomes less of an issue. I guess they want to distance themselves as much as possible, but sometimes reading an anony question, you have to put whatever gender you think in there to at least have the question be clear. It's hard to read something and not make assumptions, just to get an image in your own mind of who is doing what to whom.

Personally, when I read a question that says "partner", my first assumption is queer couple. But that's me. It doesn't actually preclude that any combination of male and female persons could have been a part of that situation, but partner is a trigger word for me - even though I know women who call their male significant others their partners as well.

For example, even knowing that the asker was female doesn't preclude the possibility that her partner was also a woman.

Right. And while I don't think the answer to the question necessarily relates to what gender anyone is in that situation, the fact that everyone comes to the question itself with difference assumptions muddies the waters.
posted by crossoverman at 6:36 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

> Why doesn't everyone bring the derails, the intercommenter crankiness, and the haterade
> from the infidelity AskMe over here?

Well, they did.
posted by jfuller at 6:42 PM on January 28, 2010

I gotta say, I never took much notice of Zambrano either way, but the more I read about the impression he made on people, the more interested I am in going back to read his posts.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 6:43 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Also, I realized after I posted my last comment that I did marry Adam Savage. He never commented on it, though. We've been together for awhile, it seems. Maybe he hasn't noticed because my harem is so over-large. I'm trying to pare it down, but it's hard to divorce folks on MeFi.

I can't believe I married some sort of weirdo $400 skin cream dude on a dare. Never again, MetaFilter. Never again.
posted by brina at 6:44 PM on January 28, 2010

J@L reminds me of some people that I know who went to law school. At all times they're 100% right and making fun of you or picking orthogonal nits is valid recourse for you being so wrong. As long as you don't have to talk to them about something where you are informed and disagree they're fine, even fun. The injustice is that the people like that who are also jerks but we agree with don't get booted because they don't have as many opportunities to flame up.
posted by a robot made out of meat at 6:54 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

He was sort of Patrick Bateman-esque. I wouldn't have been surprised if he had written a glowing review of No Jacket Required.

See I always figured those were articles that Bret Easton Ellis wrote for Roling Stone that accidentally got shuffled into the manuscript for American Psycho and no one caught it before it went to print.
posted by shakespeherian at 6:56 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I actually had never heard of Zambrano until today. I must have read his comments but never actually internalized his name.

Finding out that he apparently disses America all the time, I thought I'd check it out by searching his activity for 'America.' Oh it's probably not that over-the-top, I thought, he's probably one of those USian-users or just vocal about his politics.

Then I saw a post where he was talking about how shitty American oreos are compared to Italian ones.

I hardly knew him, but I'm gonna miss him.
posted by Solon and Thanks at 6:59 PM on January 28, 2010 [7 favorites]

I find all the speculating & joking about posters that aren't able to respond in really bad taste.
posted by stinkycheese at 7:13 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

jessamyn said: I'm eating a bologna sandwich in a Memphis airport and have been sort of scarce this week already.

If that was the first line of an existential novel, I would totally read it.
posted by amyms at 7:13 PM on January 28, 2010 [19 favorites]

Then I saw a post where he was talking about how shitty American oreos are compared to Italian ones.

....but....don't we....export Oreos....TO Italy? So their Oreos....are our Oreos....right?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:18 PM on January 28, 2010

Not necessarily-- a lot of mass-produced foodstuff folks vary the recipe for specific locations based on what's more culturally popular there.
posted by shakespeherian at 7:21 PM on January 28, 2010

Curiouser and curiouser!
posted by The Whelk at 7:22 PM on January 28, 2010

So at the beginning of the jock@law comment about "It 'feels' like a women writing this" he links to the "gender genie" as proof that the OP is a women. Well I ran the rest of his post through and it turns out jock@law is a women and he didn't even know it! Come back! We have knotted panties!

Also, anyone who reads all the way to the end of this thread can't feel superior to people who watch soap operas.

And what is metaChatRadio anyway?
posted by shothotbot at 7:24 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

If that's true I really would like to try the Oreos-mambo-italiano. Made with real espresso
posted by nola at 7:24 PM on January 28, 2010

The secret is, they're aged in brandy casks on the steamer trip to Genoa.

The Oreos.
posted by jtron at 7:24 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

I find all the speculating & joking about posters that aren't able to respond in really bad taste.
posted by stinkycheese

eponylimburger
posted by scody at 7:25 PM on January 28, 2010

MetachatRadio is pretty much what it sounds like.
posted by box at 7:27 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Can I raise a practical question at this point? Are we gonna do "Stonehenge" tomorrow?
posted by Kinbote at 7:30 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

I should say I'm broadcasting now on Metachat Radio from a USB drive of random music my house guest left without knowing any of the songs on it, for fun.
posted by The Whelk at 7:31 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

The majority of his posting history here reads something like this gem, from just yesterday:

Sadly, this is not false. I know women who have had to terminate wanted pregnancies in order to avoid that harm.

No, you don't.

posted by jock@law at 9:04 PM on January 27

I was going to say that the banhammer seemed like an overreaction based on his comments in this thread, until I followed the link and read his contributions there. He was on thin ice, and he should have been much, much more careful in his subsequent posts.
posted by UrineSoakedRube at 7:34 PM on January 28, 2010

Yeah, Italian Oreos use marscapone instead of HFCS.
posted by fixedgear at 7:35 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Complaining about a Lean Cuisine?!? I had not one It's It, but two... and someone ate both of them. Farewell, my splendid ice-cream sandwiches. I am not happy.
posted by ambient2 at 7:36 PM on January 28, 2010

Let me tell you, that man was not happy about being spoused by me.

Oh, man. I wish I'd known that. I would've ... I would've spoused him ... so hard.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:39 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

Refrigerator Raider Hater Special

2) slices artisinal bread. The freshest, fluffiest most awesome smelling bread ever.
1) thick, juicy slice of vine ripend tomato.
2) leaves freshest Boston lettuce
1) Generous dollop garlic aoili.
1/4 of a small onion, sauted until perfectly caramelized.
1) Scotch-bonnet or birdseye pepper, finely minced. Leave in the seeds.
1) can generic cat food
1) half-pint unopened carton of milk, allowed to sour.

Mix the meat with the peppers, and lay on the garlic and onions thick to mask the smell, both of the cat food and chiles. Assemble the sandwich, and pack it with the bad milk.

Serves one... serves one right!

The guy clawing out his own tongue with a staple remover will be your culprit.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:43 PM on January 28, 2010 [9 favorites]

Food theft is so common here that they have signs on the refrigerator reminding people not to take food that isn't theirs. I am not making this up.

I'm frequently surprised at what you have to tell people. At my office, we have a library that's filled with signs that simply say "Don't Steal from the Library."
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 7:44 PM on January 28, 2010

Sixcolors - kdickson - and now Zambrano?

Just wanted to make a note that kldickson was not banned and I don't think anybody was rooting for her to leave.

Also, I still feel bad about taking part of that callout.
posted by P.o.B. at 7:46 PM on January 28, 2010

I find all the speculating & joking about posters that aren't able to respond in really bad taste.

I found the oreo comment too funny (and not in a "WOW THIS GUY WHO CAN'T RESPOND SUCKS!" but a "ahhh what? oreos!? way") not to share, but on second thought I agree with you and it was in poor taste.
posted by Solon and Thanks at 7:47 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

We also have signs that say THERE IS NO GARBAGE DISPOSAL IN THIS SINK. DO NOT PUT FOOD OR NAPKINS IN THE DRAIN.

Who the hell puts napkins in the sink drain? Evidently someone did.
posted by desjardins at 7:47 PM on January 28, 2010

NO WE ARE NOT DOING FUCKING STONE'ENGE!
posted by Meatbomb at 7:49 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Food theft is so common here that they have signs on the refrigerator reminding people not to take food that isn't theirs. I am not making this up.

You know, I'm commenting in sniper and torture threads at the moment, so there's a certain amount of relativity here, but lunchroom theft fucking pisses me off. And the reason it does is almost single-handedly because of the explanation proferred if you catch someone at it: "Oh, I didn't know it was yours."

Yeah, but you KNEW IT WASN'T YOURS, didn't you?! For fucksakes.
posted by Durn Bronzefist at 7:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

Thank you. I feel better.
posted by Durn Bronzefist at 7:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

P.o.B.: "Just wanted to make a note that kldickson was not banned and I don't think anybody was rooting for her to leave."

I was. She was just as abrasive and dismissive as Zambrano, and was pretty much abusive, to boot.
posted by runningwithscissors at 7:55 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

At my job, I want to make a sign that says 'Please put dirty dishes in the dishwasher, rather than the sink.' What a world.
posted by box at 7:57 PM on January 28, 2010

It's like 9 degrees out. Tomorrow I'll just keep my lunch in my car.
posted by desjardins at 7:59 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I would take a ravenous army of lunch-stealers over the 2 or 3 middle-aged-to-elderly men with poor aim/eyesight/idefk, who, every single goddamn day, turn our restrooms into a geneva-convention violating, urine-soaked bog of hellish wrongness. My latest theory is that they position themselves about a foot and a half from the toilet, unzip, and swing it around like a firehose out of control.

This is both an extremely entertaining and extremely disturbing mental image.
posted by elizardbits at 8:04 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

Fuck, at MY JOB some asswad's been wiping boogers on the bathroom walls. AND there's noodles in the friggin bathroom sink after lunch. Take a fucking towel, wipe out your mug. Ain't nobody gonna wash his hands in your cuppanoodle effluvia.
posted by boo_radley at 8:05 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I worked on the cleaning crew at the Empire State Building in NYC for a while. One of my jobs was cleaning kitchens in offices. My favorite signage was over a sink. There was a cup full of knives, forks and spoons.

The sign said: Someone here had better stop putting knives in the cup with the blade up!!!!! There is going to be AN ACCIDENT!!!!!!

So I always made sure that the knives were blade down when I cleaned up.

They were plastic cutlery.
posted by Splunge at 8:05 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Who the hell puts napkins in the sink drain? Evidently someone did.

Who puts paper towels in a urinal? Sign in the gym at work: PLEASE DON'T PUT PAPER TOWELS IN THE URINAL!
posted by fixedgear at 8:08 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Wait, wasn't kldickson the neurobiologist?
posted by 8dot3 at 8:09 PM on January 28, 2010

Wait, wasn't kldickson the neurobiologist?

