Subsite For the Election?

election08.metafilter.com ?

I'm a long time member of this site and have always been very vocally against setting up stuff like news.metafilter.com, politics.metafilter.com, etc.

However now I'm changing my tune. I feel that the community has grown to the point where there are enough interested and interesting people to make a subsite just for election stuff entertaining, enriching, and enlightening.

Very little of what happens during the campaign will be "best of the web" but I still want to hear what the intelligent, involved people around here think about the daily political news. I have come to rely on this site as a way of gauging opinions of people I trust, and this would be a way to keep that going during the election. Unlike a general politics or news filter, this would be timed and as of nov 4th, would cease to exist, so there would no long term damage to the Blue.

I know there are always calls for subsites, and they are usually shot down; I know mathowie is not that into them, but perhaps in this one case this is a chance to enrich the community, not detract from it?

Thoughts?

posted by cell divide to feature requests at 8:15 PM (92 comments total)

Heh, reviewing my own posting history I asked for a news and politics subsite back in 2001. But, I swear that SINCE THEN I've been against topic-specific subsites. I promise.
posted by cell divide at 8:17 PM on February 21

Seconded.
posted by phrontist at 8:19 PM on February 21

They suggest this every election. it never happens.
posted by jonmc at 8:21 PM on February 21

I think it quickly runs into the problem of setting a very low bar for what gets posted and would turn into a partisan corner of the site where people post absolutely everything. I don't really want to run or moderate a daily kos style dumping ground and think it'd be bad for the site overall.

I hope we can limit ourselves to maybe 1 election post every few days instead of several a day and we'll continue to delete minor election news stories as they pop up here and hopefully just stick with the major turning points.
posted by mathowie at 8:23 PM on February 21 [7 favorites]

Days since Metafilter has been election free: 4
posted by meech at 8:31 PM on February 21

everyotherfuckingelection.metafilter.com
posted by puke & cry at 8:43 PM on February 21

However now I'm changing my tune.

To bad this isn't a democracy.

Also, TPM's election central sub site has fairly decent comment system now. The quality of the discussion isn't as great as it is on metafilter, but it's not terrible. Certainly not DKos levels. here is their comment section talking about the end of the debate that just happened. There are ... seven threads on the site just about that debate. So you can really fill up on all the commentary you could possibly want.

I know it's not the same, but it's not too bad. I do like having one thread or so a week here. I think too much gets really old, and frankly I'm getting sick of this primary :P
posted by delmoi at 8:45 PM on February 21

I vote yes.
*goes to hide the fact he's canadian*
posted by patr1ck at 8:57 PM on February 21

No.
posted by Ironmouth at 8:59 PM on February 21

Yes.."
posted by LarryC at 9:08 PM on February 21

Hey Look! An election thread!
posted by tkolar at 9:11 PM on February 21

I hope we can limit ourselves to maybe 1 election post every few days instead of several a day and we'll continue to delete minor election news stories as they pop up here and hopefully just stick with the major turning points.

This is ultimately the only answer that matters, and the best one. I do think though on the other point, the question of if MeFi could do a politics site well, I think it could, as long as the proper tone was set early. I think it could self-police with the best of them.

The quality of the membership is what I value most about this site, it would be cool to get more political commentary from the interesting minds here, but I can also see how instead of being complimentary, like AskMe, it could end up an unneeded distraction.
posted by cell divide at 9:11 PM on February 21

I think Matt should open an election subsite, with the caveat that if you post to it you will never be allowed to make another post *ever* to the main site.
posted by tkolar at 9:14 PM on February 21 [4 favorites]

Maybe I haven't been paying close attention but it doesn't seem like there have been too many election threads lately. Is this really a problem?
posted by octothorpe at 9:17 PM on February 21

Just post supplementals to current ObamaFilter/ClintonFilter/McCainFilter FPPs as appropriate. When those get unwieldly, the admins can close them after 500 or so comments, and then the party can be carried over to the next interminable funfest.

Or, y'know.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 9:20 PM on February 21

"Yeah, keep this thread running. May it serve as an example to all the American politics nuts who insist on starting a new post every time Hillary takes a shit."
posted by Effigy2000 at 9:22 PM on February 21

I understand the reservations about this idea - it stands a chance of becoming a huge, festering distraction and would likely attract the oiliest of astroturfers on a daily basis. Only religious threads go sour faster than political threads, and I wonder if elections.metafilter.com would need a metatalk.elections.metafilter.com of its own.

Nonetheless, I'm all for this idea. Metafilter is my absolute favorite place for online discussion - this is a fascinating election, and I'd love the opportunity to talk it over with Mefite politics addicts on a regular basis. There's a lot of ways it could go wrong, but it could be something really special if it goes right. And with such a site in place, the blue would never be marred with a political thread.

Metafilter's executive branch has spoken on the matter, of course, so no big deal.
posted by EatTheWeak at 9:26 PM on February 21

Speaking as an Obama supporter, this thread is a good example of why PoliticsFilter totally sucks. The comments don't improve it, either. Seriously. Ew.
posted by spiderwire at 9:39 PM on February 21

DO NOT WANT
posted by TheOnlyCoolTim at 9:44 PM on February 21

Here in Japan erection threads are more popular, but maybe that's just because they have a problem.

With Ls and Rs.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 9:46 PM on February 21

I am interested in reading and participating in discussion about the American election in exactly one place on the internet: Metafilter.

That said, I would not want to see a dedicated subsite, for the exact reasons that mathowie and others have outlined already, now and in the past. DO NOT PARTICULARLY WANT.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 9:47 PM on February 21

Here in Japan erection threads are more popular, but maybe that's just because they have a problem.

One can't help but notice here in Korea that erection season is a lot shorter than the average one in America. Oh god I'm going to hell for that.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 9:49 PM on February 21 [1 favorite]

election08.metafilter.com

Actually, an election this year is looking less likely. Perhaps election09.metafilter.com?
posted by timeistight at 10:00 PM on February 21

With Ls and Rs.

Dude, we got it, ok?
posted by Artw at 10:14 PM on February 21

stavrosthewonderchicken writes...
Oh god I'm going to hell for that.

For actually WANTING political newsfilter posts on Metafilter? Yes, you are definitely going to hell.
posted by tkolar at 10:28 PM on February 21

Wow, I was just about to come here and post that an election fever subdomain was really the best way to keep election politics crap from defiling the blue. It won't be me, but people are going to continue to post annoying election politics links.

mathowie writes "I hope we can limit ourselves to maybe 1 election post every few days"

They can't say you're not an optimist.
posted by mullingitover at 10:46 PM on February 21

mathowie writes "I hope we can limit ourselves to maybe 1 election post every few days"
They can't say you're not an optimist.

An optimist with delete access to the thread database...
posted by tkolar at 11:12 PM on February 21 [1 favorite]

What election? WHAT HAVE I BEEN MISSING?
posted by Astro Zombie at 11:12 PM on February 21

WHAT HAVE I BEEN MISSING?

A pony cross-breeding that will result in the creation of a Metafilter subsite strictly for political polls, no discussion allowed.
posted by tkolar at 11:14 PM on February 21

This is a very Ameri-centric idea and so I don't see how or why it could or should fit into Metafilter. The non-emotionally-laden equivalent would be if we had a cat subsite, and can you imagine that sh*t?!?!

*I do realize that for many, cats are a very polarizing topic, rife with emotional baggage and warm fuzzies, but it was the most "neutral" thing I could think of.
posted by iamkimiam at 11:26 PM on February 21

Yeah see, I'd totally back a PolMe subsite that had strict entry and heavy attack moderation, sometimes the political discussion here is effing sublime. Otherwise I think it would get to be like those fucking, yes I said it, fucking, comment sections that CNN and MSNBC have on their little news blurbs that end up with people sexually abusing exclamation points and yelling at one another, where thoughtful comments are like one in thirty, and god-damned methed-out, rabid, chipmunks make much more sense and are more thoughtful.