The neurobiology student, yes.
posted by runningwithscissors at 8:11 PM on January 28, 2010

I'm here for the meltdown, am I in time?
posted by mwhybark at 8:16 PM on January 28, 2010

You want an example of really horrifying, "in a sane world this would NOT be necessary" public warnings? The building management office for the condo I used to own would issue newsletters instructing people not to urinate in the stairwells.
posted by orange swan at 8:16 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

If I came this way - oh my.
posted by The Whelk at 8:21 PM on January 28, 2010

I'm here for the meltdown, am I in time?

We've already melted down a bunch of stuff, but we saved the best for last. Next up, desuetude's penis.
posted by mob panties at 8:23 PM on January 28, 2010

a geneva-convention violating, urine-soaked bog of hellish wrongness

I just wanted to repeat that.
posted by marxchivist at 8:28 PM on January 28, 2010

not sure why I clicked on that or what I was expecting.
posted by Solon and Thanks at 8:29 PM on January 28, 2010

Crap. I just told desuetude that she could borrow my penis if she needed it, but if it's going to come back to me in pieces or melted down, I'm going to have to reneg on that offer.
posted by greekphilosophy at 8:32 PM on January 28, 2010

You know what I'd do if I had a banhammer? That's right; I'd banhammer in the morning. Hell, I'd banhammer in the evening. I would even go so far as to banhammer all OVER this fucking land. I would banhammer for justice, goddamit. I would banhammer for peace.

I wouldn't banhammer for love between brothers and sisters, however. That's kind of squicky.
posted by yhbc at 8:33 PM on January 28, 2010 [13 favorites]

I feel scared and alone.
posted by The Whelk at 8:33 PM on January 28, 2010

who knew that thursdays were huffing night on mefi?
posted by desjardins at 8:34 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

elizardbits,

They do this in the ladies' room?
posted by lukemeister at 8:35 PM on January 28, 2010

Well if you got the newsletter..
posted by The Whelk at 8:35 PM on January 28, 2010

I accidentally ate raw cuttlefish last night and I gotta tell you, it was comprehensively disgusting. Warm, and sort of chewy, like having a piece of rubber in your mouth. I wanted to spit it out but it was a sushi train place and I didn't want to put off the other diners. So I just left it there for the rest of the night. Forgot about it when I went to bed. It's still there now.

Left it where? In your MOUTH? Please tell me there is another way to parse this.
posted by nebulawindphone at 8:35 PM on January 28, 2010 [19 favorites]

"it turns out jock@law is a women"

Well, there's a new twist.
posted by HopperFan at 8:40 PM on January 28, 2010

stinkycheese: “I find all the speculating & joking about posters that aren't able to respond in really bad taste.”

Me too, but everybody seems to want to do it, and I'm not very tasteful, so I'll say what I think.

I first ran afoul of Zambrano in one of the soccer threads. I'm not going to look that one up, but as I recall I was therein cheekily implying – well, pretty much out-and-out declaring – that AC Milan gets favored-son treatment from Silvio Berlusconi, and that Berlusconi had used certain... powers of his to be certain that AC Milan came back from being caught trying to fix matches in 2006 to win the European Cup in 2006-2007. It was actually, I thought, a rather nice, focused, 'Kicker Conspiracy!'-type... well, troll. I wanted to see him rise to the bait, to argue in defense of his team. But Zambrano was not happy, and advised me not to speak whereof I do not know. I replied that I was just fooling around, and he left off there, but it was intriguing. I didn't actually mind it – in fact, I like it when somebody takes something seriously enough to get mad about it like that. I only wish he'd really come out and done that in the thread.

Let's see... I kept seeing him here and there, and in my mind I saw that he seemed to be sort of a troll, but he's remarkable in the purity of his trolling: he always says the controversial or apparently 'snotty' thing... and then leaves, not to be heard from again in the thread. Several times I responded to his one-liners, hoping to get him to come back and discuss what he thought; he never did. Frankly, I was always more annoyed by that than by anything else; I couldn't see what would possess someone to just drop single comments into threads like that that indicated he had a position but never actually explained it.

Honestly I'm not glad he's gone. I really, really wish he'd engaged; I would have liked to hear what he had to say. I think he's probably right about Italian oreos; American oreos aren't exactly the finest cookies in the world, you know. And he never actually engaged – I think that's unfortunate. He seemed to be trying to argue from a particular southern European point of view, one in which the American biases toward celibacy, extreme monogamy, a dim view of relaxed mores, and a simplistic view of sexuality are strange and shockingly naive. I don't know exactly how much I agree with those ideas, but it's a view we really don't see much of on Metafilter, unfortunately.

And I hope he does decide to come back and engage us.
posted by koeselitz at 8:40 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I once was working in an office where people seemed incapable of reloading paper into the printers, or of throwing out the wrapping on the paper reams if they ever did. One day I was walking past one of the printers, and saw someone had typed up a sign in very neat capitals and taped it to the printer:

PUT THE PAPER IN THE PRINTER AND PUT THE WRAPPER IN THE RECYCLE BIN

Something about the formality of that struck me, and I couldn't resist writing my own addition underneath:

IT PUTS THE LOTION IN THE BASKET

I don't think anyone ever figured out it was me.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:41 PM on January 28, 2010 [9 favorites]

"Please do not poop in the mini fridge."
posted by Meatbomb at 8:42 PM on January 28, 2010

koeselitz, I don't think he WAS a troll. Just very, very inflexible in his beliefs. For me, total inflexibility in accepting others may believe differently than you is the best way to get on my bad side. So...yeah.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:43 PM on January 28, 2010

ok ok so I'm late. Is there popcorn?
posted by mwhybark at 8:44 PM on January 28, 2010

lukemeister, we have unisex bathrooms.

Under my totalitarian regime, this practice shall be banned.
posted by elizardbits at 8:46 PM on January 28, 2010

Gosh, I read the whole thing!

—I don't know any gay couples that have been in a relationship for nine years. Twelve years, twenty years, three years, yeah, but nine? Not a one.

—Jock was a pretty on it guy most of the time, a kind of petite Dios, at least what I saw of him. However, he did seem to be on the gnashing and rending tip lately. I hope he grows up some and comes back.

—Zambrano used to make my eyes bug out with wrongness, one of the few posters who I'd regularly flag.

—It's probably not all that great to be all reminiscing on folks so recently banned, but hell, my girlfriend's gone and it's like a spirited wake for the recently departed. Remember when Gramma Pat told Walter not to swear anymore and he mumbled, "T'hell with that," and she whipped a gallon of ice cream at his head hard enough that it cracked the paneling in the kitchen? She was a live one, wasn't she?
posted by klangklangston at 8:47 PM on January 28, 2010

jock@law is a women

Did not see this coming.
posted by hermitosis at 8:48 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

jock@law is a women

We should have set them up. Then Zambrano coulda cheated on one of her with the other one of her.
posted by nebulawindphone at 8:49 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

Holy Shit! The Return of Pot and Kettle!
posted by Fuzzy Monster at 8:52 PM on January 28, 2010

a geneva-convention violating, urine-soaked bog of hellish wrongness

Sounds like Dick Cheney on a bender.
posted by amyms at 8:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [5 favorites]

EmpressCallipygos: “koeselitz, I don't think he WAS a troll. Just very, very inflexible in his beliefs. For me, total inflexibility in accepting others may believe differently than you is the best way to get on my bad side. So...yeah.”

Maybe. I only noted him a 'troll' in a very technical sense, in that it seemed to be his habit to say controversial things - whether he knew they were controversial or not - and then leave without ever saying more. And that remains the trouble with getting a read on where he's coming from. I guess it makes some sense to infer that he was inflexible in his beliefs because he seemed to refuse to even discuss them, only very briefly expressed them before dodging out and not coming back; but I tend to wonder. Here on Metafilter, my experience is that people who are inflexible in their beliefs tend to talk a whole hell of a lot, and don't mind doing it; they feel like they're doing everybody a favor. When somebody won't even talk about what they think, just ducking in and noting their dissent every once in a while without elaborating, it suggests that either (a) they aren't as inflexible in their beliefs as they'd like to be, or (b) at root they have trouble understanding how anybody could believe differently. Either one of those is potentially very interesting in a conversation, and I would've liked to see Zambrano thus unsheathed, even though it might have been really odd; those 'how can you believe what you believe?' moments can be very interesting.
posted by koeselitz at 8:53 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I hate all of you. This is so stupid, I'm leaving. Goodbye forever!
posted by The Bizzaro Whelk at 8:54 PM on January 28, 2010

AWKWARD
posted by The Whelk at 8:55 PM on January 28, 2010

Eh, he once got into a memail with me about how there was something "psychologically wrong" with me for believing some specific thing. I don't even remember what it was -- just the implication that "you do not believe X and therefore you are defective" is enough to make me write you off, and so anything he ever typed after that carried this smug, imperious tone for me, and...I was having none of that.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:57 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

wut?
posted by The Bizzaro Whelk at 8:59 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Bizzaro you fucker
posted by The Whelk at 9:02 PM on January 28, 2010

Yeah, Italian Oreos use marscapone instead of HFCS.

I am SO making these tomorrow!
posted by Splunge at 9:03 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Even more damning, I always suspected jock@law was on Team Edward.
posted by elizardbits at 9:04 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

Oh, I think the Zamboni is awesome, too.

I was just riffing on the "Christopher Walken and hot dogs" bit. Even if you did find zambonis unawesome, people who dislike Zambonis do not actually anger me.

The Zambrano as Walter Mitty thing reminds me of this time not too long after I started long-distance-dating biscotti, me in DFW and she in Toronto... I realized that I was living the Great Lie -- yes, colleague, I have a girlfriend, but she's from Canada and you don't know her. But if this can be true for me, what other classic outrageous lies are true? Maybe John Lovitz really IS married to Morgan Fairchild. Maybe Richard Gere really did stick gerbils up his bum.* I felt a great disturbance in the Force, I did.

*What do you call a man with no arms and no legs and a hundred rabbits up his bum? Warren.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:08 PM on January 28, 2010 [4 favorites]

"I would take a ravenous army of lunch-stealers over the 2 or 3 middle-aged-to-elderly men with poor aim/eyesight/idefk, who, every single goddamn day, turn our restrooms into a geneva-convention violating, urine-soaked bog of hellish wrongness. My latest theory is that they position themselves about a foot and a half from the toilet, unzip, and swing it around like a firehose out of control."

Some years ago, I got home from class, and I had to pee so bad, so bad.
My legs were all red from the cold, and my jeans were stiff. I was dancing in the bathroom, and didn't even get my coat off.
Whipped open my fly.
Started peeing, and it came out as a fan. A thumb-over-the-hose spray.
It was so cold that my dick had retreated, curled inside itself. I had to pee so bad that I had just lept ahead.
So, I'm trying to pull the head out at least enough to get a clear stream and it's going everywhere, like a cartoon firehose, whipping a fine mist of urine all over the bathroom.
The spray finally stops, and I feel done. So I go use my thumb to realign, and suddenly another spurt is all over my hands.

I had managed to drench everything in the bathroom but myself. Cold like that is one of those reasons that I never want to live in Michigan again.
posted by klangklangston at 9:17 PM on January 28, 2010 [7 favorites]

I had managed to drench everything in the bathroom but myself.

....you're my boss, aren't you.

FYI I am going to be late tomorrow.
posted by elizardbits at 9:21 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

where some guy wrote 5 long paragraphs about how I had metaphorically slain him two months ago

This is the third recounting this week of some woman on the site saying that some guy on the site sent her extra-weird MeMails about somethingorother. Just for the record, people sending creepy or harassing MeMail is pretty well against the rules and if someone's creeping you out [not saying that person should have kathrineg, just saying for the record] let us know and we can give them a little "please don't do that" talk. I'm a little surprised at all the reports of weirdo MeMails going around this week.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 9:27 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

I have an unread message from jock@law that's been sitting in my inbox for awhile. I think I'm going to preserve it that way... Shroedinger's MeMail.
posted by muddgirl at 9:39 PM on January 28, 2010 [8 favorites]

I guess this isn't a good time to talk about the reason I quit working at the Empire State Building, right? The whole "clean the public bathroom on the concourse" thing? I mean, talk about aiming. Can't you sit down first?

Nevermind.
posted by Splunge at 9:41 PM on January 28, 2010

He seemed to be trying to argue from a particular southern European point of view,

If I recall correctly, I'm pretty sure he's actually an American who affected a southern European point of view after spending some time in Italy. Somewhat like how I affected a faux-Manchester accent after living in England during my junior year of college when the Stone Roses were so big, and said stuff like "nowt" instead of "nothing" for about six months after coming back to the states until I realized that I sounded like an ass and snapped out of it.

ROU_Xenophobe: sorry, missed the Christopher Walken reference completely. In my defense, it was toward the end of work, and I had not yet had my day's ration of Oreos.
posted by scody at 9:43 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

Crap. I just told desuetude that she could borrow my penis if she needed it, but if it's going to come back to me in pieces or melted down, I'm going to have to reneg on that offer.

greekphilosophy, darling, if I borrow your penis I will totally return it in good-or-better shape than that in which it was lent.
posted by desuetude at 9:46 PM on January 28, 2010

Although he didn't top the memail I got where some guy wrote 5 long paragraphs about how I had metaphorically slain him two months ago. My one line comment was like a knife to his heart, etc. I think my comment was about how women like giving blowjobs or something. That upset him so much! Mysterious mystery.

BUT I GAVE YUO THE +20 MIXTAPE OF GUILT WOMEN ARE SUPPOSED TO LIEK ROMANCE
posted by Inspector.Gadget at 9:47 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

We've already melted down a bunch of stuff, but we saved the best for last. Next up, desuetude's penis.

Hey, that's not nice.
posted by desuetude at 9:50 PM on January 28, 2010

You've been given more than enough chances and warning to figure it out, and I'm done trying to give you the benefit of the doubt. Find another site to kill time on.

*looks sadly at mostly full bowl of popcorn*

Wow, I saw a lot of great comments by Jock@Law, and somehow managed to miss the ones where he is a defensive asshole (why are the people complaining about being wounded by the spiky armor of victimhood often the most sensitive to criticism?). I guess I owe some serious thanks to the mods for cleaning up threads before I even get there. I'll miss J@L's input on quite a few threads, but not to the extent that I can approve of his trollishness in others.

Can we please not recommend poisoning food to catch lunch thieves? Nobody likes those people, but there are occasional innocent mistakes made when more than one person has the exact same tv dinner in the fridge. Especially in an office with 100 people. Also, odds are there is more than one thief obviously.
posted by BrotherCaine at 9:52 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

EmpressCallipygos: “Eh, he once got into a memail with me about how there was something "psychologically wrong" with me for believing some specific thing. I don't even remember what it was -- just the implication that "you do not believe X and therefore you are defective" is enough to make me write you off, and so anything he ever typed after that carried this smug, imperious tone for me, and...I was having none of that.”

See, it's weird, because I had a different experience there. I think it's kosher to say that I was sort of taken aback by his memail to me, because he talked about various things he was upset about before ending by telling me that he hoped I had a nice day. I wanted to read that as ironic, but I really can't see how you can say something like that and mean it in a passive-aggressive way; I think he was genuinely trying to end on a nice note. That made me think; I mean, if he can get into a disagreement and still be cordial, seems like he's not exactly the kind of grade-A sociopath he sometimes acts like.

But telling you there's something 'psychologically wrong' with you for disagreeing? Not really cool. And not really very sociable; there were obviously conflicts. He's kind of a mixed bag, at the very least. Ah, well - what's done is done.
posted by koeselitz at 9:52 PM on January 28, 2010

I need a style guide on the use of 'proxy hatefuck', because otherwise I'll be tempted to put it in every other sentence.
posted by BrotherCaine at 9:56 PM on January 28, 2010

I was always a little secretly afraid that J@L was secretly my cousin... the one who would troll our family dinners with liberal chum like "you know what I hate most about living near boystown?" no cousin, what, do tell... "That I can't walk down the sidewalk without getting once-overed by a [bundle of sticks]".
The blood, then, would spill into the water, liberally, and we would tear into him. You can't say that, you aren't worth ogling, why did you use that word you insensitive clod! gasp gasp, snarl, sniff.

Today, we know, only at this great age, that this is exactly what he wanted: to see us get all frothed up knowing he'd gotten the better of our better-thinking selves.
posted by Cold Lurkey at 10:03 PM on January 28, 2010

Emphasize the genitals. ALWAYS EMPHASIZE THE GENITALS.

'God took care of that for me.'
-Alvy Ampersand, unconvincingly

Somewhere (most likely a villa in Capri), the suddenly forgotten Zambrano is curling up under a mink Slanket with his nubile girlfriend who uses $400/oz. skin cream to stay perfectly fertile and foxy at all times, and smiles.

Or he's licking the last bit of sauce off of the tattered lid of a Lean Cuisine carton, the letters D E S J written on it in assertive albeit futile Sharpie. The guy was barely worth responding to when he was here (Granted, sometimes he just made it so damn easy it was hard to resist). The seeming rush to get licks in now that he's not here is fairly pointless and seems sort of spineless.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 10:06 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

But telling you there's something 'psychologically wrong' with you for disagreeing? Not really cool. And not really very sociable; there were obviously conflicts. He's kind of a mixed bag, at the very least

I've got a buddy who excels at rhetoric and debate of the high-school variety. Conversation is a game to him, and I think he feels like he has to behave like some kind of dispassionate rational actor who is unaffected by the debate. Once in a while when something touches on his core principles he can't maintain the facade completely and lashes out in odd ways where he tries to evoke a stronger emotional response in the people he's arguing with in order to cover his own 'weakness'.

An ex-girlfriend once pegged him very succinctly as "the nicest asshole she knew".

Jock@Law occasionally reminds me of him, but sadly any niceness is somewhat occluded by the nature of the Internet.
posted by BrotherCaine at 10:07 PM on January 28, 2010 [3 favorites]

The seeming rush to get licks in now that he's not here is fairly pointless and seems sort of spineless.

Fair enough. I think his 18-month history of frequently taking nasty, cheap, insulting shots at people on this site for such supposed faults as being monogamous, American, interested in medical science, and/or a female over 30 were fairly pointless and sort of spineless, but YMMV.
posted by scody at 10:18 PM on January 28, 2010 [10 favorites]

just noticed this thread. can anybody summarise it for me?
posted by UbuRoivas at 10:27 PM on January 28, 2010

I think his 18-month history of frequently taking nasty, cheap, insulting shots at people on this site for such supposed faults as being monogamous, American, interested in medical science, and/or a female over 30 were fairly pointless and sort of spineless, but YMMV.

I'm not arguing that he wasn't a frustratingly huge fucking canker and understand that it may well be cathartic or something to vent, but it's not as if people were forbidden from serving his bullshit right back at him while he was an active member. Now he's probably delighted like Tom Sawyer at his funeral while he reads this, tickled all to pieces at how many folks are wasting their breath on him.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 10:31 PM on January 28, 2010

Even worse: "moist panties." Those might be the two most unpleasant words in the English language.

Ah, yes, but when it goes unspoken...

okay I squicked myself out a 'lil bit
posted by davejay at 10:39 PM on January 28, 2010

I don't understand why Anony posters can't just make it clear so that it becomes less of an issue.

Because there's a whole bunch of people whose relationship AskMe answers are entirely predicated on the genders of the people involved. Some askers would probably like to get answers that aren't predicated on "Well, since men suck, we can see that the answer is clearly..." (or its opposite).

The fact that some people feel they need to know the gender before they can give an answer only rams that home.

Although he didn't top the memail I got where some guy wrote 5 long paragraphs about how I had metaphorically slain him two months ago. My one line comment was like a knife to his heart, etc. I think my comment was about how women like giving blowjobs or something. That upset him so much! Mysterious mystery.

A knife to his heart. *shudders* That puts me in mind of a FWB of mine who left her husband after she'd tried giving him a blowjob and he assaulted her for "being a whore."
posted by rodgerd at 10:40 PM on January 28, 2010 [1 favorite]

I was. She was just as abrasive and dismissive as Zambrano, and was pretty much abusive, to boot.

I don't think I paid enough attention to Zambrano to quite get the comparison. I do know kldickson was abrasive and dismissive, but it was usually not directed at a specific someone. Usually it was a "fuck those guys" type of thing and the fuck was always in there. I'm not saying she didn't get into it with anybody but I haven't seen anybody here who hasn't. But, yeah, she's gone and you can still remain triumphant on your moral high ground there and I'll stop protecting someone who isn't even here.
posted by P.o.B. at 11:05 PM on January 28, 2010

if I borrow your penis I will totally return it in good-or-better shape than that in which it was lent.