I'd even shell out an extra (or actual my first $5, shhh) for such a maintained site.
posted by edgeways at 11:37 PM on February 21

I've been wondering what it is about the Obama (et al) minutiae I find so off-putting. I realise the bulk of the user base here is in the US, so it shouldn't be surprising that some early campaign incident attracts more debate than something far more significant, like say the recent Pakistani elections. But it does leave me somewhat dismayed. And I much prefer feeling mayed, if it's all the same to everyone else.
posted by Abiezer at 11:40 PM on February 21

For actually WANTING political newsfilter posts on Metafilter? Yes, you are definitely going to hell.

No, for making an apparently too-obscure joke about the average size of Korean wedding tackle.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 11:55 PM on February 21

hear, hear!
posted by zardoz at 12:41 AM on February 22

Sometimes I get a joke and don't laugh.
posted by Dr. Curare at 1:07 AM on February 22

DO WANT.
posted by modernnomad at 2:29 AM on February 22

Oh, man. I've been wanting obama.metafilter.com so badly of late, to give the newly-converted somewhere to testify about their political messiah out of my earshot. Don't get me wrong: I like the guy—he's my candidate—and some very crazy weird stuff would have to transpire for me not to vote for him. Seriously, I am using a Barack Obama ringtone and wallpaper on my phone at the moment, albeit not without a sense of irony , so you've got my vote sewn up. But please, please, please, ye zeal-filled Obamites, give that shit a rest. I'm fired up already, don't hype it so much that it wraps back around and turns into apathy.

I don't expect to get an election subsite out of this—if it were to be, planning should've started a year ago—but I was going to suggest maybe adding a notice to the blue's New Post form for the next six months, asking people to think thrice before posting electionfilter stuff. AskMe did something similar last winter re: gift questions, didn't it? It'd be a figleaf, at least, but it's going to be a loooong time until November and every bit helps.
posted by mumkin at 2:42 AM on February 22

I know there are always calls for subsites, and they are usually shot down

Click-click...

Booyaka!
posted by PeterMcDermott at 2:47 AM on February 22

Otherwise I think it would get to be like those fucking, yes I said it, fucking, comment sections

fucking.metafilter.com sounds like a great idea though.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 2:56 AM on February 22 [1 favorite]

Sometimes I get a joke and don't laugh.

Sometimes I PUNCH PEOPLE.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:20 AM on February 22

I thought about doing this once, even took some steps, bought the domain, sought help, mostly built the backend, etc, etc

and then I looked really hard at how Metafilter operates and in particular Metatalk, like for several months, really watching what users do and what the mods have to deal.

and I decided there's no fucking way I want to babysit you people over politics if you're going to act that shitty over in regular Metafilter.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:21 AM on February 22

Are you callin' stavrosthewonderchicken a baby, Brandon Blatcher? He PUNCHES PEOPLE, man! You gotta be crazy to mess with a wonderchicken that'll PUNCH you, man.
posted by cgc373 at 3:55 AM on February 22

If you are less than 3mm thick, I'll PUNCH YOU TOO!
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:10 AM on February 22

I am all about the allcaps today, by god. I LOVE ALLCAPS! I AM SHOUTING AT YOU!
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:10 AM on February 22

What the hell kind of router have you got?
posted by Dave Faris at 5:03 AM on February 22 [1 favorite]

mumkin: "I am using a Barack Obama ringtone and wallpaper on my phone at the moment, albeit not without a sense of irony"

Do people vote ironically these days, too? Because that would explain a lot of things.
posted by goodnewsfortheinsane at 5:19 AM on February 22

splunge.
posted by Mister_A at 5:20 AM on February 22

I DON'T CALL STAVROS ANYMORE, HE STIFFED ME ON THE CALAMARI BILL.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:21 AM on February 22