Promises, promises.

I'm either doing something really right, or really wrong, because I have never yet received a creepy or even angry email here. The very few I get are perfectly nice and reasonable. Maybe I need to say "fuck you!" more often?
posted by Forktine at 11:05 PM on January 28, 2010

Anywho, the worst lunch stealing story I ever heard was a few years back. Apparently someone had half eaten some Teriyaki Chicken and left it in the fridge. A thief came along and ate it. Well it turns out the person who had left the Teriyaki in the fridge had some cold sores. It was a few days later when the suspect came in to work with a couple of blazing new sores around his mouth.
posted by P.o.B. at 11:12 PM on January 28, 2010 [2 favorites]

Ipecac.

Warning: I do not approve of causing someone to become violently ill. You might be found out and then sued for everything that you own, or will own. Even in the next life. If you believe in that. OTOH people that steal food in a work environment where everyone is getting a decent wage are scumbags. So YMMV. Close cover before striking. Hardhats must be worn beyond this line. Flammable. Inflammable. Lasers in operation, wear eye protection. Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
posted by Splunge at 11:30 PM on January 28, 2010

just noticed this thread. can anybody summarise it for me?

jock@law and Zambrano are history because they stole cortex's lunch, so far as I can tell.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 11:37 PM on January 28, 2010 [6 favorites]

just noticed this thread. can anybody summarise it for me?

It's a getting our moist panties in a twist party.
posted by flabdablet at 11:42 PM on January 28, 2010

An ex-girlfriend once pegged him very succinctly as "the nicest asshole she knew".

"Pegged" has more than one meaning, and I'm pretty sure that my first reading of this sentence was the unintended one.
posted by painquale at 12:05 AM on January 29, 2010 [19 favorites]

I have never yet received a creepy or even angry email here. The very few I get are perfectly nice and reasonable. Maybe I need to say "fuck you!" more often?

If you really want to see creepy email, all you have to do is post as a female, and express an interest in sex. Or at least that's how it worked for me.
posted by velvet winter at 12:23 AM on January 29, 2010

Wow. I really think you should take up jessamyn's offer to have a little chat with the sender, assuming you haven't already.
posted by Rhomboid at 1:00 AM on January 29, 2010 [5 favorites]

If you really want to see creepy email

I do, I totally do. If you post it without the name attached, it's cool, right? Right? C'mon, let's see it!

that's right I've got the discipline of a five-year-old so what wanna fight about it?
posted by davejay at 1:26 AM on January 29, 2010

velvet, blurk. That's ooky.
posted by rodgerd at 1:27 AM on January 29, 2010

I awoke with some really bad heartburn a few minutes ago. Reading this thread hasn't helped.
posted by jonmc at 1:37 AM on January 29, 2010

Goddamn, you read fast, brother.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:56 AM on January 29, 2010

And you're good-lookin' too!
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 1:57 AM on January 29, 2010

velvet, blurk. That's ooky.

I know. I was all schlibbitywao. Then I jhlasdfs!
posted by P.o.B. at 2:12 AM on January 29, 2010 [5 favorites]

A couple years ago, two colleagues got into a crazy email battle about lunch theft. It ended with the message:

"I'm sorry I ate your pizza and I'll never do it again, even if I'm very hungry."

At that point the department list serve managers got involved and told us to only talk about math, as is their way when the list serve starts wandering far from its intended purpose.

In conclusion, I think I would definitely take Salinger over jock@law, but I'm not quite sure where to rank Michael Jackson.
posted by kaibutsu at 2:24 AM on January 29, 2010

the bad thing about lunch theft is not when somebody takes your lunch to eat it; at least that way somebody benefits.

worse is when they take your lunch & just throw it away.

like when you take some premium witchetty grubs to put in the office fridge.
posted by UbuRoivas at 3:34 AM on January 29, 2010

Five hundred some comments of meh and the mods have to read them all. :(
posted by caddis at 4:23 AM on January 29, 2010

I think it's likely derived from "knickers in a twist," which I believe is gender-neutral in British English.

Nope, women wear knickers. Men wear pants.
posted by alasdair at 4:47 AM on January 29, 2010

jock@law and Zambrano are history because they stole cortex's lunch, so far as I can tell.

It was an abalone sandwich, served in an airport in Memphis.
posted by fixedgear at 5:20 AM on January 29, 2010

If I recall correctly, I'm pretty sure he's actually an American who affected a southern European point of view after spending some time in Italy.

This. It's always rather embarrassing to see a fellow expat make a trolling prat of themselves.

For the record, the only frigging difference in Italian Oreos & American Oreos is that the Italian ones first made their appearance in 2008, IIRC, and are some obscenely small quantity, a box of 4 packs of 4 for approximately €2.50.
posted by romakimmy at 5:21 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

Fair enough. I think his 18-month history of frequently taking nasty, cheap, insulting shots at people on this site for such supposed faults as being monogamous, American, interested in medical science, and/or a female over 30 were fairly pointless and sort of spineless, but YMMV.

Oooh ooh don't forget fat!

or bisexual.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 5:29 AM on January 29, 2010

You know, I'm commenting in sniper and torture threads at the moment, so there's a certain amount of relativity here, but lunchroom theft fucking pisses me off. And the reason it does is almost single-handedly because of the explanation proferred if you catch someone at it: "Oh, I didn't know it was yours."

Yeah, but you KNEW IT WASN'T YOURS, didn't you?! For fucksakes.

Yes. In college, some people on my floor figured this out really quickly and just labeled their food as "NOT YOURS." Because you don't really need to know who it belongs to, you just need to know that you aren't welcome to eat it.

(Then everyone did it and the whole fridge was full of items labeled "not yours.")
posted by grapefruitmoon at 5:29 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

I often keep a small bag in the freezer at work with my name on it. I always hope someone will sneakily open it to see if they can steal a few things.

In that bag I keep: several ounces of raw, frozen whale blubber (maktak); a number of pieces of Eskimo ice cream (caribou marrow and seal fat frozen into brownies); and a few pieces of raw caribou jerky.

You can't get the smell of Eskimo food off you. It comes out in your sweat if you eat it. Dogs go crazy when I am in an elevator with them if I've been eating it.

Please, somebody, steal my lunch. I need the entertainment.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:55 AM on January 29, 2010 [6 favorites]

Yeah, velvet winter, please do pass along that email to jessamyn. Whoever sent it needs to be told to stop that garbage.
posted by mediareport at 6:03 AM on January 29, 2010

The Beach Boys have been coming up in my ipod a lot lately. I've come to realize that Fun, Fun, Fun is The Great Gatsby or The Scarlet Letter of mid-1960's American pop. What all these works of art have in common is that they are perfect little jewels, lacking not one note or word, but totally complete in their own exact, perfectly structured way. The line "Seems like she forgot about the library like she told her old man now" is Hemingway-esque in its simplicity and weight. What is unsaid carries more gravitas than anything Brian Wilson could have actually told us. You can sense the smothering weight of small-town America in the young woman's life, redeemed only by the American promise of mobility, both spiritually and physically. Redemption is realized when the young woman realizes she can "come along with me now," and light out for the territories; the whole time unmindful of the inevitable realization that she will beat on against the current and be borne back ceaselessly into the past.

Thunder Road fits in there somehow too.

plz discuss?
posted by marxchivist at 6:11 AM on January 29, 2010

Dastardly Rouge is the name I use when I do my Palin act at the drag show.

I initially assumed you meant Michael Palin. Which was confusing and strangely intriguing.
posted by penguin pie at 6:11 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

Fair enough. I think his 18-month history of frequently taking nasty, cheap, insulting shots at people on this site for such supposed faults as being monogamous, American, interested in medical science, and/or a female over 30 were fairly pointless and sort of spineless, but YMMV.

Oooh ooh don't forget fat!

or bisexual.

Am I remembering correctly some vehement distaste for short-haired women, too? I seem to recall being in multiple categories of Zambrano-disdain.
posted by desuetude at 6:15 AM on January 29, 2010

If you really want to see creepy email, all you have to do is post as a female, and express an interest in sex. Or at least that's how it worked for me.

I hope that you will forward that email on to the mods. That's just not ok. Joking about creepy emails in one thing, but actually getting them is quite another.

I've considered setting up a sock puppette some day, just to see how different it might be to interact here as a (purportedly) woman. But more than that, I find it interesting how there are always references to parallel discussions via memail, whereas my interactions here are almost entirely public. It's not that I feel left out; it's just different ways of engaging and communicating that seem to be self-reinforcing.
posted by Forktine at 6:48 AM on January 29, 2010

If you really want to see creepy email, all you have to do is post as a female, and express an interest in sex. Or at least that's how it worked for me.

I haven't gotten any of that, but I've also spoken extensively about things like pooping and talk about my husband ad nauseam. I'm sad that that's been your experience, though. I'm always excited when I get a MeMail because people are so goddamned friendly.

This is why we can't have anything nice!
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 7:00 AM on January 29, 2010 [2 favorites]

it's not as if people were forbidden from serving his bullshit right back at him while he was an active member.

I admit I do feel like a bit of an asshole ragging on Zambrano post-ban. But there have been so many times when I've seen an answer of his on the green that is so obnoxiously and offensively wrong that I've wanted to post AGH I HAVE NOTHING TO SAY BUT YOU'RE WRONG, but held back because it would be a derail and probably get deleted right away, and rightly so. And his MeMail was disabled, so it's not like I could have taken it private.

Then again, there's not really any way to complain about a person to that degree, either behind his back or to his face, without coming across as an asshole. So I lose either way. Which is why I usually keep my mouth shut and just look after myself (self being thirty-year-old short-haired chunky happily-monogamous drugstore-brand, etc etc).
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:02 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

it's not as if people were forbidden from serving his bullshit right back at him while he was an active member.

I can't speak for them, but I'm pretty sure the mods and a lot of the Mefi community would really prefer that we didn't do that.
posted by generichuman at 7:24 AM on January 29, 2010

I miss him already. Seriously.

Zambrano, wherever you are...I can't stop loving you.
posted by The Straightener at 7:26 AM on January 29, 2010

I've considered setting up a sock puppette some day, just to see how different it might be to interact here as a (purportedly) woman.

It'll never work, we 'gender genie' people so fast around here it'll make your head spin.
posted by graventy at 7:32 AM on January 29, 2010 [3 favorites]

Yeah, but you KNEW IT WASN'T YOURS, didn't you?! For fucksakes.

I once ate some yogurt that I actually did think was mine, but it wasn't. In my defense, it was the same brand that I eat, and in the place where I usually keep mine, and I would sometimes bring some in and then forget about it for a couple of days, then wander in to the kitchen to get something to eat and find it and say, "Yay! Forgotten yogurt!" But on this particular day, it happened to be someone else's yogurt -- a friend's -- and a couple of hours later, the following conversation took place:

L: Someone stole my fucking yogurt!
Me: Seriously? What the FUCK?
L: I know! Who would steal yogurt?!
Me: An asshole, that's who! Anyway, if you want some, I might have some...in...the...oh.
L: IT WAS YOU?!
Me: Did you put it where I always put mine?
L: Yes.
Me: Yes.
L: I guess I should take down that note.

Anyway, the whole point of my story is that sometimes you don't know that it isn't yours. And then you have to replace your friend's yogurt, but when you do, try to remember that she only likes vanilla.
posted by amarynth at 7:47 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

schmoop mode

You know, this is one of the more fun MeTa threads I've joined in on. Considering how it started, that's rather sweet.

/ schmoop mode
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:53 AM on January 29, 2010

Alls I know is I put a Hunt’s Pudding Cup in the resident fridge like I’m supposed to at 1300 and da‐da‐da and at 1430 I come down all primed for pudding that I paid for myself and it’s not there and McDade comes on all concerned and offers to help me look for it and da‐da, except if you look I look and here’s the son of a whore got this big thing of pudding on his chin.
posted by The Straightener at 7:58 AM on January 29, 2010 [3 favorites]

We also have signs that say THERE IS NO GARBAGE DISPOSAL IN THIS SINK. DO NOT PUT FOOD OR NAPKINS IN THE DRAIN.
Who the hell puts napkins in the sink drain? Evidently someone did.

Not only do napkins (er, American usage of the word) and large chunks of food get washed down the sink at our work (no disposal here either), but I fished out about three dozen plastic coffee stir sticks once when the sink was badly backed-up. There's something about workplace kitchenettes that brings out the inner asshole in otherwise civilized people.

Wait. What is this thread about again? Oh yeah: "Grr, arg."
posted by aught at 8:00 AM on January 29, 2010

There's something about workplace kitchenettes that brings out the inner asshole in otherwise civilized people.

Shit, tell me about it. How many times have I gone into our lunchroom and seen leftover garbage sitting on the tables, noodles and soggy bread in the sink, the fridge door hanging open, and the teevee on?

In everyone's defense, though, maybe they are all wealthy assholes and have servants who do all this stuff for them at home.
posted by shakespeherian at 8:11 AM on January 29, 2010

Oh. My.

my, my, myyyyy, my my.

Whew.
posted by SLC Mom at 8:14 AM on January 29, 2010

There's something about workplace kitchenettes that brings out the inner asshole in otherwise civilized people.

After having lived with many roommates, most of whom resisted making a chore chart with the justification "We'll all pitch in to do {x}", I can confidently say that when cleaning is everyone's job, it's no one's job and doesn't get done. Which inevitably leads to freakouts and angry recriminations from the person with the least tolerance for mess.

I was always somewhere in the middle of the cleanliness spectrum, but recognized that shit doesn't get done unless it's assigned.
posted by electroboy at 8:21 AM on January 29, 2010 [2 favorites]

it's not as if people were forbidden from serving his bullshit right back at him while he was an active member.

In AskMe, they sort of were. He'd leave normal-ish comments that ended with things like "typical americans, being prudish" and people would rightfully respond sort of fighty/huffy and then we'd get all smalltype and suggest people flip out in MeTa.

And yes, velvetwinter and I have been in touch and I encouraged her to do what she feels she needs to do. I'm fine if people just want to note it for the record and then we can keep a sort of modly eye on creeps. People generally feel bad ratting out other members. I think we all can sympathize with bad days, bad judgment and things we wish we could unsay. While I'm happy to step in if it's helpful, I'm also okay with leaving thigns be. I just want people to know I'm here [and the other mods] if we can help.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 8:22 AM on January 29, 2010 [3 favorites]

At some point, we'll be able to do an alphabet thread using only the names of banned users.

"Big A, Little A. Which ban began with "A"?
posted by zarq at 8:24 AM on January 29, 2010

I would be so bad at your job, jessamyn. Unless smiting people all day long with the blood-soaked banhammer is to be considered unbad.
posted by Mister_A at 8:27 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

That is good, Mister_A, but what is best in life?
posted by electroboy at 8:30 AM on January 29, 2010

> American oreos aren't exactly the finest cookies in the world, you know.

YOU TAKE THAT BACK.
posted by languagehat at 8:36 AM on January 29, 2010 [5 favorites]

The best Zambrano advice was to not take cheap-ass multivitamins you see in drug stores because they're filled with filler. Instead, you should buy the $100 vitamins from wherever he gets his vitamins.

man i don't know what you guys are complaining about his advice all seems pretty solid and i'm going to follow it all for a week until i go completely bankrupt but at least my face will be smooth and i will be fully vitamined and wearing nice clothes and stuff. my wife won't be happy when they repossess the beamer i gave her though.
posted by graventy at 8:38 AM on January 29, 2010

But your mistress will be thrilled, right, graventy?
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 8:40 AM on January 29, 2010

ROU_Xenophobe: sorry, missed the Christopher Walken reference completely.

It's easy to miss. If you've never seen the Christopher Walken on hot dogs bit, I can't find the original Onion page, but there's a copy (at a hot dog page) here.

It requires reading aloud for full effect.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:43 AM on January 29, 2010 [3 favorites]

Actually, Newman 0s edge out standard Oreos.

Truth. Though I will give Oreos credit for still having the most refined soaking-up-and-dissolving-around-milk technology.

It requires reading aloud for full effect.

I'm tempted to do one.
posted by cortex (staff) at 8:52 AM on January 29, 2010

ROU_Xenophobe: I just laughed so hard I woke up both my dogs in the other room (and one of them is practically deaf). The truth is, I cannot get enough of Walken parodies. MORE!
posted by scody at 8:55 AM on January 29, 2010

Actually, Newman 0s edge out standard Oreos.

Particularly the mint Newman Os. Also, the late lamented mefite was maybe talking about "ringos" which are made by Barilla and look basically like Oreos (with a letter "R" engraved in the cookie face instead of the Oreo Nabisco logo).
posted by aught at 8:57 AM on January 29, 2010

I don't think there is a substantial difference between Walken and Walken parodies.
posted by The Whelk at 8:57 AM on January 29, 2010

Know what's good? Spread you some peanut butter on your Oreos. Hot holy damn, that's some good, right there.
posted by dirtdirt at 8:58 AM on January 29, 2010

The better the parody, the less substantial the difference. The onion bit is pretty good all in all; it manages to work off tonal and phrasal gimmicks and some light absurdity to get 90% of the job done, which is nice. It falls down a bit with the lapse from "oddly emphatic" to "violently psychotic" in bits, which, seriously, that's some pretty tinkertoy writing there, but at least it's just around the edges instead of the main thesis of the parody like so many of the shittier ones I've seen.
posted by cortex (staff) at 9:00 AM on January 29, 2010

I DO NOT HAVE AN UNHEALTHY FASCINATION WITH CHRISTOPHER WALKEN AND CHRISTOPHER WALKEN PARODIES AND IMITATIONS
posted by cortex (staff) at 9:01 AM on January 29, 2010 [5 favorites]

Jock@Law sent me a very nice MeMail saying that he/she appreciated my contributions. So I think he/she was ok. I do. I never really saw much of the mean stuff, but I wasn't going through the postings either. But it is sad.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:08 AM on January 29, 2010

there have been so many times when I've seen an answer of his on the green that is so obnoxiously and offensively wrong that I've wanted to post AGH I HAVE NOTHING TO SAY BUT YOU'RE WRONG, but held back because it would be a derail and probably get deleted right away, and rightly so.

In AskMe, they sort of were. He'd leave normal-ish comments that ended with things like "typical americans, being prudish" and people would rightfully respond sort of fighty/huffy and then we'd get all smalltype and suggest people flip out in MeTa.

Fair point, most of my interactions with Zambrano were on the Blue or Grey. But it's pretty well established that if someone is WRONG WRONG WRONG on AskMe it's totally okay to say so, just you can't say "YOU IGNORANT FUCK YOU ARE WRONG WRONG WRONG."

I can't speak for them, but I'm pretty sure the mods and a lot of the Mefi community would really prefer that we didn't do that.

It seems like people have trouble with tone or the difference between calling someone on their bullshit and having a huge derailing freak-out.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 9:08 AM on January 29, 2010

schmoop mode

For an instant I read that as shmup mode and got all excited as I imagined a bunch of powerups floating in from the right.
posted by Rhomboid at 9:14 AM on January 29, 2010

Um nothing personal but going comment trawling for a user who has been banned from the site is sort of not cricket. Nothing personal orville sash, but we have to sort of draw the line in MeTa. Let me know if you want the comment to put it on your user page.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 9:21 AM on January 29, 2010

Thanks, Jessamyn. Not taken personally. Sorry for stepping out of line.
posted by orville sash at 9:24 AM on January 29, 2010

Oh, and I don't really need that comment.
posted by orville sash at 9:25 AM on January 29, 2010

Can I request other people's deleted comments for my user page?
posted by gman at 9:26 AM on January 29, 2010

If gman wants my deleted comment, he can have it.
posted by orville sash at 9:29 AM on January 29, 2010

Too late. I have sold your deleted comment on ebay.
posted by found missing at 9:30 AM on January 29, 2010

If gman wants my deleted comment, he can have it.

How about some of your Doritos?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:31 AM on January 29, 2010

Hell no. They're cool(er) ranch.
posted by orville sash at 9:34 AM on January 29, 2010

It just occurred to me that I don't know any gays or lesbians who have been in relationships for more than 9 years. Then it also occurred to me that all the gays and lesbians I know tend to be rather lonely. The it occurred to me that all the gays and lesbians I know are Catholic.

Then it occurred to me that I'm so fucking provincial that I should never, ever make presumptions based on personal experience.
posted by cimbrog at 9:34 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

...and then we can keep a sort of modly eye on creeps.
posted by Jessamyn

I read this as "we can keep a moldy eye on creeps." That was a pretty vivid image.
posted by workerant at 9:36 AM on January 29, 2010 [4 favorites]

A great lidless modly eye on the horizon
posted by The Whelk at 9:37 AM on January 29, 2010 [2 favorites]

I'll take Doritos if they're going around. I'm having salt cravings something fierce. I swear the dudes in the convenience store next to my house could chart my menstrual cycle if they kept track of the days when I come in to buy chips. Mass quantities of chips.