STAVROS BOUGHT ME 18 KOREAN BEERS AND A PLATE OF BULGOGI WITH THE MONEY HE SAVED BY STIFFING BRANDON BLATCHER ON THE CALAMARI BILL, SO HE'S OK BY ME.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 5:29 AM on February 22

MetaTalk: STIFFING BRANDON BLATCHER ON THE CALAMARI BILL
posted by cgc373 at 5:41 AM on February 22

Maybe a sidebar link to whatever the most recent 'turning point' election thread is? No subsite or anything, but it keeps the general election talk limited to one thread.

Or you could set up a system for a weekly/biweekly General Election 08 Post. Such a post would show up on Monday mornings and all other election stuffs would be deleted as per normal.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 5:44 AM on February 22 [1 favorite]

THIS IS WHY YOU CAN'T HAVE NICE BRANDONS.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:45 AM on February 22

Every subject has politics embedded somewhere. Something as seasonal and mercurial as the election process is far less interesting alone than as part of the social tapestry Metafilter samples daily.

Random coverage of interesting points is the best.
My drive-by take, anyway.
posted by zennie at 5:49 AM on February 22

Widespread, generous deletions for 95% of the politics threads. That's what we need this (US) 'election season'
posted by signal at 6:28 AM on February 22

I'm a total politicsfilter junkie, but the mods have done a good job dosing out the methadone to keep me from twitching too much. elections.metafilter would have me frothing at the mouth no doubt.
posted by afu at 6:39 AM on February 22

Aw, Brandon. I was hoping you were gonna launch that sucker.

And, since it seems more and more often to get forgotten in these discussions as time goes on, Devoter.com.
posted by cortex at 7:21 AM on February 22

And, since it seems more and more often to get forgotten in these discussions as time goes on, Devoter.com.

Yeah, so all you politics posting types, y'all please consider taking it over to that site, okay? I'm serious!
posted by flapjax at midnite at 7:24 AM on February 22

Well, yeah, so ya'll could shovel shit my way! no thanks.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:24 AM on February 22

what about just a hillary4u&me.metafilter.com subsite?
posted by birdherder at 7:29 AM on February 22

I don't believe the ampersand (&) is permissible there.
posted by TheOnlyCoolTim at 7:37 AM on February 22

I am interested in reading and participating in discussion about the American election in exactly one place on the internet: Metafilter.

And that's just it. I *do* want to obsess over all the minutiae of this election with all the very bright political analysis Metafilter consistently musters.

I think tkolar's joke about creating a politics subsite that locks you out of posting anywhere else is actually very close to the mark for a workable version of this - Matt could make a ton of money off of a politics.metafilter.com that had a separate user database from the main site and kept the $5 entry fee. Big shot of site revenue from a whole new round of signups, siphons off the ZOMG ELECTION from the main site, and provides an outlet for those of us who really really want to discuss the small stuff. Oh, and because it's interest-specific you can do better-targeted advertising, and if it's really obsessive there'll be a huge number of hits.

There's a market for it, money to be made, and it improves the quality of the main site - that seems like a solid win. If moderation's a concern, have it written somewhere extremely visible in giant bold letters that this specific subsite is lightly moderated, but all moderation for this specific subsite is done in wrath-of-God mode (Asshole? Banned.).

Is there a downside I'm missing?
posted by Ryvar at 7:40 AM on February 22 [2 favorites]

Is there a downside I'm missing?

If it's so easy and great, why aren't you doing something similar?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:42 AM on February 22

Is there a downside I'm missing?