If you'll excuse me, talking about this is making me need to go find a salt lick.
posted by grapefruitmoon at 9:37 AM on January 29, 2010

Jock@Law sent me a very nice MeMail saying that he/she appreciated my contributions

Count me in as another one who got some melodramatic I'M TAKING THIS TO MEMAIL haterade from jock@law.

I wonder what the gender breakdown is on this?
posted by desuetude at 9:43 AM on January 29, 2010

Neman O's are OK. Ginger Newman O's are the devil incarnate, sent to earth to make me fat forever. Or they would be, if any of the local stores still sold them. I have a will of iron and stone, but Ginger Newman O's are fatman kryptonite. Almost as bad as Caramel Delights.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:49 AM on January 29, 2010

The best Zambrano advice was to not take cheap-ass multivitamins you see in drug stores because they're filled with filler. Instead, you should buy the $100 vitamins from wherever he gets his vitamins.

Man, dude must've missed out on a lot of filler in his lifetime, no wonder he got so cranky
posted by jtron at 9:51 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

So I've casually known two people that remind me of Zambrano. They both came from money and were full of ridiculous pronouncements about consumer goods and completely oblivious to the way most people live.

"Honda? Why would you drive a piece of shit like that? You should get one of the new C Class convertibles. What do you mean you can't afford it? It's a C class, not a Bentley."

"Everyone should try jamon iberico. If they did, they wouldn't eat anything else. Certainly not that Oscar Mayer shit you eat for lunch."

"I am always single, even when I have a girlfriend. You, it's like you're married already. Plenty of time for that later."
posted by electroboy at 10:13 AM on January 29, 2010 [4 favorites]

I'm not going to go searching out any of Zambrano's previous comments until our next meetup. We can haul those out when we get to the Spoken Word Dramatic Readings portion of the evening. We're running out of Sixcolors material.
posted by 8dot3 at 10:24 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

All the gays and lesbians and Welsh people I know have two arms and two legs apiece. I don't know any Roma. Anyway, though I don't have any numbers in front of me, I bet most lesbians and gays each have two arms and two legs.

In closing, all the cats I know have bad, bad breath.
posted by everichon at 10:26 AM on January 29, 2010

I swear the dudes in the convenience store next to my house could chart my menstrual cycle if they kept track of the days when I come in to buy chips. Mass quantities of chips.

Don't laugh. I once worked in an ice cream store where the employees, out of boredom, did exactly that based on particular women's purchases of double chocolate ice cream.

I kid you not.
posted by fourcheesemac at 10:35 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

If you post it without the name attached, it's cool, right? Right? C'mon, let's see it!

Oh, believe me, I'm tempted. Very tempted. But posting personal email here is a bannable offense, and with good reason.

I hope that you will forward that email on to the mods. That's just not ok. Joking about creepy emails in one thing, but actually getting them is quite another.

Indeed. I'm still thinking about what would be the best way for me to handle this. I told Jessamyn I'd let her know if I wanted her to try to track down the guy's username, but I haven't yet decided.

See, the guy who sent me the creepy wanna-fuck offer did not actually use MeFi Mail - he used regular e-mail. I know he was a MeFite, though, because he used the e-mail address on my profile that is only visible to logged-in MeFites. So I don't know his MeFi username. I only know the name on the e-mail account he used to write to me.

As I told Jessamyn, I'm kind of torn. Yes, I'd like to know who it is, but...I can't really prevent him from e-mailing me, and I don't know if it would do much good other than to put him on my personal shit-list.

I think we all can sympathize with bad days, bad judgment and things we wish we could unsay.

See, that's the thing. While the email was crude and insensitive and left me feeling icky and disheartened, the tone also left me with the impression that it came from someone who was feeling desperate, lonely, isolated, and sexually frustrated. And people in those circumstances do some very unwise things that they later regret and wish they could take back. So, as I said, I'm torn. Yes, people need to know it's not okay to send email like that, but...would a note from the mods really make much difference in this particular case? I'm not sure.

I also want to add that 98% of the email I've received from MeFites has been awesome - supportive, encouraging, thoughtful, and just a total delight to read. So I am not about to let one bad apple interfere with my love for MeFites in general!
posted by velvet winter at 10:35 AM on January 29, 2010 [2 favorites]

"Everyone should try jamon iberico. If they did, they wouldn't eat anything else. Certainly not that Oscar Mayer shit you eat for lunch."

I have to say, that ham looks pretty tasty.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 10:40 AM on January 29, 2010

It can be yours for only $1400.
posted by electroboy at 10:45 AM on January 29, 2010

Plus another $1000 for the special holder.
posted by electroboy at 10:47 AM on January 29, 2010

It can be yours for only $1400.

Sweet! Free shipping!
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 10:49 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

I'm heading to Spain in two months, so for just $14, I'll eat some jamon iberico and (tweet|memail|text|email) you to let you know how awesome it is.
posted by soelo at 11:06 AM on January 29, 2010

"would a note from the mods really make much difference in this particular case"

I would say that if someone got a considerate but firmly worded note from Jessamyn, and it still didn't make them think twice about their crude and insensitive ways, then they're beyond hope.
posted by HopperFan at 11:34 AM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

I'm thinking about hosting a jamon iberico / prosciutto di parma ultimate cage match... in my stomach.
posted by BrotherCaine at 11:53 AM on January 29, 2010

You know who else likes Oreos? Martian Manhunter!
posted by Sparx at 1:57 PM on January 29, 2010 [2 favorites]

Okay, I went back and re-read the creepy e-mail I got after I posted that AskMe question, and it gave me the creeps all over again. I also realized that at the moment I'm probably more inclined to go easy on him than I would otherwise be, simply because I understand all too well how loneliness and chronic sexual frustration can drive someone to do unwise things.

However, "unwise" is really a different animal altogether than "creepy." This guy needs to be reminded that sending email like that is just NOT okay, period. I'm going to forward it to Jessamyn. Thanks for the encouragement.

(And now, back to talking about lunch thieves, banhammers, modly eyes, etc.)
posted by velvet winter at 2:17 PM on January 29, 2010 [7 favorites]

velvet winter, that's a level beyond fucked up. IMO, that's a not-illegal but certainly disingenuous use of your profile info. Good for you for forwarding it, and seriously, sorry that you even thought for a minute that this might be par for the course.
posted by desuetude at 3:31 PM on January 29, 2010

Just want to say that I enjoyed much of jock@law's contributions on legal matters, particularly on the informed jury thread. I don't recall anything nasty from him, but I have some vague recollection of a disagreement at some point in the past. I'm not questioning the mod's decision on this, I'm just slightly disappointed that we couldn't somehow keep the good and lose the bad.
posted by yesster at 3:38 PM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

sorry that you even thought for a minute that this might be par for the course.

Thanks. Sadly, though, it IS par for the course elsewhere. Among general-interest forums, MeFi is the closest thing to an oasis in the desert in that respect that I've ever found online. The men here - well, most of them, anyway - are pretty fucking awesome, which is part of why I often find myself more inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt.
posted by velvet winter at 3:52 PM on January 29, 2010

Also, I realized after I posted my last comment that I did marry Adam Savage. He never commented on it, though. We've been together for awhile, it seems. Maybe he hasn't noticed because my harem is so over-large. I'm trying to pare it down, but it's hard to divorce folks on MeFi.

I can't believe I married some sort of weirdo $400 skin cream dude on a dare. Never again, MetaFilter. Never again.
posted by brina at 9:44 PM on January 28 [+] [!]

Good news, brina. You've got one more spouse!
posted by Maisie at 4:43 PM on January 29, 2010

Pony Request: Hellbanning.

I think you have to say it three times in front of a mirror.
posted by grobstein at 5:35 PM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

Hydrox are better than Oreos.
posted by klangklangston at 5:46 PM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

BURN HIM!
posted by The Whelk at 5:59 PM on January 29, 2010

Uh, Hydrox preceded Oreo—Oreo's the sweeter, mushier knock-off.
posted by klangklangston at 6:29 PM on January 29, 2010

Hydrox sounds awful chemically for a cookie, ain't it so? Oreos are full of natural* goodness.

*In the sense that Oreos, like most other things, are made out of elements.
posted by Mister_A at 6:49 PM on January 29, 2010 [2 favorites]

Actually, klangklangston, it's a little-known fact that boxed mix mashed potatoes preceded real mashed potatoes, too. It took scientists years of careful genetic modification to produce a tuber that had the same color and consistency when heated up and whipped. Sadly, the original team still views their potatoes as a massive failure, as they were never able to quite perfect the chemical taste of fake butter.
posted by koeselitz at 6:53 PM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

This has been my experience as well. I'd like to see him get a Brand New Day if he can manage to stop being such a headache for the mods.

I haven't (can't/won't) read everything here, but as someone who once responded, ahhh, poorly to one of jock@law's more egregious comments, I have to concur with this.
posted by lex mercatoria at 8:02 PM on January 29, 2010

The secret ingredient is diacetyl.
posted by ryanrs at 9:10 PM on January 29, 2010

Blazecock Pileon vs. Artw. Blazecock vs. unSane. Blazecock vs. Burhanistan (and, really, just about everybody). Blazecock vs. dunkadunc. And that's just this year.

What can we do? I know! Let's ban jock@law!
:-(
posted by Crabby Appleton at 9:36 PM on January 29, 2010 [1 favorite]

Oh, knock it off, Crabby.
posted by desuetude at 9:39 PM on January 29, 2010 [7 favorites]

Don't drag me into this- outside of the way he chooses to express his religious beliefs regarding computers I don't really have any problem with him at all. He can be a bit obnoxious in an argument, but hey, aren't we all?
posted by Artw at 10:08 PM on January 29, 2010

I kick ass for the lord.
posted by nola at 10:14 PM on January 29, 2010

Gee, Crabby Appleton, I love this new house of yours – it seems so open and spacious! I think that's because it's entirely made of glass. Now what was that game you wanted to play? You know – the one with stones; I think it involved throwing them. That sounded like a great idea.
posted by koeselitz at 10:27 PM on January 29, 2010 [3 favorites]

I didn't think this would ever happen, but... I must defend BP, if only in one instance mentioned above. I thought that in the dunkadunc thread, he responded humorously and...dare I say it...with restraint. Yes.