The giant pain in the ass?
posted by monju_bosatsu at 7:44 AM on February 22

I think it's a shame that devoter never took off. jca is still over there plugging away, though.
posted by monju_bosatsu at 7:45 AM on February 22

yeah, send some political love over at devoter. It's been around a while.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:54 AM on February 22

For actually WANTING political newsfilter posts on Metafilter? Yes, you are definitely going to hell.
No, for making an apparently too-obscure joke about the average size of Korean wedding tackle.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure everyone got that the first time. But believe me, your stance on politicalfilter is *far* more offensive.
posted by tkolar at 8:12 AM on February 22

fucking.metafilter.com sounds like a great idea though

I want a different subsite for fuckers, called safefucking.metafilter.com. And foreplay.metafilter.com. And republicanmensroom.metafilter.com.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 8:12 AM on February 22

If it's so easy and great, why aren't you doing something similar?
posted by Brandon Blatcher

Because I don't have access to Mefi's codebase or DNS records. If it's not official, you automatically wipe out the vast majority of your potential userbase.
posted by Ryvar at 8:13 AM on February 22

I'm betting that the glory of riches you're talking about won't be outweighed by the headache of doing it.

Still, the idea of politicalfiter is nice, but it would need more of jessamyn/cortex clone (or more likely, clones from around the world) to keep it as heavily moderated as Askme.

But really, if someone wants to do this, you gotta start outta love, not with your eyes full of dollar signs.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:24 AM on February 22

Because I don't have access to Mefi's codebase or DNS records. If it's not official, you automatically wipe out the vast majority of your potential userbase.

So, in summary: I want to take advantage of someone else's hard work, create more work for them, and change the nature of the site itself, all for my own selfish need of discussing politics EXACTLY where I want to, when I want to.

That about right?
posted by SeizeTheDay at 8:56 AM on February 22

Full disclosure: I used to want exactly the same thing, until I realized (for myself) that the political debates created very little light, riled up too many people, and ultimately created less "community" and more polarity. Of course, it helps that I stay out of most political debate anymore, since it's almost never about the issues, IMHO.
posted by SeizeTheDay at 8:59 AM on February 22

suggestanewsorpoliticalsubsite.metatalk.metafilter.com
posted by ALongDecember at 10:01 AM on February 22

SeizeTheDay:
Holy shit, calm down. I think you really, really missed something or are wildly misunderstanding my suggestion.

Like many people in this thread, I'd like an election/politics subsite. I'm just suggesting a way Matt could do it that might yield a good return-on-investment (of time, on his part).

Considering that a sizable fraction (9 for, 12 against as of this comment) of the people above indicated that they would like this, there may exist a market awaiting a solution. My comment about not having codebase or DNS records was my way of saying only Matt can provide a solutuion. The only suggestion I offered was a method that might make sufficient money to offset the trouble.

That's all. No, seriously, that is all. Brandon was the one suggesting someone other than Matt do it, not me. Please don't jump down my throat, thanks.
posted by Ryvar at 10:09 AM on February 22

I can feel for people who want things like this, I really can, but the reasoning behind is always the same, at least the reasoning people admit to:

"I really want to know what the special smart and lovely mefites have to say about every minor thing relating to [topic x]."

That's admirable. It is. But here's the thing. All of those other sites that you and I know already exist to talk about precisely this sort of thing? The ones that we're all imagining don't have our special brand of super-smart generally awesome members? They all have mefites. In fact, they're where mefites get the talking points they use in metafilter threads. Daily KOS is lousy with mefites. I bet you could even find a couple over at LGF. I promise you, you'll get all the mefite discussion you could possibly want on this election at any of the established political community discussion blogs that are out there. The sad truth is that "I want to know what mefites think about every minor development regarding [thing y]" is simply not enough reason for something like this.
posted by shmegegge at 10:16 AM on February 22

was my way of saying only Matt can provide a solutuion. The only suggestion I offered was a method that might make sufficient money to offset the trouble.