The frothing and GRAR! in that thread was mainly dirtynumbangelboy, from what I remember.
posted by HopperFan at 10:32 PM on January 29, 2010

I love this new house of yours – it seems so open and spacious! I think that's because it's entirely made of glass. Now what was that game you wanted to play? You know – the one with stones

You seem to be confused and gotten things backwards. Crabby Appleton's just showing the house on behalf of a relative who moved out of the state, he actually lives under the stones.

God bless his egregious - YES, EGREGIOUS - trolling and intellectual dishonesty. Or whatever he has that passes for an intellect.
I'm guessing it involves macaroni, glue, a discarded paper towel tube and several rubber bands of varying size and colour.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 10:36 PM on January 29, 2010

"Or whatever he has that passes for an intellect"

I hardly think you can make any sweeping assumptions about a person's intelligence based solely on a few comments on MetaFilter. Whether Crabby possesses the persona to be a successful member of MF is another thing entirely.

I've found his comments on programming to be particularly interesting and thoughtful - I suggest (though I'm sure he's already a member) that spending time at stackoverflow is an excellent alternative for when the annoyance at certain MF denizens becomes too much. See you there, Crabby!
posted by HopperFan at 11:00 PM on January 29, 2010

Hey, since the actual iPad MeTa got closed, and I'm not stepping foot near that awful thread on the blue again, I'd like to settle something here. Can we all agree that the iPad does not have a USB port and that that sucks and can in no way be construed as a good decision?
posted by graventy at 11:04 PM on January 29, 2010

>: Blazecock vs. dunkadunc. And that's just this year.

Please Crabby, I need you defending me like I need a hole in my head.
posted by dunkadunc at 11:09 PM on January 29, 2010 [5 favorites]

I hardly think you can make any sweeping assumptions about a person's intelligence based solely on a few comments on MetaFilter.

I think I made it quite clear that I can and did, tyvm.

Honestly though, I'm just poking fun at the silly message on his profile page.

Can we all agree that the iPad does not have a USB port and that that sucks and can in no way be construed as a good decision?

iNDOUBITABLY.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:19 PM on January 29, 2010

"I think I made it quite clear that I can and did, tyvm."

Then that says more about your intelligence than his.

"Honestly though, I'm just poking fun at the silly message on his profile page."

OK.
posted by HopperFan at 11:45 PM on January 29, 2010

*peeks in on thread again*

o.O

*hurriedly shuts tab and walks away, whistling*
posted by darkstar at 1:16 AM on January 30, 2010 [2 favorites]

Jessamyn, my god -- you're in the Memphis airport, home of some INCREDIBLY tasty BBQ (no, really...amazing stuff, especially compared to most airport food) and you are eating bologna? This cannot be!
posted by bitter-girl.com at 6:21 AM on January 30, 2010

you are eating bologna? This cannot be!

I had a five dollar bill in my pocket. Bologna's cheap. I have had plenty of good BBQ since then.

Crabby, you're welcome to trust us or not, but jock@law was one of a short list of people we had been working with [for lack of a better word]. We've spoken to BP a little too and we generally feel that things are moving in the direction they're supposed to.

This sort of thing is tough because we'd prefer to have sidebar conversations with users without making big MeTa deals about them but when people say "well what about THIS users then, huh??" our options are to say "Yeah we're working on it" or "Huh, didn't know that person was a problem" so this is me saying "Yeah we're working on it."
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 6:33 AM on January 30, 2010

Not long ago, I was happy to learn that the Columbus (OH) airport has a Columbus Brewing Company bar. Draft local craft brew 90 shilling ale, at the airport? Oh yeah.

Also, that trippy art-installation walkway thing in the Detroit airport? I love that thing.
posted by box at 7:56 AM on January 30, 2010

I can think of lots of airports with locally-roasted coffee, but locally-brewed beer seems to be a little rarer.
posted by box at 8:08 AM on January 30, 2010

I used to go to Columbus pretty regularly, to DSCC which you can see from the terminal. That brewpub must be pretty new. Good to know.
posted by fixedgear at 8:16 AM on January 30, 2010

Jock@law seemed to have worthwhile things to say, but was incredibly fighty when disagreement cropped up, as seen in this thread. He should come back but with less caffeine.
posted by Mid at 10:17 AM on January 30, 2010

Wow, banning jock@law was completely uncalled for.
posted by spaltavian at 10:40 AM on January 30, 2010

Judging by the type of modding found on this site and the repeated statement that they were talking to him behind the scenes, spaltavian, I'd say it was most likely called for. The mods aren't really ones to make rash decisions.
posted by flatluigi at 11:33 AM on January 30, 2010

I ask the mods about my rashes all the time.
posted by klangklangston at 12:05 PM on January 30, 2010 [2 favorites]

especially because he hasn't really been "banned" - the mods say he is welcome to come back. So, the only difference between a timeout and what happened to j@l is that he has to get a new username, which is sorta a weird distinction

From what I understand, this is generally the case when a user is banned. If they come back, it's under the rules of Brand New Day. A banning is a forced New Day if they want to keep posting - I only recall hearing of a few users who weren't welcome back under any name.
posted by grapefruitmoon at 12:10 PM on January 30, 2010

> Wow, banning jock@law was completely uncalled for.

Wow, another person who thinks the mods make random brainless decisions.
posted by languagehat at 12:11 PM on January 30, 2010

If we had an ikkyu3, then those rash questions could be fielded by him.
posted by UbuRoivas at 12:11 PM on January 30, 2010 [3 favorites]

A timeout would have been more appropriate, on reflection, especially because he hasn't really been "banned" - the mods say he is welcome to come back. So, the only difference between a timeout and what happened to j@l is that he has to get a new username, which is sorta a weird distinction. It's like a timeout+.

In that sense all but very few "you are never, ever allowed back here" bans are a timeout+. It's hard to get kicked off this site, but it's harder yet to get kicked out and banned for life full stop.

In any case, jock@law has gotten a regular old week off before, and a bunch of warnings and attempts from our end to find some way to get to a middle ground with his behavior where he wasn't doing the sort of stuff that, in fact, he kept on doing. If he can find some way to actually make a definitive change in how he interacts with people on the site and lets us know that he genuinely wants to give it another go, we'll give him that shot. That's what jessamyn is talking about.

It's very much not "hey, come back in a week and everything's keen", and it hasn't been that way for anyone else who has gotten the boot either.
posted by cortex (staff) at 12:15 PM on January 30, 2010

OK, that makes a lot of sense.
posted by Mid at 12:26 PM on January 30, 2010

It's hard to get kicked off this site, but it's harder yet to get kicked out and banned for life full stop.

Changing one's ISP should be enough to cover tracks, I'd guess. And I assume that most of the time, internet plans (not to mention corporate networks) come with a floating IP address (ie a new IP address assigned from a common pool every time you connect to the net) rather than a fixed one, so it'd be surprising if the mods could definitively know if a new user was the same person as a banned one.
posted by UbuRoivas at 12:28 PM on January 30, 2010

It's a given that someone dedicated to keeping definitive proof out our hands could do so. We've had a couple cases where one of the rare Banned For Life folks has managed to sneak by for some period of time before we were able to make the connection, and by implication there may be folks on the site right now who are successfully slipping under the radar.

I pretty much don't lose sleep over that, because if someone manages to adopt and forever wear a disguise that involves not being a problem in the way that they were before, the community-interaction problem has resolved itself.

My feeling is that most people banned and trying to return aren't that careful about going undetected or don't particularly intend to at least as far as taking active measures to hide it from the mods.

The scope of "Brand New Day" is fuzzy, and where you have on one terminus of the returnee continuum the kind of ninja situation described above and on the other terminus someone who practically announces their return under a new name, most of what I've seen has been folks more in the middle who manage to just sort of come back and get along and go mostly or entirely unnoticed as The Return Of User X even if behind the scenes the mods know who they are. And that's totally okay with me.
posted by cortex (staff) at 12:40 PM on January 30, 2010

there may be folks on the site right now who are successfully slipping under the radar... if someone manages to adopt and forever wear a disguise that involves not being a problem in the way that they were before, the community-interaction problem has resolved itself.

Exactly, we only want to be rid of the problems not the people per se. This is not the type of community that would not give the reformed a second or even more chance. None of us are without sin here.
posted by caddis at 3:42 PM on January 30, 2010 [1 favorite]

None of us are without sin here.

Not even these users?
posted by amyms at 6:13 PM on January 30, 2010

As I read this thread, my cute little dog came over and proceeded to hork up... something.
posted by theora55 at 6:31 PM on January 30, 2010

Not even these users?
not even

by contrast, the real Jesus had few if any recorded sin. he was still man as much as god and exhibited anger in the temple and perhaps even had some dietary lapses (which to many today are no longer lapses).

anyway, good people accept people who have sinned (hurt us), especially after contrition and renouncement. it is among our finest human qualities. it also paves the path forward for all of us, for all of us have hurt others. our efforts to repent and right those wrongs make us human. religion embodies this struggle, but it transcends any particular religion. it's the essence of humanity.

one of the most beautiful teachings of Jesus comes from the Lord's Prayer, "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us." that's a universal teaching of import to all man, all religion, all non-religion. forgiveness is among if not the most important of human values.

alright, perhaps i am a bit off-track, but you know, if we all practiced a tad more forgiveness here things would run much more smoothly and the mods would have the easiest jobs in the world.
posted by caddis at 7:16 PM on January 30, 2010 [1 favorite]

not even

I get what you're saying. I was just being silly.
posted by amyms at 7:24 PM on January 30, 2010

jock@law

And here was I noticing he'd gotten better in most every thread I saw him in.
posted by rodgerd at 1:46 AM on January 31, 2010

We've spoken to BP a little too and we generally feel that things are moving in the direction they're supposed to.

I know, Jessamyn. I know because this is what you and cortex always say, and have been saying for, literally, years. Either his progress is not monotonically increasing, or it is glacial.
posted by Crabby Appleton at 5:07 AM on January 31, 2010

Actually I see it as more tidal, ebbs and flows. When things are better [for him or anyone else] we just shut up and are happy. When things get a little more bumpy, we drop a note. You and BP are historically catty with each other, so as much as I'm concerned about your opinion, it's outweighed in this case by the opinions of cortex, me, mathowie and pb. Your options, as always, are to take it, leave it, or offer some suggestions to help us make the place better. The BP/CA snarkfight stops when either one of you stops responding.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 5:36 AM on January 31, 2010 [1 favorite]

cortex: “My feeling is that most people banned and trying to return aren't that careful about going undetected or don't particularly intend to at least as far as taking active measures to hide it from the mods.”