I'm pretty calm right now...though if you could use a hug, I'm sure that could be arranged. My point was that your suggestion only considers monetary gains as weighed against the work needed to establish this subsite. I understand perfectly what you're asking for, and I've certainly thought in the past that it would be a good idea. But having been here a while, like yourself, I'm understanding that the negative affects that such a site would have far outweigh the benefits. Moreover, you're asking Matt to do all the work, just for your pipedream. Seems a bit selfish to me.
posted by SeizeTheDay at 10:22 AM on February 22

The (long running!) discussion on this issue seems to have shifted. In the past is was mostly the haters (like me) who called for a politics site to keep that stuff off the blue. But a big chunk of the pro-politicsfilter posters here seem to want a place where they can have more political discussion without the haters (like me) always flagging their threads and prattling on about bestoftheweb and otherwise being obnoxious bores. Like me.

(Of course, Matt says that it is not happening!)
posted by LarryC at 10:31 AM on February 22

SeizeTheDay:

Restating once again - I'm asking Matt to do all the work for a) a pipedream shared by many people AND b) profit. Not just for me.

And while I'm on the topic, Matt profiting is good for Metafilter's overall continued excellence. As I told him way back when he thought I didn't like him - I want to see him make as much money off this site as he possibly can *without* fucking with my user experience, because that means good things for all of us.
posted by Ryvar at 10:47 AM on February 22

Yeaaaaaaaaah. I don't think this about money.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:00 AM on February 22

Can we have an election08.metafilter.ca subsite, while we're at it? Because, quite frankly, I find discussions about carbon tax, green initiatives and the Afghan mission more interesting than discussions about race, change, the influence of her husband and McCain's PR bunny.
posted by KokuRyu at 11:33 AM on February 22

Seems we're all asking mathowie to work harder. Longer.....

As Dan Hicks [and his hot licks] stated, Where's The Money¿

So I vote for neh.

KokuRyu, you're reading the NP in Japan, fer crying out loud¿
Way to add the CanCon though./

I saw a car, in Toronto of all places, Ontario plates, with an 'Obame'08' sticker on their bumper.
The bumper had a big crack on the left hand side. Is this an omen¿

see¿ politics.
posted by alicesshoe at 4:20 PM on February 22

Can we have an election08.metafilter.ca subsite,

How about a metafilter.ca? I'd feel a lot safer on the site if we just got rid of the Canadians.
posted by eyeballkid at 4:44 PM on February 22

MetaFilter.ca is pwnzored by baremetal.com, which is nowhere near as interesting as I thought it might be.
posted by Mister_A at 5:31 PM on February 22

MetaFilter: Holy shit, calm down.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 6:17 PM on February 22

I'd give my left nut for American politics to move the hell out of MeFi. So damn much of it just junk frippery that is nothing like "best of the web" and doesn't even have the decency to be about real events. It's almost all media-pushed bullshit and I'm tired of seeing the Blue buy into it.

If we have to have politics on MeFi, let's not puke up the same bread and circuses gruel that Fox, CNN, and all the rest of those loathsome anti-everything-good hacks are pushing down the throats of the public.

If we have to have politics on MeFi, let's choose stuff that actually informs or makes a difference in the world.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:29 PM on February 22 [1 favorite]

So if I understand correctly you have a hankering for change you can believe in?
posted by goodnewsfortheinsane at 4:32 AM on February 23 [1 favorite]

...making an apparently too-obscure joke about the average size of Korean wedding tackle.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 2:55 AM on February 22 [+] [!]

fucking.metafilter.com sounds like a great idea though.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 5:56 AM on February 22 [1 favorite +] [!]

I want a different subsite for fuckers, called safefucking.metafilter.com. And foreplay.metafilter.com....
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 11:12 AM on February 22 [+] [!]

Which brings us back to this very amusing post by hama7: Cunnilingus in North Korea. Power to the people, right on!
posted by GrammarMoses at 8:08 AM on February 23

Subsite For the Election? February 21, 2008 8:15 PM Subscribe

Subsite For the Election?
February 21, 2008 8:15 PM Subscribe