Hey, here's something I've always sort of wondered –

If you notice a (non-banned-for-life) banned person trying to return, and they haven't said anything and apparently are trying to fly under the radar – what do you guys do? Do you drop them a line and let them know you're watching? Or do you just keep an eye on them without saying anything? Or does it differ from case to case?

If you can't answer this, that's fine; I was just wondering.
posted by koeselitz at 6:34 AM on January 31, 2010

Hey, here's something I've always sort of wondered –

It depends on the situation, yeah. If they weren't banned recently and there weren't some extenuating circumstances that makes us feel like we need to say something up front, we'll like as not just make a note and keep an eye on them to make sure things don't fall back into whatever the old problematic pattern was.

But that's basically the default plan for most things, really. Until a problem manifests, we're mostly just going to keep our eyes open.
posted by cortex (staff) at 7:45 AM on January 31, 2010

Have you ever observed one of those "3 bland comments and then a blatant self-link FPP" dorkbags to return to the site with a new account and try to actually function as a member?
posted by Rhomboid at 8:42 AM on January 31, 2010

If they have, we haven't noticed. We've definitely argued with them a lot when we banned their accounts. The same people who seem to be inclined towards SEO douchebaggery are also really fighty and dickish even when they've gotten banned for breaking basically the site's only rule. There are a few users who have been problematic in the past who have come back and settled in pretty nicely, so we see it happening in a good way at least sometimes.
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 8:47 AM on January 31, 2010

I'm pretty impressed with the number of people that J@L seemed to have sent memails too. I'm not a big contributor, but he sent me one a while back disagreeing with a point of constitutional interpretation. The first one wasn't obviously rude, but after I responded with a basic 'I see why you think that, but I disagree' he sent me another couple of somewhat aggressive followups trying to get me to renounce my earlier position, which I wasn't going to do.

Things like that tend to make such a member stick out when you see them on various threads, and ever since then I kept noticing what a jerk he was. Great job, mods!
posted by norm at 10:31 AM on January 31, 2010

I think I can actually recall one or two cases where a braindead self-linker signed up again, but it's so rare it's just trivia, not something we really worry about a standard approach for. I just put them on the watchlist and wait for them to spam again and then ban them again, pretty much.
posted by cortex (staff) at 4:40 PM on January 31, 2010

I know, Jessamyn. I know because this is what you and cortex always say, and have been saying for, literally, years. Either his progress is not monotonically increasing, or it is glacial.

His participation in this site is sufficiently prolific that I can't imagine how you could make such a judgment on his "progress," unless you disregard everything other than the bits that personally annoy you.
posted by desuetude at 5:06 PM on January 31, 2010

desuetude, I know that I could never objectively assess BP's progress by my own reactions to his writings. I judge his progress by the effect he has on other people. Aside from the examples I cited from this month, I'll never forget the time last summer when his participation inspired shmegegge, MetaFilter's avatar of sweet reason and font of moral instruction, to call him (and please excuse my language, but you asked) an asshole and a prick. I guess we just have different notions of progress.
posted by Crabby Appleton at 5:56 PM on January 31, 2010

CA, I realize I probably give you a fair amount of crap which may discourage you from taking anything I have to say seriously, but speaking as someone who used to bump heads occasionally with BP, I've grown to appreciate him and feel that his overall contributions to MeFi are positive. The question is, is my perception based on BP changing his behavior or me adjusting my attitude towards him? The answer is both.

Beee the change you want toooo seeee!
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 6:24 PM on January 31, 2010

Well just for the record since everyone wants to judge BP right now, he has irked me in the past, been testy, etc., even rather unfair by my opinion, yet I would be quite depressed to see him leave. He's essentially a founding father with some issues and that's OK by me when you toss in all the positive contributions. As I said up thread NONE of us are angels here.
posted by caddis at 6:35 PM on January 31, 2010

I have no dog in this fight, and no ill will toward anyone involved, but I just wanted to pop in and say that I think BP's positive contributions to the site far outweigh his contentious ones. He seems to be very passionate about his beliefs and opinions, and he can be prickly sometimes when defending them, especially in heat-of-the-moment situations. But I don't think he's gone out of his way to be malicious or hateful to anyone, and I'm confused about the motivations of the people who seem to want to drag his dirty laundry out all the time.
posted by amyms at 7:54 PM on January 31, 2010 [6 favorites]

I have no dog in this fight, and no ill will toward anyone involved, but I just wanted to pop in and say that I think BP's positive contributions to the site far outweigh his contentious ones. He seems to be very passionate about his beliefs and opinions, and he can be prickly sometimes when defending them, especially in heat-of-the-moment situations. But I don't think he's gone out of his way to be malicious or hateful to anyone, and I'm confused about the motivations of the people who seem to want to drag his dirty laundry out all the time.

Nicely put. This reflects my feelings about him as well.
posted by zarq at 7:58 PM on January 31, 2010

Also... not that it matters anymore, since J@L has been banned, but he also memailed me a couple of weeks ago during a contentious MeTa thread. He was quite friendly and polite.

His banning is not a surprise. I do think it's a shame, though.
posted by zarq at 8:10 PM on January 31, 2010

I judge his progress by the effect he has on other people.

How about judging your OWN affect on people?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:20 PM on January 31, 2010 [1 favorite]

these threads are proof of perpetual motion.
posted by The Whelk at 8:25 PM on January 31, 2010

This bodes well for my business selling outrage offset credits.
posted by electroboy at 8:41 PM on January 31, 2010

Avatar Second definition.
posted by Crabby Appleton at 9:07 PM on January 31, 2010

Oooh, ooh, my turn! My turn! Judge me!
posted by nebulawindphone at 9:09 PM on January 31, 2010

"I know that I could never objectively assess BP's progress by my own reactions to his writings. I judge his progress by the effect he has on other people. "

You know what? I mix it up with BP from time to time, but I know he's a good person at heart and I value his contributions here. I think he's not very good at arguing, especially when he gets wound up, and he can push my buttons. But I look forward to his contributions and his front page posts. He's a member here, a contributing member.

What the hell do I look forward to from you? You've never posted on MeFi, I don't remember you being a big AskMe help—BP's answered my questions with aplomb even when he'd probably like to throttle me, and I sure as hell don't look forward to your endless carping in MeTa.

So how about you leave BP the fuck alone until you can start participating constructively here?

No matter how valid your criticisms might be—though in this case, judging BP's progress by noting that he pissed off shmeggege, what, six months ago, is pretty fucking weak sauce—no one is going to seriously give a shit because you're just some snarky asshole who doesn't seem to have any investment in making MeFi a great place to be. Instead, you seem to want to make it worse because it's not as perfect as you imagine it could be. Instead of being the change you want to see, you post sniffy little comments to mods, favorite sniping comments and foment drama. I mean, seriously, how old are you? Is this what you want to do with your time? Worry about some guy named fucking Blazecock Pileon on some web site?

Get better or fuck off.
posted by klangklangston at 9:17 PM on January 31, 2010 [10 favorites]

I'm still looking forward to the official Crabby Appleton 'How I would Run Metafilter' essay.
posted by dunkadunc at 9:21 PM on January 31, 2010 [1 favorite]

How about judging your OWN affect on people?

This.
posted by scody at 9:23 PM on January 31, 2010 [1 favorite]

Effect.
posted by electroboy at 10:26 PM on January 31, 2010

Oi.
posted by Meatbomb at 1:35 AM on February 1, 2010

How about judging your OWN affect on people? -- Me

Effect. -- Electroboy

....See? He's making me forget grammar!
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:47 AM on February 1, 2010

I judge his progress by the effect he has on other people. Aside from the examples I cited from this month, I'll never forget the time last summer when his participation inspired shmegegge, MetaFilter's avatar of sweet reason and font of moral instruction, to call him (and please excuse my language, but you asked) an asshole and a prick. I guess we just have different notions of progress.

you know, I'm not a big fan of this comment. in case any of you were wondering, yes Crabby is taking a jab at me with the "sweet reason and font of moral instruction" bit. and yes, it's something he's gone on about before. it's kind of odd that he'd do that at the same time he's trying to use me to make some kind of point about Blazecock, but there you go.

so let me just take this moment to say that I disagree with Crabby, and that the only way I consider that fight is as evidence of my own fightiness on the site, and as an example of what I need to avoid doing again.
posted by shmegegge at 5:41 AM on February 1, 2010 [2 favorites]

Lights not fights!

(passes out glowsticks)
posted by The Whelk at 5:43 AM on February 1, 2010 [1 favorite]

If that was a jab at you, shmegegge, it was a pretty weak one. Regardless of whether I agree with it or not, that does seem to be the consensus view of you on MetaFilter. Or, at least, I've never seen anyone but me express a contrary opinion. I was simply tailoring my argument to the audience.
posted by Crabby Appleton at 6:21 AM on February 1, 2010

CA: I was ~~simply~~ passive-aggressively tailoring my argument to the audience.

Eff tee eff why.
posted by shiu mai baby at 6:38 AM on February 1, 2010

scody (in re Zambrano/Zamboni): "Just as there is no crying in baseball, there is no $400 skin cream at hockey games."

May I present Sean Avery?
posted by Nabubrush at 8:47 PM on February 1, 2010

Hey everybody, let's have a pool party!
posted by Artw at 10:06 PM on February 1, 2010

How about judging your OWN affect on people?

I was just playing Mass Affect 2 the other day on my XBOX. I got into a confrontation, but I totally routed the other guy by popping my collar and then sipping some tea with my pinky held out. Note to self, catch up on 8 hour sleep debt before next mefi comment spree happens.
posted by BrotherCaine at 11:42 PM on February 1, 2010 [1 favorite]

I was ~~simply~~ passive-aggressively tailoring my argument to the audience.

Don't be crabby, Crabby.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:09 AM on February 2, 2010

This question needs Zambrano something awful.
posted by electroboy at 10:44 AM on February 2, 2010

A cure for lunch thieves.

I could not remember for the life of me what thread this was in and it took me forever to find this!
posted by shothotbot at 7:01 PM on February 4, 2010

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